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That Hornswoggle "Looney Tunes" bit was loving awful, mostly because it was just completely out of place on the show. In a different context it might have been funny (unlikely, Looney Tunes stuff is funny in Looney Tunes cartoons, not so much in any other context) but on a wrestling show it's just plain dumb.
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Aug 17, 2010 22:32
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Jerusalem posted:That Hornswoggle "Looney Tunes" bit was loving awful, mostly because it was just completely out of place on the show. In a different context it might have been funny (unlikely, Looney Tunes stuff is funny in Looney Tunes cartoons, not so much in any other context) but on a wrestling show it's just plain dumb. an example in which it was funny - Farscape, an example of when it is not - a wrestling show
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Aug 17, 2010 22:36
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I think it's more a consistency problem. If Hornswoggle had always used bizarre leprechaun powers to appear and disappear and escape at will, less would have been made of it. It's the fact that he did it once and never again.
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Aug 17, 2010 22:42
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I presume that Ron Simmons also wanted free ice cream sandwiches.
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Aug 17, 2010 22:48
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Jerusalem posted:That Hornswoggle "Looney Tunes" bit was loving awful, mostly because it was just completely out of place on the show. In a different context it might have been funny (unlikely, Looney Tunes stuff is funny in Looney Tunes cartoons, not so much in any other context) but on a wrestling show it's just plain dumb. If anyone follows the Red Letter Media movie reviews (the guy who did those super long reviews of the Star Wars Prequels) he did a great examination of real world cartoon physical comedy in his review of Baby's Day Out that explained this well. But if one doesn't want to spend 25 minutes understanding it, those two sentences explain it pretty well!
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Aug 17, 2010 22:49
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Kane shot lightning from his hand once.
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Aug 17, 2010 22:50
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Burrito posted:Kane shot lightning from his hand once. Yeah, I thought that was silly too, just not as dumb as Hornswoggle creating a magical hole in the wall that only exists for him to run through.
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Aug 17, 2010 22:53
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reality_groove posted:I think it's more a consistency problem. If Hornswoggle had always used bizarre leprechaun powers to appear and disappear and escape at will, less would have been made of it. As Livid Liquid said, they set the rules for their universe. WWE is no different than any other TV show. In a TV show, you set up your reality, and you deem what is and isn't cool. In WWE, zombies kidnapping the daughter of the company's owner is legit. Looney Toons wackiness is not. The AV Club did a great summary of a universe breaking its own rules in their review of the season premiere of Futurama: quote:To put it another way: I love The Simpsons, like any reasonable person should, and I can't stand what the show has become. I blame Frank Grimes. Season 8 is the last full season I own, and while I've seen later episodes, and enjoyed many of them (and yeah, I liked the movie), "Homer's Enemy" is where I mark the beginning of the end. Not because it's a terrible episode, but because it fundamentally and permanently undermines the series' core. "Enemy" has newcomer Frank Grimes railing against Homer's stupidity, his luck, his sloth, his grotesque ineptitude. It's a clever piece of meta-commentary on certain basic elements that have been with the show since the beginning. It gets laughs out of pointing out how ridiculous these characters are, and how monstrous they would appear to an outsider. Since the show relies on us caring about these people, this seems like an odd approach, especially eight seasons in.
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Aug 17, 2010 22:56
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bobkatt013 posted:an example in which it was funny - Farscape, an example of when it is not - a wrestling show Farscape was funny? News to me. Gotta agree that the Hornswoggle bit is stupid if he only does it once, although Ron Simmons can save pretty much anything.
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Aug 17, 2010 22:57
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Jerusalem posted:Yeah, I thought that was silly too, just not as dumb as Hornswoggle creating a magical hole in the wall that only exists for him to run through. Why does everyone want everything to make sense all of a sudden? I just want to watch midgets run through walls and grown men slap each other in the chest.
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Aug 17, 2010 22:59
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Burrito posted:I just want to watch midgets run through walls and grown men slap each other in the chest. I will be happy with the former only if the wall breaks and he's wearing a glittery stormtrooper mask.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:00
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Jerusalem posted:I will be happy with the former only if the wall breaks and he's wearing a glittery stormtrooper mask. Who was it that was Shockmaster in that backstage segment a few months back?
