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Hedrigall posted:So uh, Mark of MRHP's new review is... well...
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Sep 19, 2010 02:49
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Obligatory Toast posted:What? That's... odd. They didn't change the typeface at all for the US editions - the only time they do change it is basically for inserts like notes, letters, and newspaper articles. It's a bizarre decision in any case as by the time HBP was coming out page length wasn't going to be a deciding factor. Harry Potter was a license to print money by then; people would still buy the poo poo out of it even if it was just Harry being a petulant twat for 800 pag, oh.
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Sep 19, 2010 03:04
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Someone brought it up earlier, but it just seems like Voldemort and his bad bros are a recast of Skeletor and co. from He man and the masters of the universe. In book 5, we have the "Oh poo poo! wands are loving up, welp Harry just ran away, oh well, good thing one of the other big bad guys didn't get in the way. Voldemort in the second book could have just dueled Harry in the Chamber of Secrets, but no, LET THE BASILISK KILL HIM. When Voldemort and Dumbledore were dueling it out, I think 'ole Voldy possesses Harry or some poo poo, why not just blow him up there and fly away on his broomstick like a champ? The whole time Harry is looking for the Horcruxes and poo poo, Voldemort leaves HIS SNAKE at that old ladies house for an ambush. Well, why didn't he just camp out in the house until Harry showed up? What the hell else is he doing? Was Dumbledore that badass that Voldemort was scared to attack him in Hogwarts? All of the students, compared to what the "adults" could do, were essentially worthless and lovely magicians. And yeah, all of the students were lovely. You here about the older dudes making their own spells, potions, learning how to transform into animals, becoming immortal and poo poo, but Harry is the laziest motherfucker ever. I'm done 
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Sep 19, 2010 03:09
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Sometimes being logical means a really short and depressing book. When you're writing a series that's popular, you'll basically be encouraged by your fans and publishers not to end it prematurely. ... Or in some cases, ever.
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Sep 19, 2010 03:28
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Zarfol posted:Someone brought it up earlier, but it just seems like Voldemort and his bad bros are a recast of Skeletor and co. from He man and the masters of the universe. In book 5, we have the "Oh poo poo! wands are loving up, welp Harry just ran away, oh well, good thing one of the other big bad guys didn't get in the way. quote:When Voldemort and Dumbledore were dueling it out, I think 'ole Voldy possesses Harry or some poo poo, why not just blow him up there and fly away on his broomstick like a champ? quote:The whole time Harry is looking for the Horcruxes and poo poo, Voldemort leaves HIS SNAKE at that old ladies house for an ambush. Well, why didn't he just camp out in the house until Harry showed up? What the hell else is he doing? quote:Was Dumbledore that badass that Voldemort was scared to attack him in Hogwarts?
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Sep 19, 2010 11:27
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Zarfol posted:Was Dumbledore that badass that Voldemort was scared to attack him in Hogwarts? All of the students, compared to what the "adults" could do, were essentially worthless and lovely magicians. Grindelweld was basically Magic Hitler compared with Voldemort as magic... um Magic Oswald Mosley. And Dumbledore beat the former. Sure, Voldie had his cheating immortality, and may have been more magically powerful than Grindelweld, but he couldn't no for sure because it's a different generation, so it's an intimidating reputation to go against. As for the students, yeah, it kinda bugged me how scrub-like Harry and co were when the previous generation were learning forbidden magic (animagi), creating potent magical artifacts (marauder's map), and inventing creative and powerful new spells (Snape's stuff from his potions book). If one of the Marauders had been the Chosen One then Voldie would've eaten it before they were finished with their fourth year.
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Sep 19, 2010 12:21
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Shyrka posted:As for the students, yeah, it kinda bugged me how scrub-like Harry and co were when the previous generation were learning forbidden magic (animagi), creating potent magical artifacts (marauder's map), and inventing creative and powerful new spells (Snape's stuff from his potions book). If one of the Marauders had been the Chosen One then Voldie would've eaten it before they were finished with their fourth year. My argument for why the trio were not performing crazy bits of magic is that they really didn't have the time. Previous generations just didn't have crazy poo poo happen to them every 6 months or so. They could sit around when all of their homework was done (or not) and experiment. Also, the trio were super busy with a billion activities even when Voldemort was not attacking. The Marauders on the other hand were not as sucked up in extracurricular activities all the time. Snape clearly had nothing better to do. The twins had absolutely nothing to do since they didn't even do homework. I do believe it is all a matter of free time.
