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Oh my god the joke is you click that and it's a legitmate email address.
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Sep 30, 2010 05:32
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hammeredspace posted:Is there a real-world job that will pay me real money to give a poo poo about this stuff? If so, CC idiot.desperate.sailor@us.fuckme.mil.com High school english teacher maybe?
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Sep 30, 2010 05:53
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Yeah I substitute-taught for a few months and that poo poo is literally loving torture. There's a reason there's a handful of billboards in my neighborhood advertising BECOME A TEACHER NOW. BE A HERO. HAVE AN IMPACT ON THE COMMUNITY. ALL FOR SIXTY DOLLARS A DAY! Okay enough of that; we got any more wacky stories of crazy personalities at DLI? hammeredspace fucked around with this message at 11:33 on Sep 30, 2010 |
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Sep 30, 2010 05:56
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"An" is generally employed to avoid a stop between words, so you use your best judgement. Acronyms and Abbreviations follow the same rules. an x-ray, an NCO, a JO, etc. Hammerdspace, you could always aspire to be my 12th grade English Teacher. She was the only teacher I ever had that gave a gently caress, and all she got for it was misery. I think the only reason she maintained composure when she found out that only one of us (not me) knew what an appositive is was because she was unable to decide between rage or sadness. Clearly I didn't learn enough, because I still can't come up with a more graceful way to word that sentence. Edit: I sometimes say an historian, but I also pluralize octopus as octopodes, so keep that in mind. Comradephate fucked around with this message at 15:47 on Sep 30, 2010 |
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Sep 30, 2010 15:45
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Slippery posted:High school english teacher maybe? I'm actually side-tracking my dream/degree-plan (to be Robin Williams in Dead Poets Society) to take a gander at how much fun it might be to become a CTI in the Navy.* I loving love the intricacies, rules, and contextual interplay of the English language, and am a sponge for learning new ones. I go on orgasmic spasms of verbosity when people ask me if there's a better word/metaphor/analogy for what they're trying to explain or describe, and then I sit like a retarded parakeet and pick at the finer points of the language for a few minutes after they wander away. From both personal experience and classroom observation, I've seen that the English teacher is the one most likely to actually give a poo poo about stimulating the potential of his or her students. Especially secondary English, as elementary is usually, "Read short story. Regurgitate the following things: Setting, Characters, Theme, Conflict, Resolution. Write exactly three five-sentence paragraphs on the story, using the Paragraph Template. Repeat." Secondary English actually shows the teacher some measure of independent thought and improvement in communication. Someone with an actual passion for linguistics (hammeredspace !!!) would be invaluable to the teaching field. Starting pay as a HS teacher would depend on the state in which you are licensed and choose to teach (varying between $30-40K for beginners), but benefits kick in pretty quickly AND you get holidays and summers off. Experience as a substitute DOES NOT translate to how actual teaching goes. No child born in the Western Hemisphere has ever treated a substitute with anything less than complete disrespect bordering on disdain. So now that I'm here and loaded with coffee I'm going to re-read this thread to see if any of my concerns about CTI have been addressed. *To clarify: I'm not putting school on hold specifically to enlist, but outside circumstances have forced a break in my schooling and I'm looking at opportunities to use my brainsmarts elsewhere while I wait for life to straighten back out.
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Sep 30, 2010 16:15
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OKAY HERE COMES A QUESTION: To become a linguist, do you need to already demonstrate fluency in a language, or just the aptitude to become fluent? I ask this because my recruiter said there was no point in trying to go CTI if I wasn't already fluent in "Arabic or one of those languages" (said in the same tone as your racist grandmother talking about those people). I would totally be willing to Rosetta-Stone the hell out of some Pashto/Dari/something useful if it was necessary to do so before even enlisting, but methinks that if all linguists were fluent to begin with, then DLI would be pointless.
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Sep 30, 2010 16:36
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Your recruiter is incorrect and is lazy. You knock the DLAB out of the park and it doesn't matter if you speak a single language other than English.
