The Prison Thread

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HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

BattleMaster posted:

Is Toronto home to worst-fed inmates in North America?

No it isn't.

# ? Oct 19, 2010 00:14

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# ? May 31, 2024 23:42

BattleMaster: Aug 14, 2000

Yeah the article was Canadian-centric and shouldn't have said "North America". I can't imagine private prisons actually being better than the worst public prison.

# ? Oct 19, 2010 00:16

BENGHAZI 2: Oct 13, 2007; by Cyrano4747

a handful of dust posted:

The number of people who actually believe this stuff is frightening; they're not just trolling or making inflammatory comments online. I don't think I've had a discussion about this kind of stuff outside of university where the majority of opinions weren't something along the lines of "gently caress em, they deserve worse," or "don't do the crime if you can't do the time, we coddle them too much as it is," etc. etc."

Almost any discussion of prison abuse or prisoner rights/activism with average joes will get you at least one rear end in a top hat who pipes in with the old "take em out back and shoot em" line. At least in my experience. It's not something I really like to talk about outside of the internet or classes anymore, because so many people seem to have such nasty opinions about it.

Last time I had jury duty half the jurors assumed the defendant was guilty simply because he was in court:

"If he hadn't done anything, why'd the cop arrest him? He must've had a reason!"

Strangely, the only place I've had that argument was IN college. Sure, it was at a community college in rural NC, but that doesn't make "we could solve overcrowding by forcing inmates into military service" and the teacher then treating that as a reasonable statement any less insane.

I honestly think I spent half of that class calling people dumb without using the word.

# ? Oct 19, 2010 03:41

AmbassadorFriendly: Nov 19, 2008; Don't leave me hangin'

HidingFromGoro posted:

Texas court blocks ruling in Willingham death-penalty inquiry. They're trying to clear his name through a court-of-inquiry...

I've been meaning to bring this up, but this is kind of a good opportunity. In capital cases, you need to make sure that the jury is "death-qualified". What that means is that the jury needs to be able to convict someone knowing that they might receive the death penalty. They have to be able to put away any personal convictions. They are not categorically opposed to the death penalty.

The problem is that death-qualified juries are more likely to convict. It's possibly because people that aren't opposed to the death penalty are more likely to be tough on criminals and not give them a fair trial.

If you have access to a university library, you can read more. I'm sorry I can't provide a PDF.

The Risks of Death: Why Erroneous Convictions Are Common in Capital Cases, 44 Buffalo L. Rev. 469

# ? Oct 19, 2010 04:35

duck monster: Dec 15, 2004

igby posted:

The Willingham case is so hosed up. I read the New Yorker story about him a few months ago and it broke my loving heart.

Australia is no where near the US in terms of systemic abuse and institutional violence, but we have 12 private prisons now and the number is set to rise in NSW with Cessnock and another prison being bartered. Indigenous Australians and the mentally ill are hideously over-represented in the prison system. Since the '90s, when deinstitutionalisation of the mentally ill began, Australian prisons have turned into warehouses for people with untreated psychiatric issues. The average figure is that 80% of the prison population is sick, and most of the people we lock up shouldn't be in prison, they should be in therapy or hospital. Not to mention the fact that the prison population is further disenfranchised by high levels of poor literacy.

I'm currently studying to be an English teacher, and one of my long-term goals is to do a Ph.D involving analysing and creating programs designed to promote literacy in the Australian prison population. The Australian system isn't even broken and it's still lovely. I don't know what to say to you guys in America. Keep doing what you're doing, I guess. I have so much respect for people doing advocacy work, especially in situations as broken as this one. You're proof that all is not lost.

Yeah, a mate of mine worked at Justice Action
http://justiceaction.org.au/cms/
And some of the poo poo the NSW system comes up with is loving appalling. Its really the worst in the country, which is strange considering its probably had most consistedly a supposedly progressive (labor lol) government.