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Sep 19, 2010 15:52
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innocent_deadly posted:My argument for why the trio were not performing crazy bits of magic is that they really didn't have the time. Previous generations just didn't have crazy poo poo happen to them every 6 months or so. They could sit around when all of their homework was done (or not) and experiment. Also, the trio were super busy with a billion activities even when Voldemort was not attacking. The Marauders on the other hand were not as sucked up in extracurricular activities all the time. Snape clearly had nothing better to do. The twins had absolutely nothing to do since they didn't even do homework. I do believe it is all a matter of free time. Honestly it's probably more that the books had no system of magic, so JK had no idea how inventing spells might actually work or how to prevent them from developing whatever game-breaking spell they wanted once they started. So while obviously new spells get invented off camera, she didn't really want face characters doing it. Hermione spends 3/4 of her time reading extra books, she definitely had time to figure out her own spells. You could argue that none of the main three were really psychologically likely to do it - she's too obsessed with doing things by the book and health and safety and poo poo to do something as dangerous and creative as making up new spells, and the other two are basically dumb. Still, it's pretty weird that a couple of people are capable of doing absolutely nutty poo poo, and no one else even tries or seems interested. It would be pretty cool if by the fifth or sixth book there were generally people in the common room trying out variations of spells they knew or trying to make new crazy stuff work.
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Sep 19, 2010 16:30
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Shyrka posted:As for the students, yeah, it kinda bugged me how scrub-like Harry and co were when the previous generation were learning forbidden magic (animagi), creating potent magical artifacts (marauder's map), and inventing creative and powerful new spells (Snape's stuff from his potions book). If one of the Marauders had been the Chosen One then Voldie would've eaten it before they were finished with their fourth year. I think with Snape, he was pretty isolated anyway so he spent his time in the Dark Arts. That's probably all he did when he went home during the holidays, to get away from his unhappy home life.
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Sep 20, 2010 05:53
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IRQ posted:No, they thought we wouldn't know what the mythical alchemical bullshit the philosopher's stone was. No, dude. It's on record. They thought kids wouldn't know what a philosopher was or wouldn't want to read a book with "Philosopher" in the title. This is a thing that happened. I know what the Philospher's Stone is. Thanks for being a huge dick about it, though.
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Sep 20, 2010 10:16
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Hey, at least it's better than the title the French got. Harry Potter and the Magic School 
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Sep 20, 2010 10:19
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I just finished Half-Blood Prince. Oh god that final chapter. 
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Sep 20, 2010 12:54
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Am I wrong in disagreeing with the idea that Snape was actually a good guy? All the things he did that supposedly put him on that side of the ledger were done because he had a creepy and obsessive crush on Harry's mom. It's probably just that I really hate it when writers take the "deep cover" thing to such an absurd extent.
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Sep 20, 2010 20:15
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Plus, what about all those times Snape bullied Neville for being bad at Potions, or Hermione for being good at Potions,* or Harry for existing? What about when he tried to discredit Lupin as a teacher because he couldn't stand the thought of James' old werewolf buddy holding the job he coveted? His "deep cover" doesn't justify those acts, nor do his heroic acts - however momentous - fully redeem him. *When he called Hermione an "insufferable know-it-all" and took points from Gryffindor for giving the correct answer to his question, teenage me was filled with so much CAPLOCKS RAEG, it is not even funny. I'm still kind of pissed off about it, to tell you the truth.
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Sep 20, 2010 21:30
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LooseChanj posted:Am I wrong in disagreeing with the idea that Snape was actually a good guy? All the things he did that supposedly put him on that side of the ledger were done because he had a creepy and obsessive crush on Harry's mom. It's probably just that I really hate it when writers take the "deep cover" thing to such an absurd extent. It annoys me too. One of the biggest themes in the novel is that there is no true good or evil, but always shades of grey (Umbridge being a great example). Snape's actions were motivated by tremendous guilt, so while he did the right thing in the end, he did them for the wrong reasons. I also have a theory that Dumbledore used an Unbreakable Vow to ensure Snape's loyalty.
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Sep 20, 2010 22:20
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Dimentia posted:I also have a theory that Dumbledore used an Unbreakable Vow to ensure Snape's loyalty. That strikes me as very out of character for Dumbledore. He was always about choice. He knew how broken Snape was and gave him opportunity to find some sort of redemption / peace.
