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frozenphil posted:I just ran the numbers and it's going to cost me almost $700 for my 6k mile valve adjustment and new tires. Riding a bike sure is cheaper than driving a car! That must be paying the dealer to do the valve adjustment, right? I've read it isn't all that terrible on a Ninja 250, couldn't you save some serious money doing it yourself?
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May 14, 2010 19:18
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quote:I just ran the numbers and it's going to cost me almost $700 for my 6k mile valve adjustment and new tires. Riding a bike sure is cheaper than driving a car! Valve adjustments are just a myth anyways. Ride that bitch into the ground!
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May 14, 2010 19:20
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Weinertron posted:That must be paying the dealer to do the valve adjustment, right? I've read it isn't all that terrible on a Ninja 250, couldn't you save some serious money doing it yourself? Yeah, $280 for the valve adjustment. I think you may be thinking of the previous generation Ninja 250's valve adjustment, which isn't bad. The current gen, which I own, is a bitch and a half. This looks completely worth paying someone $280 to do. http://www.theyeagergroup.com/2008_ninja_250_valve_clearance.htm
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May 14, 2010 19:20
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Jabs posted:On what, with who? KLR650, el cheapo outfit here in SoCal. Like $700 for comprehensive (ok so I have two wrecks and a ticket, but still, its a loving KLR) and $200-some for uninsured. Mind you I'm payin $300 for the KLR and FZR for basic liability.
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May 14, 2010 19:24
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Ohh, you have a new-gen. That explains everything. I'm probably going to be paying the dealer to check / do the valves on my SV650, but that's only due every 14.5K miles. Parallel twin still can't be as bad as a V-twin, though. I'm curious what book labor rate will be for my valves.
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May 14, 2010 19:25
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On the plus side, I'm using the more frequent valve adjustment requirement angle to haggle with my wife for a new bike.
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May 14, 2010 19:40
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frozenphil posted:I just ran the numbers and it's going to cost me almost $700 for my 6k mile valve adjustment and new tires. Riding a bike sure is cheaper than driving a car! Unless the bike is running like poo poo, it's unlikely your valves are too far out of adjustment. Since checking the clearance is the same procedure for both the old and the new bikes (ie. mostly just disassembling things far enough to get the valve cover off), you might consider just doing that, since it will save you $280 if you don't have any valves out of spec. Also, $420 for new tires? That sounds a bit steep.
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May 14, 2010 19:55
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sectoidman posted:Unless the bike is running like poo poo, it's unlikely your valves are too far out of adjustment. Since checking the clearance is the same procedure for both the old and the new bikes (ie. mostly just disassembling things far enough to get the valve cover off), you might consider just doing that, since it will save you $280 if you don't have any valves out of spec. I'm not going to skimp on the valves in an engine that spends >90% of its life over 10k RPM, or 3k RPM below redline, however you want to look at it. The job looks like a royal bitch and $280 does not seem out of line to me. The tires are going to cost roughly $340 ($102 front, $127 rear, $56 each to mount with the tire on the bike). The actual price is a little over $650 before tax and shop fees and stuff, which is almost $700 when you're poor like me. I'm not adverse to doing my own work. I've just done enough of my own work to know when it is worth it to have someone else do it and when it isn't. Their tire prices are right inline with what I found online with shipping. Their tire mounting prices are inline with what everyone charges around here. I'm not complaining about the price, just pointing out that increased maintenance intervals and tire replacement are the major parts of why it is no cheaper to daily drive a motorcycle than a car. frozenphil fucked around with this message at 20:12 on May 14, 2010 |
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May 14, 2010 20:07
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Just a an odd thought...do you compensate the valve adjustment schedule for time, or is it just straight miles? My manual just indicates 16,000 miles...and I'll probably hit that this summer. The bike is 28 years old, though, it might not hurt it to do is 4k early 
