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lilljonas posted:I finished cleaning up my Germans today, it's 100 infantry mixed with NCO's, submachine guns and MG-42s. I'm reading Festung Europa but I'm new at this, is the MG bases just 4 riflemen and a submachine gun, or is it riflemen and a MG-42? Or are the MG-42 only used in the heavy plutoons, and just two guys on a small base? I was also wondering this, since it says a fortress company comes with 18 MG teams, and this was my main aversion to it, as I want a bog standard rifle company. But does it simply mean MG options? Integral SMGs? Could I say make a weapons platoon and 2 rifle platoons? So many questions, I wish the site was more clear.
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Jan 16, 2010 12:36
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At the very beginning of Fortress Europe, it explains how to base each type of unit. Rifle teams just have rifles. Rifle/MG teams have one base with 4 rifles and an MG, and one base with 4 rifles. As I'd asked previously, it seems throwing in an SMG here or there isn't a big deal.
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Jan 16, 2010 13:43
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Yeah, the newer books (Cobra and on) all have graphical representations of what goes on what base. German MG teams are gonna be one team of 5 men (NCO with SMG, 2 riflemen, and 2 guys with an MG-42) and one team of 4 men (two riflemen, 2 guys with an MG-42) per squad. Rifle/MG squads will only have one team with an MG-42. But the main thing as far as Rifle teams, MG teams and Rifle/MG teams go is that Rifle teams have no machine guns, Rifle/MG teams have one machine gun per two teams (or 3 teams in the case of falschirmjaegers) and MG Teams have a machine gun in each team. So long as you follow that rule, you'll be set.
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Jan 16, 2010 14:07
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Well, then that brings me back to my question. Do SMGs count in that rule? If so, I may have to buy more infantry.
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Jan 16, 2010 14:14
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Lord Commissar posted:Well, then that brings me back to my question. Do SMGs count in that rule? If so, I may have to buy more infantry. As long as you have the proper amount of men and machine guns on a base, replacing a rifle with an SMG here or there probably won't make much of a difference. Personally I wouldn't put more than one on a base.
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Jan 16, 2010 15:17
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Devlan Mud posted:As long as you have the proper amount of men and machine guns on a base, replacing a rifle with an SMG here or there probably won't make much of a difference. Personally I wouldn't put more than one on a base. I have this: http://www.flamesofwar.com/hobby.aspx?art_id=1354 There wouldn't be more than one SMG on a base, and there would be bases without them at all. I just wanted to make sure it was okay. Statwise, it almost makes sense anyway, since Rifle/MG Teams have a higher RoF than straight Rifle Teams, and it would be a good way to identify them on the table. Also I think Fortress Europe mentions in the beginning that you can kind of do that, but it wasn't clear. It definitely says you can change the look to suit your needs, so long as the rules are the same. I kind of like that about FoW. EDIT: Also, with respect towards the war in the Pacific, I think you'd need a lot more skirmish-type rules, with almost everything on small bases with no more than 2 models per base. 3 Action Economist fucked around with this message at 15:51 on Jan 16, 2010 |
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Jan 16, 2010 15:40
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All this talk of ww2 has got me itching to paint my German battlegroup in 10mm for BKC.
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Jan 16, 2010 15:51
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Lord Commissar posted:I have this: http://www.flamesofwar.com/hobby.aspx?art_id=1354 As long as there's enough rifles so that it's not gonna be confused with a soviet SMG company, SMGs here and there won't make a difference.
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Jan 16, 2010 15:55
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EDIT: NM
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Jan 16, 2010 19:09
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Anyone here have any experience with the Recruits tourney in Missouri? I have an overwhelming temptation to paint up a Free French Infantry Force or something and try my hand at Spring Recruits in March.
