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Revenant.Eagle posted:Some retard posted this on the WERA forums. poo poo storm ensued. Pretty drat funny. Why was there a poo poo storm? Chances are BMW handed the S1000RR over to Chris McNeil to play with. He's basically their factory sponsored stunta' and was a featured attraction at the BMW MOA rally last year.
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Jan 29, 2010 02:19
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The big problem with stuntin' is once you've seen it once, you've seen it all
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Jan 29, 2010 02:40
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laymil posted:Why was there a poo poo storm?
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Jan 29, 2010 02:44
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Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:i bet it's because stuntaz until now have ridden japanese crotch rockets exclusively and they fear deeply the new encroachment of the white man haha that's amazing but true
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Jan 29, 2010 03:57
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Revenant.Eagle posted:Some retard posted this on the WERA forums. poo poo storm ensued. Pretty drat funny. So rude to talk about internet drama but not post a link  Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:i bet it's because stuntaz until now have ridden japanese crotch rockets exclusively and they fear deeply the new encroachment of the white man Never mind Christian Pfiffer or whatever the gently caress his name is, pretty much the first big factory sponsored stunter.
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Jan 29, 2010 05:47
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So now that the S1000RR makes more horsepower than either the ZX14 and Hayabusa, is it going to become the staple for bikers everywhere who just want the absolute fastest bike?
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Jan 29, 2010 06:23
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Maybe Suzuki will do what they did when the ZX-14 came out and made more power than them. Namely go "Pfff" and release a new Busa thats more powerful.
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Jan 29, 2010 06:24
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/\/\/\/\ Factory turbo 'busa option? I wish I was a much more experienced rider, I'd be all over the S1000RR. Pure loving sex.
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Jan 29, 2010 07:05
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SeamusMcPhisticuffs posted:/\/\/\/\ just use rain mode (lol)
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Jan 29, 2010 07:11
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I wonder if BMW will make a S600R that would REALLY make the Japanese 4 nervous Also that black color on the S1000R is awesome and I kinda like the headlights really.
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Jan 29, 2010 07:14
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hayden. posted:just use rain mode (lol) I had briefly thought about it since I'll be able to afford one this spring, but I think I'd still wrap myself around a telephone pole since I'll I've ridden are dirt bikes and a KLR650.
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Jan 29, 2010 07:25
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infraboy posted:I wonder if BMW will make a S600R that would REALLY make the Japanese 4 nervous The japanese 4's target demographic coupled with the market downturn will make a BMW sport bike have to go through a tough hurdle, unless they make something at a similar price.
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Jan 29, 2010 07:26
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hayden. posted:So now that the S1000RR makes more horsepower than either the ZX14 and Hayabusa, is it going to become the staple for bikers everywhere who just want the absolute fastest bike? According to MCN the 07+ Hayabusas make 1hp more than the S1000RR http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/bikereviews/searchresults/Bike-Reviews/Suzuki/Suzuki-GSX1300R-Hayabusa-2007-current/?&R=EPI-94783No doubt the S1000RR will be fast as poo poo though, it weighs a hell of a lot less. I'm interested to see if the claimed 193bhp turns out to be accurate once people start dynoing them, but given it's a litrebike with 13:1 compression and peak power at 13k, it would be no surprise if it is that powerful. Gah, $26k AUD for the sport version once all the registration and West Australian government fun tax is paid. Unfortunately, that's about 19k more than I can afford anytime soon. Also the official BMW options pricing is nothing short of ridiculous, e.g. $450 for a drop sensor, $1400 for rearsets FlyinDoc fucked around with this message at 07:33 on Jan 29, 2010 |
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Jan 29, 2010 07:27
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infraboy posted:I wonder if BMW will make a S600R that would REALLY make the Japanese 4 nervous The rumour that's been floating around for ages is that'll be a 675 triple, as will MV's smaller sportsbike. FlyinDoc posted:According to MCN the 07+ Hayabusas make 1hp more than the S1000RR MCN's dynoed one and gotten nearly 185whp, so has Akrapovic. Obviously those lightweight F1 cam followers have done their job.
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Jan 29, 2010 07:31
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infraboy posted:I wonder if BMW will make a S600R that would REALLY make the Japanese 4 nervous bmw club mag had an article on it where a project manager specifically said they do not plan to do a 600. he said the production and r&d costs are about the same as a 1000 but the retail price has to be several k lower, so the profit margin is too small to make it worth it. and yeah those lights are starting to grow on me. no one's more surprised by this than i.