Justice action are great, and really do have an impact, even if they get criticized a lot for picking up cases that seem indefensible to some (sex offenders etc). But they are heavily involved with trying to get prisoners justice, and the guy who started them is an ex con who has to be one of the most driven people I've ever met.

Said friend is now working as a civil rights lawyer in Arizona btw. Out of the pan into the fire I guess. Gotta admire that poo poo though, I'd be drat nervous about taking on arpaio myself personally.

e: http://justiceaction.org.au/cms/mental-health-copy-of-main-menu-403/255-mental-health-system-corrupt

duck monster fucked around with this message at 05:01 on Oct 19, 2010

# ? Oct 19, 2010 04:55

HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

Mothers Behind Bars:
A state-by-state report card and analysis of federal policies on conditions of confinement for pregnant and parenting women and the effect on their children (pdf)

State Findings
Overall grades: Averaging the grades for prenatal care, shackling, and family-based treatment as an alternative to incarceration, twenty-one states received either a D or F, both of which are considered failing grades. Twenty-two states received a grade of C, and seven received a B. The highest overall grade of A- was earned by one state�Pennsylvania.

Prenatal care: Thirty-eight states received failing grades (D/F) for their failure to institute adequate policies, or any policies at all, requiring that incarcerated pregnant women receive adequate prenatal care, despite the fact that many women in prison have higher-risk pregnancies.

Forty-three states do not require medical examinations as a component of prenatal care.
Forty-one states do not require prenatal nutrition counseling or the provision of appropriate nutrition to incarcerated pregnant women.
Thirty-four states do not require screening and treatment for women with high risk pregnancies.
Forty-eight states do not offer pregnant women screening for HIV.
Forty-five states do not offer pregnant women advice on activity levels and safety during their pregnancies.
Forty-four states do not make advance arrangements for deliveries with particular hospitals.
Forty-nine states fail to report all incarcerated women�s pregnancies and their outcomes.

Shackling: Thirty-six states received failing grades (D/F) for their failure to comprehensively limit, or limit at all, the use of restraints on pregnant women during transportation, labor and delivery and postpartum recuperation.

There has been a recent increase in states adopting laws that address shackling, now totaling ten. Of the states without laws to address shackling:

Twenty-two states either have no policy at all addressing when restraints can be used on pregnant women or have a policy which allows for the use of dangerous leg irons or waist chains.
When a pregnant woman is placed in restraints for security reasons, eleven states either allow any officer to make the determination or do not have a policy on who determines whether the woman is a security risk.
Thirty-one states do not require input from medical staff when determining whether restraints will be used.
Twenty-four states do not require training for individuals handling and transporting incarcerated persons needing medical care or those dealing with pregnant women specifically, or have no policy on training.
Thirty-one states do not have a policy that holds institutions accountable for shackling pregnant women without adequate justification.
Thirty-four states do not require each incident of the use of restraints to be reported or reviewed by an independent body.

Family-Based Treatment as an Alternative to Incarceration: Seventeen states received a failing grade (F) for their lack of adequate access to family-based treatment programs for non-violent women who are parenting.

Seventeen states have no family-based treatment programs, while thirty-four states make such programs available.
Of the thirty-four states with family-based treatment programs, thirty-two offered women the option to be sentenced to these programs in lieu of prison, while two did not.

Prison Nurseries: Thirty-eight states received failing grades (D/F) for failing to offer prison nurseries to new
mothers who are incarcerated. While a far less preferred option than alternative sentencing, prison nursery programs still provide some opportunity for mother-child bonding and attachment.

Thirty-eight states do not offer any prison nursery programs.
Of the thirteen states that do offer such programs, only two allow children to stay past the age of two.
Three of the thirteen programs offer therapeutic services for both mother and child.

# ? Oct 22, 2010 19:37

HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

British justice secretary pledges to reduce prison population through "rehabilitation revolution" and other significant reforms (!)

quote:

Prison reformers welcomed the justice secretary's plans, which they said were practical. Justice ministry sources said the elements that would be used to cut the prison population included:

� Speeding up the removal of foreign national prisoners.

