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Pompous Rhombus posted:If you marry a foreign national, could you potentially lose your security clearance? Not likely unless you marry somebody with some major red flags.
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Dec 4, 2009 22:15
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Pompous Rhombus posted:How is the written test? Do they do it in-house, or through Language Testing International? When I checked I don't think LTI had a written test for Thai, which kinda negates the majority of what I studied. All the language testing is done in house, and only FSI-tested scores are valid. Tests like the HSK and JLPT don't have any relevance inside the State Department, and I know that none of my cohort of Chinese-language students took the HSK. I have heard that each year one or two people in the two-year Japanese course prepare for and take the JLPT, but that is more for personal achievement goals than anything work related. State uses the Interagency Language Roundtable (ILR) system of rating. Though ILR covers the five skills of speaking, writing, reading, listening, translation performance and interpretation performance, State only tests for speaking and reading. The ILR Scale goes from zero to five, with five being an educated native speaker of the target language. At State, jobs requiring language proficiency are known as Language Designated Positions (LDPs) and jobs where the language would be useful but not required are Language Preferred Positions (LPPs). Except at the entry-level, where language requirements are sometime lowered to account for limited training time, most LDPs require a level three in both speaking and reading. Thus the job description would be annotated S-3/R-3, or just 3/3. The ILR scale also has "plus" grades, so someone might have a 3+/3 in Russian, for example.
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Dec 7, 2009 14:28
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Pompous Rhombus posted:If you marry a foreign national, could you potentially lose your security clearance? Not really, no. Unless they were pretty shady. I don't think they hold that against you much, either. It's likely DSS/Homeland will just deny his/her visa application, and when your clearance cycles they might want some words about it. I'm betting it's highly unlikely somebody would know their "real" background and still marry them. AFAIK, your spouse will not even have to pursue citizenship. And if you have good clearance going through, for some reason your/his/her visa application gets pushed through a little quicker*, probably because they've already done most of the background checking on your behalf. For example, with my wife, from mail of application to receiving the green card in the mail was ~5 months give or take a week, which was something like 3 months shorter than the average. (However, if we sent in the application in her host country, it apparently would take ~2 months. I have no idea why) On a side note about that, Homeland/USCIS really seems to process some countries faster than others... :\ * (no hard facts on this, it may be analomy - just from what I've observed, friends w/ clearance against friends w/o clearance)
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Dec 7, 2009 17:04
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So, it's barely been a month and a half since I submitted my application online, so this is going to sound really impatient - but I've been going on the time frame someone mentioned before of 4-5 months for a response and I'm working if it's ever shorter than that. Has anyone heard a response to a job there in like two months? It's for the courier position, btw.
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Dec 7, 2009 17:58
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Any idea if what you fill out under "Special Skills" on the Registration for the FSOT has any bearing on anything?
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Dec 7, 2009 20:14
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Barracuda Bang - I am sure that within 2 months they have picked ideal candidates out, but doesn't federal law/EEO require them to look at all applicants? There's probably thousands of them, even for courier positions. Students or interns will sometimes apply to a job they don't really understand or have a chance at getting just because it's the State Department and it aligns with their major. so the people at HR, although they may have already chosen you, also have to sort through those applicants. And when it's done do they send out the batch of emails, as it's more efficient that way. Federales also take their time. A typical federal agency, say Dept. of Justice - within 2-3 months you may get an mass-email stating you're eligible (or not) for the position, then another month or two, they'll send out a follow up mass-email saying whether you're chosen for the interview or not, then it'll be like another 3 months before the actual interview and maybe another month for the offer. I'm not in State, so they may (probably) work differently but I would imagine a longer process since they probably receive a lot more job applicants than other agencies. Or maybe they don't, I don't really know. The wait sucks, I know. but think of it as getting it makes getting the job all the more rewarding.
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Dec 7, 2009 20:37
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Barracuda Bang! posted:So, it's barely been a month and a half since I submitted my application online, so this is going to sound really impatient - but I've been going on the time frame someone mentioned before of 4-5 months for a response and I'm working if it's ever shorter than that. Has anyone heard a response to a job there in like two months? It's for the courier position, btw. No word yet here either. TBH I've kinda almost forgotten about the position, got plenty of other things on my plate now (not that I wouldn't drop all of them for the courier job).
