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I went for Helios when I was fourteen, because I was a massive singularity techno-geek who thought a big mad uncontrollable A.I was a natural leader of men. Returning to the game now Dark Age seems the only responsible choice and seems to better fit the themes of the game. What the hell gives any of these mad bastards the right to decide the fate of humanity? They're all worse than each other. Hit the reset button. If the levels are anything to go by there's plenty of soy food and shotgun ammo to go round.
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Jul 26, 2010 16:56
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yes a complete technological and societal collapse is truly the only responsible decision
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Jul 26, 2010 17:03
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I still pick Helios ending, because all the other ones still end in the same fatal pattern of humanity: a bunch of apes trying to control other apes, because that's just how we're programmed naturally. The only possible exception may be the dark ages one, since it may be a big enough hit to our species to so drastically change our way of life that we actually consider the idea of long-term biological change in ourselves, though it could easily go the opposite direction, or just repeat history. Helios clearly seems to have a decent idea of human nature, and seems to also have a decent enough goal of "success" defined that our emotional well-being is considered an important thing, and merging with Denton, who is supposed to be a relatively altruistic and good guy, would certainly help maximize human well-being. With everybody united in thought under guidance of an entity who strives for maximized prosperity, progress, and well-being, I'd be willing to bet that people end up better-off despite digitally-moderated thought. It could easily be true understanding of your fellow man, probably the best antidote for conflict and suffering you can think of.
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Jul 26, 2010 17:09
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People have survived it in the past. The Illuminati brought the world an inch away from eternal, total slavery to megalomaniac techno-god Bob Page. And it's them or Helios who you know next to nothing about. What are the odds that a cobbled-together A.I composed of at least two seperate A.I's built for spying on and manipulating people fused to an unknown degree with a nano-augmented ultra-voilent super soldier turns out to be a charming benevolent dictator? Good? Good enough to bet the whole world for the rest of time on? Or let people muddle on. As we have done for thousands of years. We survived World War II. A couple of decades we'll be back to normal. Given the choice of who to hand all of humanity to, forever, I'd say damning them both is the most responsible decision.
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Jul 26, 2010 17:10
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Fnoigy posted:Denton, who is supposed to be a relatively altruistic and good guy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DAPXMZk2iw
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Jul 26, 2010 17:13
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I said "supposed to", gosh darnit! You know what I meant! 
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Jul 26, 2010 17:15
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I'm beginning to think that the Deus Ex sequel should have exclusively used the Dark Age ending, and kept JC Denton as the main character. I'd quite like to have seen it as a post-apocalyptic affair, with JC's augmentations either stripped out entirely, and replaced as the game went on by more haphazard creations. Trying to find Tracer Tong in a world where communications have collapsed would be a decent starting point for a plot.
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Jul 26, 2010 17:16
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BennyHillsraeli posted:I'm beginning to think that the Deus Ex sequel should have exclusively used the Dark Age ending, and kept JC Denton as the main character. Yeah, either this or a sequel in which the Helios ending was the real one, but Helios ends up corrupting JC and you either play a new agent or actually play as Paul and have to hunt JC down and either take him out or somehow extract the AI from him. Either angle would have been awesome. Maybe even add in some demented Neuromancer/Snow Crash-esque bits later on where you actually link up to JC's (or Helios') mind and it's just really surreal and features entire cities shifting around like Dark City and rooms morphing and bending around as puzzles. Fuzz fucked around with this message at 17:26 on Jul 26, 2010 |
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Jul 26, 2010 17:24
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Fnoigy posted:Helios I think people are equating the Helios ending of IW with that of the original. The goal of Helios in the original game was to moderate human society at the macro level as a dictator, monitoring communication and controlling the judicial system. The whole hivemind tactic doesn't come up until IW.
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Jul 26, 2010 18:29
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Ansob. posted:Except he has JC with him. Fargo Fukes posted:Or let people muddle on. As we have done for thousands of years. We survived World War II. A couple of decades we'll be back to normal. Given the choice of who to hand all of humanity to, forever, I'd say damning them both is the most responsible decision.
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Jul 26, 2010 18:38
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The last level does give you reasons to pause about all of the endings. The Dark Age one is obvious, the Illuminati are a bunch of smug dicks, and at one point you get a transmission that Helios has taken over Hong Kong or something and outlawed the Triads, so maybe even that's not a good idea. Personally, I just set up a save where I'd done the prerequisites for all three, then ran through them all in sequence. It's like I used to do when I read Choose Your Own Adventure books as a kid: put a finger in each page where there's a choice to be made, and backtrack each time I hit an ending.
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Jul 26, 2010 19:57
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If you honestly think the crosshair settling times in the game when you're under level 3 in something are anything sort of retarded you're crazy.
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Jul 26, 2010 20:01
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A cool plot change/ ending would be: Tracer Tong is only able to delay the killswitch, meaning you've only got a limited time to stop Page and the like. Merging with Helios is the only way Denton can survive, but JC is such a gently caress-up that instead of tempering the AI he ruins it. The ultimate only "good" ending would be to save Paul and merge him with Helios, creating a benevolent AI and sacrificing yourself. Huh, that would actually be pretty cool and add tempo. Also, we're spoilering a ten year old game?