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Jan 29, 2010 12:43
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Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:
Battered spouse syndrome. edit: no, maybe stockholm syndrome. whichever one makes the joke work. Ola fucked around with this message at 13:53 on Jan 29, 2010 |
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Jan 29, 2010 13:48
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SeamusMcPhisticuffs posted:I had briefly thought about it since I'll be able to afford one this spring, but I think I'd still wrap myself around a telephone pole since I'll I've ridden are dirt bikes and a KLR650. If you have enough experience with the KLR, I don't see a problem with getting the S1000RR. The KLR isn't far behind middle weight non-supersport bikes. It's inline with the Ninja500, a bit behind SV650 and 650R. People's complaint about newbies getting liter bikes is that they don't have good throttle control and safe habits regarding higher speed turning. If it's what you want, get it. It's maybe not the best looking bike out there, but it's still nice, and poo poo does it look fast. It's definitely on my list of possibilities once I graduate and get a full time job. Also on that list are the ZX14, Concours 14, CBR1000RR, or V-Max. It's one of those difficult yet petty first world problems. hayden. fucked around with this message at 14:48 on Jan 29, 2010 |
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Jan 29, 2010 14:43
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SeamusMcPhisticuffs posted:I had briefly thought about it since I'll be able to afford one this spring, but I think I'd still wrap myself around a telephone pole since I'll I've ridden are dirt bikes and a KLR650. gently caress, I've done that with the KLR, guess the S1000RR is out of the question.
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Jan 29, 2010 17:47
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ABS and Traction Control people, it's not a crash proof situation, but I'd buy a S1000RR over a CBR1000RR for that alone. Plus the quick shift is awesome. And the colors are sexy. And the headlights have completely won me over now. and.. and... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coa1vb-AVxY
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Jan 29, 2010 18:17
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Spiffness posted:ABS and Traction Control people, it's not a crash proof situation, but I'd buy a S1000RR over a CBR1000RR for that alone. I love that it's claimed to be "essentially uncrashable" by people like Keith Code and the very first one on the track in the hands of the public was wadded after 2 sessions.
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Jan 29, 2010 18:35
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Spiffness posted:ABS and Traction Control people, it's not a crash proof situation, but I'd buy a S1000RR over a CBR1000RR for that alone. Seriously. The amount of electronics more than make up for the price difference, and the power advantage is just another bonus. I don't know why the big four are so lacking in the electronics department.
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Jan 29, 2010 18:52
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hayden. posted:Seriously. The amount of electronics more than make up for the price difference, and the power advantage is just another bonus. I don't know why the big four are so lacking in the electronics department. Lacking in which department? Electronics? Part of me would like stuff like abs and traction control. The other part of thinks that the more of that stuff they add onto the bike the harder and more expensive it is for me to do my own work on the bike.
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Jan 29, 2010 18:58
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hayden. posted:Seriously. The amount of electronics more than make up for the price difference, and the power advantage is just another bonus. I don't know why the big four are so lacking in the electronics department. The new CBR ABS is supposedly amazing. But the real reason that it's not there is because most people think they're badass racers who doesn't need ABS, that poo poo'll just slow him down! The same reason that we don't get standards over here, basically.
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Jan 29, 2010 19:11
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I'm on the verge of repairing my own vehicle for the first time in my life for the simple reason that it does not have a computer in it (except for the fuel injection system... *sigh*). The more poo poo you put in these things the faster we reach that event horizon in the future where you crash land on an alien planet in the past where nazis somehow won WWII, and you try to build your time machine, but there's too many steps involved in recreating the technology, so you end up having to bleach your hair and raise a sub aryan brood in Italian Sumatra, because, sure you can get the part where you use an old style chemical battery as a capacitor, but you have no idea how to ... look, the point is, gently caress computers. They lead to flappy paddle gearboxes, which lead to kissing men.
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Jan 29, 2010 19:12
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Z3n posted:I love that it's claimed to be "essentially uncrashable" by people like Keith Code and the very first one on the track in the hands of the public was wadded after 2 sessions. I think it was Bike who, when they did their expose' on it, said everyone at the launch was pushing it hard and nobody crashed (which they remarked as, very unusual). There was however a close call, when some other journal rider dug a foot peg deep into the pavement on a turn which lifted the rear tire off the ground and almost lead to a high-side. I like those chances.