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Sep 30, 2010 17:01
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hammeredspace posted:You're cute. What's your name? *twirls hair* My name is PVT. Aspy and I LARP down on museum field. I am an NCO. Though this place would have you think differently. I come from a combat-arms background and have been overseas before coming here. The massive shock of how this place is run comes from being put back into TRADOC after seeing the real military (not practicing military, but actually going to combat) and after going through college and watching this place parade itself around, calling itself a "school" and not a military training post. We have a girl in my company who will seldom speak with anyone and always sits alone until formation is called. Like many brooding, misunderstood kids, she has a notebook she always writes or draws in. 2 weeks ago, after formation, my friend noticed she left it and had seemingly already left. It's almost funny to think that, because she's a student at DLI, the book was adorned with countless pictures of homosexual furries in graphic depictions of aggressive, homosexual intercourse and page after page of stories pertaining to said characters. The funny point happened after 3 or so minutes when she she came back to find her book and saw us looking through it, bemused. I made a point to call her over and take her book back.
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Sep 30, 2010 17:15
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krylex posted:Your recruiter is incorrect and is lazy. I am sensing a theme...
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Sep 30, 2010 17:33
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The only job that requires fluency in a foreign language before you start is interpreter, at least in the Army.
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Sep 30, 2010 17:49
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krylex posted:Your recruiter is incorrect and is lazy. Just FYI for any of you aspiring linguists...there is no official way to study for the DLAB, but a guy I know took it, got a 96, and then used this and went to a 122.
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Sep 30, 2010 20:14
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Busket_in_Posket posted:I am sensing a theme... They are nothing if not consistent.
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Sep 30, 2010 21:15
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This is an entirely academic question, but I don't know a better place to ask, and I'm curious. What are some of the linguistic tendencies/stumbling blocks of people who are native speakers of American English (besides drooling and trying not to spit up on themselves in public) when they speak other languages? For example, Poles often replace v's with w's when speaking English, Spanish speakers sometimes drop j's, and so on.
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Oct 1, 2010 13:17
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Comradephate posted:This is an entirely academic question, but I don't know a better place to ask, and I'm curious. What are some of the linguistic tendencies/stumbling blocks of people who are native speakers of American English (besides drooling and trying not to spit up on themselves in public) when they speak other languages? On a basic note, Americans are notorious for trying to stick to the "adjective -> noun" format, when many languages will state the noun first and then the descriptor. We're also really bad at adapting our brains to the fact that letters that look like the ones we use every day may have a different pronunciation (LL in Spanish, J in Spanish, CC in Italian, S in Castilian, CRAZY BACKWARDS R in Cyrillic, etc.). Also gendered nouns/adjectives are a huge stumbling block. English is a relatively neuter language (we just say "a ______," "an ________," "the ________," with adjectives that mix and match), whereas many others (particularly the Romance and Slavic languages) ascribe a masculine/feminine/neuter declension to nouns and their corresponding adjectives. Messing these up can change meanings or just make you sound like a confused toddler. Um um um what else... Many Americans try to speak other languages while retaining their native accent (see: Peggy Hill). Many languages require glottal and lingual movements that aren't native to our speech, and so trying to say some words while maintaining the same mouth movements you've used your whole life just comes out silly (see: the kid from Minnesota trying to learn Mandarin and sounding like a badly-dubbed Fargo). The practice of adding descriptors on as prefixes (German et al.) or suffixes (Japanese et al.) shouldn't be as difficult to master as it seems for some people, but gosh darn it we want our descriptors and modifiers to be separate like we separated from those drat British to found this fine country. *spits into spitoon* That's all I can think of for now.
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Oct 1, 2010 15:17
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Rhotic sounds tend to be a huge problem for alot of English speakers. For example... English - Rush Chinese - Rou French - Rouge All of those words start with different sounds. This blows alot of peoples' minds. It's the same way with the examples Busket gave, and it all comes back to the fact that people are under the impression that letters inherently makes some sort of sound. The truth is people have been speaking since long before they had writing, and in the case of European languages they all just used the symbols the Romans came up with and pidgeon-holed them into their own languages. This is why English has 5 letters for vowels, despite the fact that it uses 16 vowels, give or take a few depending on dialect. That is to say, letters stand for specific sounds within specific languages. There is no phonetic information inherent to letters outside of an actual use in language transcription. From the Asian language side, English speakers have a hard time getting the idea that attributive phrases come before the noun, that is to say instead of saying "the guy who went to the store and bought milk yesterday" you have to say "the went to the store and bought milk yesterday guy". The standard screw up winds up coming out as "The guy went to the store... the went to the store guy bought some... The went to the store bought some milk guy". There are a lot of sounds in Mandarin that people have trouble with too. The sounds represented by Ch, Zh, J, and Q inevitably all get turned into the sounds from the English words chew and Jew. Neither of those sounds are in Chinese.
