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I was more thinking modern history on ancient subjects (I've read a looooooot of old timey Roman/Greek translated stuff, just got through Homer last year and am a bit burnt out on that) but by massively annotated is it somewhat like... this is probably horrible phrasing, but 'fun' to read? I'm not looking for dry textbooks, something with even a slight narrative throughout each chapter would be nice but I'm probably describing this awfully
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Jul 30, 2010 02:38
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teacup posted:I was more thinking modern history on ancient subjects (I've read a looooooot of old timey Roman/Greek translated stuff, just got through Homer last year and am a bit burnt out on that) but by massively annotated is it somewhat like... this is probably horrible phrasing, but 'fun' to read? I'm not looking for dry textbooks, something with even a slight narrative throughout each chapter would be nice but I'm probably describing this awfully Herodotus has a sort of overall narrative -- it's technically tracing the causes of the Persian invasion of Greece -- but it's so discursive (egypt is mentioned; we get the entire known geography and history of Egypt) that you might want something more modern. For modern history I tend to read biographies. The Hawkwood: Diabolical Englishman, mentioned above, is what I'm reading now and it's pretty interesting; the main theme is more "wow, Hawkwood was an opportunistic bastard", at least so far, than there is an overarching "story", but the author does a good job of depicting the era *generally*, not just Hawkwood particularly. My favorite modern biography is probably Edmund Morris' Theodore Roosevelt biographies, which do tell a fairly coherent story (Roosevelt's rise to and execution of the Presidency). If you're looking for something more general, you might try _A World Lit Only By Fire_ or Terry Jone's _Medieval Lives_ for general depictions of the high medieval era.
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Jul 30, 2010 02:56
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teacup posted:I just want to run into a bookstore and buy heaps of poo poo but I know a lot of it is just pop trash and I'd like something with a bit of credibility. I've already pimped it recently but Tom Holland's Rubicon is probably the best, most readable history of the end of the Roman Republic. The ancient sources are great but rarely what I'd call entertaining reading. Other good books right here on my shelf are: Into the Land of Bones, about Alexander the Great and Afghanistan. The Gangs of New York, self-explanatory title there. Putin's Russia, if you want to be depressed. Not exactly history either but same vein. Under the Black Flag, about the golden age of piracy. If You Survive, a WW2 memoir. There are of course billions of these but I liked this one a lot. The Year 1000 by Danziger, it's a quick read for an overview of life in England in the early Middle Ages. Greek Fire, Poison Arrows, and Scorpion Bombs, about chemical/biological/general creative warfare in the ancient world. Contains descriptions of Roman bee bombs and Spartan flamethrowers, among other fun things.
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Jul 30, 2010 03:44
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that warfare one sounds awesome, as do most but I love just... I dunno, books with a hook in them? Guns Germs and Steel was one I mentioned that imo takes a good look at things that other books/texts rarely do (for fear of being a bit overly PC or seeming racist I guess but this book mostly avoids PC and isn't racist at all) thank you 
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Jul 30, 2010 04:17
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As cool as Greek Fire, Poison Arrows... sounds, I'd stay away from it and its author, Adrienne Mayor, in general. She has an unfortunate knack for making really interesting subjects boring, and her historical accuracy seems dubious at best. She has a tendency for baseless/unnecessary speculation, and is super biased in her presentation of some subjects (though this complaint is more relevant for her book on Mithridates). Reading the ancient sources on the subject would probably be a better way to spend your time. Unfortunately, I don't know of any other, better books about this. If anyone knows of any, I'd love to hear about them, though.