� Diverting more prisoners with mental illness to facilities largely funded from the protected health budget.

� Speeding up the risk assessment and parole of 1,300 inmates serving indefinite sentences for the public's protection who were recommended to serve a tariff of two years but had been in prison for longer.

� Reducing the use of remand for defendants charged with crimes that would not normally attract a prison sentence.

� Recalling released prisoners only for serious breaches of their licences rather than technical lapses, as happens now.

� Increasing the discount for early guilty pleas from 33% to 50%.

Juliet Lyon, of the Prison Reform Trust, said the government had recognised that it could not build its way out of the prison crisis.

"Deferring prison building, together with the justice secretary's determined plan to reduce any needless custody, should benefit victims and society," she said.

# ? Oct 23, 2010 05:04

Crackbone: May 23, 2003; Vlaada is my co-pilot.

Here's a new story to make your gut churn:

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=130833741

In a nutshell, the new Arizona Immigration Law, requiring detainment of illegal aliens? It was written in a Hyatt Conference room by a bunch of businesses, including Corrections Corporation of America, a private prison business. The bill they wrote landed almost verbatim on Brewer's desk.

# ? Oct 28, 2010 12:46

widunder: May 2, 2002

A really great article I read in The Economist this summer:

http://www.economist.com/node/16636027

# ? Oct 28, 2010 19:23

HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

After 18 years on death row, an innocent man finally went home a free man yesterday afternoon.

quote:

"He's an innocent man," [District Attorney] Bill Parham said, noting that his office investigated the case for five months. "There is nothing that connects Anthony Graves to this crime. I did what I did because that's the right thing to do."

quote:

Graves called his mother to tell her he was coming home. Doris Curry left the house to pick up her youngest son, and by the time she returned home, Graves was already there, surrounded by family and friends.

"I hugged him and I hugged him and I cried and we both cried and we hugged and we cried," Curry said. "He said: 'Mama, it's over. Mama, 18 years we've fought this fight a long time. It's over. Justice has been done for me.' "

The 62-year-old woman said she never doubted the innocence of Graves, the eldest of her five children.

"A mother knows her child," she said. "I know what kind of person he was. He wasn't that person they built him up to be."

Curry said there is no way to ever fill the void of Graves' 18 years in prison, close to half his life. It is time gone that cannot be retrieved, she said.

"But he can build his life on what he has and move on," she said. "He's lost a lot. He was 26 years old when they took him. Now he's 45. He's got grandchildren he's never touched."

Graves' youngest brother, Arthur Curry, testified in vain at his 1994 trial, telling jurors that Graves had been at home sleeping at the time when the murders occurred. Jurors did not believe him, so his brother's return home carried a deep, personal significance.

"The sun couldn't shine any brighter," Curry, now 37, said. "It's just like celebrating a resurrection, almost, because it was almost like a death in our family. But it was a slow death, continuously, just waiting for that demise."

# ? Oct 28, 2010 20:18

Tempora Mutantur: Feb 22, 2005

Ridiculous that he lost 18 years because some prosecutor wanted to keep his stats high. Does Texas pay citizens who were wrongly convicted, and will his felon status be revoked so he can vote and enjoy being a citizen again?

# ? Oct 28, 2010 21:58

HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

S.T.C.A. posted:

Ridiculous that he lost 18 years because some prosecutor wanted to keep his stats high. Does Texas pay citizens who were wrongly convicted, and will his felon status be revoked so he can vote and enjoy being a citizen again?

Yes, up to $80K per year, and TX is one of the most generous states in the nation as far as awarding these kinds of payments.

# ? Oct 28, 2010 22:20

PTBrennan: Jun 1, 2005; by Y Kant Ozma Post

quote:

Yes, up to $80K per year, and TX is one of the most generous states in the nation as far as awarding these kinds of payments.

This may sound stupid but I really am curious. Would they need to pay taxes on the money awarded?