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Jan 29, 2010 19:21
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TheCosmicMuffet posted:I'm on the verge of repairing my own vehicle for the first time in my life for the simple reason that it does not have a computer in it (except for the fuel injection system... *sigh*). The more poo poo you put in these things the faster we reach that event horizon in the future where you crash land on an alien planet in the past where nazis somehow won WWII, and you try to build your time machine, but there's too many steps involved in recreating the technology, so you end up having to bleach your hair and raise a sub aryan brood in Italian Sumatra, because, sure you can get the part where you use an old style chemical battery as a capacitor, but you have no idea how to ... look, the point is, gently caress computers. They lead to flappy paddle gearboxes, which lead to kissing men. Good thing having fuel injection around doesn't stop wick carbs from working  I'd be unhappy with computers but I work IT so they make me a lot of money. But I do love me some flatslides...oh choices, choices. Spiffness posted:I think it was Bike who, when they did their expose' on it, said everyone at the launch was pushing it hard and nobody crashed (which they remarked as, very unusual). There was however a close call, when some other journal rider dug a foot peg deep into the pavement on a turn which lifted the rear tire off the ground and almost lead to a high-side. Yeah the guy was a complete moron, riding in the C group and thinking he was some sort of badass who couldn't be touched. Contrary to popular belief, you still have to know how to ride to ride a motorcycle, even one with traction control, and if you're a dumbass, you can still crash it!
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Jan 29, 2010 20:37
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Z3n posted:and if you're a dumbass, you can still crash it! This is why I should just get an SV650 and get better at riding instead.
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Jan 29, 2010 20:45
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Roll-your-own ABS and traction control has to be right around the corner. Working on your classic computerized vehicle in the future will be just as hard as our grandfathers trying to figure out electric windows and air conditioning.
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Jan 29, 2010 20:46
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Ola posted:Roll-your-own ABS and traction control has to be right around the corner. Working on your classic computerized vehicle in the future will be just as hard as our grandfathers trying to figure out electric windows and air conditioning. Check out Durbahn...he's doing some crazy poo poo with Motec ECUs on normal(ish) sportbikes and turning them into crazy poo poo. Like his trackbike CBR with traction control. I think ABS is a little farther off because you have to interface the electronics and the hydraulic system, and there's some liability there, but traction control is already available, either in brew your own Motec formats or Bazzaz TC stuff. SeamusMcPhisticuffs posted:This is why I should just get an SV650 and get better at riding instead. I'd almost never say no to ABS for street use. It just makes sense.
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Jan 29, 2010 20:59
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I was going to buy self warming gloves, but then I saw I had to connect something to the electrical system. Now I know why the germans made everything pneumatic for as long as they could. ... my hands are cold 
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Jan 29, 2010 21:15
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Z3n posted:I'd almost never say no to ABS for street use. It just makes sense. Is it any harder to service your brakes, things like changing pads or bleeding fluid, with abs? How hard is it to diagnosis the abs unit? Does it give out codes to the cpu? I'm not trying to make a point, I'm honestly curious. I know my dad's abs system on his truck has given him fits, and I think you're supposed to crack the bleed screw open on a caliper on a car with abs when you compress the cylinder to put a new pad in so you don't send dirty? fluid back through the sensor. Same thing with a bike?