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Sep 20, 2010 23:32
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LooseChanj posted:Am I wrong in disagreeing with the idea that Snape was actually a good guy? All the things he did that supposedly put him on that side of the ledger were done because he had a creepy and obsessive crush on Harry's mom. It's probably just that I really hate it when writers take the "deep cover" thing to such an absurd extent. I'm pretty sure Snape was actually a bad person but not a "bad guy." He was selfish, self-centered and a jerk, but did not actually seem to be aware of the full extent of what he was getting into until it threatened someone he cared about. Basically like Draco Malfoy. I think you could make the "bad person, but on the not-evil side" about quite a few characters. I'd certainly say as much for Sirius or that dude who replaced Fudge too, if to a somewhat lesser extent.
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Sep 20, 2010 23:49
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geeves posted:That strikes me as very out of character for Dumbledore. He was always about choice. He knew how broken Snape was and gave him opportunity to find some sort of redemption / peace. Hmm...you're probably right. I've just noticed how extremely reluctant Snape was whenever Dumbledore gave him a task (the "mercy kill" task was understandably difficult though) and how initially distrustful Dumbledore was of him.
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Sep 21, 2010 02:44
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Just started Deathly Hallows for the first time since July 21, 2007.  The first chapter is loving horrifying, with the Muggle Studies professor crying and pleading Snape for her life while he just watches impassively then she gets murdered holy loving poo poo Just looking over a chapter list online, there's a lot I do not remember about this book at all. This is going to be an awesome ride!
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Sep 21, 2010 15:37
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ImpAtom posted:I think you could make the "bad person, but on the not-evil side" about quite a few characters. I'd certainly say as much for Sirius or that dude who replaced Fudge too, if to a somewhat lesser extent. I don't think either of those are really the same as Snape. The only thing about Sirius that I can remember as casting him in a negative light was his treatment of Kreacher. Between Kreacher egging him on, worshipping Mrs. Black, and the fact that the majority of the wizarding world treats house elves like crap, I really have a hard time seeing how that outweighs his good qualities. Scrimgeour could be seen as a bad person I suppose. With the entire wizarding world relying on you to protect them and knowing how hopelessly outclassed you are, I can understand his "ends justify the means" approach. With Snape, every good action he did was in direct opposition to his nature and what he wanted to do. Dumbledore had to drag him along by the scruff of his neck and constantly remind him of Lily in order for him to do the right thing. He took every opportunity he could to make student's lives miserable at Hogwarts, not just Harry.
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Sep 21, 2010 16:19
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God I fucking love Diablo 3 gold, it even paid for this shitty title
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Obligatory Toast posted:What? That's... odd. They didn't change the typeface at all for the US editions - the only time they do change it is basically for inserts like notes, letters, and newspaper articles. Actually they did, go compare books 5 and 6. There are definitely more lines per page in book 5.
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Sep 21, 2010 19:17
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What annoys me is in HBP, Harry is accusing Snape of being a traitor and asking Mr Weasley why Dumbledore trusts him so implicitly despite all the evidence to the contrary. Then Lupin interjects and tells Harry that he's inherited an old bias against Snape from Sirius and his father. Really? I would say it's more Snape has been a massive bell end to Harry since his first day at school. Snape took every opportunity to belittle, threaten, accuse and generally poo poo on Harry. All because Snape hated his dad and wanted to get off with mum. And Harry is supposed to be the guy with the irrational bias?
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Sep 21, 2010 21:37
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Suprfli6 posted:I don't think either of those are really the same as Snape. Sirius is a bastard to Kreacher and did nasty stuff to Snape back when they were back in school, including tricking him into almost getting killed by werewolf Lupin. In fact, most of what we saw good from Sirius was his connection to James, who was a bit of a twit himself, and he actually tried to goad Harry into doing dangerous things because he wanted excitement. They play this up a bit in the movie where he actually calls Harry "James" at one point, but it's in the books as well. I'm not saying he's a ridiculously terrible person or anything, but I wouldn't call him a good person either. It's just that, unlike Snape, he happened to be someone sympathetic to Harry, so we saw more of the good aspects.