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Jul 26, 2010 21:13
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The Supreme Court posted:Also, we're spoilering a ten year old game? It seems crazy, but because of this thread and the hype for DX 3 and the recent Steam sale, a ton of people are coming out of the woodwork who are playing it for the first time.
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Jul 26, 2010 21:18
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Helios ending is obviously the best. Let's see, you can -destroy the world -hand the world over to the shady, manipulative Illuminati, who basically started the game's entire conflict -RULE THE WORLD AS A MAGNIFICENT COMPUTER GOD-KING Gee which is the most appealing. I... we... yes indeed.
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Jul 26, 2010 21:27
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From reading about IW, it seems like the plot is actually really good and I kinda wanna experience it, but at the same time I've heard too many negative things about playability issues (I would be using a PC) and I don't wanna bother too much with it. And I already watched all the endings on YouTube so whatever.
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Jul 26, 2010 21:45
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Incoherence posted:It's like I used to do when I read Choose Your Own Adventure books as a kid: put a finger in each page where there's a choice to be made, and backtrack each time I hit an ending. code:
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Jul 26, 2010 21:49
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Incoherence posted:and at one point you get a transmission that Helios has taken over Hong Kong or something and outlawed the Triads, so maybe even that's not a good idea. It outlawed organised crime groups? Good god man, that's monstrous!
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Jul 26, 2010 22:10
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that part always bugged me, it felt like whoever wrote it really wanted the player to pick the Helios ending
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Jul 26, 2010 22:12
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MrL_JaKiri posted:It outlawed organised crime groups? Good god man, that's monstrous! Yeah but by the time you leave Hong Kong, I thought the triads had been portrayed pretty positively? Obviously organized crime and all shouldn't exist and such but I always interpreted that message as ominous and slightly sinister. edit: quoted the wrong post pretend i quoted the one directly above me
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Jul 26, 2010 22:30
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Pretty Little Rainbow posted:If you honestly think the crosshair settling times in the game when you're under level 3 in something are anything sort of retarded you're crazy. I think that the crosshair shouldn't take more than like 3 seconds to fully relax, but it shouldn't zero in to a tiny point if you aren't at a high skill level. It should probably contract if you whip the mouse around quickly, too. I don't know if you meant sort of retarded or short of retarded.
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Jul 26, 2010 23:03
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Can i use the savegames from my standalone GOTY cd version of deus ex with the steam version ? My old install isnt working on me for some reason
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Jul 26, 2010 23:12
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fleshweasel posted:I think that the crosshair shouldn't take more than like 3 seconds to fully relax, but it shouldn't zero in to a tiny point if you aren't at a high skill level. It should probably contract if you whip the mouse around quickly, too. I don't know if you meant sort of retarded or short of retarded. Wow sorry I hosed that sentence up didn't I. Yeah, it should just be less accurate overall at lower skill levels and a bit slower, right now at level 1 or 2 you've got to wait like 10 seconds and then not move.
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Jul 26, 2010 23:14
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loving manual saves screwed my dumb rear end something fierce today. I saved in Paris right before fighting Gunther because I thought his killphrase would be located right before I fought him like Anna's was. Then made it through probably about half of Area 51 when I died like an idiot to a flamethrower. Welp, try again tomorrow! 
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Jul 27, 2010 01:13
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Flamethrowers have got to be the most annoying things to fight in this game. I mean the guys holding them are fairly conspicuous but I unfailingly have the worst luck around them, like they'll ambush me around a corner or I'll have to reload before I can finish them off. The fire lasts nearly forever and unless there's something I'm missing, the only way to put it out is to jump into water or use a fire extinguisher. Usually they put one of the two nearby but it's kind of hard to concentrate when you're running around on fire. Fortunately the enemies are rare enough for this to not be a game-ruining problem but still, I hate those guys.
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Jul 27, 2010 01:31
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Well the game kinda screwed me too. I came up behind two MJ12 guys thinking I could easily drop them both with two quick headshots. Only the first shot didn't kill the guy with the flamethrower, giving him time to make me extra crispy in the second I was stunned by this turn of events. Then I forgot to click on regenerate and was dead as soon as I dropped the second.
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Jul 27, 2010 01:58
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Well, I find it very interesting the different reasons people have for choosing different endings. Am I really the only one who went with the Illuminati ending usually? I guess I'm a bad person 
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Jul 27, 2010 05:39
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Both the Illuminati and Helios endings rely on the player basically consenting to two different forms of picture-perfect fascism; one that relies on the strength of Humanism and rational ethics and the other relying on the unspoken guarantee that an impartial technological construct can make the best aggregate decisions. The dark ages ending is basically the ultra-edgy "lol anarchy" route.
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Jul 27, 2010 07:42
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3 posted:The dark ages ending is basically the ultra-edgy "lol anarchy" route. Except it's not? It's just an end to globalization, albeit probably temporary. All you're doing is wiping out the world's communication structure, it's not like local governments would completely cease to operate. There would be a lot of upheaval but that's a necessary thing to bring about the end of a massively corrupt regime.