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Oct 1, 2010 16:04
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QingLaiXiguaba posted:
Man, you should try learning Fuzhou. Front-rounded vowels, nine tones, a ton of tone sandhi, and it's spoken very rapidly. It makes you go home with an aching face for the first few weeks.
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Oct 1, 2010 17:31
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Busket_in_Posket posted:OKAY HERE COMES A QUESTION: Yeah, your recruiter is flat-out wrong. I just sat the DLAB Wednesday, and I'm not even close to anything approaching fluent in any language other than English. If he were correct, there'd be no way in hell I'd've gotten the CTI contract I now hold. Good luck if you take it, it's *tough* as hell, but holy poo poo, the feeling of passing that thing and qualifying for the program is amazing. Speaking of, I do have a question for anyone currently at DLI. My recruiter and the guys who drew up my contract yesterday told me language choice gets assigned once you reach DLI after basic. I know I probably won't have much choice in what I'm learning, but will they take any prior instruction in a language into account when assigning me a program? I say this because I'd started Russian in college and absolutely love the hell out of it to the point where I was gonna declare that my minor before I ended up leaving college. My DLAB scores qualify me to get it, and I'd really, really love continuing in it if I can. Not opposed to learning anything new, mind ya, but I'm hoping I can continue on with Russian if I can.
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Oct 1, 2010 20:26
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Navik posted:Yeah, your recruiter is flat-out wrong. I just sat the DLAB Wednesday, and I'm not even close to anything approaching fluent in any language other than English. If he were correct, there'd be no way in hell I'd've gotten the CTI contract I now hold. Good luck if you take it, it's *tough* as hell, but holy poo poo, the feeling of passing that thing and qualifying for the program is amazing. I can only speak for the Marines, but I've confirmed with the Navy and the Air Force that they're all about the same... Prior instruction counts for poo poo. As in, it's not hyperbole to say regardless of how they assign languages, they could just as well throw darts. I had 2 years of Japanese and 2 years of Russian experience when I signed my contract. After MCT I got orders to report to DLI and learn Arabic. During in-processing we got to fill out our wishlists. My first choice was Russian, others in the room put Chinese. I got Chinese. They got Russian. Not a single airman or sailor from my class put Chinese as their first language. The two soldiers in my class did get to pick their languages, but they were both prior service.
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Oct 1, 2010 22:31
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QingLaiXiguaba posted:Credentials: I DLPT'd Chinese in July. 2+/2+/1+ I have a 4/3+ in Russian, 3/2+ in Ukrainian, and am currently in the second half of my Pashto course. As someone who's taken no less than 8 DLPTs in the past, I think the DLPT is a very fair assessment of your ability to understand a language. Having cited that experience, I have to say that I haven't found the test to be inconsistent in any way over the years. The OPI, on the other hand, is straight-up subjective bullshit. I just took one for the first time a few months ago. I speak Russian at least as well as English and somehow I got a 2+. Also, prior 1371 here.
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Oct 2, 2010 04:45
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themarine posted:I have a 4/3+ in Russian, 3/2+ in Ukrainian, and am currently in the second half of my Pashto course. As someone who's taken no less than 8 DLPTs in the past, I think the DLPT is a very fair assessment of your ability to understand a language. Having cited that experience, I have to say that I haven't found the test to be inconsistent in any way over the years. The OPI, on the other hand, is straight-up subjective bullshit. I just took one for the first time a few months ago. I speak Russian at least as well as English and somehow I got a 2+. I don't doubt that at all. As I understand it, the tests are made completely independent of each other, and all the other languages' linguists I know view the test as fair, despite the difficulty of the tests. The instructors were all in agreement with the students on the test being inaccurate, though as I understand there are very strict guidelines about them never seeing the test or interacting with the test makers, so I'm not sure if their opinions can be taken for holding much value. That being said, my entire attitude towards the language has changed since leaving the stress of DLI, so it wouldn't surprise me if alot of my conceptions about the test are a direct result of my mindset at the school. I'm actually kind of anxious about my first post-DLI DLPT just to see how different it seems.
