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Dr. Goonstein posted:Also just wondering beforehand, is the 2nd one in the series any good? Most people say 'NO.' I say 'not overwhelmingly.' I picked it up for a few dollars and enjoyed it well enough, it was just massively limited compared to the first. It looks like they'd misunderstood what people liked about the first. At best, it's a somewhat ho-hum imitation of Deus Ex; at worst, almost a parody. If you can get it cheap, I personally think it's worth checking out, if only for curiousity's sake. It's reputation as being the shittiest poo poo which shat all over Deus Ex seems unfair, and a product of the somewhat-overinflated view people have of the first game (look at the NMA-esque hissy fits in the Deus Ex 3 thread) Also, if you're playing Deus Ex like Half-Life or something, you're doing it wrong. Early in the game you aim like poo poo and have very little capacity to deal with threats. Going toe-to-toe with the baddies is suicide early on.
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Jun 6, 2010 06:28
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I think Invisible War is poo poo compared to the first game, but on its own merits it isn't too bad. Don't feel compelled to play it but if you want to, it's not a total waste of time.
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Jun 6, 2010 06:32
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For me i borrowed IW off a roomie and i didnt mind it too much but the glacial pace at which things moved due to the horrible engine work followed by occasional bursts of normality was almost too much to bare.
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Jun 6, 2010 06:51
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I played IW before DX1 and I had fun. It's not without it's flaws, but on it's own it's a pretty fun game.
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Jun 6, 2010 06:52
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Dr. Goonstein posted:I beat the first level after 25+ saves, and even the first part of the second. But gently caress. How do these guys survive a clean shot to the head with a silenced pistol? I'm only playing on Normal. If you want lethal headshots, play on Realistic. Just be careful that they don't shoot you in the head.
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Jun 6, 2010 07:43
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e
usually fucked around with this message at 08:54 on Jul 19, 2011 |
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Jun 6, 2010 07:56
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I just recently tried to play IW and I can't play it for long periods of time. It just doesn't feel right, from setting to movement. The animations are also pretty sucky too.
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Jun 6, 2010 08:18
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Dr. Goonstein posted:So I finally downloaded this game, after seeing how badass the 3rd looks to be. The silenced pistol sucks balls. If you want to headshot people, use the regular pistol.
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Jun 6, 2010 08:28
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Astroturf Man posted:The silenced pistol sucks balls. If you want to headshot people, use the regular pistol. You can't silence the regular pistol. With a bunch of stability and accuracy modes and a scope, the silenced pistol becomes a silenced sniper rifle. e; VVV LordLeckie posted:With a silencer the sniper rifle becomes a silenced sniper rifle. .30-06 isn't anywhere near as common as 10mm ammo and the sniper rifle takes three more inventory slots. You also can't get a sniper rifle with 20 rounds in the magazine, and it can't be aimed for poo poo if you're not trained in rifles. Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 11:05 on Jun 6, 2010 |
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Jun 6, 2010 08:37
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Ansob. posted:You can't silence the regular pistol. With a bunch of stability and accuracy modes and a scope, the silenced pistol becomes a silenced sniper rifle. With a silencer the sniper rifle becomes a silenced sniper rifle.
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Jun 6, 2010 08:41
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e
usually fucked around with this message at 08:54 on Jul 19, 2011 |
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Jun 6, 2010 08:51
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It seems to me like weapon balance was really one of the weaker parts of Deus Ex. There isn't a ton of point in using weapons other than the tooth (baton early on), prod (for early on and MiBs), pistol, sniper, and GEP gun. It would be pretty hard to balance the usefulness of a flamethrower with that of the GEP gun, because one of them works at all ranges, but for instance the plasma rifle should absolutely annihilate any living thing it touches if it's going to take up as much inventory space as it does and have so little ammo available compared to rockets. edit: I wish i knew how to edit the game rules as I would probably make my own set of modified weapons. Doesn't the SDK not work in Windows later than XP?
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Jun 6, 2010 09:59
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DVD Drive posted:The silenced pistol is weaker than the normal pistol. Damage is also affected by skill level in the weapon type. This is why realistic mode is probably the better choice thanks to headshot damage multiplier: Enemies are more deadly, but so are you 
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Jun 6, 2010 10:08
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goddamn, The Nameless Mod has some balance problems. On my current mission I'm infiltrating some level with an invincible character running around (he's a moderator!) He doesn't really do much damage, but there's nothing I can do about him but run away - and thanks to all his magical mods he still can see me and set off the alarm again and again even though I'm in a tiny bathroom where he can't reach me. The only real hope seems to be to go around him somehow, if I can avoid his magic laser sight (sees right through my cloak, and the walls) and somehow convince him to get back to normal patrols.
