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GEMorris posted:Save yourself the time: http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=65138&cat=1,41080,51225&ap=1 I've got a couple of these lying around:  I'm going to cut one to size and drill a hole in it for now. Should work great.
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Mar 4, 2010 22:10
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The arbor on my table saw is too short to fit my whole dado stack. Generally this isn't a problem, but it still annoys me. Is it possible to just get a longer arbor and replace it?
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Mar 4, 2010 22:22
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Got the big pieces painted an tags back on. All the internals are still a rusty mess. Also, haven't started on the stand or wiring. I'm seriously considering putting a 3 phase motor (already have) and a VFD on this for variable speed, as the lowest speed it has is 900 RPM. Too fast for bowls. Just don't have funds to spring for the VFD and get a chuck at the same time. Choices.
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Mar 5, 2010 21:26
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I know poo poo about band saws brands/options/etc. Can someone take a quick look at this and tell me if it's worth the $200 they're asking? http://desmoines.craigslist.org/tls/1625891264.html Otherwise, there's this Delta for $75... http://desmoines.craigslist.org/tls/1619885675.html Anyhow, just looking for a little guidance here from those who know more than I.  Of course, if it'll do what I need, I'd rather pay $75...
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Mar 5, 2010 21:49
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Bad Munki posted:I know poo poo about band saws brands/options/etc. Can someone take a quick look at this and tell me if it's worth the $200 they're asking? Both of those are not worth owning I am sorry to say. I would say the cheapest NEW option that is not throwing your money in a hole is the 12" Craftsman that Sears now sells. Their line is very similar to that Rikon (they may in fact be the same saws), which has become the general value standard for bandsaws. Personally I wouldn't gently caress with anything short of 14" but finances are finances. http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00922400000P?vName=Tools&cName=Bench+%26+Stationary+Power+Tools&sName=Band+Saws http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00921059000P?vName=Tools&cName=Bench+%26+Stationary+Power+Tools&sName=Band+Saws If you are going to step above the standard 14" rikon, step all the way to the 18". I don't feel that the 14" Deluxe is worth the premium. In the used market, the only thing to look for is the Delta 14" and larger, as well as the knock offs like jet etc. Many of these saws are clapped the hell out though, and they were never terribly rigid to start with. The modern steel framed saws are superior in nearly every way. 14" Deltas tend to be the honda civic of bandsaws as well, people spend more than the saw costs trying to get them to perform, and in the end they have an economy tool with a bunch of bells and whistles hanging off of it. You have not said how much space you have, or anything about your power supply. This is important info. While I was at the Sears site I noticed the Sheppach saw, and while I have no experience with them, a look at their website nearly caused me to mess my pants. Their lineup seems to be similar to that of INCA before they shut down the tool division, and very similar to the stationery tools that Metabo sells in Europe. Here's hoping that Sears carries more of their stuff. http://www.scheppach.com/no_cache/en/products/products-overview/categories/werkstatt.html GEMorris fucked around with this message at 22:27 on Mar 5, 2010 |
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Mar 5, 2010 22:15
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Well, that's fine. I was just throwing those out there just in case. I was just hoping to not spend more than a couple few hundred bucks, since I've already spent what ought to be my summer's budget.  If it comes down to it and I get a wild hare up my rear end to really get on this, I'm sure I could rationalize spending 400-500, but we'll see.
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Mar 5, 2010 22:28
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Bad Munki posted:Well, that's fine. I was just throwing those out there just in case. I was just hoping to not spend more than a couple few hundred bucks, since I've already spent what ought to be my summer's budget. Keep an eye on the woodnet.net and sawmillcreek.com for sale forums. What floorspace do you have for this? Because a machine from a shop auction is often a great bang for the buck. Do you have the means to move anything like an 18" bandsaw? I have moved 2,000lbs of lead type with a VW Golf and a trailer, so a truck is not necessary per-se.
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Mar 6, 2010 05:04
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Ok, a few things. 1. Do not start a large project using only red oak boards from Lowe's. Once you cross the $1000 mark, you will want to kill yourself. 2. I don't think I'm doing the hand plane thing right. I have a tiny Stanley trim plane that is a million times more effective than either of my 8" planes. I'm content to think that planing will have to be something I master later in life. 3. Here's a birch ply coffee table I designed and built a few years ago. It isn't built to last, but it served its purpose and I love the look of it.