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Aug 17, 2010 23:03
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Burrito posted:Who was it that was Shockmaster in that backstage segment a few months back? Arn Anderson.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:11
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Captain Charisma posted:The AV Club did a great summary of a universe breaking its own rules in their review of the season premiere of Futurama: The Grimes episode was one of the best Simpsons episodes ever. What a terrible example.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:19
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Lone Rogue posted:The Grimes episode was one of the best Simpsons episodes ever. What a terrible example. Yeah. The guy seems like a bit of a miserable guy. Perhaps he lives above a bowling alley and below another bowling alley.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:26
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There is literally no one on this earth more pathetic than a television critic. My son could be a murderous nazi hooker but if he ever became a television critic I would disown him
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Aug 17, 2010 23:29
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Everyone knows the true mark where the Simpsons went down hill is the 200th episode with Homer getting a wacky job, celebrities, a ridiculous deus ex machina ending and everything else.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:38
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Burrito posted:Who was it that was Shockmaster in that backstage segment a few months back? Santino wore the helmet, Arn Anderson did the voice.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:39
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MassRayPer posted:Everyone knows the true mark where the Simpsons went down hill is the 200th episode with Homer getting a wacky job, celebrities, a ridiculous deus ex machina ending and everything else. Howwever, that one did have one of my favourite lines in the show "Woah. Staff only" "Potato man" "Where the hell have you been?"
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Aug 17, 2010 23:42
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MassRayPer posted:Everyone knows the true mark where the Simpsons went down hill is the 200th episode with Homer getting a wacky job, celebrities, a ridiculous deus ex machina ending and everything else. Anyway, content: As far as Daniel Bryan's technique is concerned, is there really any difference between the omoplata crossface and the arm trap version? I was looking at some gifs and pictures of it, and I couldn't really tell the difference.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:48
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Kerck Pnameless posted:Eh, I'm more lenient than that and say that Phil Hartman's death was what ultimately killed the show for me. The arm-trap basically has the arm between the thighs or calves and pulls the shoulder away from the torso with leg strangth. The omoplata version loops the arm around the near-leg and wrenches the arm upwards like a hammerlock/Kimura-lock.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:52
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Ziggy Tsardust posted:The arm-trap basically has the arm between the thighs or calves and pulls the shoulder away from the torso with leg strangth. The omoplata version loops the arm around the near-leg and wrenches the arm upwards like a hammerlock/Kimura-lock. It also looks like it would make it more difficult to escape from, because you're not going to get any leverage on the trapped arm; can't push against the mat or against Bryan to ease the tension. You're probably also going to have trouble rolling out of it like people would do to Benoit, since you'd be putting a hell of a lot of stress on your arm if you did.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:57
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Ziggy Tsardust posted:The arm-trap basically has the arm between the thighs or calves and pulls the shoulder away from the torso with leg strangth. The omoplata version loops the arm around the near-leg and wrenches the arm upwards like a hammerlock/Kimura-lock. It also acts as an elbow lock along with the chokehold. If you notice, Bryan does it so he is bending the arm back the wrong way too.
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Aug 17, 2010 23:57
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Burrito posted:I will respond to you with the same response I hear when anyone says something dumb has happened on wrestling: it's wrestling.
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Aug 18, 2010 00:19
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tzirean posted:Yeah. Say what you will about HHH, he's fantastic at selling.
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Aug 18, 2010 00:20
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LividLiquid posted:So you must think Bischoff/Hogan/Warrior in the mirror moment was just fine and dandy. Actually back when I watched that I had literally no problem with it because that was the only way the angle could have worked
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Aug 18, 2010 00:27
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El Axo Grande posted:Actually back when I watched that I had literally no problem with it because that was the only way the angle could have worked
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Aug 18, 2010 00:50
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LividLiquid posted:So you must think Bischoff/Hogan/Warrior in the mirror moment was just fine and dandy. Take Bischoff out of it, it would have been fine. Had Hogan gone in the dressing room, Warrior appears in the mirror, Hogan freaks out and throws a chair at the mirror, Bischoff runs in and Hogan claims he seen Warrior in the mirror. Bischoff questions Hogan's sanity, scene. Instead, Bischoff is there the entire time and because the viewer saw it and Hogan saw it, it makes Bischoff look like a complete idiot.
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Aug 18, 2010 00:50
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LividLiquid posted:...Really?! Its not really that surprising, Ax is pretty consistently post modern in his view of things and I don't think respecting the logical integrity of pro wrestling is a very important criteria to his enjoyment of the product. I thought that the mirror poo poo was dumb as hell but I was like 18 then and also though Rush was the greatest band ever. It wouldn't bother me now.