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Jul 30, 2010 05:09
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I haven't read any of her other books, but that one is solid. I am an ancient historian so I have a fairly good antenna where that subject is concerned. I'd read about most of the things in the book previously, it's just the first time I've seen it all compiled. There's not really any editorializing that I remember, just reporting the facts. I've also never heard a bad word about her work before now, so I have to admit being a little skeptical of random internet post. Do you have some specifics you're basing it on? Edit: And if you don't believe her work there's a quite extensive bibliography and endnotes, so you could just skim those at the bookstore and read the originals if you want. Grand Fromage fucked around with this message at 05:23 on Jul 30, 2010 |
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Jul 30, 2010 05:20
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I have to admit, most of my complaints are based on her Mithridates book. I read Greek Fire and remember being unhappy with it, but it was a couple years ago, whereas I only recently finished the Poison King. In the Poison King at least, she invents little (not implausible, just needless) situations mostly to create a more narrative story but occasionally for other reasons. She's got a weird habit of forcibly including mentions of Mithridates' reputation for skill with poisons in places where it's not really relevant or supported by anything in particular. It's nothing egregious, just really bothersome to me, though maybe not for other people. Of course now I can't think of anything specific for Greek Fire, so maybe I am just ascribing my disappointment with the Poison King to that. I'm glad to hear that the history is fine with Greek Fire, though. Like I said, it's been awhile since I read it, and while I remember being sort of suspicious of it, I don't remember anything specific. It might have just been her writing style/the way she groups all her citations together so it looks like she has like none. I might have to go read it again now, if only to see what I thought was weird. (also it is awesome that you are an ancient historian. That is sort of kind of what I am in school for, but my focus is completely not anything related to this) edit: while I know there are some reviews which mention complaints about Greek Fire, I of course can't access them at the moment because I'm not on campus. whoops. Radio! fucked around with this message at 05:58 on Jul 30, 2010 |
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Jul 30, 2010 05:47
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I think it is influencing your memories. The stuff in Greek Fire does sound crazy as poo poo, but that is the point of the book after all. I can't speak to the writing style, there wasn't anything special about it that I remember. Ultimately if something seems off, you can always check with the originals. And I am pretty awesome yeah. Sadly employers are less impressed with expertise in Roman political propaganda than most other people I meet.
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Jul 30, 2010 05:56
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In an effort to prove I am not completely off base, I did manage to track down a few reviews with complaints about her research: http://www.americanscientist.org/bookshelf/pub/germs-of-truth http://tinyurl.com/26cz7vu The second is JSTOR, so some people might not be able to read it, but the first should be fine. There's another article by Brian Balmer, as well, but that's more about her comparisons between modern and ancient biological warfare.
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Jul 30, 2010 06:26
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Ah, that jogged my memory. The temple thing was a bit of a stretch. To be fair, it's going to be hard to find any ancient history without a good dose of speculation mixed in. The sources are simply too incomplete to avoid it entirely. Part of studying the ancient world is developing your bullshit detector. That's true to some extent for any history, the ancient world is just worse because of the documentation problem. Especially if you get outside of record-obsessed societies like the Romans. You read anything about Gauls or Scythians and it's all speculation based on archaeology and incredibly biased reports. So the lesson is, always read history with a critical eye, and let's stop detrailing. Grand Fromage fucked around with this message at 06:35 on Jul 30, 2010 |
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Jul 30, 2010 06:32
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Could someone direct me to some books (fantasy or sci-fi) that basically spend their entire time throwing weird poo poo at the reader? I'm thinking of China Mieville here. Just, horrible and strange things, all throughout the book. And the more body horror the better. I hope that's general enough.  Edit: I wanted to emphasize the "bizarre" factor more. I mean really, really bizarre and grotesque. Cobweb Heart fucked around with this message at 08:04 on Jul 30, 2010 |
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Jul 30, 2010 07:57
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Cobweb Heart posted:Could someone direct me to some books (fantasy or sci-fi) that basically spend their entire time throwing weird poo poo at the reader? I'm thinking of China Mieville here. Just, horrible and strange things, all throughout the book. And the more body horror the better. Try John Dies At The End by David Wong. It's very episodic because it was originally published as a serial novel online. It reads more like a season of a TV show than a single novel. But it's a lot of fun. It's very funny and very hosed up, treading the line between sci-fi, horror and comedy. The best way to describe it is Clive-Barker-style body horror as written by Douglas Adams. Every "episode" of the story has some bizarre new threat against the heroes, it really does throw weird poo poo at you for the entire book. http://www.amazon.com/John-Dies-End-David-Wong/dp/031255513X Edit: and yes, it really is bizarre and grotesque. I felt queasy at certain points reading it. Doggy Howser M.D posted:Can anyone recommend any mature contemporary fantasy or sci-fi? Something set in the present where magic exist, but in secret, or involving some powerful science/discoveries. It would be even better if the story involved secret history, or espionage. I recommend The Magicians by Lev Grossman. It takes the bread and butter of Harry Potter (a secret school for magic) but moves it to upstate New York, the characters are all in their 20s, there's murder, sex, drugs and alcoholism. It's beautifully written, too. http://www.amazon.com/Magicians-Novel-Lev-Grossman/dp/0452296293/
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Jul 30, 2010 08:07
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Hedrigall posted:Try John Dies At The End by David Wong. It's very episodic because it was originally published as a serial novel online. It reads more like a season of a TV show than a single novel. But it's a lot of fun. It's very funny and very hosed up, treading the line between sci-fi, horror and comedy. The best way to describe it is Clive-Barker-style body horror as written by Douglas Adams. Every "episode" of the story has some bizarre new threat against the heroes, it really does throw weird poo poo at you for the entire book. Ah, I read the first few chapters of this back when it was online for free. I've got to finish it now! Thanks very much!