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Jan 17, 2010 00:12
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Field of Glory writeup Field of Glory is a game of historical battles, currently ranging from biblical era to the age of early firearms. Field of Glory Renaissance is in beta stage, and will start to cover a couple of centuries after that. FoG is one of the most discussed releases of historical games the last couple of years, for two reasons. First of all, it is backed by Osprey Publishing, universally known amongst historical geeks for their gazillion books on military history. The other reason is that it is a points based system with much in common to what you see in Fantasy and Sci-Fi games, a design choice that Flames of War has shown to be effective in today's market. Army lists are released in sourcebooks with a major theme, like "armies around Middle East during the Crusades" or "Dark Age armies in North-West Europe". Even if the ruleset is pretty new these books have been released with an impressive speed, and by now most of the popular historical armies (and quite a few less popular) are covered.  Armies in FoG are made out of Battlegroups, which are usually 4 to 8 bases, with 2 to 4 miniatures on most bases. A starter army can easily be 100 miniatures or more. The basing system is the same as for DBx. The game system can be used with any scale, though 15mm seems to be the most popular followed by 25/28mm.  FoG in 28mm can require some space If you read my DBA writeup, you should know that units are far more detailed in FoG. You have your unit type, such as Medium Foot, Heavy Foot or Light Cavalry. This affects how you deal with terrain and such. Then you are either Drilled or Undrilled, affecting how disciplined your troops are at doing complicated manouvers such as turning while marching. Then you have the quality of troops: are your awesome knights just bragging Poor or are they actually Superior? Superior quality troops gets rerolls and just generally gets the job done better. Then you have a value for how armoured they are (armoured, protected etc) and finally armament (heavy weapons, swordsmen, light spear, offensive spear etc.). So while a DBA unit can be summed up with "Spearman", a FoG unit can be Medium Foot, Drilled, Average, Protected Light Spears. This means that there are more stats to keep track of, but also helps making the different armies feel different even if they might all be carrying sticks and spears. The second big difference is the point values. Army building is actually very easy compared to say, Warhammer. Your army will have a certain required core troops, and then a bunch of extra choices. A base will vary in price depending on how much bling you add to them: knock your knights down from Drilled to Undrilled might save you a point but cause problems when you want them to do anything but charge straight forward, while giving your Gallic Warbands some more armour will make them last better in a fight but also cost more points. Battlegroups also comes in variable sizes, like 6-12 bases, and your army will usually have a maximum amount of every troop type. So you pick your Battlegroups, you kit them out like you want, and you choose the quality of your commanders. If you want to add some colour to your army you can usually add allies from other related lists. Allies, and even some troop choices, will be based on historical dates. So your Crusader army might or might not be able to have Saracen allies depending on what year you play. And you might or might not have access to unit choices depending on dates. A typical example is a Carthaginian army that can have Elephants at first, but once Hannibal has been rampaging around Rome for a while he loses that choice but gets access to imitation legionnaires and heavily armoured gauls instead.  Manouvers in the game are also more complicated than DBA. Moves have a level of complication that are dependent on what unit type you have and whether they are drilled or not: everyone can walk forward without problem, but while drilled skirmishers have no problem waltzing in eights in difficult terrain, just trying to wheel twice can be tough on undrilled pikemen or elephants. You'll need to roll command rolls to do difficult things, and here it makes a difference if you have an Inspired Commander like Julius Caesar or Hannibal babysitting your troops or if you just picked up some backwater bum of a sargeant. Combat is also more complicated, and is all about bonuses and maluses. Everything that tips the combat in your favour adds to your dice rolls on the attack: outnumbering your opponent, flanking them, having better armour or having a preferable choice of weaponry. Unlike Warhammer a winning result will usually not kill enemy bases. Instead you are more likely to just make them disrupted, which makes them even worse at fighting, then fragmented, and finally broken. Thus you are usually involved in slow drag-out battles of attrition between big infantry blocks, which is very true to the Ancient battlefield.  What I like with FoG: The points based system for making armies is very helpful for people like me who started out playing Warhammer. Lots of historical systems will just say "oh, 12 500 spearmen attended this battle, figure it out", while making FoG armies is simple. The backing from Osprey makes these books way better designed than your average historical rulebook. The only books I've seen that are better are IMHO the Flames of War books. FoG rules are clearly written and easy to grasp. It's accessible to buy. Many 15mm makers and even some 28mm makers have FoG starter armies for sale, and sometimes even Battlegroup sets. FoG has become one of the really big sets in the UK for Ancients, maybe even the biggest, and the miniature producers are happy to sell big-rear end sets to people. The sourcebooks are widely available at all online stores with miniature rules. It's accessible to collect. Say I play a DBA army with Byzantines. That's just about 20-30 bucks and a dozen bases to paint. Then I get a Crusader army to set up fights between them. Another 20-30 bucks, a dozen bases to paint, and now I have two entire armies for DBA. From here it's not a far step to add to my Byzantines to beef them up into some battlegroups, and I can use the Crusaders as allies. So while getting enough miniatures to play a game of FoG can be 70-100 dollars and 50 bases to paint, you can make it into sizeable bites through DBA. Units are more detailed than DBA which gives armies more of a soul. Disorganized but powerful barbaric spearmen fight very different from disciplined ranks of Greek hoplites in FoG, without having as long a statline as Warhammer. FoG armies have the bulk where it actually starts to look like an army. Stuff I don't like: It takes time and money to collect a FoG army, even in 15mm. After a year I still lack two bases of light cavalry and two bases of heavy cavalry for my Carthaginian starter army. It takes time to play. Sometimes it is fun to sit down and just play a long, high tension game, but I find that I rarely have the time. I usually play on work days when I just have a few hours of game time available. FoG can easily take 2-3 hours, not to mention setup time. In that time I can get in two DBA matches and still have time to paint and talk bullshit with my club mates.  All in all, I think it is a game that is worth checking out if you are into big battles in the Ancient or Medieval eras. The basing means that you'll probably need to make a bunch of movement trays if you usually play with WAB 28mm miniatures, and if you are starting out I would highly recommend 15mm instead of 28mm unless you go with plastics because it will get expensive. The frequency of releases means that there's already a better coverage of armies lists than WAB. But if you just want to chuck loads of dice, you might want to look elsewhere. lilljonas fucked around with this message at 01:06 on Jan 17, 2010 |
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Jan 17, 2010 00:53
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Added to the OP.