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Mar 6, 2010 21:48
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iwannabebobdylan posted:Wow, it looks ginormous for a coffee table, or is it just a trick of perspective?
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Mar 6, 2010 23:24
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wormil posted:Wow, it looks ginormous for a coffee table, or is it just a trick of perspective? 48 long, 18 wide, 19 tall. DON'T PUT YOUR FEET ON THE CANTILEVER END!
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Mar 6, 2010 23:41
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I finally got around to building an assembly/outfeed table for my new table saw. I found some great plywood/particle board styles like this online and decided to copy. I will be adding some caster wheels that can be pulled up in the future, just didn't have the effort to do it today. 
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Mar 7, 2010 01:03
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wormil posted:Yikes, this sounds scary. I would probably just use a handsaw to make those cheek cuts. Late response is late, my apologies. I assume by cheek cuts we are referring to the same thing which is cutting the "shoulders" that the 2x4s will sit in/on? Would a jigsaw work? Seems like it would be a good tool for the job.
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Mar 7, 2010 07:33
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Cheek cuts are 90deg from shoulder cuts. It's the material that is often removed by several dado passes.
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Mar 7, 2010 17:00
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bandsaws make short work of tenon cheeks (and every other cut needed to make a tenon for that matter). If you don't have a bandsaw then use a backsaw by hand, as it was intended for such cuts. A jigsaw is far too rough and uncontrollable for such work. You don't need piston fit accuracy, but glue can only bridge so large of a gap.
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Mar 7, 2010 18:35
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Does anyone have any good recommendations for UK timber suppliers who carry board lengths over 18 feet? (I'm in London, but if they can deliver I don't mind ordering) I'm mulling over a possible project in my mind -a strip built kayak- but want to get an idea of possible suppliers and costs for red cedar or white pine (it's very important that its knot free) before I dedicate myself to the build. Thought some of you guys might have some ideas.
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Mar 8, 2010 00:30
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anaemic posted:Does anyone have any good recommendations for UK timber suppliers who carry board lengths over 18 feet? (I'm in London, but if they can deliver I don't mind ordering) Dude, I don't know where to find boards that long in the US, much less in the UK. You might want to try here though.
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Mar 8, 2010 02:31
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WildFoxMedia posted:Late response is late, my apologies. Maybe I'm imagining something very different than what you are actually doing. I had an image of you cutting (ripping) down through the end of the 2x4 with a circular saw, to make the shoulders and cheeks. In theory it could be done but the kickback potential is scary.
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Mar 8, 2010 16:13
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So apparantly Minwax Poly can remove Oil based Gel Stain from knot's in Pine because the knots are so dense with Sap that it barely absorbs any stain. These are doors for a dart board cabinet, the stain didn't ruin my piece but was enough to annoy me, has more of a rustic look now is all:  Also, I hate endgrain staining. It looks worse in this picture because of the sunlight but it's actually not too bad. MarshallX fucked around with this message at 16:50 on Mar 8, 2010 |
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Mar 8, 2010 16:44
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This is why I frequently recommend dye instead of stain, you avoid splotching and other common problems.
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Mar 8, 2010 17:03
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wormil posted:This is why I frequently recommend dye instead of stain, you avoid splotching and other common problems. I don't mean to come across like I am disagreeing with you, as you certainly seem to know your stuff, but I take an even harder stance in that I pretty much shun pigment stain altogether. I just don't understand the logic in building something out of pine then smearing it with "classic heritage walnut stain" when you could have just built whatever it was out of walnut in the first place and finished it with shellac, oil, varnish, or something along those lines. Any wood (even pine) is quite beautiful on its own. It doesn't need any help from stain. It just seems like there is this unwritten rule that the only way to finish a woodworking project is "STAIN AND POLY". I love Norm just as much as the next guy, but I have the feeling that stain and poly mentality came from New Yankee Workshop. I didn't mean for this whole post to be a lead in to an advertisement, but it was Flexner's book "Understanding Wood Finishing" that really opened my eyes and showed me that there are a heck of a lot of alternatives to "STAIN AND POLY". Shellac is where its at
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Mar 8, 2010 17:35
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^^^ The only argument I can think against your view is when wood cost is prohibitive, which is probably why stains/dyes come out so often.wormil posted:This is why I frequently recommend dye instead of stain, you avoid splotching and other common problems. I went to look for some dye instead of stain the other day- had no luck at Lowes. Know if Home Depot or another 'home center' carries the dye packets? I ended up having a similar problem to MarshallX with coverage on my plane's handle/knob, but it looks good enough and the rustic look fits it. However, I think in the future I'm going to mostly steer clear of stains if I can find somewhere around here that actually stocks dye.