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Jan 29, 2010 22:26
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redscare posted:The big problem with stuntin' is once you've seen it once, you've seen it all Yea, kind of like racing, once you've seen one dude drag knee you've seen it all. Or maybe like skateboarding, once you've seen one dude flip a little board, you've seen it all. Trying to delegitimize an entire sub-culture of motorcycle with sweeping generalizations like that just makes you look ignorant. People have spent years of their life busting their rear end day in and day out to push a rapidly evolving sport that they thoroughly enjoy? Haha, what schmucks, it's all wasted because I, redscare, think it's boring! It's not your thing, that's great, but there is no reason to spout your mouth off like a little 5 year old kid looking for attention when something you don't like is brought up. inolen fucked around with this message at 22:55 on Jan 29, 2010 |
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Jan 29, 2010 22:47
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Coredump posted:Is it any harder to service your brakes, things like changing pads or bleeding fluid, with abs? How hard is it to diagnosis the abs unit? Does it give out codes to the cpu? It's not harder, it's just more work. You may have to bleed it in a certain fashion or bleed some extra individual fittings, but it's not significantly more complicated than a normal system. If there's dirty fluid in the system, there's dirty fluid in the system. Bikes aren't big enough to have a lot of seperation there. inolen posted:Yea, kind of like racing, once you've seen one dude drag knee you've seen it all. Or maybe like skateboarding, once you've seen one dude flip a little board, you've seen it all. Trying to delegitimize an entire sub-culture of motorcycle with sweeping generalizations like that just makes you look ignorant. Eh, it's true of any sport. Watching racing is pretty boring when you don't have the context to appreciate it in. I only got seriously interested in watching racing after I started doing it. Same with skating, where a pop shoveit is gonna look about as impressive as 360 flip to someone who doesn't know what they're looking at. Basketball/baseball/football,etc bores me to tears because I have no idea what's going on beyond "ball goes here, points!". Stunting's the same as anything else. To me, it still just looks like a bunch of wheelies, a bunch of stoppies, and some rolling burnouts/slides. I like watching it because it's entertaining regardless, but no one really knows what's going on because there's no "oh he's doing a xyz" unless you're involved in the scene. Also, as to "rapidly evolving", people have been stunting bikes for as long as there have been 2 wheels. The guys on bikes aren't doing much new that hasn't been done by someone else (ie. trials riders) in the past. Not to talk poo poo about you as a person or anything, I really enjoy your posts on stunting and clanofants/etc, but the most hilarious part of it all is how strung out stunters get about it. You so much as call them on anything and you can promise a huge, multipage meltdown...the threads on stuntride and BARF after someone posted the video of the guy crashing on the bay bridge were hilarious. Yeah, going around in a circle really fast is dumb to the general population, but we've come to terms with that. Somehow, stunters haven't figured that one out yet. Z3n fucked around with this message at 23:16 on Jan 29, 2010 |
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Jan 29, 2010 23:13
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Z3n posted:Eh, it's true of any sport. Exactly. And who besides bitter old curmudgeons run around talking poo poo on skateboarding and racing motorcycles these days? Z3n posted:Also, as to "rapidly evolving", people have been stunting bikes for as long as there have been 2 wheels. The guys on bikes aren't doing much new that hasn't been done by someone else (ie. trials riders) in the past. Absolutely not. The new styles and tricks just keep coming, and are not things trial riders have been doing. Regardless, I'm more talking about the legitimization of the sport as a whole. Big factories are stepping in (Yamaha, Kawasaki, BMW, Ducati) and XDL is becoming a rather popular event with lots of support (it's taken time for riders to learn how to be entertaining, not just technical). Did anyone go to IMS this past weekend? Did you try to see the Ducati stunt show? There is a reason it was absolutely packed, and it's not because it's boring or because nobody is interested. With the proper funding and support, the sky is the limit for this sport. We have people who are actually able to make a living off of it these days, and are out practicing and pushing the technical limits everyday now. I could go on and on, but it'd purely be from my perspective which I doubt would sway many opinions. Z3n posted:Not to talk poo poo about you as a person or anything, I really enjoy your posts on stunting and clanofants/etc, but the most hilarious part of it all is how strung out stunters get about it. You so much as call them on anything and you can promise a huge, multipage meltdown...the threads on stuntride and BARF after someone posted the video of the guy crashing on the bay bridge were hilarious. Yeah, going around in a circle really fast is dumb to the general population, but we've come to terms with that. Somehow, stunters haven't figured that one out yet. Lots of the people who are in the upper echelon of stunt riders these days are laying it all down for it. Quitting their jobs, selling their houses, leaving their lives behind to move to active riding areas, road tripping non-stop, scrapping along to get to event after event, etc. You can't poo poo all over their efforts from atop your high horse without them getting frustrated. Of course there are the type who just get agitated because they are fragile people who desperately need something to feel cool about and don't want you telling them otherwise, but I don't think that they account for a lot of it (and they exist in all facets of life, they aren't particular to stunt riders). I'm neither, I've been riding while working my lovely 9-5 for years now, but it annoys me to see people act so rude for absolutely no reason. Edit: Also, there were immature idiots on both sides of the fence in that situation. Crotchety track day guys saying Bullo deserved to die because he does wheelies on the street. Classy. inolen fucked around with this message at 23:51 on Jan 29, 2010 |
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Jan 29, 2010 23:35
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inolen posted:You can't poo poo all over their efforts from atop your high horse without them getting frustrated. Of course there are the type who just get agitated because they are fragile people who desperately need something to feel cool about and don't want you telling them otherwise, but I don't think that they account for a lot of it... I mean, really - honestly - how many guys in the whole of the U.S. are so very dedicated to being a pro that [/b]they've already quit their day jobs[/b] to do so. 300? 500? How many of those super-dedicated guys are there that also spend lots of time posting on internet forums about it? Conversely, how many more are 'casual' stunters who have day jobs, and the time to sperg out about it on the internet night after night? The threads seem to hold the proportion of A to B that I'd expect. (i.e. Many more of type B...)