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Jan 17, 2010 01:09
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lilljonas posted:The French were beaten by superior strategy and superior tactics, not superior equipment.
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Jan 17, 2010 04:51
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Arquinsiel posted:Nah, they were beaten because nobody would ever try the same invasion plan twice right? Anyway, modern warfare is too dependant on tanks. Nobody can get tanks through the Ardennes..... *cough*Afghanistan*cough*  Anyway, a friend just got an order from Crusader Miniatures and Artizan Designs, and he's pretty stoked about both. Good choices for 28mm I guess.
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Jan 17, 2010 07:18
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They are great choices. My 28mm US 82nd Airborne are all Artizan- lots of the characters are based on the Band Of Brothers series. Hang on, let me throw a couple of pics up. EDIT  Click here for the full 1200x511 image.  Click here for the full 1200x606 image.
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Jan 17, 2010 09:15
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There are a couple modern warfare style games I've heard of, like Ambush Alley, to name one. Anyone have experience with them? Or can recommend an alternate?
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Jan 17, 2010 15:34
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Elendil004 posted:There are a couple modern warfare style games I've heard of, like Ambush Alley, to name one. Anyone have experience with them? Or can recommend an alternate? Try reading the thread... http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3248082&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=3#post370503944
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Jan 17, 2010 15:39
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Serotonin posted:Try reading the thread... OOps! I thought Commissar was linking all of those to the OP and I didn't see it there! Sweet though, thanks 
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Jan 17, 2010 15:40
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Elendil004 posted:OOps! I thought Commissar was linking all of those to the OP and I didn't see it there! Sweet though, thanks Hes just lazy...
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Jan 17, 2010 15:43
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Serotonin posted:Hes just lazy... I know he's practically worthless
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Jan 17, 2010 15:44
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I didn't particularly think it was big enough to go in the OP, but it's there now.
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Jan 17, 2010 16:11
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Lord Commissar posted:I didn't particularly think it was big enough to go in the OP, but it's there now. I was joking! It wasnt really written with the intention of the OP. But cheers anyway
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Jan 17, 2010 17:52
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As I posted before that there was an upcoming tournament at Easter. I finally looked up the points, and it is Late war 1750 pts. code:Critique / comments would be appreciated. I have everything but the M10 sections so it would be nice to know if I need to buy anything else.
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Jan 18, 2010 11:11
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Looks like all bases are covered really. Got your artillery, tanks, anti-tank and some grunts. The air support I don't really trust, but there's not a lot you can get for 150 points really. If you want to switch it for anything I'd say a MG platoon, but I dunno the costs.
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Jan 18, 2010 14:15
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Ok, a general hobby question, maybe something we can put in the FAQ: Flags. How do you guys make flags that look real at various scales?
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Jan 18, 2010 14:58
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No Pun Intended posted:As I posted before that there was an upcoming tournament at Easter. I finally looked up the points, and it is Late war 1750 pts. what's the motivation and rating of your force, and what book did you point your army out of?
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Jan 18, 2010 15:54
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Lord Commissar posted:Ok, a general hobby question, maybe something we can put in the FAQ: For 15mm, one thing I used to do was pretty simple. Take a paper flag (either from a sheet or a color printout) and put a thin piece of aluminum foil between the two sides, and glue them together with white glue. The foil lets you shape the flag. A lot of the time flags are shown just flying straight in one direction or the other, but if you look at pictures of reenactments and such, you can see that they usually are just chilling there, wrapped around the flag pole a bit. The foil lets you wrap the flag a little, and still make it look like it has volume.