At 80k a year, for 18 years, amounts to 1.44 million and even if no taxes are taken out it seems like a small sum of money for 18 years of someones life.

I work for a law firm and I've seen people awarded much larger settlements for damages in civil cases that don't even close to damages that would be caused by 18 years of someones life being taken from them. While I can't cite anything, I would think being wrongly imprisoned for 18 years of your life, especially younger years of life, would cause serious trauma, stress, anxiety, etc. to a the person wrongly imprisoned for the rest of their life.

PTBrennan fucked around with this message at 22:31 on Oct 28, 2010

# ? Oct 28, 2010 22:23

HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

It would be considered for tax purposes the same as any other legal settlement or judgment.

Unfortunately some inmates sign away the rights to these kinds of payout. I can't tell right now if this man did, but before the Rational Actors show up let me say this: if I throw you in prison for 18 years, and the only thing you've got to look forward to is a gurney and a needle; and then I show you your Mother standing outside, waiting to take you home... then you will sign anything, pay anything- do anything- to go home and not to the death chamber.

# ? Oct 28, 2010 22:32

HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

PTBrennan posted:

1.44 million and even if no taxes are taken out it seems like a small sum of money for 18 years of someones life.

Yes- that's the point.

And Texas is the most progressive state on these matters. In Louisiana it's illegal to pay for wrongful imprisonment. Sadly more states are like LA than TX.

# ? Oct 28, 2010 22:34

PTBrennan: Jun 1, 2005; by Y Kant Ozma Post

quote:

And Texas is the most progressive state on these matters. In Louisiana it's illegal to pay for wrongful imprisonment. Sadly more states are like LA than TX.

I live in Louisiana and that doesn't surprise me at all. The corruption with our Police Department and Justice System is unbelievable especially since I work in the law field (Live in New Orleans so general statement towards the city and not the state).

It's not Justice for all, it's Justice for who you know and how much money you can throw at the system. (I'm sure it's that way all over, just seems more here since I see it everyday.)

# ? Oct 28, 2010 22:46

nm: Jan 28, 2008; "I saw Minos the Space Judge holding a golden sceptre and passing sentence upon the Martians. There he presided, and around him the noble Space Prosecutors sought the firm justice of space law."

HidingFromGoro posted:

After 18 years on death row, an innocent man finally went home a free man yesterday afternoon.

That DA needs some kudos for actually admitting that guy is innocent. He made everything a easier for them.
This is an extremely rare occurrence even in supposedly liberal states.

# ? Oct 29, 2010 06:09

VoidAltoid: Sep 27, 2005

I'm hoping someone, somewhere will be able to take a corrupt DA and all the hired police goons who wrongfully put them in prison to a criminal trial, and have them convicted and sentenced to an equal amount of time without a possibility of parol. Maybe then we'd see something closer to real justice instead of simply trying to be "tough on crime" and convict every single person no matter how much the evidence points otherwise.

# ? Oct 29, 2010 22:05

eSports Chaebol: Feb 22, 2005; Yeah, actually, gamers in the house forever,

VoidAltoid posted:

I'm hoping someone, somewhere will be able to take a corrupt DA and all the hired police goons who wrongfully put them in prison to a criminal trial, and have them convicted and sentenced to an equal amount of time without a possibility of parol. Maybe then we'd see something closer to real justice instead of simply trying to be "tough on crime" and convict every single person no matter how much the evidence points otherwise.

Aren't DAs basically immune from prosecutorial misconduct charges unless it can be proved they acted with deliberate malice?

# ? Oct 29, 2010 23:41

Shang Yang: Oct 16, 2010; by T. Finn

VoidAltoid posted:

...instead of simply trying to be "tough on crime" and convict every single person no matter how much the evidence points otherwise.

Only that's not what actually happens. Where, exactly, do you practice criminal law? Because it's certainly not around here.

# ? Oct 30, 2010 01:34

HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

Dickeye posted:

Strangely, the only place I've had that argument was IN college. Sure, it was at a community college in rural NC, but that doesn't make "we could solve overcrowding by forcing inmates into military service" and the teacher then treating that as a reasonable statement any less insane.