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Jul 30, 2010 08:30
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I was wondering if someone could recommend me some historical romance books (or romance in general) that don't have lots of tasteless sex. I'm more interested in the story. I'm not sure the difference between historical fiction and historical romance so I'll give some examples of what I like. I really like Jane Austen. I've enjoyed reading books like The Secret Book of Grazia dei Rossi, Captain Corelli's Mandolin, and The Other Boelyn Girl. I also like classic love stories that don't work out like The Great Gatsby and Tess of the D'Urbervilles. A few pages ago someone recommended Fanny Burney and Vanity Fair so I'm going to read those too. I have lots of time to kill this summer though. Any suggestions are appreciated
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Aug 1, 2010 04:22
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nyxie posted:I was wondering if someone could recommend me some historical romance books (or romance in general) that don't have lots of tasteless sex. I'm more interested in the story. I'm not sure the difference between historical fiction and historical romance so I'll give some examples of what I like. I really like Jane Austen. I've enjoyed reading books like The Secret Book of Grazia dei Rossi, Captain Corelli's Mandolin, and The Other Boelyn Girl. I also like classic love stories that don't work out like The Great Gatsby and Tess of the D'Urbervilles. A few pages ago someone recommended Fanny Burney and Vanity Fair so I'm going to read those too. I have lots of time to kill this summer though. Any suggestions are appreciated You might like Liber Amoris by William Hazlitt. Its about this dude that moves into a tenement building and falls in love with the maid. It was quite a scandal at the time of release in 1823 or so.
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Aug 1, 2010 04:35
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nyxie posted:I was wondering if someone could recommend me some historical romance books (or romance in general) that don't have lots of tasteless sex. I'm more interested in the story. I'm not sure the difference between historical fiction and historical romance so I'll give some examples of what I like. I really like Jane Austen. I've enjoyed reading books like The Secret Book of Grazia dei Rossi, Captain Corelli's Mandolin, and The Other Boelyn Girl. I also like classic love stories that don't work out like The Great Gatsby and Tess of the D'Urbervilles. A few pages ago someone recommended Fanny Burney and Vanity Fair so I'm going to read those too. I have lots of time to kill this summer though. Any suggestions are appreciated Speaking of Vanity Fair(the magazine instead of the book), they called Lolita "The only convincing love story of our century." You could take a look at that.
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Aug 1, 2010 06:29
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I'd like to read more about Daoism, but all I've got is an unannotated Tao te Ching and the Tao of Pooh. Any suggestions as to where I should go next? Annotated Taos especially preferred.
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Aug 1, 2010 07:14
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What are some good books to read about the Holocaust? I'm looking for both biographical accounts and general historical overviews. The only specific purpose books I have read on the subject are Anne Frank's diary and Night so whatever else you can recommend me would be great.