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Dec 7, 2009 20:53
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Pompous Rhombus posted:No word yet here either. TBH I've kinda almost forgotten about the position, got plenty of other things on my plate now (not that I wouldn't drop all of them for the courier job). Again, it took me a good 3-4 months before I heard anything.. then nothing, then something then nothing... Just be patient guys.. You'll hear eventually.
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Dec 7, 2009 22:05
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Skandiaavity posted:Barracuda Bang - I believe it is an Exempted Service position, meaning no.
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Dec 7, 2009 23:25
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What do you mean by Exempted Service? And thanks for the info
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Dec 8, 2009 03:51
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Government jobs classify into one of two ways: Exempted Services and Competitive Services. Most entry level government positions (all the way down to things like Janitors) are competitive service -- the applicants have certain rights, and once job is granted, they can only be fired for certain reasons. The long and short of it is, exempted services may set their own hiring and firing criteria. There's more to it than that, but basically because of either the organization's needs or the job's description, it is not required to follow the hiring rules in Title 5. For instance, all attorney positions in the US Gov't are exempted service.
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Dec 8, 2009 05:26
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SWATJester posted:Government jobs classify into one of two ways: Exempted Services and Competitive Services. Most entry level government positions (all the way down to things like Janitors) are competitive service -- the applicants have certain rights, and once job is granted, they can only be fired for certain reasons. How does this fit in with non-competitive hiring status? Also, I asked about it a while ago and didn't really get an answer, any tips/suggestions on job-hunting with it?
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Dec 8, 2009 06:12
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SWATJester posted:I believe it is an Exempted Service position, meaning no. I think the terminology is Excepted Service, in case anyone is trying to google this. e: corrected a typo that was bugging me. Business of Ferrets fucked around with this message at 06:25 on Dec 9, 2009 |
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Dec 8, 2009 09:37
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Business of Ferrets posted:I think the terminology in Excepted Service, in case anyone is trying to google this. Yeah you're right; though I think it may have once been called Exempted? I have seen it being used both ways.
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Dec 8, 2009 10:17
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Pompous Rhombus posted:How does this fit in with non-competitive hiring status? When you apply, they should tell you whether the job is Excepted or not, though most of the time you can tell anyway (is it a job requiring a graduate level education, involving placing you or your comrades in danger, etc.?)
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Dec 8, 2009 10:18
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SWATJester posted:When you apply, they should tell you whether the job is Excepted or not, though most of the time you can tell anyway (is it a job requiring a graduate level education, involving placing you or your comrades in danger, etc.?) Yeah, true. From USAJobs it seems more and more apparent that Master's is the new Bachelor's  Back to language stuff, I'm applying for a one-year language grant for 2010. It's intended for professionals, and I'm applying with the angle of it being useful to a career in the Foreign Service. To that end, I need to sell my application to the foundation as having a rigorous, full-time program of study that's tailored specifically to the needs of an FSO. As it turns out, the most likely place I'm applying to study at happens to be the school used by the Foreign Service Institute, diplomats get a choice of studying there or in DC. The downside is that I've probably already had the equivalent of most of the 900-1000 hours they offer, so I'm kind of on my own for coming up with the advanced, upper level stuff. So basically, what sort of language skills/areas do FSO's typically use, specifically political or consular cone? I think stuff like literature/descriptive language I can safely ignore, I'm guessing I should emphasize things like politics/economics, etc. I'm at around an ILR score of 2+ (speaking) right now, reading/writing I've never been assessed on.
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Dec 9, 2009 04:33
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Pompous Rhombus posted:Back to language stuff, I'm applying for a one-year language grant for 2010. It's intended for professionals, and I'm applying with the angle of it being useful to a career in the Foreign Service. To that end, I need to sell my application to the foundation as having a rigorous, full-time program of study that's tailored specifically to the needs of an FSO. As it turns out, the most likely place I'm applying to study at happens to be the school used by the Foreign Service Institute, diplomats get a choice of studying there or in DC. The downside is that I've probably already had the equivalent of most of the 900-1000 hours they offer, so I'm kind of on my own for coming up with the advanced, upper level stuff. What language is it and what school are you considering? I'm not aware of any voluntary options besides FSI, though students of some very-low-density languages do wind up in contract programs, rarely. For content, be sure you can cover social issues, including health care, education, retirement, (un)employment, drug use and the interwebs. You should be able to talk about the structure and responsiblites of the U.S. Government. Also, taxation, rule of law. Econ and science topics show up a lot, too. There is no specific test for Pol or Cons officers, so you will want to be well versed in as much as possible.