I honestly think I spent half of that class calling people dumb without using the word.

NC college professors support giving prison inmates access to machine guns, grenades, rocket launchers, and body armor? As well as extensive training in the use of military weapons/equipment, combat tactics, interrogation, battlefield first aid, and urban warfare; plus comprehensive insurance & medical benefits for them + their families- all at taxpayer expense?

Sounds to me like you could really put some NC professors on the spot with the local media, should you be so inclined.

# ? Oct 30, 2010 09:34

duck monster: Dec 15, 2004

HidingFromGoro posted:

Sounds to me like you could really put some NC professors on the spot with the local media, should you be so inclined.

They might be whack, but harassing academics in the media for their opinions breeds stupidity and anti intellectualism.

# ? Oct 31, 2010 20:20

HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

duck monster posted:

They might be whack, but harassing academics in the media for their opinions breeds stupidity and anti intellectualism.

Write the op-ed or open letter in a non-harassing way then.

# ? Oct 31, 2010 21:30

duck monster: Dec 15, 2004

HidingFromGoro posted:

Write the op-ed or open letter in a non-harassing way then.

Much better. I wasn't having a go at you by the way, its just there has been a fairly concerted harassment operation by conservative operatives against liberal professors, and I think we need to realise that its been hugely harmful, and whilst engaging and critiquing the ideas is perfectly valid and healthy, trying to shame professors really just replicates the sort of conditions that I think are going to have long term harmful effects on american society and its intellectual culture,.

# ? Nov 1, 2010 00:05

duck monster: Dec 15, 2004

HidingFromGoro posted:

Yes, up to $80K per year, and TX is one of the most generous states in the nation as far as awarding these kinds of payments.

,
I'd loving hope so. Disenfranchising a man for a crime he never committed is a horrible act.

Well so is sticking him in jail terrified out his mind about impending oblivion for 18 years, come to think of it.

I hope he finds a nice wife and is able to make the best out of his middle and elderly ages. I imagine the dude has a lot of trauma to work through.

# ? Nov 1, 2010 00:09

Orange Devil: Oct 1, 2010; Wullie's reign cannae smother the flames o' equality!

duck monster posted:

,
I'd loving hope so. Disenfranchising a man for a crime he never committed is a horrible act.

Well so is sticking him in jail terrified out his mind about impending oblivion for 18 years, come to think of it.

I hope he finds a nice wife and is able to make the best out of his middle and elderly ages. I imagine the dude has a lot of trauma to work through.

Not to mention the stigma. Locked up for 18 years and released as 'innocent'... "well, he must've done something, else they wouldn't have locked him up". Just world in action.

# ? Nov 1, 2010 00:14

The Valuum: Apr 11, 2004

If anyone in interested, I did 6 months in a rural, redneck county jail (Yes I know it's not prison. I used to have an ask/tell thread while I was in jail (I was on work release). Feel free to ask whatever.

# ? Nov 1, 2010 14:22

Hieronymous Alloy: Jan 30, 2009; Why! Why!! Why must you refuse to accept that Dr. Hieronymous Alloy's Genetically Enhanced Cream Corn Is Superior to the Leading Brand on the Market!?!; Morbid Hound

HidingFromGoro posted:

NC college professors support giving prison inmates access to machine guns, grenades, rocket launchers, and body armor? As well as extensive training in the use of military weapons/equipment, combat tactics, interrogation, battlefield first aid, and urban warfare; plus comprehensive insurance & medical benefits for them + their families- all at taxpayer expense?

Sounds to me like you could really put some NC professors on the spot with the local media, should you be so inclined.

Think of the bright side. A few million armed, trained, disenfranchised, unemployed men with urban combat experience. One way to re-balance the income disparity!

# ? Nov 1, 2010 15:30

flux_core: Feb 26, 2007; Not recommended on thin sections.