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Sep 21, 2010 22:13
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Suprfli6 posted:With Snape, every good action he did was in direct opposition to his nature and what he wanted to do. Dumbledore had to drag him along by the scruff of his neck and constantly remind him of Lily in order for him to do the right thing. He took every opportunity he could to make student's lives miserable at Hogwarts, not just Harry. Maybe early on? I don't know it's not really shown. Snape came to Dumbledore in a panic about the prophecy when Voldemore decided to target the Potters. In one of Snape's last memories it's clearly Snape who reminds Dumbledore that he's been doing it all for Lily.
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Sep 21, 2010 23:23
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I got the impression that Snape was tortured, not evil in any way. He was a pissed off, unhappy, jealous and petty person in a lot of cases, which is what motivated a lot of the poo poo he did. I know that Lily was a huge motivator in him being on the "good" side, but I also felt that Dumbledore's unwavering trust in him is another big reason he didn't falter. Despite all of his flaws, Dumbledore saw the good in him, which meant a lot to Snape in a way he probably didn't fully understand. There are people who do evil things because they're evil, and those who do because they're in lovely circumstances. I always felt like Snape was the latter, and Dumbledore was the thing that kept him from falling off the wagon into the bad poo poo. Obviously, guilt over Lily also played a part, but I'm not sure it would have been enough. Dumbledore using Lily to show Snape that he was capable of pure, true love was important.
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Sep 22, 2010 00:35
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Hedrigall posted:Just started Deathly Hallows for the first time since July 21, 2007. I just re-read it, and boy was it chock full of stuff I was so glad to re-read. And yeah, that scene really threw me for a loop upon my first read. It really sent my theories about Snape being good or evil into huge doubt.
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Sep 22, 2010 05:05
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I've started a reread of the series and "finished" GoF the other day. I'm not sure I will continue. I ended up being sick of the yule ball, and even the tournament. Especially, though, I couldn't take all of the horrible world building. I also remembered hating Harry in the beginning of the next book so I just didn't feel like following it through. The moment I got fed up was when Harry first meets Rita Skeeter she takes him into a broom closet to sit him on a cardboard box. Cardboard? In Hogwarts? That seems very...muggleish. There are so many little things like that and they just jump out at you if you are paying even the smallest amount of attention. I am not one that grew up with the books, but I enjoyed them quite a bit on my first read through. Even the things I couldn't stand this time around I enjoyed before. They are good for what they are, kid books, and the story is very good. I just am not sure the series warrants another read for me. On the other hand I cannot remember a thing from the last 3 books other than major plot points, so I would like to give them a shot. I've got plenty of time until the first part of the DH movie is out. So no rush, I suppose.
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Sep 22, 2010 06:15
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Having just finished the series for the first time, I recommend not getting flustered about the cardboard box (seriously dude? relax) and finish.
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Sep 22, 2010 09:13
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Yeah seriously, what the gently caress? Wizards have printed books, notepads, newspapers, posters and many other things made out of paper. Why shouldn't they have cardboard :| edit: chocolate frog cards, the box Harry's cake from Hagrid is in, etc
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Sep 22, 2010 09:22
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So..in the end, all those people died and so many suffered...because the key to immortality was in the loving library for anyone to read. Thanks, inexplicable 'Restricted Section'.
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Sep 22, 2010 10:31
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FrensaGeran posted:So..in the end, all those people died and so many suffered...because the key to immortality was in the loving library for anyone to read. Even a wizard librarian is not going to take a book off the shelves just because others deem it "dangerous." They'd probably put it out on display during banned book week.
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Sep 22, 2010 15:49
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FrensaGeran posted:So..in the end, all those people died and so many suffered...because the key to immortality was in the loving library for anyone to read. Then Dumbledore went back to his "For the greater good" roots and decided that censorship was best.
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Sep 22, 2010 16:13
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FrensaGeran posted:Having just finished the series for the first time, I recommend not getting flustered about the cardboard box (seriously dude? relax) and finish. I didn't exactly throw the book away in a fit of rage. The cardboard box just seems very out of place. It is no more complicated than that. And I obviously was getting tired of the series before that scene, I'm not sure why that is hard to understand. There are many small things (and big ones) that just don't work. Rowling just didn't put much thought into the world she built. I enjoy the books and the story, but I am not sure I want to reread them all. At the end of the day, a kid's book series is probably just not going to be good enough, and deep enough, to read over and over again. I thought it might be interesting going through it again knowing more about Snape's background, but he is really just a bitter rear end in a top hat to everyone for no reason in the first four books. Really I'd have been better off reading summaries of books 1 through 4 and then starting with OotP.