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May 14, 2010 20:15
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frozenphil posted:I'm not going to skimp on the valves in an engine that spends >90% of its life over 10k RPM, or 3k RPM below redline, however you want to look at it. The job looks like a royal bitch and $280 does not seem out of line to me. The tires are going to cost roughly $340 ($102 front, $127 rear, $56 each to mount with the tire on the bike). The actual price is a little over $650 before tax and shop fees and stuff, which is almost $700 when you're poor like me. Well, I have to say this. Regarding the tires you need to man up and either pull the wheels yourself and take them in, or man up further and do the tire removal and installation yourself. It ISN'T that hard. In fact, it is far easier than doing motocross tires IMO. I did a front change last night for the first time on a tubeless. Besides having to do a hillbilly job to break the bead because I didn't really have correct tools, it was as simple as could be. Having a stealership do work for you will make the cost of owning ANYTHING out of the range of most mortals. I bought some T-Rex stands from eBay for $150 after shipping and will do the work on my bike myself, saving a butt load of cash. Granted, valve adjustments are a bear on your bike, but to me I don't make enough money that I couldn't justify taking even 8 hours of my time to do the check/adjustment. Really, owning a motorcycle isn't about saving a few bucks in cash. It is extremely possible and likely that you will do this, but it is more about being on two wheels and enjoying your time so much more. Edit : I am not saying you don't know how to do the work, but you have a bike that as you said, spends a lot of it's time above 10K, that will wear on ANY engine, not just a bike. Be happy you aren't riding a 4 stroke MX bike, I would be happy to have had the valves done for less than $400~500 from a dealer. mAlfunkti0n fucked around with this message at 20:27 on May 14, 2010 |
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May 14, 2010 20:22
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mAlfunkti0n posted:Well, I have to say this. Regarding the tires you need to man up and either pull the wheels yourself and take them in, or man up further and do the tire removal and installation yourself. It's going there to get the valves adjusted anyway. It's not worth the hassle to save $25/wheel. I understand that some of you are just offended by the idea of having someone else work on your bike. I do all of the regular maintenance stuff outside of valve adjustments and tire replacements. I'm not going to do those two jobs ever. I already have one vehicle that I am doing everything to after starting a job on it to replace a broken cam. I don't need another 14 year old project. If you're the kind of person who can dive into a complex job, get it done in a weekend, and then feel better about yourself knowing you saved a bunch of money, great. I'm not. I'd rather just ride the bitch, do simple maintenance, and hand off the really lovely jobs to others.
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May 14, 2010 20:31
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frozenphil posted:It's going there to get the valves adjusted anyway. It's not worth the hassle to save $25/wheel. I am by no means offended that you don't want to do that work, everyone is free to do whatever they want with their own stuff. I guess my point being is that having a dealer do anything is going to cost you a fortune. With even some basic tools, you could do a tire change yourself the easy way the first time around. Seriously, I HATE doing tire changes, but I was impressed with how easy it was on my bike last night, and that was using two 15" irons. Basically, you need to get a different bike, that 250 is going to rape you in expenses if you plan on beating on it like it needs to be. 
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May 14, 2010 20:34
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frozenphil posted:I just ran the numbers and it's going to cost me almost $700 for my 6k mile valve adjustment and new tires. Riding a bike sure is cheaper than driving a car! I feel your pain... 2500 miles until my Duc needs a $800 service. Ow ow ow ow
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May 14, 2010 20:36
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mAlfunkti0n posted:Basically, you need to get a different bike, that 250 is going to rape you in expenses if you plan on beating on it like it needs to be. Yerp. I plan on getting to around 10k miles on it or so just so I feel like I got my money's worth and then picking up a 650r, FZ6, or SV650. They all seem to be ideal for the type of riding I do; commuting a long ways with parts of that commute on fast and twisty mountain roads.