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Aug 2, 2010 07:10
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I've just finished reading The Gates of Troy by Glyn Iliffe. It's a Bernard Cornwall style retelling of the start of the trojan war with the full cast of heroes and gods chucked in. I enjoyed it for what it is, but i'd love to learn more about greek mythology. I'm looking for book/s on the subject that avoid being dry and textbook like. Any suggestions?
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Aug 2, 2010 07:19
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OrangeGuy posted:I am going to be taking a 14 hour non-stop flight to Delhi in September, so I have been looking at books to stock up on for ample reading material on the way there and on the way back home later. Quoting this a new page. teacup posted:I was more thinking modern history on ancient subjects (I've read a looooooot of old timey Roman/Greek translated stuff, just got through Homer last year and am a bit burnt out on that) but by massively annotated is it somewhat like... this is probably horrible phrasing, but 'fun' to read? I'm not looking for dry textbooks, something with even a slight narrative throughout each chapter would be nice but I'm probably describing this awfully If you find modern Iran fascinating in the slightest but want to cut through all of the inflammatory rhetoric about Iran's nuclear program that makes up 90% of the literature out there, I strongly recommend reading "The Ayatollah Begs to Differ" by Hooman Majd. It provides a great look at Iran's recent history, anecdotes, and insight into the paradoxical forces at work in Iran's simultaneous Shi'ia and Persian culture as well as a more grounded, personal observation of notable (e.g. Mahmood Ahmedinejad, Muhammad Khatami, etc.) and ordinary Iranians alike. It is altogether readable, entertaining, accessible, and greatly insightful all at once. [edit]: Err... After re-reading, that might not be what you are looking for. Sorry, it's late here. Still, it's a great read for anyone interested in modern history, regardless. Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 09:51 on Aug 2, 2010 |
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Aug 2, 2010 09:47
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You know that sounds interesting I'm not really an OP kinda guy but I guess I could try and put some work into it for a history/non fiction thread... even just browsing this thread I reckon there'd be enough support for it. Yeah? Or is it too specific for it's own thread?
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Aug 2, 2010 11:02
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End Of Worlds posted:I'd like to read more about Daoism, but all I've got is an unannotated Tao te Ching and the Tao of Pooh. Any suggestions as to where I should go next? Annotated Taos especially preferred. Chuang Tzu.
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Aug 2, 2010 14:25
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:What are some good books to read about the Holocaust? I'm looking for both biographical accounts and general historical overviews. The only specific purpose books I have read on the subject are Anne Frank's diary and Night so whatever else you can recommend me would be great. There are literally thousands of biographical accounts of the Holocaust. Some from my library: Survival In Auschwitz by Primo Levi I Have Lived A Thousand Years: Growing Up In The Holocaust by Livia Bitton-Jackson Eyewitness Auschwitz: Three Years in the Gas Chambers by Filip Muller All But My Life by Gerda Weissmann Klein A Lucky Child: A Memoir of Surviving Auschwitz as a Young Boy by Thomas Buergenthal For a general history of the holocaust, a good place to start is Martin Gilbert's The Holocaust: A History of the Jews of Europe During the Second World War
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Aug 2, 2010 15:07
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OrangeGuy posted:1.) First, could anyone recommend a good, relevant, informative, and current book as an introduction to knowing more about Africa as a whole? While I know much about the basics when it comes to Africa, I am fairly ignorant when it comes to knowing specifics about African history/politics/culture, especially when distinguishing between the events and story of each particular country. While I know better than to automatically label Africa as a single, homogeneous state as many do, I feel uneasy with my relative lack of knowledge when it comes to understanding or knowing Africa as a continent. Still, it's hard to imagine a book that could cover the essentials about the various aspects about Africa without being too short as to oversimplify things while not being too long as to be inaccessible. You want either Nugent or Cooper - Africa Since Independence and Africa since 1940. They were the introductory texts on my african politics course at uni, they give a really goo introduction without getting too detailed. After that you'll want books either focussed on an individual issue or country, but as a continent wide study they're both excellent. quote:4.) Although I am going to be in India in the Fall (and arriving in Delhi to start with), I am actually going to be doing intensive Tibetan studies and will have plenty of material to read with respect to Tibetan history and Sino-Tibetan affairs. Try India: A Million Mutinies Now, by Naipul. It's huge, he basically travels round the country meeting and interviewing people and hearing about their lives and beliefs. It was controversial because it's quite negative in it's opinions of indians, but i found it really interesting. It's from 1990, he also did one in 1960 (An Area of Darkness) and another in 1975 (A Wounded Civilization) but I've not read either of them. Slightly specific request: I want a copy of Either / Or, lots of people say the Penguin copy is badly abridged, is this true? The other copy is stupidly expensive. but apparently the Penguin misses out earlier sections which you need to understand later parts? delicious beef fucked around with this message at 21:57 on Aug 2, 2010 |
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Aug 2, 2010 21:41
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So after finishing the second book in Abercrombie's The Blade Itself trilogy I find myself unable to move on to the third book. The plot was never very interesting to me as much as teh characters were and I feel like if I can't care about where the book is going I can't bring myself to see how it ends. I absolutely loved the characters Abercrombie created and the banter between Bayaz's gang as they were traveling really made me the book for me. But all the other poo poo going on plot-wise had me skimming pages waiting to go back to Logan and the gang. Off on that tangent I feel burnt out on fantasy and want to move onto science fiction. The more science-y the better.