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Oct 2, 2010 04:54
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QingLaiXiguaba posted:I'm actually kind of anxious about my first post-DLI DLPT just to see how different it seems. It's actually awesome cause you find out your score right away. Also, if your test admin's cool (most of them are, at least at the Pendleton LRC) they'll let you take breaks pretty much whenever you want, which is great if you smoke.
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Oct 2, 2010 05:05
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Oh man the DLI is the sperg capital of the world but I am starting to think that Fort Gordon is some sort of sperg nexus. It is like the sperg kids have grown up and now it is sperged out adults. Who am I kidding, these people never grow up but now it is kid brains in adult situations.
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Oct 3, 2010 22:36
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An engineer in my office is fluent in two Chinese dialects when he joined, and received double language pay during his stint as a Naval officer... in which they stuck him behind a desk in DC watching buildings get built, and he never actually did any translating. Meanwhile, Navy paid a lot of money to send someone else through school to learn Chinese and probably not as good as this guy. Yay DoD.
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Oct 3, 2010 23:01
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Delayed response, but thanks for the replies to my inane question. That was pretty much what I was looking for.
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Oct 4, 2010 00:17
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Comradephate posted:Delayed response, but thanks for the replies to my inane question. That was pretty much what I was looking for. You'll be a general one day, dammit. Mark my words.
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Oct 4, 2010 03:10
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grover posted:An engineer in my office is fluent in two Chinese dialects when he joined, and received double language pay during his stint as a Naval officer... in which they stuck him behind a desk in DC watching buildings get built, and he never actually did any translating. Meanwhile, Navy paid a lot of money to send someone else through school to learn Chinese and probably not as good as this guy. True story, I've been getting double FLPP almost since day one, and I've only been a linguist for less than a year. The other 3+ years I was a combat engineer. You better believe I never used my Russian or Ukrainian skills in Iraq. When I actually got to DLI though, they put me in Pashto. Next month I take my first Pashto DLPT, and if all goes well, I should come pretty close to maxing out my FLPP.
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Oct 4, 2010 13:48
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Honestly, tell me: is it natural, god-given talent that lets you double-triple up on the FLPP, or do you spend your off-hours pouring over dogshit that would never otherwise interest you in languages you'll never even have a passing casual interest in exercising? If it's the latter how do you stop yourself from killing yourself unless learning a new word in Pasto gives you the biggest goddamn orgasm the world will never know of I know you're human god drat it; tell me your loving secret.
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Oct 6, 2010 01:39
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What's the word for oil derrick in Swahili? UUUNNNGGH
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Oct 6, 2010 01:41
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Well, I'm in week 42 of Farsi now. I don't think anyone in my class has any smidgen of motivation left. Fortunately we have a great teaching team. I got a 1+/2 on my mid term DLPT. In a month I take my final DLPT, and I'm getting worried about it. I was hoping for a 2+/2+/2 but now gently caress, just gimme a 2/2/1+ and get me the hell out of here! Farsi being my second language from DLI, I thought I would be able to handle the "end of course boredom" better, but gently caress me, I just want to get out of here and back to the real Army. At least I'll get lots of extra BAH at Goodfellow!
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Oct 6, 2010 18:27
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Even nailing a 2/2 on the DLPT5 these days is an accomplishment. You'll do good. You'll make it. It loving sucks now. We all want it to be over. We all want to move the gently caress on. But keep it up. Keep giving a poo poo. Because the alternative is unbearable, even if it's not the end of the world. Go do it.
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Oct 7, 2010 01:00
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Otto Skorzeny posted:Machine translation is an AI problem that has received tons of funding since at least the 60s btw. It's almost the platonic form of problems AI research promised to solve quickly and easily that turned out to be fiendishly hard. True story, SYSTRAN, the company that wrote Yahoo Babelfish and the early code for Google Translate has been around since 1968, born of a government contract with the USAF for machine-based Russian translation. They are working on many different projects now, but USG is still their largest client.