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May 14, 2010 20:41
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frozenphil posted:Yerp. I plan on getting to around 10k miles on it or so just so I feel like I got my money's worth and then picking up a 650r, FZ6, or SV650. They all seem to be ideal for the type of riding I do; commuting a long ways with parts of that commute on fast and twisty mountain roads. Yeah you won't need to have it pegged all the time, unless you want to. A 250 @ 10K rpm is great if you are racing it ... but sucks for pretty much anything else. You should see all the guys on 250 four stroke MX'ers at the tracks. I have seen so many bad things go wrong with them, the best was the rod punching out of the bottom of the case after destroying the wrist pin. That was a hoot.
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May 14, 2010 20:44
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frozenphil posted:It's going there to get the valves adjusted anyway. It's not worth the hassle to save $25/wheel. You could seriously do the entire job in under 4 hours, I don't know what it is about 250 owners that do writeups that makes them seem like everything is a huge deal. Goddanm, I could do the entire check in less time then he spent writing about it. And 56$ to mount and balance per tire is loving rape. 112$ for what's a 30 minute job even for a shade tree mofo like myself? That's loving absurd. I'd be pissed, not because it's a pain in the rear end or anything (the check isn't, the adjustment is), but because you're getting loving taken for a ride on those prices. The check is essentially "remove valve cover, insert feelers". There's no way you can break anything on a valve check unless you started hitting the cams with a hammer. And I'd bet that they don't need to be adjusted but you'll pay the full adjustment cost anyways.
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May 14, 2010 21:18
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Being too lazy to take the wheels off the bike and bring them to the shop to get em mounted is a stupid thing to be too lazy to do. You say you're poor and yet you're setting money on fire.
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May 14, 2010 21:28
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Z3n posted:You could seriously do the entire job in under 4 hours Have you seen a 2008+ Ninja 250 in person? It would take 4 hours just to get to the valve covers. redscare posted:Being too lazy to take the wheels off the bike and bring them to the shop to get em mounted is a stupid thing to be too lazy to do. I am taking the bike there anyway, what am I going to do, remove the wheels in the parking lot and put the bike up on blocks?
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May 14, 2010 21:39
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Hughmoris posted:You and me both, buddy. Everyone that sees my KLR kind of turns their nose up since its not a HAWG or supersport. Where's the love for dual-sports? I love seeing a KLR when I'm out riding. That tractor noise is 
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May 14, 2010 21:46
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frozenphil posted:I am taking the bike there anyway, what am I going to do, remove the wheels in the parking lot and put the bike up on blocks? I've actually done this before, it wasn't even terribly difficult. Of course, I was using the centerstand and not some random blocks, but still.
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May 14, 2010 22:13
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frozenphil posted:I am taking the bike there anyway, what am I going to do, remove the wheels in the parking lot and put the bike up on blocks? Well, yes you could do that. Or you can make two separate trips and save yourself something like $80 because off-the-bike mounting is generally dirt cheap.
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May 14, 2010 22:41
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frozenphil posted:Have you seen a 2008+ Ninja 250 in person? It would take 4 hours just to get to the valve covers. Yup, there's a lot of plastic there, but it's a motorcycle and most of that comes off with a couple of push rivets and some other bolts. I can almost promise you that it's going to be in spec for at least the first adjustment. If it's not, toss the bike on a trailer (or ride it mostly naked) over there and have them do it, that should knock a decent chunk of cost off of doing in (take it down to a 1 hour job + shims), because all they need to do is pull the cams and replace the shims. If it were me, I'd pull the wheels off the bike, run it them the shop, and ask them how much it'd cost if you brought the bike in stripped to the valve cover and they just needed to pull the cams and do the shims. Plus after 2 checks you will have a very good idea of how much they're going to go out over time, and that will help you get a better idea of when it's worthwhile to check/adjust the valves. The other problem is that when the shop does it, they're probably not going to adjust them to the loose end of the spec if they're approaching it. 300$ is a lot of cash. Saving 330$ by spending a few hours working on your bike and dropping off the tires seperately is drat good return on your time. Even at 6.5 hours of work you'd be making 50$ an hour.