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

Think of the bright side. A few million armed, trained, disenfranchised, unemployed men with urban combat experience. One way to re-balance the income disparity!

Then we'd have enlisted as having already been in prison before starting service and all the officers being mostly college kids.

I wonder how stable that kind of situation would be :allears:

That would just make my day... as long as I'm far enough away I don't have to dodge the bullets.

# ? Nov 1, 2010 20:31

HidingFromGoro: Jun 5, 2006

The Valuum posted:

If anyone in interested, I did 6 months in a rural, redneck county jail (Yes I know it's not prison. I used to have an ask/tell thread while I was in jail (I was on work release). Feel free to ask whatever.

All contributions are welcome, especially from former inmates.

# ? Nov 2, 2010 03:24

The Valuum: Apr 11, 2004

HidingFromGoro posted:

All contributions are welcome, especially from former inmates.

Cool, thanks! I'll answer any questions. I have a lot to tell, but most of it is probably already known. I'll write a bit about something unique. The comradery in jail.

When I first got sentenced to 6 months (thinking I was doing no time) I was pretty bummed in the holding cell, waiting to be assigned a cell. I was talking to a few inmates, and instead of "suck it up, kid", instead people where really helpful, and gave me a bit of inspiration.

All the inmates where pretty focused on being clean, for the sake of themselves and others. When people came to jail with no commissary (food) most people were willing to help them out, I always was. We also had a community style coffee stash. Since people came in and out (and always wanted coffee) this helped everyone always have a least a little comfort.

Every sunday we always had a "cook up". We would take a 8~ ramen noodles, 8~ bags of chips, hot pickles, beef jerky, and meat. We'd crush the ramen to noodle like consistency, crush the chips to powder, and mix them with hot water. Then chop everything up and add it in. Typically only 3 people could contribute, but we fed everyone. It was actually pretty good.

# ? Nov 2, 2010 07:47

baquerd: Jul 2, 2007; by FactsAreUseless

They had to bring Capone down for tax evasion, I suppose Arpaio won't necessarily pay directly for his crimes either.

quote:

The sheriff's employee database operated parallel to a county-run system, recording a different set of sheriff's staff assignments and payments than official records provided to county auditors.
...
County administrators believe the Sheriff's Office intentionally misappropriated as much as $80 million designated for jail operations over five years to pay employees working in patrol, human-smuggling operations and investigative units.

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/11/01/20101101maricopa-county-joe-arpaio-payroll-investigation.html

The Valuum posted:

The comradery in jail.

Always good to hear about humanity staying around in jail. Did you have to do anything special to qualify for work release?

# ? Nov 2, 2010 09:01

Shang Yang: Oct 16, 2010; by T. Finn

The Valuum posted:

Cool, thanks! I'll answer any questions.

What'd you do that got you in jail? Did jail make you consider your crime or discuss it, and if so what were the programmes/staff like and what were your conclusions?

# ? Nov 2, 2010 14:20

The Valuum: Apr 11, 2004

baquerd posted:

They had to bring Capone down for tax evasion, I suppose Arpaio won't necessarily pay directly for his crimes either.

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articles/2010/11/01/20101101maricopa-county-joe-arpaio-payroll-investigation.html

Always good to hear about humanity staying around in jail. Did you have to do anything special to qualify for work release?

Well I was 17, great grades, best public school in the state, had a job, and was starting college. They allowed me to be trustee, work release, but not school release.

Shang Yang posted:

What'd you do that got you in jail? Did jail make you consider your crime or discuss it, and if so what were the programmes/staff like and what were your conclusions?

I got busted with a bunch of drugs, I ended up being charged (after plea) with conspiracy to distribute cocaine <50 grams, and conspiracy to distribute marijuana <25 grams. They never even got me actually selling, I don't think I did anything wrong. I just re considered the life of selling drugs due to the social consequences. What do you mean by staff? The guards? Some were ok, some were major dicks. One was actually really cool and nice. He had been over in Iraq and knew we were hardly bad people. He would even come in our cell and watch TV with us for a bit sometimes. When our cell had all cool people (that weren't big mouths) he would even talk poo poo about the other guards.