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Jun 6, 2010 10:31
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Dr. Goonstein posted:Also just wondering beforehand, is the 2nd one in the series any good? I played it through once and thoroughly enjoyed it but I have no inclination to go back and play it again. Whereas I'm on maybe my fourth or fifth playthrough of the original. In all honesty, apart from a few stupid design decisions and poor engine optimisation there's not really anything wrong with it. A lot of the levels are really cool and fun to play and it definitely has a bunch of awesome features. It's just that stuff like the neutered hacking, the universal ammo system and the lovely, lovely super Templars that make it unfun to play in some parts. Seriously, I had to just turn on sprint and run around dodging all the enemies in the endgame because it took 2 or 3 rockets to kill one Templar and then that was all my ammo.
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Jun 6, 2010 10:41
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Apparently they had a weak spot in the middle of their back, but I could never, ever hit it. Or is that the MJ12 Commandos? I was stuck for ages on one section where there were 3 of them and I had half a clip of 'ammo' left. Stupid, stupid universal ammo.
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Jun 6, 2010 10:48
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fleshweasel posted:It seems to me like weapon balance was really one of the weaker parts of Deus Ex. There isn't a ton of point in using weapons other than the tooth (baton early on), prod (for early on and MiBs), pistol, sniper, and GEP gun. It would be pretty hard to balance the usefulness of a flamethrower with that of the GEP gun, because one of them works at all ranges, but for instance the plasma rifle should absolutely annihilate any living thing it touches if it's going to take up as much inventory space as it does and have so little ammo available compared to rockets. No, the weapon balance in Deus Ex is right off. There is such an odd gap between certain things that it feels really weird, and certain weapons are just overpowered for what they are. Honestly, as much as I enjoy DE, a lot of the balance is really off and could have been looked at. Some skills could have used a little adjustment. (I just said this in the Deus Ex 3 topic, but seriously, roll swimming into Environmental Training.) Same goes for augs, where some could have used buffs here and there, although some mods do this. I don't think everything needs to be 100% equal, but if you're not going to go for ideal balance, then everything in the game should be actually useful.
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Jun 6, 2010 10:51
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Vivian Darkbloom posted:goddamn, The Nameless Mod has some balance problems. On my current mission I'm infiltrating some level with an invincible character running around (he's a moderator!) He doesn't really do much damage, but there's nothing I can do about him but run away - and thanks to all his magical mods he still can see me and set off the alarm again and again even though I'm in a tiny bathroom where he can't reach me. The only real hope seems to be to go around him somehow, if I can avoid his magic laser sight (sees right through my cloak, and the walls) and somehow convince him to get back to normal patrols.
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Jun 6, 2010 11:09
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Jetsetlemming posted:He cannot see you through walls you're just bad at sneaking. Sneak better. Alternatively, just rush to the goal, turn right out the elevator and follow the wall until you reach the big dude behind a desk, talk to him, talk him into setting himself on fire, then go on past into the office behind him and close the door behind you, follow the directions you get on your infolink. I was sneaking pretty hard ok  Maybe he's just a lot more persistent than other enemies in the game, but he seemed to detect me instantly if I was anywhere nearby. Ultimately I just turned on my ballistic armor aug and ran for it, which worked fine but wasn't too satisfying.
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Jun 6, 2010 13:04
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fleshweasel posted:It seems to me like weapon balance was really one of the weaker parts of Deus Ex. There isn't a ton of point in using weapons other than the tooth (baton early on), prod (for early on and MiBs), pistol, sniper, and GEP gun. It would be pretty hard to balance the usefulness of a flamethrower with that of the GEP gun, because one of them works at all ranges, but for instance the plasma rifle should absolutely annihilate any living thing it touches if it's going to take up as much inventory space as it does and have so little ammo available compared to rockets. Well, the Flamethrower was fantastic at clearing rooms of multiple fleshy enemies and then laughing as a maniac as they run and set fire to everything and scream in the way only Deus Ex characters know how. But the Plasma Gun was really underwhelming, certainly the worst weapon in the game. The Silenced Pistol is really good once you get used to double-tapping it, and at high skill levels you should be one-shoting everything that's not augmented.