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Dec 9, 2009 06:24
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Business of Ferrets posted:What language is it and what school are you considering? I'm not aware of any voluntary options besides FSI, though students of some very-low-density languages do wind up in contract programs, rarely. It's the Thai program at Chiang Mai University (grant is the Blakemore Language grant). I was a little surprised it wasn't at Chulalonkorn (my Thai-language alma mater, in Bangkok), as CMU's regular yearlong course doesn't look as rigorous as Chula's. OTOH Chula doesn't really offer private lessons, so that could be it. Cheers for the info, wrote all of that down. My previous course covered a lot of that sort of thing (at the expense of some more useful day-to-day stuff), and I've been trying to stay sharp by listening to Thai-language news radio through the internet, although it's a bit of a losing battle without really having to produce stuff in my day-to-day life. Definitely got some remedial work to do. As far as for the essay, what sort of situations does an FSO most often find themselves using the foreign language in? Early on I know you're pretty much guaranteed a stint in a consular section, so I know there's that.
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Dec 9, 2009 06:53
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Thailand is awesome, and I hear that Chiang Mai has some amazing food (even by Thai standards). But then you probably know that better than me! Depending on one's cone, the language could be used for anything. I would say that interviewing skills (asking questions, followup questions, etc.) are important to develop. You might take the opportunity to build vocab and familiarity regarding counterterrorism or refugee/border issues, especially with relation to Burma. Stuff like that will make you a more interesting language testee and should make the essay sound sexier.
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Dec 9, 2009 10:26
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So apparently I'm supposed to find out if I get an interview by early January. I'm starting to get super nervous. If I don't get one, will they send me some sort of rejection message? How much will my Urdu proficiency actually help my chances, I wonder.
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Dec 9, 2009 19:51
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CherryCola posted:So apparently I'm supposed to find out if I get an interview by early January. I'm starting to get super nervous. If I don't get one, will they send me some sort of rejection message? How much will my Urdu proficiency actually help my chances, I wonder. Urdu? Dude, if you're fluent in it you probs have nothing to worry about.
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Dec 9, 2009 23:30
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I think people with critical needs languages get an automatic pass to the oral exams.
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Dec 10, 2009 03:42
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Happydayz posted:I think people with critical needs languages get an automatic pass to the oral exams. Really? Any sources on this? edit: Just looked at the FSOT site and I guess I get a .4 point bonus on my application since Urdu is SUPER CRITICAL NEEDS HOLY CRAP! And it looks like I'd probably be sent to Pakistan during one of my first two assignments. Helloooo danger pay. CherryCola fucked around with this message at 05:49 on Dec 10, 2009 |
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Dec 10, 2009 05:38
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CherryCola, are you going the specialist route or the generalist (FSO) route? Or do you have several candidacies in play? I'm not sure that specialists get the language bump; does anyone know?
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Dec 10, 2009 06:15
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Business of Ferrets posted:CherryCola, are you going the specialist route or the generalist (FSO) route? Or do you have several candidacies in play? I'm not sure that specialists get the language bump; does anyone know? Specialists do get a language bump on your application package. We have a different point scale, so the scores are different but yes, you do get a bump as occasionally, specialists positions are lang designated.
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Dec 10, 2009 06:51
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Business of Ferrets posted:CherryCola, are you going the specialist route or the generalist (FSO) route? Or do you have several candidacies in play? I'm not sure that specialists get the language bump; does anyone know? I'm applying for a plain ol' consular track position.
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Dec 10, 2009 06:51
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CherryCola posted:I'm applying for a plain ol' consular track position. This could work out very well for you, should you pass the orals and get into A-100 (with the language bonus, the latter is almost certain if you accomplish the former). You would be sitting pretty if you were able to get a Pakistan Cons tour for your first assignment. Under the entry-level bidding rules, you would pretty much get your pick of jobs for your second tour. I know, first things first (pass the FSOA). But if you do that, the rest should be pretty straightforward.
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Dec 10, 2009 14:06
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CherryCola posted:I'm applying for a plain ol' consular track position. have you heard back on your PN results yet?
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Dec 10, 2009 18:57
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xanthig posted:have you heard back on your PN results yet? Nah, like i said, i'm pretty sure they'll let me know in January. Oh just checked, yeah I'll receive my next email from the panel in late January. Dammit, I thought it was early January. I hate this waiting.