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Aug 3, 2010 03:51
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Grand Fromage posted:Putin's Russia, if you want to be depressed. Not exactly history either but same vein. I've heard relatively mixed reviews concerning Putin's Russia. As an ancient historian, but historian nonetheless, what was your opinion concerning it? I'd like to pick it up sometime in the future.
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Aug 3, 2010 09:32
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Kneel Before Zog posted:So after finishing the second book in Abercrombie's The Blade Itself trilogy I find myself unable to move on to the third book. The plot was never very interesting to me as much as teh characters were and I feel like if I can't care about where the book is going I can't bring myself to see how it ends. I absolutely loved the characters Abercrombie created and the banter between Bayaz's gang as they were traveling really made me the book for me. But all the other poo poo going on plot-wise had me skimming pages waiting to go back to Logan and the gang. Off on that tangent I feel burnt out on fantasy and want to move onto science fiction. The more science-y the better. I'm reading Blindsight right now, and absolutely loving it. If you have an e-reader, Peter Watts has released it for free here: http://www.rifters.com/real/Blindsight.htm So far, it's amazing.
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Aug 3, 2010 14:05
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A big thread! I'm after something written in the first person, preferably fantasy/sci-fi, but I'll look into anything that sounds interesting. Specifically, I'd like more stuff that follow a character from their childhood through to whatever adventures they go on to have; FitzChivalry in the Farseer series, Zap Brannigan in the Name of the Wind, the Great Skeeve and so on. I'm sure there's some other major example I can't remember right now, but you get the idea. I just love to read about little orphans who get trained up to become great heroes. I'm reading Across the Nightingale Floor at the moment, and that seems to be exactly the kind of thing I'm after (it's basically Fitz's story set in feudal Japan). Similarly, I just finished Jhereg which was along those lines as well.
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Aug 3, 2010 14:28
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Meningism posted:Zap Brannigan in the Name of the Wind, Here's to us poor schmoes, working for the man. Even if he is a hot, sexy female man.
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Aug 3, 2010 14:59
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Fitzgerald me please. I've just finished reading The Diamond as Big as the Ritz (the short story collection), I'd like to try some of his novels. What's good/bad/indifferent?
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Aug 3, 2010 17:22
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GreyLondon posted:I've heard relatively mixed reviews concerning Putin's Russia. As an ancient historian, but historian nonetheless, what was your opinion concerning it? I'd like to pick it up sometime in the future. It's very interesting, a lot of the stuff in it has been reported in numerous other sources (like the practice of dedovshchina in the Russian army, that goes back a long time). And the fact that the author was murdered, likely by the FSB, of course gives it a certain cachet. Russia is my main interest other than Romans so I've read plenty, and nothing in the book struck me as off or contrary to anything else I've read. Essentially the thrust was that Putin has portrayed himself as a huge reformer, when really things haven't changed much from the oligarchy that rose up during Yeltsin's reign. Plus Putin's version of democracy is more of an "elected" dictatorship with an advisory parliament than what we consider democracy in the west. That's not a terribly controversial position. I haven't seen any negativity about the book (from non-Russian sources anyway) but I'd guess the controversial part is about Russian soldiers being used for slave labor. I couldn't tell you either way about that, there's no way to determine the truth there without personally investigating. Given everything else that we know for sure goes on, though, it's not hard to believe.
