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Web Jew.0 posted:I think we can all agree that 99 - 01 Triple H was the best Triple H. Are you kidding? His initial heel run, beginning at WrestleMania XV, was an abortion, and it took the Foley feud for him to really start getting over as a monster heel. 2000 wasn't bad, but almost all of 1999 was loving awful.
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Jul 1, 2010 16:44
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Honestly I didn't even start watching before RR 2000 and have barely seen anything from before that, but he was amazing in 2000/2001 so I went ahead and assumed he didn't become a really great wrestler overnight with some kind of reverse quad tear when the millenium started, but maybe you're right. I also vaguely remember him having some good IC title matches.Edwardian posted:I'd have to disagree with you. As crazy as it seems to prefer an active Triple H, he was really really good back then. LIke I think it'd go: 00-01 Triple H > Injured Triple H > 90s Triple H > 05-10 Triple H > 02-04 Triple H
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Jul 1, 2010 17:38
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HHH during 2000 was my favourite wrestler. He was actually a good combination of being dangerous, while at the same time being vulnerable enough and cowardly enough to not be seen as a face. I still remember the scene where he was mocking Mankind for quitting, but then Mankind revealed Cactus Jack was back and HHH just lost his poo poo. So great.
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Jul 1, 2010 17:56
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ColeM posted:Why did Rick Rude leave the WWF back in the early nineties? I think it was a couple of things. One because he didn't want to be associated with any of the the steroid charges that were facing WWF at the time and secondly he wouldn't be elevated from where he was. While it would have been awesome he would have never beaten Hogan/Warrior for the championship after his IC title run. He had put over the Warrior and was a major player in grooming him for his Wrestlemania 6 win against Hogan. After putting Warrior over yet again at SummerSlam 90 there wasn't much else for him to do. Going to WCW he did get some midcard title runs and probably more money.
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Jul 1, 2010 18:12
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Triple H was really good late in the Attitude Era when he could work as a foil to the top guys. He was always at his best when someone better was in the ring with him. He really suffers when he has to carry the load IMO.
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Jul 1, 2010 18:46
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sportsgenius86 posted:Triple H was really good late in the Attitude Era when he could work as a foil to the top guys. He was always at his best when someone better was in the ring with him. He really suffers when he has to carry the load IMO. If he cares enough, he can carry a good match. Hell, he got a decent match out of Khali.
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Jul 1, 2010 19:00
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My favourite HHH conspiracy theory is that the reason the wrestling slowed down in the WWE after 2001 is that Hunter couldn't keep up and he used his political powers to get everyone else to slow down.
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Jul 1, 2010 19:29
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sportsgenius86 posted:Triple H was really good late in the Attitude Era when he could work as a foil to the top guys. He was always at his best when someone better was in the ring with him. He really suffers when he has to carry the load IMO. It was the way he worked too. He was cowardly outside the ring but in the ring he did his whole "cerebral assassin" thing where he found a weak point and exploited the poo poo out of it. Especially if the opponent was coming off an injury he could really sell 1 on 1 face-in-peril situations. He also didn't necessarily need to use weapons to do it which made both him and his opponent look really good. I really dislike HHH as a heel on a whole but the cerebral assassin period was the only period I liked him in the role. Otherwise I prefer corny joke-telling face HHH.
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Jul 1, 2010 19:38
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ColeM posted:Why did Rick Rude leave the WWF back in the early nineties? In his book, Bret Hart says Rude quit after feuding with Warrior. Rude carried him and worked his rear end off and he found out Warrior was making gently caress-loads of cash more than Rude so he got pissed and quit.
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Jul 1, 2010 21:58
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Burrito posted:If he cares enough, he can carry a good match. It is bizarre because his match with Kozlov was loving TERRIBLE but he had a surprisingly good, entertaining match with Khali like you mention. I remember at the time there was a lot of talk about Kozlov being right on the edge of quasi-main eventing, an idea that is laughable now. And I think you can point to that match as being the reason why.
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Jul 1, 2010 23:13
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Jerusalem posted:It is bizarre because his match with Kozlov was loving TERRIBLE but he had a surprisingly good, entertaining match with Khali like you mention. Survivor Series 2008? I can't think of another notable Triple H/Kozlov match. I don't think it was supposed to be that bad, but I got the feeling the plan was to stall for time until the Edge reveal and Hardy run-in, so they kinda avoided doing anything too interesting and accidentally put the crowd to sleep in the process.
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Jul 1, 2010 23:19
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If you don't think the guy that wrestled Shawn Michaels for the European Title and beat Jeff Hardy with a sleeper won't do a bad match on purpose in order to get a reaction, I don't know what to tell you.