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Dec 10, 2009 19:45
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After doing all kinds of research into what life has in store for me (domestic policy work, grad school, law school, campaign work, or mcdonald's) I've basically decided this is what I want to do. I applied to take the FSOT the other day and should be hearing back in January. I know getting selected as an FSO (Political) is extremely competitive, but I was wondering if someone could tell me in what ways it is competitive. Does it rely a lot on education, GPA, test scores, etc? Does it rely on past experience? I have never been out of the country and my GPA is weak. I am not going to Grad School as far as I can tell. I don't speak a foreign language (Spanish a tad). I really want to work in sub-saharan Africa. Maybe Uganda or Rwanda, etc. Can someone give me any direction on my chances? I've thought about trying to hook up with some NGOs and work in Africa with them for a few years and reapplying if I don't make it. Will this drastically improve my chances? I am stressed out.
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Dec 10, 2009 23:37
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Miss Fats posted:After doing all kinds of research into what life has in store for me (domestic policy work, grad school, law school, campaign work, or mcdonald's) I've basically decided this is what I want to do. I applied to take the FSOT the other day and should be hearing back in January. Well you are already cruising for a bruising. The foreign service should NEVER be your first choice, and you should not decide you want to do it after a long, deliberative thought out process. The reason is that it is 1) extremely difficult to get into, and 2) a LONG on-boarding process even if you do get hired. Your best bet is to go full steam with another course of option while still applying for the foreign service, and if you get in well that's just gravy.
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Dec 10, 2009 23:41
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Miss Fats posted:After doing all kinds of research into what life has in store for me (domestic policy work, grad school, law school, campaign work, or mcdonald's) I've basically decided this is what I want to do. I applied to take the FSOT the other day and should be hearing back in January. If on top of that you don't have much work/internship experience it seems kind of unlikely you will make the cut. It would probably help to do the NGO stuff, Peace Corps is another possibility somewhat in that same direction. Military service is another shortcut, although again it's hardly a guarantee.
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Dec 10, 2009 23:48
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Happydayz posted:Well you are already cruising for a bruising. The foreign service should NEVER be your first choice, and you should not decide you want to do it after a long, deliberative thought out process. This is exactly the attitude I'm taking. I'm planning on moving to DC in the fall and I'm going to be applying for jobs as if the foreign service doesn't even exist. If I do get the job, then cool...if not, then I'm not totally screwed.
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Dec 10, 2009 23:48
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I'm obviously not putting all my eggs in the FSO basket. I am just trying to figure out what to do and I've decided that State is my #1 priority - as in I would drop everything else if I got hired. I'm also applying to the Peace Corps' Masters International program to try and get my Masters and get a couple years of international experience as well in case I don't get in to state so that my app looks better next time around.
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Dec 11, 2009 03:38
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Miss Fats posted:I'm obviously not putting all my eggs in the FSO basket. I am just trying to figure out what to do and I've decided that State is my #1 priority - as in I would drop everything else if I got hired. Just so you know, Peace Corps = (likely) never going to work in the intelligence community. Maybe that's not your thing, but you should think carefully before closing off an option.
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Dec 11, 2009 04:23
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That always baffled me because it's a government org. I knew it was sometimes a barrier to intelligence work, but surely it doesn't effect the clearances for State work, does it?
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Dec 11, 2009 05:54
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Miss Fats posted:I really want to work in sub-saharan Africa. Maybe Uganda or Rwanda, etc. You're stressed, it's not going to be good for you. I applied to be a specialist on a whim, now I'm in Rwanda. Your chances are quite low getting all the way through on your first try. PC shouldn't be an issue for working in State. Also consider USAID.
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Dec 11, 2009 07:01
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The stressed out part comes mostly from Finals Week after taking 18 credit hours this semester.
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Dec 11, 2009 07:12
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Miss Fats posted:That always baffled me because it's a government org. It's because they don't want it to look like PCV's are gathering intelligence for the CIA, etc. It wouldn't affect getting hired at State (don't returned PCV's get a special bonus in the application process?), but the intelligence community is a pretty big hirer or political science grads, so it's something to consider.
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Dec 11, 2009 08:06
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Ah ok that makes sense. I kind of gave my up fascination with the intelligence community after I grew out of Tom Clancy in Grade 8, but it's not something I've completely rejecting. We'll see, I guess.
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Dec 11, 2009 10:16
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