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Jun 6, 2010 13:12
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GoldenNugget posted:I just recently tried to play IW and I can't play it for long periods of time. It just doesn't feel right, from setting to movement. The animations are also pretty sucky too. IW was better at the time because physics was still new and novel, and the physics were hosed up in the most hilarious way. I ran through half the game with the strength aug on beating people to death with corpses and trash cans.
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Jun 6, 2010 16:04
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ZearothK posted:scream in the way only Deus Ex characters know how. Eeeeeyaaarrrrgh Eeeeeyaaarrrrgh Eeeeeyaaarrrrgh Eeeeeyaaarrrrgh Hmm. Must have been nothing.
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Jun 6, 2010 16:20
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Well, after owning it for six years, I've finally got round to finishing Invisible War. And I now feel slightly more generously inclined towards it than I used to. It's possible to see what the designers were trying to do, but everything just seems too claustrophobic and cramped. The bits of city are nice, but it all ought to be so much bigger. The fact that you travel to Seattle, Trier, and Cairo is all very well, but you never get those moments of just wandering round the streets of a living city, the way you did in Hell's Kitchen, or Hong Kong in the first game. There didn't seem to be anywhere in each bit of city in Invisible War that wasn't completely relevant to the overall plot, aside from the greasel fighting. That's understandable in a shooter, but not in a Deus Ex game, where you really want to feel there's a world at work around you. The universal ammo was irritating, but survivable. The way most sections of gameplay ended up revolving around killing two guards in a corridor, then avoiding a camera and turret wasn't great, but it was again, tolerable. Again, it lacked for big, open spaces more than anything. The plot was the other irritant. I think a bit more story at the beginning would have helped immensely. For one thing, it's hard to give a drat about Tarsus when you don't really know what it is, and within 5 minutes of starting the game it's already a moot point. In DX1, you really felt like UNATCO was your employer, and the actions leading off of that had some meaning. Invisible War descended into chaos too early, if you see what I mean. Anyway, depth and immersion was the problem, as pretty much everyone said from the start. If they'd managed to get that right, all the gameplay irritants and graphical quirks wouldn't have been an issue.
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Jun 6, 2010 17:18
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So who wants to play some DX MP on Steam? It was horribly balanced and ridiculous at times, but it was still fun to run around with some of the skins.
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Jun 6, 2010 19:31
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I figured out what I like the most about this game, apologies if it's already been said. Throughout the game, unlike most games, you don't just get tougher, more badass enemies every time you move onto the next level. All enemies are easy to kill if you have certain skills, and there are no traditional video game bosses. Christ, I was up on the catwalk in Versalife and headshotted Maggie before even speaking to her the last time I played. Basically it comes down to the skills that you choose make the game easy or hard. If you have a lovely electronics skill you're going to either have to run through the lasers and activate turrets or use an EMP grenade that would have helped you out with the bot in the next room. I think it's really funny in games when essentially the bad guys wait until you've killed enough of their hired goons and hosed up their plans enough to justify sending their elite troops to kill you. Of course by that time you're much more powerful than you were at the beginning when they would have made mincemeat out of you. In Deus Ex, it makes sense when it gets tougher because at that point you have basically all of the US Government's secret organizations using all their resources to kill you.
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Jun 6, 2010 20:21
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I just finished my first play through with shifter but I only found the railgun, the infrared scoped rifle, and the other nanotech sword. I heard there is a magnum somewhere, where the heck is it? I'm starting play through number two on realistic and it owns pretty hard so far.
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Jun 6, 2010 22:09
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Next to Lebedev's pillow on the 747
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Jun 6, 2010 22:17
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I've just started giving The Nameless Mod a shot. It's... well, I don't know how to feel. It's very Deus Ex, but the whole concept is so obnoxiously in-jokey that you're frequently pulled out of it to get treated with 'lololoz llama noobz' bullshit. I hope this kind of crap becomes less emphasised as I go on, because as mod projects go this is really goddamned impressive.