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Jul 1, 2010 23:30
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I missed Heidenreich's debut in the WWE... was he supposed to be a neo-nazi or something? That's about all I can garner of his pre-LOD character based on knowing he was a heel and his music.
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Jul 1, 2010 23:42
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LightsGameraAction posted:I missed Heidenreich's debut in the WWE... was he supposed to be a neo-nazi or something? That's about all I can garner of his pre-LOD character based on knowing he was a heel and his music. Psychopathic poet
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Jul 2, 2010 00:00
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SAVE_US.CHR
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ChampRamp posted:Psychopathic poet Michael Cole rapist
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Jul 2, 2010 00:13
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Moose Bigelow posted:Michael Cole rapist A Heidenreich appearance should have been the climax of the Bryan/Cole feud.
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Jul 2, 2010 00:17
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anakha posted:A Heidenreich appearance should have been the climax of the Bryan/Cole feud. Do you really want to use the word climax there?
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Jul 2, 2010 00:19
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Moose Bigelow posted:Do you really want to use the word climax there? Yes he does.
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Jul 2, 2010 02:02
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LightsGameraAction posted:I missed Heidenreich's debut in the WWE... was he supposed to be a neo-nazi or something? That's about all I can garner of his pre-LOD character based on knowing he was a heel and his music. Chocolate Enthusiast.
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Jul 2, 2010 02:50
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Jerusalem posted:I remember at the time there was a lot of talk about Kozlov being right on the edge of quasi-main eventing, an idea that is laughable now. And I think you can point to that match as being the reason why. You could actually say that about a lot of guys and their HHH programs: Jericho, RVD, Booker T, Kane, etc. I've only ever read this on a Scott Keith review but they supposedly use to give guys who they're about to release the "Chris Benoit test" where they'd put them in a program with Benoit as they're out the door - if they have a really great match then maybe they'd get another chance but if their match with Benoit sucks then it's future endeavours. I like to think Triple H is the main event test which only two people have ever passed.
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Jul 2, 2010 02:53
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LightsGameraAction posted:I missed Heidenreich's debut in the WWE... was he supposed to be a neo-nazi or something? That's about all I can garner of his pre-LOD character based on knowing he was a heel and his music. Then he turned into a quasi-pedophile with the whole "Who's gonna be my friend?" while he'd pick out a young kid from the crowd. Who knows what he was supposed to be because he flip flopped so much between characters.
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Jul 2, 2010 02:59
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ColeM posted:Then he turned into a quasi-pedophile with the whole "Who's gonna be my friend?" while he'd pick out a young kid from the crowd. Who knows what he was supposed to be because he flip flopped so much between characters. That was worth it for the one match I saw where the girl marched in rhythm to his theme music.
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Jul 2, 2010 03:03
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Moose Bigelow posted:That was worth it for the one match I saw where the girl marched in rhythm to his theme music. Hey he was super over near the end of his run, I'll give him that. Why did the WWE release him?
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Jul 2, 2010 03:11
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ColeM posted:Hey he was super over near the end of his run, I'll give him that. Why did the WWE release him? IIRC, he quit to help his family down in new orleans after katrina.
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Jul 2, 2010 03:20
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Web Jew.0 posted:I've only ever read this on a Scott Keith review but they supposedly use to give guys who they're about to release the "Chris Benoit test" where they'd put them in a program with Benoit as they're out the door - if they have a really great match then maybe they'd get another chance but if their match with Benoit sucks then it's future endeavours. WOMAN! YERRRRRRR FAHHHED
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Jul 2, 2010 03:23
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Web Jew.0 posted:You could actually say that about a lot of guys and their HHH programs: Jericho, RVD, Booker T, Kane, etc. Well I'd certainly disagree with that entirely since all of them continued to be hover around and eventually enter the main event and Kozlov is far more of an exception to that so far.
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Jul 2, 2010 03:25
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Fun fact: Heidenrich debuted on Raw first before going to Smackdown. His gimmick was talking about a "Little Johnny" which, if I remember correctly, wasn't a cute nickname for his dong or his son.