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Sep 22, 2010 18:37
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geeves posted:Then Dumbledore went back to his "For the greater good" roots and decided that censorship was best. Is it really censorship to remove a book called "Mustard Gas: And How to Make It" from your local library? e: So...I think I understand what happened, but I have some elder wand questions. Even if it's not rightfully yours, you can still use it. Voldemort cast the bubble around Nagini, the voice-enhancing spell, and I'm sure some other stuff. Voldemort was able to destroy the part of himself inside Harry with Avada Kadavra...so the wand works? Right? Why didn't it work the second time? Was his mother's blood involved? Endless Trash fucked around with this message at 20:02 on Sep 22, 2010 |
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Sep 22, 2010 19:43
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Chaglby posted:I didn't exactly throw the book away in a fit of rage. The cardboard box just seems very out of place. It is no more complicated than that. And I obviously was getting tired of the series before that scene, I'm not sure why that is hard to understand. There are many small things (and big ones) that just don't work. Rowling just didn't put much thought into the world she built. Considering that there's no machinery or anything in the wizarding world - having cardboard existing seems to imply that there's a paper mill staffed by luckless hufflepuffs or house elves somewhere churning out chocolate frog cards and packaging for magical janitorial products.
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Sep 22, 2010 21:00
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FrensaGeran posted:Is it really censorship to remove a book called "Mustard Gas: And How to Make It" from your local library? That's pretty much the definition of censorship, yes.
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Sep 22, 2010 21:04
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FrensaGeran posted:e: So...I think I understand what happened, but I have some elder wand questions. I figure it's like this: The first time Voldemort used Avada Kedavra, Harry was fully prepared to die. The elder wand was therefore acting within it's true master's wishes. The spell worked because Harry expected it to. That's also why Voldemort didn't win ownership of the wand after blasting Harry with it. The second time around, Harry chose to deny Voldemort the ability to use the elder wand against him, and so the wand followed its master's wishes yet again.
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Sep 22, 2010 21:08
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IRQ posted:That's pretty much the definition of censorship, yes. Well I figure if Hogwarts students are taught about the Unforgivable Curses by being told exactly what they are and what they do, it's not so unreasonable for a library to house detailed instructions on how to rule the world.
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Sep 22, 2010 21:11
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Marchegiana posted:I figure it's like this: The first time Voldemort used Avada Kedavra, Harry was fully prepared to die. The elder wand was therefore acting within it's true master's wishes. The spell worked because Harry expected it to. That's also why Voldemort didn't win ownership of the wand after blasting Harry with it. The second time around, Harry chose to deny Voldemort the ability to use the elder wand against him, and so the wand followed its master's wishes yet again. I have two theories. 1 - The Elder Wand would not have killed Harry - it saw the part of Voldemort in Harry and killed that instead. The Killing Curse is still powerful though and knocked Harry out and it gave him the opportunity to succumb to the curse or chose to live. 2 - Dumbledore's plan was for him to die willingly at the hands of Snape, thus the Elder wand would have "died" with Dumbledore. Malfoy screwed that up. Later, Harry knew he was the master of the Elder Wand from his conversation with Ollivander and speculated that if he died willingly like Dumbledore, and removed the last Horcrux, someone might have been able to take out Voldemort that night or soon after because of Voldemort's misplaced confidence in the Wand. Aside from that I think the reason that Voldemort could no longer hurt Harry or any of the other students, I don't think was the Wand's doing, it was Harry's sacrifice. Bringing things full circle. Actually, I think Harry says as much when he confronts him.
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Sep 22, 2010 21:19
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FrensaGeran posted:Well I figure if Hogwarts students are taught about the Unforgivable Curses by being told exactly what they are and what they do, it's not so unreasonable for a library to house detailed instructions on how to rule the world. But they weren't supposed to be. Moody (aside from not being who he was expected to be), was very much "gently caress the ministry, I do what I want." I think Hermione even mentions that it's illegal for him to perform them in the class. And if not spiders, then the Imperius on the whole class is definitely illegal. Moody just didn't give a gently caress, and I'm not sure Dumbledor knew he was going to go that far.
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Sep 22, 2010 21:32
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