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Jun 6, 2010 23:46
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Kieselguhr Kid posted:I've just started giving The Nameless Mod a shot. It's... well, I don't know how to feel. It's very Deus Ex, but the whole concept is so obnoxiously in-jokey that you're frequently pulled out of it to get treated with 'lololoz llama noobz' bullshit. I hope this kind of crap becomes less emphasised as I go on, because as mod projects go this is really goddamned impressive. It does get less LOLinternet as you go on and starts to become actually funny in places. And there are some pretty impressive feats. Remember how people wanted to stay with UNATCO in the original? In TNM you can side with the bad guys and access a different set of missions in different locations. Tip for early on: Regardless of the path you choose you'll go to WorldCorp HQ. In a lab on level 2, look VERY carefully at a pedestal thing in the middle of the floor with wires coming out. The most useful weapon in the game is on top but the pedestal is shaped in such a way that you can't see it from the other side of the room. I missed it first time round.
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Jun 7, 2010 00:08
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Yeah, the start of TNM is pretty jarring - the developers have admitted as much, but once you're a couple hours in, and introductions are over, it really hits its stride. As Dr Snofeld mentions, it's actually pretty funny.
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Jun 7, 2010 00:11
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Doodmons posted:I played it through once and thoroughly enjoyed it but I have no inclination to go back and play it again. Whereas I'm on maybe my fourth or fifth playthrough of the original. In all honesty, apart from a few stupid design decisions and poor engine optimisation there's not really anything wrong with it. A lot of the levels are really cool and fun to play and it definitely has a bunch of awesome features. It's just that stuff like the neutered hacking, the universal ammo system and the lovely, lovely super Templars that make it unfun to play in some parts. Seriously, I had to just turn on sprint and run around dodging all the enemies in the endgame because it took 2 or 3 rockets to kill one Templar and then that was all my ammo. And on the flipside, if you have a fully-leveled Aggressive Defense Drone aug the super Templars just blow themselves up because the rocket launcher is all they have.
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Jun 7, 2010 00:17
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I'm many hours into TNM now and I have to give it a pretty positive take. The most striking part is the huge levels, which are pretty thoughtfully designed and encourage lots of exploration. Even if they're actually too big for the obsolete engine, and make the framerate fall sometimes.
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Jun 7, 2010 01:33
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usually fucked around with this message at 08:54 on Jul 19, 2011 |
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Jun 7, 2010 03:12
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...of SCIENCE! posted:And on the flipside, if you have a fully-leveled Aggressive Defense Drone aug the super Templars just blow themselves up because the rocket launcher is all they have. Don't they also have machine guns in their arms?
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Jun 7, 2010 05:44
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Dr Snofeld posted:It does get less LOLinternet as you go on and starts to become actually funny in places. And there are some pretty impressive feats. Remember how people wanted to stay with UNATCO in the original? Man, why didn't anyone ever make a mod to do that?
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Jun 7, 2010 06:02
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I uninstalled Deus Ex two days ago I installed it again today to play TNM because I have no willpower. If you haven't downloaded BioMod, DO IT RIGHT NOW. You can climb onto walls and boxes. It makes the game so much smoother and friendly.
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Jun 7, 2010 06:26
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Concerned Citizen posted:Man, why didn't anyone ever make a mod to do that? That would be really hard to convincingly retcon into the original game - would you still go to the same places for some different reason while working for UNATCO? Plus there's the matter of the original voice actors, though it was all so uneven in DX maybe you wouldn't notice.
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Jun 7, 2010 06:28
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Vivian Darkbloom posted:That would be really hard to convincingly retcon into the original game - would you still go to the same places for some different reason while working for UNATCO? Most of the missions of the game are helping Paul's side against MJ12 (Tong vs MJ12, Silhouette vs MJ12, X51 vs MJ12), just have the missions be against Tong/Silhouette/X51 rather than MJ12.
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Jun 7, 2010 16:35
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Having to choose a side makes a bit more sense in TNM, because it's so much more polarized. There may be some shady goings-on with PDX, but WorldCorp are full-on mustache-twirling comic supervillainy, and you'll be cheered on for acts of excessive ultraviolence, rather than chastised. It's nice having the option to be an enormous jerk and get paid for it.
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Jun 7, 2010 16:40
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Dominic White posted:Having to choose a side makes a bit more sense in TNM, because it's so much more polarized. There may be some shady goings-on with PDX, but WorldCorp are full-on mustache-twirling comic supervillainy, and you'll be cheered on for acts of excessive ultraviolence, rather than chastised. This, yeah. Some of the best dialog in TNM is the 'evil' Trestkon justifying his actions to his former colleages. Plus, at the very end you can screw over Scara and take it all for yourself.
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Jun 7, 2010 20:18
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