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Mar 8, 2010 17:38
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SkunkDuster posted:Shellac is where its at Also not a big fan of stains or anything that changes the color of the wood, really. And yeah, while the cost may affect your choice of wood, that's okay, enjoy the type of wood for what it is. Danish oil is nice, and really makes those colors pop. I think the last time I stained anything was in wood shop in high school. Completely unrelated: anybody in this thread from Iowa? I have some wood I'd like to resaw, but I've decided I shouldn't let myself buy a bandsaw at this juncture. More for keeping good relations with the wife than anything else, but still...and while I could resaw my pieces on the table saw, it's just so drat wasteful. But if I were able to find someone in the area, I'm sure we could work out a reasonable deal, maybe some homebrewed beer or some other form of compensation (no gay stuff). Anyhow, just thought I'd throw that out there on the off chance someone was in the area. Des Moines, specifically.
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Mar 8, 2010 17:50
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Many people choose to use stains so they don't have to lay out the bucks for a wood like walnut, but want the color to match other pieces or decor in the room. I too normally prefer not using any dyes, pigments, stains, etc., and leaving the natural beauty of the wood, however, they do have their place in some circumstances.
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Mar 8, 2010 18:43
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SkunkDuster posted:I just don't understand the logic in building something out of pine then smearing it with "classic heritage walnut stain" when you could have just built whatever it was out of walnut in the first place and finished it with shellac, oil, varnish, or something along those lines. All I can say is that not everyone has the same taste. You can either accept that or go the route of, "my way is the only way and anything else is wrong" which is a clear path to eternal frustration. There are woods like poplar, maple, mahogany and birch that can be enriched with stains or dyes. I actually used a red mahogany stain on my mahogany table because I wanted a deeper, richer color. I think the most common use for stain/dye among hobbyists is to simulate patina or just darken the wood. Dye also comes in non-wood colors -- red, blue, green, black. Stain and dyes have been around for a long time, far longer than New Yankee Workshop. In commercial applications they are used to hide imperfections, to intentionally obscure the grain and to blend dissimilar woods. The process is actually fairly elaborate. And yeah, I love shellac also but I made the mistake of using it on end tables. Not a good idea when you have a sloppy drunk relative. benitocereno posted:if I can find somewhere around here that actually stocks dye. I buy mine at a local woodworking store, I doubt you'll find them at chain hardware stores. It doesn't have to be marketed specifically for woodworking though, just search for aniline dye. They can be mixed with either alcohol or water but water will raise the grain so keep that in mind.