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Aug 3, 2010 17:41
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Meningism posted:A big thread! The Lies of Locke Lamora by Scott Lynch is exactly what you're after, right down to the orphans. It's also really, really fun.
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Aug 3, 2010 19:22
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jmaze posted:I'm reading Blindsight right now, and absolutely loving it. If you have an e-reader, Peter Watts has released it for free here: drat, and the robot just called me from the library to tell me that Blindsight is waiting for me.
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Aug 3, 2010 19:49
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delicious beef posted:Fitzgerald me please. I've just finished reading The Diamond as Big as the Ritz (the short story collection), I'd like to try some of his novels. What's good/bad/indifferent? The Beautiful and Damned is wholly mediocre, stay away from that one. This Side of Paradise and The Great Gatsby are definitely the ones worth reading. If you like Fitzgerald, make sure to jump ahead 30 years for John O'Hara too.
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Aug 3, 2010 20:27
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I just finished reading Jared Diamond's Gun Germs and Steel. Any other recommendations? Specific history or general history is fine, nothing to do with Rome though.
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Aug 4, 2010 01:07
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CharlesWillisMaddox posted:I just finished reading Jared Diamond's Gun Germs and Steel. Any other recommendations? Specific history or general history is fine, nothing to do with Rome though. If you look in the last page or two I asked more or less the same thing so maybe peruse some of that if you haven't though he wrote a follow up called 'Collapse', looking at why some specific civilisations 'succeeded' or 'failed' which is similar, and well worth a read.
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Aug 4, 2010 01:32
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CaptainScraps posted:The Beautiful and Damned is wholly mediocre, stay away from that one. Naw, they're all really good, it's just that they're all also really overrated, Gatsby most of all. The nice thing about Fitzgerald is you can knock his entire oeuvre out in less than a month and get him out of your system.
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Aug 4, 2010 08:57
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ONE TWO THREE TIMES TWO TO THE SIX/JONESING FOR YOUR FIX OF THAT LIMP BIZKIT MIX
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Meningism posted:I'm after something written in the first person, preferably fantasy/sci-fi, but I'll look into anything that sounds interesting. Specifically, I'd like more stuff that follow a character from their childhood through to whatever adventures they go on to have; FitzChivalry in the Farseer series, Zap Brannigan in the Name of the Wind, the Great Skeeve and so on. I'm sure there's some other major example I can't remember right now, but you get the idea. I just love to read about little orphans who get trained up to become great heroes. JonnyNapalm fucked around with this message at 17:46 on Aug 4, 2010 |
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Aug 4, 2010 17:39
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So, I've never read any mystery novels, but the concept of Sherlock Holmes has greatly intrigued me over the last few weeks. As someone new to this genre all together, is Sherlock Holmes easy to get into? On that note, is Sherlock Holmes worth getting into? If so, which novels of his should I start with?
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Aug 5, 2010 01:15
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Grand Fromage posted:It's very interesting, a lot of the stuff in it has been reported in numerous other sources (like the practice of dedovshchina in the Russian army, that goes back a long time). And the fact that the author was murdered, likely by the FSB, of course gives it a certain cachet. Russia is my main interest other than Romans so I've read plenty, and nothing in the book struck me as off or contrary to anything else I've read. Thanks for clearing that up. I'll be sure to pick it up sometime in the future. I got several recommendations in this thread about which books I should look into if I was interested in Russia. Do you think you could recommend me something concerning the tsarist era and anything before the Romanovs (Kievan Rus', the Duchies that formed after its fall). I'm also very interested in the Don and Zaporozhian Cossacks as well and would love to find a book that isn't horribly outdated about them.
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Aug 5, 2010 01:51
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