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Jul 2, 2010 03:44
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Jerusalem posted:Well I'd certainly disagree with that entirely since all of them continued to be hover around and eventually enter the main event and Kozlov is far more of an exception to that so far. Yes jericho was so successful after his hhh feud that he went from winning 3 world titles in four months to toiling in the midcard for six years Rvd was maybe the hottest star after rock and austin. He wasn't even on the main card of the wrestle mania after his hhh program (19, match got bumped to heat) Kane was his tag team partner I don't think anyone will suggest that h did any favors for booker t (except maybe financially I guess) They've all done ok since and triple h probably didn't personally want to bury lots of people but, imho, 2003 jericho or 2004 rvd weren't really higher on the card than kozlov is now ----------------
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Jul 2, 2010 03:49
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KungFu Grip posted:Fun fact: Heidenrich debuted on Raw first before going to Smackdown. His gimmick was talking about a "Little Johnny" which, if I remember correctly, wasn't a cute nickname for his dong or his son. It was supposed to be a doll iirc but they never did the reveal. Can someone do a heidenreich timeline? He may have done as much convoluted shir in his short career as kane (in that same timeframe)
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Jul 2, 2010 03:53
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Web Jew.0 posted:but, imho, 2003 jericho or 2004 rvd weren't really higher on the card than kozlov is now Again, in my opinion they absolutely, demonstrably were, but obviously you disagree. I think it's silly to try to compare them since they were so clearly still over and getting lots of attention while until very recently Kozlov just fell into obscurity and the crowd just didn't seem to care at all.
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Jul 2, 2010 03:58
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I know they've done Mankind to Cactus Jack and Shamrock/Benoit/Angle would "snap" in the middle of matches, but have they ever done an angle where a face character has "snapped" in a match and turned heel from it? Sort of related, I know about RVD and Lynn's first match together, but has there ever been another instance where a crowd has changed sides in a match simply based on ring-work?
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Jul 2, 2010 04:54
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LightsGameraAction posted:I know they've done Mankind to Cactus Jack and Shamrock/Benoit/Angle would "snap" in the middle of matches, but have they ever done an angle where a face character has "snapped" in a match and turned heel from it? Edge got booed at WM26 because he snapped and he was face.
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Jul 2, 2010 05:08
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LightsGameraAction posted:I know they've done Mankind to Cactus Jack and Shamrock/Benoit/Angle would "snap" in the middle of matches, but have they ever done an angle where a face character has "snapped" in a match and turned heel from it?
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Jul 2, 2010 05:40
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LightsGameraAction posted:I know they've done Mankind to Cactus Jack and Shamrock/Benoit/Angle would "snap" in the middle of matches, but have they ever done an angle where a face character has "snapped" in a match and turned heel from it? Kind of the opposite and it happened post match, but the Red Rooster (Terry Taylor) snapped when Bobby Heenan wouldn't stop treating him like poo poo after he lost a match with.... Tito Santana I think. Rooster snaps and slaps/pushes Heenan and screams,"YOU WANT A PIECE OF ME!?!" and pretty much turned face instantly.
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Jul 2, 2010 06:02
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Jerusalem posted:Kind of the opposite and it happened post match, but the Red Rooster (Terry Taylor) snapped when Bobby Heenan wouldn't stop treating him like poo poo after he lost a match with.... Tito Santana I think. Rooster snaps and slaps/pushes Heenan and screams,"YOU WANT A PIECE OF ME!?!" and pretty much turned face instantly. Wasn't the face "snapping" to turn heel how they also did the original Chris Jericho WCW heel run?
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Jul 2, 2010 06:19
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Jerusalem posted:Well I'd certainly disagree with that entirely since all of them continued to be hover around and eventually enter the main event and Kozlov is far more of an exception to that so far. funny thing they were all on different brands than hhh when they finally reached main event status. hhh was on smackdown when jericho got his first proper world title run, booker was on smackdown when he got his, rvd was on ECW and still midcarding because hhh's dx revival took the main events, and kane has been a midcarder ever since and hasn't had a singles main event match.
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Jul 2, 2010 06:52
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Didn't Eddie also snap and turn on Chavo, throwing him through their lowrider's window because Chavo was slammed into it during their match?
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Jul 2, 2010 06:53
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LightsGameraAction posted:I know they've done Mankind to Cactus Jack and Shamrock/Benoit/Angle would "snap" in the middle of matches, but have they ever done an angle where a face character has "snapped" in a match and turned heel from it? Bret Hart vs. Steve Austin
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Jul 2, 2010 07:16
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UndergroundHero posted:Didn't Eddie also snap and turn on Chavo, throwing him through their lowrider's window because Chavo was slammed into it during their match? That was Tajiri. Eddie was so over, however, that the drat crowd wouldn't let him turn, cheering loudly as he heeled it up.
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Jul 2, 2010 08:15
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LightsGameraAction posted:Sort of related, I know about RVD and Lynn's first match together, but has there ever been another instance where a crowd has changed sides in a match simply based on ring-work? Kind of the opposite, but Cena vs. RVD is the best example of a wrestler changing sides because of crowd reaction. Cena was in full on heel mode all the way through it because the fans were loving rabid.
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Jul 2, 2010 08:40
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