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Jan 29, 2010 23:58
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Jabs posted:Having seen the threads in question, I'd be willing to bet that the latter outnumber the former by a very hefty margin. LOL, you're right. I guess anyone running back and forth talking trash in those situations is pretty low on the totem pole of whatever activity they are so fond of. I don't talk to those people often (I'm on my bike, they're on their keyboard) so in my mind it's skewed differently. inolen fucked around with this message at 00:07 on Jan 30, 2010 |
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Jan 30, 2010 00:03
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inolen posted:Exactly. And who besides bitter old curmudgeons run around talking poo poo on skateboarding and racing motorcycles these days? Well, that's the point. Getting strung out about bitter old curmudgeons doesn't do much for anyone, especially not when stunters really need to shed the "underground manchild" image to get mainstream acceptance, or even acceptance from the riding community. It'd also help if they'd stop having sideshows on the loving freeway or blocking the bay bridge. quote:Absolutely not. The new styles and tricks just keep coming, and are not things trial riders have been doing. Regardless, I'm more talking about the legitimization of the sport as a whole. Big factories are stepping in (Yamaha, Kawasaki, BMW, Ducati) and XDL is becoming a rather popular event with lots of support (it's taken time for riders to learn how to be entertaining, not just technical). Did anyone go to IMS this past weekend? Did you try to see the Ducati stunt show? There is a reason it was absolutely packed, and it's not because it's boring or because nobody is interested. With the proper funding and support, the sky is the limit for this sport. We have people who are actually able to make a living off of it these days, and are out practicing and pushing the technical limits everyday now. I could go on and on, but it'd purely be from my perspective which I doubt would sway many opinions. I saw a bit of the Duc stunt show in Long Beach and honestly, it wasn't really anything too exciting. It also was in a horrible location, and the riders spent a bunch of time doing burnouts and stand ups. I can do burnouts and I can fake a stand up reasonably well. I just wasn't that impressed. You say that there's "technical advance" in the field, but I can't see it from where I sit. Most of the stunting videos that I've been impressed by recently have been trials riders, not stunters, as they're doing something besides wheelies in a parking lot. Technical stuff may be rewarding for the rider, but to the rest of us, a dude doing a wheelie and a dude doing a wheelie while holding his front wheel look about the same. And again, not to rip on stunters or anything, but with the proper funding and support, the sky's the limit for anything. Racing, offroad, barrel racing, whatever. gently caress, look at NASCAR. It's boring. It's already at the sky limit for making money. quote:It's because lots of the people who are in the upper echelon of stunt riders these days are laying it all down for it. Quitting their jobs, selling their houses, road tripping non-stop, scrapping along to get to event after event, etc. You can't poo poo all over their efforts from a top your high horse without them getting frustrated. Of course there are the type who just get agitated because they are fragile people who desperately need something to feel cool about and don't want you telling them otherwise, but I don't think that they account for a lot of it (and they exist in all facets of life, they aren't particular to stunt riders). I'm neither, I've been riding while working my bullshit 9-5 for years now, but it annoys me to see people act so rude for absolutely no reason. And people have sacrificed everything for decades in every form of competition out there. Kevin Schwantz is missing bones in his hand because he voted to have them removed rather than letting them heal so he could race. But he understood that when he did that he was a racer and that's what racers do. Destroying your body, destroying your finances, destroying everything that you've ever worked for and earned to ride fast? That's just what you do to win. The rest, the haters, the everyone else? They don't matter a goddamn bit. In the end: If you care what anyone else thinks, you're doing it for the wrong reason, be it stunting, racing, trials, enduro, whatever. So many stunters devote so much time to flipping out on the internet, that it's just hilarious to see a bunch of dudes all tatted up and hardcore flipping out about punk rear end bitches on the internet. When stunting stops being the easiest group of people to troll ever, it'll start to gain some legitimacy. Until then, it's just seen as a bunch of children playing in a parking lot. And don't get me wrong, there's a bunch of dipshit assclown racers out there too. And they do stupid poo poo and we all laugh at them...the bright side to racing is they tend to smear themselves across the road or the track and give it up after one too many crashes  You guys don't get the loving hand of Darwin weeding out your spot.