# ? Nov 2, 2010 21:27

aejix: Sep 18, 2007; It's about finding that next group of core players we can win with in the next 6, 8, 10 years. Let's face it, it's hard for 20-, 21-, 22-year-olds to lead an NHL team. Look at the playoffs.

That quote is from fucking 2018. Fuck you Jim; Pillbug

Thanks for posting The Valuum!

I don't really have any good questions but I'm interested in how your record has affected your ability to find employment? What are the sorts of setbacks/obstacles/discrimination you've encountered as a result of the conviction, if any? Are you now prevented from doing certain professions (teachers or whatever)?

I guess I'm asking because this part of the justice system always seems the trickiest - how the system balances giving people another chance vs. virtually ruling them out of truly being given that chance because of conviction records and whatever.

# ? Nov 3, 2010 02:00

Gunshow Poophole: Sep 14, 2008; OMBUDSMAN
POSTERS LOCAL 42069; Clapping Larry

The Valuum posted:

One was actually really cool and nice. He had been over in Iraq and knew we were hardly bad people. He would even come in our cell and watch TV with us for a bit sometimes. When our cell had all cool people (that weren't big mouths) he would even talk poo poo about the other guards.

I would be curious about how often this prevails in certain jails/prisons. Do guards have perspective on the fact that the vast majority of people are incarcerated for drug-related offenses that are essentially victimless?

# ? Nov 3, 2010 02:14

Shang Yang: Oct 16, 2010; by T. Finn

The Valuum posted:

I got busted with a bunch of drugs, I ended up being charged (after plea) with conspiracy to distribute cocaine <50 grams, and conspiracy to distribute marijuana <25 grams. They never even got me actually selling, I don't think I did anything wrong. I just re considered the life of selling drugs due to the social consequences.

You don't think being a cocaine dealer, or breaking a law against dealing controlled substances, is wrong? That seems a little odd. Are you saying you didn't sell, and accidentally had a fair amount of coke and weed on you, or you're just disappointed that they were able to convict you despite not literally nicking you during a sale? If it's the latter, then it sounds like you're playing the victim, although I guess that's par for the course when it comes to defendants.

quote:

What do you mean by staff?

No, I was thinking more mental health professionals, teachers, the sorts of people who might talk to you professional with a specific focus on your transgression. I guess most of that would be in prison, though.

# ? Nov 3, 2010 04:46

lonelywurm: Aug 10, 2009

Shang Yang posted:

You don't think being a cocaine dealer, or breaking a law against dealing controlled substances, is wrong? That seems a little odd. Are you saying you didn't sell, and accidentally had a fair amount of coke and weed on you, or you're just disappointed that they were able to convict you despite not literally nicking you during a sale? If it's the latter, then it sounds like you're playing the victim, although I guess that's par for the course when it comes to defendants.

Some people feel that the laws criminalizing possession and even distribution of drugs are immoral, unethical, or misguided regardless of whether they themselves use or distribute those drugs. As such, the violation of those laws will not seem 'wrong' for reasons well beyond 'playing the victim'.

# ? Nov 3, 2010 06:11

BrawndoTQ: Oct 18, 2001

Shang Yang posted:

You don't think being a cocaine dealer, or breaking a law against dealing controlled substances, is wrong?

What's wrong with selling coke?

# ? Nov 3, 2010 08:04

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# ? May 31, 2024 23:42

baquerd: Jul 2, 2007; by FactsAreUseless

brizna posted:

What's wrong with selling coke?

Because it's illegal, the typical channels of supply are filled with violence, the manufacturers see a tiny percentage of the immense profits when they aren't effectively slaves, and the proceeds work their way back to fund the cycle over again, save for those kickbacks that go to law enforcement through seizures and the like.

If you make your own straight from the plants though, absolutely nothing.

# ? Nov 3, 2010 08:21

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > The Prison Thread

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