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Oct 7, 2010 04:16
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hammeredspace posted:Honestly, tell me: is it natural, god-given talent that lets you double-triple up on the FLPP, or do you spend your off-hours pouring over dogshit that would never otherwise interest you in languages you'll never even have a passing casual interest in exercising? Russian and Ukrainian are my native languages. I learned English when I was 12. I understand all 3 equally well, and I speak Russian no worse than I speak English. I can't speak Ukrainian though, unless maybe I take a refresher course or something. Pashto just happens to be what the great logistical genius behind the curtain assigned to me. I have no idea why, but I'm still doing my best to learn it. I'm at about 1+/1+ right now, my goal is 3/3 before 2013 so I can land an awesome contract job if I choose to get out after this. And yes, I will study on my own time just to get those numbers.
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Oct 7, 2010 04:21
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{quote}Hey, are any of you currently in F company? {/quote} Yep. Just graduated Pashto. 2/2/2 whoot. {quote} I can't speak Ukrainian though, unless maybe I take a refresher course or something. Pashto just happens to be what the great logistical genius behind the curtain assigned to me. I have no idea why, but I'm still doing my best to learn it. I'm at about 1+/1+ right now {/quote} Which teaching team do you have? Are you the AF SSGT with the big head? ... As far as the Army goes with DLI. If you are a reclass NCO and you are competent, you'll have an easy time with the company business. The language side will be challenging, but if you do the normal 7 hours, (7:55-1545) and night class (1800-2030), you'll win over your MLIs, your instructors, and you'll at the very least meet the standard for graduation. SirEverlast fucked around with this message at 07:55 on Oct 17, 2010 |
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Oct 17, 2010 07:52
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I start Chinese here at Ft. Bragg pretty soon. I'm a little bummed out I don't get to experience DLI, but it sounds like a horrible place. Any suggestions for being successful with a totally foreign language?
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Oct 19, 2010 00:35
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iceslice posted:I start Chinese here at Ft. Bragg pretty soon. I'm a little bummed out I don't get to experience DLI, but it sounds like a horrible place. Any suggestions for being successful with a totally foreign language? Being a week away from graduating from Chinese, I can offer a few tips based on my subjective experience: - PRACTICE! Seriously. The more you use what you know, the more quickly you can understand by listening and reading. For instance, I speak Chinese as often as possible and I found it helped me immensely. If they have an after school speaking club, go one or two nights a week. It's not too time consuming is worth it in the end. - Get as intimate with the new vocabulary as possible. With Chinese, you'll find that it ends up sounding like the same few sound over and over. Again, like with speaking, do it often. My method was to study vocabulary lists until I could read and translate from pinyin to English, the character to English, and then English to spoken Chinese. The more you can layer your knowledge of a word, the better you understand it. - This is a bit tough, but don't neglect sleep. Going into class on 4 or 5 hours a sleep to try to absorb 8 hours of Chinese is not a good idea.