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Jan 30, 2010 00:12
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inolen posted:Yea, kind of like racing, once you've seen one dude drag knee you've seen it all. Or maybe like skateboarding, once you've seen one dude flip a little board, you've seen it all. Trying to delegitimize an entire sub-culture of motorcycle with sweeping generalizations like that just makes you look ignorant. Wow, someone didn't get laid last night. I don't have anything against stuntin' in principle. If that's your thing, knock yourself out. There's certainly skill involved in doing the more technical stunts...but the list of those is so drat short. And most racing is boring as gently caress. Its only interesting if there's a battle for position going on. Rossi walking everyone else by 20 seconds is just as boring as the stuntas doing the same 5 variants of wheelies and seatstands over and over. And I'm just going to second what z3n said. Now, let's get back to pictures since this is the loving picture thread. Here's a Dnepr
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Jan 30, 2010 00:38
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Z3n posted:When stunting stops being the easiest group of people to troll ever, it'll start to gain some legitimacy. Until then, it's just seen as a bunch of children playing in a parking lot. It's just as easy to rile up a bunch of mediocre track day riders as it is a bunch of stunters on the internet, stunters are just more of a minority. Z3n posted:In the end: If you care what anyone else thinks, you're doing it for the wrong reason, be it stunting, racing, trials, enduro, whatever. So many stunters devote so much time to flipping out on the internet, that it's just hilarious to see a bunch of dudes all tatted up and hardcore flipping out about punk rear end bitches on the internet. I'm posting my opinion just as redscare posted his. But because I'm pro stunting I'm doing something for the wrong reason? LOL! I'd be more eager to vote that anyone who rides motorcycles and sits around bad mouthing and making blanket insults to a whole group of dedicated motorcyclists who don't ride them in the exact way they do is "doing it for the wrong reason." I enjoy riding, that's the bottom line. Maybe you've never been that involved or passionate about something, but every single person who is/has been cares, to varying degrees, about what other people think. inolen fucked around with this message at 00:57 on Jan 30, 2010 |
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Jan 30, 2010 00:51
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inolen posted:It's just as easy to rile up a bunch of mediocre track day riders as it is a bunch of stunters on the internet, stunters are just more of a minority. Not really. I can't count the last time I saw a forum invasion because someone talked poo poo about track riders. Sure, you can go and bait morons anywhere, but stunters seem to devote a unique amount of attention to online BS. quote:I enjoy riding, that's the bottom line. Then why do you care what anyone else thinks? Are they going to change the way you feel about it? Are they going to devalue your involvement in it? For me, the answer to those questions is no, so...who cares how much fun people make? Who cares what old bitter curmudgeons or random people on the internet think? When you hit the point where you're 1500$ in the hole for that weekend alone and then you crash your bike, and suddenly you're 3k more in the hole, you're duct taping your leathers back together and frantically sprinting through the pits to find a helmet, a master cylinder, and some pegs so that you can go out and race...you just have to take a moment to look at yourself and realize what an special form of complete idiot you are. You're dumb for doing this. Everything about this sport is loving retarded. You're talking about an inherently unstable vehicle, dragging body parts on the ground at 100mph, and dressing up in a leather suit to go hang out at starbucks. Tires that cost 500$ a pair and shred in 50 miles. It's hilarious. Everything about it is one big clusterfuck of stupidity. Whatever someone calls me, whatever someone says about me, or racing, or anything else that I do on a bike, simply cannot compare to how utterly retarded it really is.
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Jan 30, 2010 01:14
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