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Jan 18, 2010 16:36
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What size should I make the flags for FoW? I guess I could just go do the math on my own....
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Jan 18, 2010 16:57
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Ok, I've decided to go ahead with a FOW army after having the starter set and the (now defunct Afrika book) kicking around gathering dust. I listened to the D6 Generation podcasts where they had a looonng review of the game so I've got a better handle on how the game works, Questions, A combined arms force works best right? A whole bunch of army lists from The Internet have tanks with a min inf choice, which seems kinda boring, whereas I was thinking of having a bit of everything, take all comers type of army. Do you have to have the plane models on the board to represent air forces or are they 'off camera' Is Festung Europa (or whatever the gently caress it's called nowadays) the go to book for LW lists? This game really isn't easy to get into with it's million supplements... Ideally I'd like to go for an 8th army force, but everyone else at my club is collecting european theatre forces and my sand based dudes will look a bit out of place. It looks like it's going to be either the Soviets or the Finns (are these guys any good at all?).
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Jan 18, 2010 17:30
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free mummy posted:what's the motivation and rating of your force, and what book did you point your army out of? This is pointed from D -1. All paras are Fearless Veterans and the tanks are Confident Veterans
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Jan 18, 2010 19:49
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Lord Commissar posted:Ok, a general hobby question, maybe something we can put in the FAQ: I tend to keep it simple for 6mm and print off flags from the net http://www.warflag.com/ No need for any fancy shenanigans at this scale.
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Jan 18, 2010 19:52
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What! Ok, this isn't historical, technically, but I want it: http://www.ambushalleygames.com/ambushz.html
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Jan 18, 2010 21:33
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Lord Commissar posted:What! Ok, this isn't historical, technically, but I want it: http://www.ambushalleygames.com/ambushz.html I haven't played AA, but from what I gathered from the write-up it really does sound like one of the better systems for a game of zombie apocalypse survival, with random zombie reinforcements and all.
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Jan 18, 2010 21:41
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BeigeJacket posted:Questions, Lots of people like tank companies because nerds like tanks. They aren't really any better or worse than mechanised or infantry companies. Planes have models, and come on the board in their phase. Fortress Europe has generic lists for the Late War period. You can however find an 7th Armoured Division list for use in europe in the Villers Bocage supplement if you want to do Desert Rats in Europe. On the other hand, the Soviets have some darned good lists in both Fortress Europe and the Bagration books. Finns have a Mid-War list in Eastern Front, and they might have a Late War pdf on the website, but I'm not positive.
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Jan 18, 2010 21:52
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No Pun Intended posted:This is pointed from D -1. All paras are Fearless Veterans and the tanks are Confident Veterans Your tank destroyers have the disengage rules, right? a friend of mine who tried them out had a problem with the M10's being forced to fall back once they were in combat due to those rules. If you have access to Shermans with the 76mm gun those might be a better choice if you run into problems with the M10's
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Jan 18, 2010 21:57
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lilljonas posted:I haven't played AA, but from what I gathered from the write-up it really does sound like one of the better systems for a game of zombie apocalypse survival, with random zombie reinforcements and all. Ive not played Ambush Z, but I can imagine it working superbly.
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Jan 18, 2010 22:35
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free mummy posted:Your tank destroyers have the disengage rules, right? a friend of mine who tried them out had a problem with the M10's being forced to fall back once they were in combat due to those rules. If you have access to Shermans with the 76mm gun those might be a better choice if you run into problems with the M10's Yes they use a variation of the disengage rules, I have used M10's before and it is wise to take advantage of the tank destroyer doctrine. They don't have the front armour (FA 4) to take other tanks head on. No I can't get 76mm Shermans 
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Jan 19, 2010 05:59
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Scale Creep miniatures may be selling a bunch of stuff on clearance:quote:Time to Refocus Might be a good place to keep an eye on for decent deals, especially on things like Victrix, Warlord Games, and Wargames factory.
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Jan 19, 2010 15:51
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Lord Commissar posted:Scale Creep miniatures may be selling a bunch of stuff on clearance: Legio Heroica has some nice 15mm medievals, some discounts would be nice.
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Jan 19, 2010 18:17
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No Pun Intended posted:No I can't get 76mm Shermans The only difference is the gun right? That sounds like a really easy conversion. Unless the rules say you can't take 76mm Shermans, in which case ignore me.
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Jan 19, 2010 18:40
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