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Mar 8, 2010 19:01
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wormil posted:There are woods like poplar, maple, mahogany and birch that can be enriched with stains or dyes. I actually used a red mahogany stain on my mahogany table because I wanted a deeper, richer color. I think the most common use for stain/dye among hobbyists is to simulate patina or just darken the wood. That's why I'm a such sucker for shellac. With all the tints availabale, it can really deepen and enrich the color without messing up the natural grain. wormil posted:Dye also comes in non-wood colors -- red, blue, green, black. I have no gripe with dyes. My whole rant was against pigment stains. I have some maple burl offcuts that I have tried various (non dye) finishes on and none of them looked good. I've never used dyes, but I have no doubt that they would be the way to go for something like that. There are also a lot of guitars out there made from figured woods that look absolutely beautiful in their unnatural dyed colors. wormil posted:Stain and dyes have been around for a long time, far longer than New Yankee Workshop. Of course you are right. I was referring more to the mentality of, "I just built this piece of furniture, now I am going to stain and poly it because that is what you do with wood". That's where the NYW influence comes in. I used to think that way, too, because I thought that just how it was done and had no idea that there were other ways you could finish wood. I didn't have a clue about shellac, oils, varnish, or any other finishing method other than stain and poly. So that was just they way it was done. wormil posted:And yeah, I love shellac also but I made the mistake of using it on end tables. Not a good idea when you have a sloppy drunk relative. You speak the truth. As wonderful as shellac is, it does have some serious drawbacks in certain situations. I'll concede that sometimes poly is the way to go, but STAIN IS WRONG AND IF YOU ARE PUTTING STAIN ON YOUR PROJECT THEN YOU ARE WRONG BECAUSE MY WAY IS THE ONLY RIGHT WAY
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Mar 8, 2010 20:02
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I actually rarely use stain or dye because I hate finishing. There, I said it -- I hate finishing. I don't mind wiping something down with oil or an oil/varnish, shellac isn't too bad but I absolutely hate messing with poly. It looks like rear end if you get it on too thick and if you get it on too thin then it doesn't provide much more protection than shellac. I tend to prefer oil based varnish over poly but it isn't much easier to work with. Occasionally I'll buy spray lacquer and go that route but spray cans are more expensive.
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Mar 8, 2010 20:14
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I was being a cheapass and went with Pine for my doors instead of properly jointing two pieces of nice wood. Bottom line. I've learned from my mistakes and the Minwax colored stains & poly will never see the light of day again. Shellac for life.
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Mar 8, 2010 20:40
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MarshallX posted:I was being a cheapass and went with Pine for my doors instead of properly jointing two pieces of nice wood. Bottom line. Do you mind elaborating a little more for the newbies like me. What would be "nice wood" and whats the problem with Miniwax? Edit: I missed your previous post and I just read up on Shellac.. Though I would like to know what is considered to be nice wood Bicho6 fucked around with this message at 22:11 on Mar 8, 2010 |
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Mar 8, 2010 21:38
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I like pine and have made several things from it but it's actually not an easy wood to work or finish though it is inexpensive. By nice woods he probably means the popular North American hardwoods like cherry, oak, maple and walnut. Poplar is probably one of the best woods for beginners because it's inexpensive, easy to work, fairly strong and finishes easily. And Minwax is just a brand, I think Skunkduster is mostly opposed to staining wood to resemble other wood, an opinion shared by many woodworkers. I think it's generally a bad idea to stain something like cherry (which doesn't stain well anyway) or walnut since both those woods are beautiful and there really isn't any reason to use them if you're going to stain them. But, you can use stain or dye to simulate patina rather than wait 30 years for it to happen naturally and I'm not really opposed to that. Another benefit of dye over stain is that dye doesn't obscure the grain. wormil fucked around with this message at 22:46 on Mar 8, 2010 |
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Mar 8, 2010 22:36
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wormil posted:Maybe I'm imagining something very different than what you are actually doing. I had an image of you cutting (ripping) down through the end of the 2x4 with a circular saw, to make the shoulders and cheeks. In theory it could be done but the kickback potential is scary. I haven't even been able to attempt doing the cheek cuts more then a couple times because I couldn't even get the shoulder cuts correct. Almost every time I did a shoulder cut I either cut too much which sank the other 2x4 too low, or didn't cut enough then mangled it terribly with a chisel. In 90% of the cuts they were too hosed up to use and never sat flush on the top and/or sides.
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Mar 9, 2010 00:12
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Bicho6 posted:Do you mind elaborating a little more for the newbies like me. Oak, Walnut, Mahogany, Cherry, Maple, Rosewood...all these I would love to start working more in. Pine is relatively cheap, and available in craft boards so I avoided having to joint two planks together....never again.
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Mar 9, 2010 00:15
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A couple of years ago my wife took down the door to the broom closet, painted it and let it dry outside. The result of leaving it outside was a warped door, its functional but just looks ugly. I have been thinking about a first project for woodworking and I figured I would jump right into the semi-deep end and give this a shot. I figured if my first project was something that I actually needed I would invest more time and patience. Click here for the full 2048x1536 image. I have been doing a lot of research on how I construct the door and it looks like It will be a tongue and groove joints with raised paneling. I will have to use a cove raised panel bit in the router to get that look I want. One of my questions is how do I not mess up the width of the door. Since the tongue of the panel has to go into the groove I'm foreseeing myself really messing that up. Since i'm panting over it I dont need anything fancy wood, pine should do, but i'm a little intimidate when I walk into the home depot lumber section. What should I be looking for and how much. The door is 77"x11-5/8" I hope to get this start possibly this weekend and keep your guys up to date.