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Oct 19, 2010 00:59
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I just wrapped up Chinese about 3 months ago... In the beginning, you will learn very slowly. This doesn't mean you won't learn a lot. The best advice I can give you is in the beginning, take it as a mechanical process. You don't need to understand the language, just know that when they ask you Ni Jiao Shenme Mingzi, you reply Wo Jiao Your Name. That doesn't make any sense to you now, and it won't really make sense when you start class either. Learn to simply react to what they say, and figure it out later. Talk about whatever is your current topic as much as possible. Have you ever met the type of rear end in a top hat who will bring up whatever bland topic he was interested in yesterday, and just go on and on about it as if you cared? Be that guy. The teachers want you to use your language as much as possible, so they'll be overjoyed that you wanna to talk about how you ate 3 apples yesterday, and one was red but the others were green, and they were all kind of sour etc... Lastly, talk to yourself in Chinese. Constantly. Everyone will tell you to think in Chinese, my advice is when nobody's around no poo poo talk out loud to yourself in Chinese. Speech is a physical art as well as a mental exercise, and when you speak you train both the muscles in your mouth and the parts of your ear that hear to do Chinese. I was lucky enough to have a roommate that was in the same class as I was, so we would both do it all the time as well as speak to each other in Chinese. In summary, when something as intricate as language is done as a speed course, the key is quantity over quality. Do Chinese as much as possible, whenever possible. Around second semester (If your course is the 63 week one, that should start somewhere around week 20) I started using SKYPE to call Chinese people. I found this to help a ton. If you have any questions, you can email me at zencrisisATgmailDOTcom
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Oct 19, 2010 01:08
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QingLaiXiguaba posted:Around second semester (If your course is the 63 week one, that should start somewhere around week 20) I started using SKYPE to call Chinese people. I found this to help a ton. "Hello?" "I ate three apples yesterday." "Hello? Who is this?" "I ate three apples yesterday. One was green, one was red, and one was yellow." "I'm sorry, do I know you?" "One of the apples I ate yesterday was very sour. After I ate that apple, which was one of the three apples I ate yesterday, I drank a glass of water. The glass of water was very good." "..."
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Oct 19, 2010 01:36
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QingLaiXiguaba posted:] I'm glad I'm not the only person who does this, and it definitely helps with accent a lot. I dunno how the military's course goes, but dig up good pronunciation guides. I've never studied linguistics, but I've picked up some of the terminology (trill, aspirated/unaspirated, glottal stop, etc) from self-studying pronunciation guides, as teachers I've had tend to give up on correcting pronunciation after the first few weeks or months. It helps to get equivalents from English, or at least "it's like this in English, but your tongue/lips/throat should be like this, or halfway between this English sound and this other one. For example, the "r" sound in Mandarin isn't like our "r", it's more between our "r" and "y", IIRC. Do an "r", then a "y", then figure out where halfway is for your tongue. You aren't used to making that movement on its own, so you have to keep setting up the position using the English equivalents to get your bearings, and practicing it until muscle memory kicks in and you can do it without using the English positions as crutches. /zh/ /ch/ /sh/ and /z/ /c/ /x/ are also ones that a lot of foreigners let slide with sloppy pronunciation. We have those sounds in English, but sometimes only as final consonants (/z/ and /c/), not initials, so you need to practice making them at the start of a word, which I do by starting the English word that ends in the sound, voicing the final consonant (which is the initial in Chinese), and then saying the rest of the Chinese syllable. After a little while you won't need to rely on the English, and the Chinese sound will come to you naturally. I've taught myself how to pronounce an initial "ng" (not found in Mandarin or English, but in a few Southeast Asian languages) by practicing the final movement from the English word "song" enough; a lot of my classmates (and even a Lao-Canadian friend who grew up in the West) can't do it to save their lives. It really helps to break the characters down by radical (little component pictures; you will see the same ones over and over again, in different arrangements and combinations) rather than try to remember them as an amalgamation of random squiggles. There are self-study courses which do this systematically, such as the one by James Heisig, but it sounds like you probably don't have the time to invest in that. Just make up memorable pet names for them and weave them into stories to use as mnemonic devices; for example, "金", which means metal or gold, and shows up in a lot of other characters*, is "cruise missile" for me (my friend blurted that out when our 11th grade Japanese teacher asked us what we thought it looked like, so it's been "cruise missile" for me ever since  )*in mainland Chinese its form is simplified to the left part of this character: 镀
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Oct 19, 2010 01:47
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tengohemroidz posted:Just FYI for any of you aspiring linguists...there is no official way to study for the DLAB, but a guy I know took it, got a 96, and then used this and went to a 122. Not true, Deltalabs or Deltagear has a DLAB prep guide that helped me go from an 85 to a 114.
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Nov 29, 2010 02:55
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QingLaiXiguaba posted:I just wrapped up Chinese about 3 months ago... Thanks for posting this. I'm starting Mandarin at Fort Bragg (6 month course) Jan 3 so you'll probably be getting a ton of questions from me starting then. I'm required to pass with a 1/1, but really want to get a 2/2 so I can get paid. How realistic is that given the length of my course?
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Nov 29, 2010 16:47
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