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May 14, 2010 23:26
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Z3n posted:
This is the truth. I know we're told to adjust valves to middle/tight spec to keep them quiet. On a bike with shims I'll bet you $100 that even if it's near tight spec they won't bother changing out the shim. They will be doing a go-no go check and that's it. Nothing really wrong with doing it that way but it's not the way I would do it on my bike or car. I do those types of adjustments on normal cars because most people don't like clicky, but on NSXs and back when I used to work on a lot of Porsches I used to ask the owners if they wanted them loose and noisy (but happy) or tighter and quiet. I'm all for people taking stuff to the dealer (it's how I make my money after all) but you have to be aware of what's most likely going to happen.
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May 15, 2010 01:54
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-Inu- posted:Just as an FYI, this Saturday (& Sunday) Cycle Gear is selling SETS of Q2's for $199 for 120/70-17 + 180/55 or 160/60-17. 120/70-17 + 190/50-17 sets are $209. We're allowed to presell them so you can drop a deposit tomorrow and pick up the tires on the weekend. There's also some kind of deal where if you buy the set you can get a 3rd tire for cheap as hell too, I'll check what the communication said tomorrow and post it up for you guys. Retarded cheap deal for sweet tires. If you buy a set of Q2's for either $199.99 or $209.99 you can get another rear for: 180 = $129.99 190 = $159.99
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May 15, 2010 02:48
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frozenphil posted:Have you seen a 2008+ Ninja 250 in person? It would take 4 hours just to get to the valve covers. Classic Ninja 250 Supremacy.
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May 15, 2010 03:27
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It's 6 AM, eggs are boiling, music is playing, most of my poo poo is packed. Riding 500 km across Norway to Oslo to celebrate the 17th of May with some friends. That tummy-tingle of anticipation before going on a long trip is the best thing.
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May 15, 2010 04:56
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The good news, the monster is running again! I finally brought it to a guy in puyallup who fixed it in only a few hours. But now it's having inconsistent idle and is backfiring a little. Probably from when I decided to try to gently caress with the carbs and I probably screwed in the pilot jet too much. I'll have to mess with it tomorrow.
Slim Pickens fucked around with this message at 07:00 on May 15, 2010 |
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May 15, 2010 06:55
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Slim Pickens posted:The good news, the monster is running again! I finally brought it to a guy in puyallup who fixed it in only a few hours. But now it's having inconsistent idle and is backfiring a little. Probably from when I decided to try to gently caress with the carbs and I probably screwed in the pilot jet too much. I'll have to mess with it tomorrow. Then we can Ducati it up?
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May 15, 2010 07:19
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Slim Pickens posted:The good news, the monster is running again! I finally brought it to a guy in puyallup who fixed it in only a few hours. But now it's having inconsistent idle and is backfiring a little. Probably from when I decided to try to gently caress with the carbs and I probably screwed in the pilot jet too much. I'll have to mess with it tomorrow. What the hell was wrong with it/
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May 15, 2010 07:45
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Z3n posted:You could seriously do the entire job in under 4 hours, I don't know what it is about 250 owners that do writeups that makes them seem like everything is a huge deal. Goddanm, I could do the entire check in less time then he spent writing about it. And 56$ to mount and balance per tire is loving rape. 112$ for what's a 30 minute job even for a shade tree mofo like myself? That's loving absurd. I'd be pissed, not because it's a pain in the rear end or anything (the check isn't, the adjustment is), but because you're getting loving taken for a ride on those prices. I want to check them on my GS... it just seems like removing the gas tank completely and putting it back on will be a huge pain in the rear end. It may just be me but the fuel lines seem fairly short, so it's difficult to be able to lift the tank up and turn that little tap off from the inside. Also i'm thinking that pulling out the 2 fuel hoses will be relatively easy, but putting them back on is another pain in the butt. I think i'll give it a shot, but I need to order some feeler gauges and probably a micrometer to verify shim thickness, are the shims usually the thickness that is stamped on them? Also do I really need to check them every 4k on the GS? Seems incredibly short, I mean at this rate i'd have to check them every 4 months or so. Does a certain type of riding determine how out of spec they might be? I am mostly commuting on the freeway these days, never really exceeding 80mph on the speedo at any point.