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Mar 9, 2010 01:37
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I've built panel cabinet doors but never an interior door. If you're going to paint it I would pick popular maybe even soft maple. I wouldn't use pine unless you actually wanted a pine door.
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Mar 9, 2010 03:43
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SkunkDuster posted:...I love Norm just as much as the next guy... I don't mean to come across like I am disagreeing with you, as you certainly seem to know your stuff, but I take an even harder stance in that I pretty much hate Nahm and how he helped turn woodworking from a craft into a gimmicky sales pitch for more gimmicky and poorly constructed power tools the viewers did not really need. (Aside from that, I am with you 100%. I thought of posting something similar but less well written, but decided not to as it always seems like I am contradicting wormil) RE: The Pine Discussion: Southern Yellow Pine is loving beautiful. It is one of my favorite woods to work, and to look at in a completed piece. If you compose your piece with the boards you have, selecting the most pleasing grain patterns, Then I contest that you can make a SYP piece that will rival nearly any other wood in aesthetic appeal as long as the viewer is able to leave behind any residual class prejudices against less costly materials. SYP also has some pretty amazing physical characteristics, including a notable "stiffness to weight" ratio that is nearly unmatched. Its downfall is of course the fact that the surface is not terribly hard (different from stiffness, which is the resistance to deflection of the entire piece, whereas hardness is resistance to dents in the surface of the part). Please note that just any old pine in a hardware store may not be SYP, but SUP will be labeled as such and can be bought in most borg hardware stores below and east of the "SYP Line" If you live below the "SYP Belt" I encourage you to get a good clear piece from your local borg, let it acclimatize in your shop for two weeks, and then make a pair of nesting sawbenches. If you don't love SYP and sawbenches after that, THEN YOU MUST BE MENTALLY DEFICIENT AS MY WAY IS THE ONLY RIGHT WAY
GEMorris fucked around with this message at 04:58 on Mar 9, 2010 |
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Mar 9, 2010 04:43
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GEMorris posted:I pretty much hate Nahm and how he helped turn woodworking from a craft into a gimmicky sales pitch for more gimmicky and poorly constructed power tools the viewers did not really need. Are you saying that I don't need to fire a thousand brads into my project to hold it together until the glue dries? I need to rethink my whole philosophy now. I never caught many episodes of Woodwright's Shop, but when I did, I always liked that show. Roy would come out and say "Today, we are going to make a rolltop desk using an axe and a spokeshave" and, sure enough, 30 minutes later, he would have a rolltop desk he made using an axe and a spokeshave. Okay, that was a bit of an exaggeration, but it was pretty cool to watch him work.
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Mar 9, 2010 06:12
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GEMorris posted:...but decided not to as it always seems like I am contradicting wormil Ha ha, go for it. I grew up with an uncle was who was one of those, "there is a right way, a wrong way, and my way" about everything and more often than not, his way wasn't particularly clever or efficient. So I sort of grew up with the intention of being open minded which is tough because I do like things done a certain way.  So especially when it comes to something like wood, I don't try to place the wood above the woodworker, if they want to smear honey oak stain on a piece of cherry then who am I to tell them it's tacky. It's their stuff, they have to live with it. But then if someone wants to use a dye to simulate fumed white oak, I don't see anything wrong with that. Or if they want to fill the pores with a very dark filler to create greater contrast, it doesn't bother me.Another softwood I really like is northern white cedar. My father-in-law lives on an island in Lake Michigan and can buy cedar from the local mill dirt cheap. It's gorgeous wood. SkunkDuster posted:Are you saying that I don't need to fire a thousand brads into my project to hold it together until the glue dries? I need to rethink my whole philosophy now. I met Roy at the state fair a couple of years ago and I really wanted to spend more time talking to him but he seemed to be in extreme pain. His face was distorted into an ugly grimace and he seemed very uncomfortable so I had mercy and decided to leave him alone. When it comes to Norm I look at it like this... watching someone else make these projects inspires me to want to make things too and even if I use different techniques I still enjoy watching.