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Aug 18, 2010 00:57
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LividLiquid posted:...Really?! Look at it like this If Hogan saw it, but the audience couldn't, then it would have lost the eerie supernatural effect the entire thing was going for. If Bischoff could have seen it, it would have lost the sense of the Warrior's "power" over Hogan. Also, it would have made the viewer see the effect as a parlor trick, and not as the Warrior having magic or whatever. The announcers, in my opinion, always act like a companion to the viewer, not the wrestlers. They are like the Greek chorus narrating events in a way that breaks the fourth wall. If you consider it like that, of course the announcers had to have seen it in order to relate the narrative to the audience. While Hogan seeing Warrior in the mirror when Bischoff couldnt but everyone else could made no logical sense, it made perfect narrative sense. For what they were trying to go for with the segment, that was the most effective way to present it. El Axo Grande fucked around with this message at 01:05 on Aug 18, 2010 |
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Aug 18, 2010 01:01
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Whilst watching a basketball game, would you buy this kind of thing happening? We are supposed to be watching a sport. This, and only this in a very broad sense, is why wrestling isn't cool anymore. It's a live action cartoon and not treated as the sport it is pretending to be. UFC is eating wrestling's lunch and poo poo like that is exactly why. If you, as a booker, ever say, "It's only wrestling. Who cares?" then nobody will.
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Aug 18, 2010 01:06
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LividLiquid posted:If you, as a booker, ever say, "It's only wrestling. Who cares?" then nobody will. Thats not what he said, at all.
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Aug 18, 2010 01:08
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El Axo Grande posted:Look at it like this The announcers not saying anything during the segment and ending the show on it would have been better, IMO. I agree that they are narrators for the show, but the problem is they can't be considered truly like a traditional chorus, as they are regularly involved. The entire thing put them in an odd position, and I think the best way to handle it would have been to remove them from it entirely.
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Aug 18, 2010 01:09
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LividLiquid posted:Whilst watching a basketball game, would you buy this kind of thing happening? We are supposed to be watching a sport. Maybe you are.
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Aug 18, 2010 01:17
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LividLiquid posted:Whilst watching a basketball game, would you buy this kind of thing happening? We are supposed to be watching a sport. I would buy it if I was watching jokey fake sports like Rollerjam or wrestling. also, "whilst" lol
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Aug 18, 2010 01:25
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Hey, remember that baseball game last night? The one where Alex Rodriguez was filmed backstage with the coach plotting on how they were going to doublecross Derek Jeter by joining the Red Sox? It was just before the Undead Lord of Darkness hit that homerun pitched by the Leprechaun
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Aug 18, 2010 02:03
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El Axo Grande posted:Hey, remember that baseball game last night? Just because we accept a lot of ridiculous poo poo doesn't mean we have to accept all of it.
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Aug 18, 2010 02:28
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WeaselWeaz posted:Just because we accept a lot of ridiculous poo poo doesn't mean we have to accept all of it. I think Ax was simply commenting on the flat out ludicrousness of the basketball analogy.
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Aug 18, 2010 02:32
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El Axo Grande posted:Hey, remember that baseball game last night? I would watch a gently caress of a lot more baseball if Ax held the book.
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Aug 18, 2010 02:33
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WeaselWeaz posted:Just because we accept a lot of ridiculous poo poo doesn't mean we have to accept all of it. I think it's more of a problem of plotting then outright silliness in a lot of cases. The Chavo tunnel on wall bit is good for a chuckle but man it totally does not fit at all. It breaks too many of the internal rules of the WWE Universe as it were and as it's set up. Chakira's outright silliness fits perfectly in it's own little comic book universe of evil cults, magic gems, secret finishing moves, and whatever the hell Dragon Dragon is because their consistent in their plotting. For all of the silly involved the fact the fed has storyline elements going back three years speaks to how good their pacing is. Magical leprechauns doesn't fit the WWE's in story reality at all. On the other end of the spectrum stuff like "I just kicked Stan!" does fit and still manages to be funny. As for WCW and the magical mirror Warrior that's just a case of WCW having no idea what the gently caress their doing at a base level and totally messing up on every level and only getting across that Bish is a gigantic tool.
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Aug 18, 2010 02:54
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