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May 15, 2010 07:55
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Spiffness posted:Then we can Ducati it up? Hell yeah, we'll hit up every starbucks in town to drink coffee and talk about dry clutches or polish our bikes or something. As for the bike's problem, turned out to be a wire controlling spark pulled loose, and I can't remember the terminology again, but the gap between the points on the flywheel that initiate spark, yeah, that was out of spec as well. I'll have to ask him again in case it happens again, and since he forgot to give me back my haynes manual.
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May 15, 2010 09:08
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Spiffness posted:I feel your pain... 2500 miles until my Duc needs a $800 service. Ow ow ow ow That's the 2500 mile wash and wax, I still think you can skip it.
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May 15, 2010 14:46
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infraboy posted:I want to check them on my GS... it just seems like removing the gas tank completely and putting it back on will be a huge pain in the rear end. It may just be me but the fuel lines seem fairly short, so it's difficult to be able to lift the tank up and turn that little tap off from the inside. Also i'm thinking that pulling out the 2 fuel hoses will be relatively easy, but putting them back on is another pain in the butt. What type of GS? BMW or Suzuki? If it's a Suzuki you probably have screw type adjusters and don't have any shims to worry about. Feeler gauges you can get anywhere. Sears, Kragen, Harbor Freight. My Suzuki GS is supposed to have a valve adjustment every 6K but after adjusting them to loose spec when I first got it and checking them at 6K I found that they would easily go to 10K before making it even close to tight spec. At 10K a few of them were getting pretty close to tight spec so that's my new interval.
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May 15, 2010 16:58
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infraboy posted:I want to check them on my GS... it just seems like removing the gas tank completely and putting it back on will be a huge pain in the rear end. It may just be me but the fuel lines seem fairly short, so it's difficult to be able to lift the tank up and turn that little tap off from the inside. Also i'm thinking that pulling out the 2 fuel hoses will be relatively easy, but putting them back on is another pain in the butt. The GS500 goes out of spec really fast, apparently they use really soft metal in the heads. And it's air cooled, which increases the rate of wear. It's not that hard, you just need some needlenose pliers, you lift up the tank, turn it with the pliers, and off you go. It's pretty easy to get the hoses off, just use a small screwdriver to break them loose and then they'll slide right off. As bugdrvr mentions, there's no need for shims, yours uses screw/nut type adjusters.
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May 15, 2010 18:12
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Carbs were definitely lean, but on the fault of the mechanic, not mine. The haynes manual didn't have a stock setting, so he screwed them in all the way and backed out 2 turns. I had to back it out another 2 turns to get it running right again, although I'm still hearing low pops at idle and engine braking.
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May 15, 2010 20:34
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Spiffness posted:I feel your pain... 2500 miles until my Duc needs a $800 service. Ow ow ow ow I like the Honda maintenance schedule: Dont' do poo poo except change oil and put in gas for 100k+ miles. 
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May 15, 2010 20:41
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Doctor Zero posted:I like the Honda maintenance schedule:  Note: does not apply if the previous owner(s) hosed around or broke it in any way Chris Knight fucked around with this message at 22:23 on May 15, 2010 |
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May 15, 2010 22:14
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I was taking random parts off the bike today trying to figure out why it wasn't running. I took the front sprocket cover off for the first time in 10k+ miles. At least 3/4" build up of old chain lube and crud. Gross.
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May 16, 2010 00:06
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Doctor Zero posted:I like the Honda maintenance schedule: Not my Honda. The bastard before me rode it for one season, then parked it for like 20 years.
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May 16, 2010 00:25
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blugu64 posted:Not my Honda. The bastard before me rode it for one season, then parked it for like 20 years. See, he didn't follow instructions.
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May 16, 2010 01:19
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