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Mar 9, 2010 07:57
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Maybe you fine woodworking gents can help me out. I'm finishing a room off. Long story short, there's a section by the window about 9 feet long, 9.5 inches wide that Im turning into a ledge. I have a piece of pine cut and routed that needs to be finished. It's going to be painted. The first challenge is dealing with a few small knots. 2 are hollow about half-inch in diameter and need to be filled. The other few are slightly larger solid. My first idea was to drill out all the knots and replace their core with a circle of non-knotty pine. The other option was to fill in the hollow knots and just work over the others. Would the primer be enough to cover the solid knots. Any other gotchas I might encounter. Obviously I need to fill the small hollow one. Second, I know pine has a tendency to cup-up a bit. Any advise to keep the ledge level once its mounted in place?
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Mar 9, 2010 15:05
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FidgetyRat posted:The first challenge is dealing with a few small knots. 2 are hollow about half-inch in diameter and need to be filled. The other few are slightly larger solid. My first idea was to drill out all the knots and replace their core with a circle of non-knotty pine. How do you plan to make these circles of non-knotty pine? You didn't mention what tools you have available. Since it is being painted, I would drill them out then either use a hole saw to make plugs (keeping the orientation of the plug grain the same as the board), or make the plugs out of a piece of dowel. For the larger knots, I would think you could just pry out any loose lovely parts of the knot that look like they might eventually fall out, then just fill it with wood filler. Another option I have seen people use (but haven't tried myself) is to fill the voids with super glue or epoxy. FidgetyRat posted:Second, I know pine has a tendency to cup-up a bit. Any advise to keep the ledge level once its mounted in place? Unless it is quarter sawn, it is going to cup to some extent. Cupping is a result of moisture exchange causing the wood to swell and shrink unevenly depending on the humidity. If the humidity in the room is fairly consistent year round, I wouldn't worry about it much. wormil posted:I met Roy at the state fair a couple of years ago and I really wanted to spend more time talking to him but he seemed to be in extreme pain. His face was distorted into an ugly grimace and he seemed very uncomfortable so I had mercy and decided to leave him alone. That makes me sad to hear. I hope it was just a temporary condition. He always seemed so energetic and had such a passion for his work.
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Mar 9, 2010 16:01
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Thanks. I think the plan at the moment is to make the plugs. I need to check the size of the largest knot when I get home, but I have enough of the original board as scrap that I can form some plugs from. I think the largest one is about 1" diameter and theres only a total of maybe 4 on the whole board and are all centered, so it shouldn't be too hard. I'll pick up a hole bit once I get the right size. I'm hoping that a mixture of having all sides of the board primed and painted will prevent too much moisture exchange. I don't live in any extreme climate, so I don't think we'll have too much cupping. I'm hoping the fasteners will hold it in place. Since its a ledge, I have the entire front of the board that can be nailed down to the stud below and 3 4" sections in the back. Also plan on putting some shoe molding along the contact points with the wall and some chair rail molding underneath, so shifting shouldn't be that much of an issue. I believe the boards are quarter sawn if the image I found is accurate. It had a bit of a U shape from the store to begin with. FidgetyRat fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Mar 9, 2010 |
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Mar 9, 2010 16:08
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wormil posted:I met Roy at the state fair a couple of years ago and I really wanted to spend more time talking to him but he seemed to be in extreme pain. His face was distorted into an ugly grimace and he seemed very uncomfortable so I had mercy and decided to leave him alone. Roy is a really great guy, he does have some bad chronic back pain IIRC and you probably caught him at a bad time. His new woodworking school in Pittsboro is neat and worth a visit if you ever are in the area. Make sure he will be there first of course. I met him and Christopher Schwarz there when Schwarz was writing an article on the place for Popular Woodworking. Both were awesome guys and much more deserving of the "face of woodworking" mantle than Nahm ever was. Schwarz is incredibly cerebral and academic about his research, but also incredibly engaging, not a common combo.
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Mar 9, 2010 16:33
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