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Jul 27, 2010 07:51
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K8.0 posted:Except it's not? It's just an end to globalization, albeit probably temporary. All you're doing is wiping out the world's communication structure, it's not like local governments would completely cease to operate. There would be a lot of upheaval but that's a necessary thing to bring about the end of a massively corrupt regime. You are alsohanding the world over to corporations to completely gently caress over without any governments or groups of people meddling to prevent them from turning the world into a profit-driven dystopia. So yeah, Bad End. e; VVV this also happens. I quite like whoever wrote IW. Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 09:55 on Jul 27, 2010 |
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Jul 27, 2010 08:55
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More to the point, by destroying the Aquinas hub completely, you've created a massive power vacuum that will inevitably be fought tooth and nail for by thousands of entities and organizations wishing to seize control, basically creating a Somalia scenario writ large.
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Jul 27, 2010 09:21
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In Training posted:Yeah but by the time you leave Hong Kong, I thought the triads had been portrayed pretty positively? I think you're conflating "being personable" with "being portrayed positively". Sure they buy you a drink, but they're still going to be getting protection money from everyone in the market. Their enemies are still going to end up in the canal, and they have no vested interest in getting the city working again and if Page through Versa Life is running the show they have insufficient power to do it.
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Jul 27, 2010 09:36
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MrL_JaKiri posted:and they have no vested interest in getting the city working again Neither does Page and his band of cut-throat capitalists. If anything, they're worse, because the Triads at least have the feudal traditions to go on and will protect their subjects. e; VVV MrL_JaKiri posted:And nor does Helios, but Helios still gets the city working again in a matter of minutes - something the other groups do not want to do. Well, by that point, Helios has decided to make it its purpose to rule fairly. So yes, it's in Helios' interest insofar as it's part of Helios' goals. Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 13:24 on Jul 27, 2010 |
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Jul 27, 2010 09:57
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Ansob. posted:Neither does Page And nor does Helios, but Helios still gets the city working again in a matter of minutes - something the other groups do not want to do.
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Jul 27, 2010 12:08
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Ansob. posted:Well, by that point, Helios has decided to make it its purpose to rule fairly. So yes, it's in Helios' interest insofar as it's part of Helios' goals. It's not a vested interest though. Anyway the way I phrased my post was the most polite way of saying "Why the gently caress are you talking about Page, the conversation was about Helios vs the Triads" that I could think of
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Jul 27, 2010 13:44
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Calling it the dark ages ending is kind of rich given that high-speed international communications didn't exist until the laying of the transatlantic telegraph cable in 1866, and was a pretty unreliable, small-time sort of thing until the 20th century. E: And anyway, it's not like JC is also simultaneously destroying all the technology involved in international communication- he's just destroying the existing infrastructure. Sure, it's a blow. But the idea that he's doing some kind of irreversible damage, or that humanity will be plunged into the 1400s, is just silly. Pope Guilty fucked around with this message at 14:50 on Jul 27, 2010 |
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Jul 27, 2010 14:42
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On the other hand, society is much more reliant upon them now than it was.
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Jul 27, 2010 14:46
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Pope Guilty posted:Calling it the dark ages ending is kind of rich given that high-speed international communications didn't exist until the laying of the transatlantic telegraph cable in 1866, and was a pretty unreliable, small-time sort of thing until the 20th century. You're right, let's call it the Steampunk ending instead.
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Jul 27, 2010 15:40
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Doc Hawkins posted:You're right, let's call it the Steampunk ending instead. Let's call it the "Tracer Tong is an idealistic retard" ending.
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Jul 27, 2010 15:44
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I do like how they set up the advocates for the various endings in-game. For the dark ages ending, Tong is the advocate, probably the most sympathetic of the three. He's a little  about the 'first of many favors' with saving your life, but he's the most openly idealistic and helpful, which sort of mitigates the fact that he's advocating for the most reactionary solution to the problem by destroying modern society.The Illuminati guy is Everett, who is extremely shady and ambivalent. The ending itself is the closest to maintaining the status quo as possible, which is a powerful incentive, and if it was just JC, or JC and Paul, or basically anyone else that the skeezy dude who kept his mentor on ice in his basement and was so focused on his goal he let his compound get infiltrated by some guy who sounds like Charlie from It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. Finally, the Helios. On the one hand, Daedalus was your homeboy right from the start, but on the other hand Icarus was a creepy stalker who did nothing but scare the poo poo out of you, and them plus the combined entity are all AIs with alien thought patterns, so who knows how much they can really be trusted to look out for humans. The solution they're advocating for is interesting; an impartial arbiter to solve the problems that humans have created for themselves and can't be trusted to solve. But a day or so ago half of that arbiter was the thing saying RUN WHILE YOU CAN. Imagine how much more compelling merging with Helios would be if it was Tong begging you to do it? (Or how suspicious you'd get if it was Everett?)
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Jul 27, 2010 16:18
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