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Leperflesh posted:Or if you have a battery operated tool you can do it yourself in the parking lot. Leperflesh posted:A couple of you guys have asked where to get cheap iron. In my area (Bay Area, CA) there are numerous steel supply places; you go and look around and somewhere they have a scraps bin. There is a steel mill half an hour away, maybe they have an outlet store.  (Actually: Nope. They make pipe.)
Chillbro Baggins fucked around with this message at 05:30 on Jan 16, 2011 |
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Jan 16, 2011 05:27
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Bad Angus! Bad!
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AbsentMindedWelder posted:except SmokeyXIII, (did I get the numeral right?) whom we haven't heard from in ages. That's because Ft Mac is currently at absolute zero and there's a giant ice dome over the entire region. All contact has been lost.
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Jan 16, 2011 06:27
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Slung Blade have you made anything cool recently? I am truly curious.
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Jan 16, 2011 06:36
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No I've been busy with work from my day job and it's really hard to get motivated to work outside when it's loving -25C outside, even if you do have a shop with a forge in it. I might do something tomorrow, I dunno.
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Jan 16, 2011 09:17
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Slung Blade posted:No I've been busy with work from my day job and it's really hard to get motivated to work outside when it's loving -25C outside, even if you do have a shop with a forge in it. This is why I am glad I am back in Ontario. Alberta is as cold as the devil's vagina.
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Jan 16, 2011 17:48
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Delivery McGee posted:Kinda want to get an inverter to put in the car so I can take the real tools to the store. I even have an unused 50A circuit to put it on! If you live in an area with industrial projects then there has to be steel supply somewhere nearby. There's going to be contractors and projects and people who need raw metals to build things with. Maybe call your local welding shops or one of those pipe-making places and ask them where you can get steel bar and plate stock. Use "iron" as well as "steel" in your search terms. Also "metal". Like, "metal supply".
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Jan 16, 2011 21:09
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Gas vs. coal forges? Coal seems like the first, natural choice; it's cheaper to start up with, it sounds way more fun than a gas forge, and it has that rustic appeal. I've been doing reading, though, and a gas forge sounds a lot more convenient- it sounds easier to learn on, as they supposedly don't burn the iron like a coal forge does, and a lot of the commonly-cited issues- gas forges that run too cold to forge-weld with- seem to be avoidable if you go with tried/tested burner designs or just buy proven, pre-assembled burners (like the T-Rex/Shorty, whose site seems to be down). Also, gas won't irritate the neighbours nearly as much, and blacksmith's coke seems to be a pain in the rear end to get a hold of in my area (propane, not so much).
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Jan 16, 2011 23:45
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Don't forget charcoal. It's pretty easy to get at hardware stores, or any place that sells bbq gear. The forge itself is just something good enough to hold the heat and give a supply of air. Gas forges are great and all, but they're somewhat limited. They're limited in three dimensions, whereas you can put almost anything into a solid fuel forge, provided you can make a fire deep enough to take in whatever little bit you're working on at that moment. Most serious blacksmiths use both. Don't limit yourself to just one or the other, they both have places where they're supremely useful. I started with charcoal because it was inexpensive to get set up, easily available, and highly versatile. Later on I bought a gas forge to do most of my work with, but I keep my homemade charcoal burner around and I still use it.
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Jan 17, 2011 01:49
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Slung Blade posted:Gas forges are great and all, but they're somewhat limited. They're limited in three dimensions, whereas you can put almost anything into a solid fuel forge, provided you can make a fire deep enough to take in whatever little bit you're working on at that moment. I actually came across a 'clamshell' forge design that comes pretty highly-recommended. It has a heavily-insulated 'hood' that can be moved up or down, and you stack firebrick underneath it to make any size of forge you need for a given project. Looked pretty clever.
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Jan 17, 2011 02:24
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Leperflesh posted:If you live in an area with industrial projects then there has to be steel supply somewhere nearby. There's going to be contractors and projects and people who need raw metals to build things with. Maybe call your local welding shops or one of those pipe-making places and ask them where you can get steel bar and plate stock. Buying metal on the interwebs is a loving terrible idea. The shipping is insane and it isn't exactly easy to deliver a 4x8' sheet of metal or a bunch of 12' long tube or pipe sections. That poo poo doesn't fit in the UPS truck. Just the shipping will sometimes run you more than the metal itself. Then there's the unloading. I knew a guy who ended up having to unload by hand a bunch of sheets of 1/8 mild steel sheets. We're talking like 300-400 pounds per sheet. Kinda of awkward trying to talk the delivery truck driver into sticking around to help you carry a bunch of poo poo into your shop(probably garage). Like Leper said, best place to find material is to find a recycler or a business in town that will do small orders. Some places are happy to unload their scrap, or even unused material, marked up to you. Other places don't care because they know you don't have am million dollars and are not worth their time. I have found a business in my town that is happy to supply me with small orders. Of course, this means I have to pick it up in my truck. This is the cheapest way to go, but it requires you to unload anything you buy and you have to haul it. So I always ask my self "Do I want to try to unload this poo poo by myself?" before I buy anything.
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Jan 17, 2011 10:01
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duck hunt posted:Buying metal on the interwebs is a loving terrible idea. ... If you live near any big city, then check the phone directory under metals dealers. Call them and ask if they normally have the sizes of pieces that you want. Also ask if they sell by the foot, and if they have any drops or salvage. (drops are leftover pieces when a customer with a big order only wants part of a whole piece) If you happen to live anywhere near St Louis, the place to go is Shapiro Metals. They have new & salvage, plus they sell anything by the foot. They also do mail orders, but again, you'll overpay that way. ------- If you MUST do a mail-order, the best way is to give the place you're ordering it from the minimum size of metal that you need, and ask for whatever they have that's closest but larger than that. Doing this MAY avoid the cutting charge they normally add on for cutting a piece to the size you specified. Often they will charge you more to cut down a piece to size than what they would charge for a slightly larger piece that they can just stick a shipping label on. Also We Note- Metals dealers like Shapiro mostly just deal in common structural metals--hot & cold-rolled steels, 4130 steel, tooling plate steel, common aluminum alloys and stainless steel. If you want something exotic like titanium or inconel, they may only have a very-limited selection, or may not have any at all and nowhere to get it. ,,,,,In that case, you are stuck paying lots of money to whoever you can get it shipped from online--but in many cases of the exotic metals, they cost a lot anyway. Titanium is up around 10X the cost of typical steel, for example. It will cost a lot of $$$, no matter where you buy it from. ~
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Jan 17, 2011 11:55
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If you are in a position that the steel you need to unload is too heavy to do by hand, then you probably have enough $$$ that you can rent a forklift for a day. I got two steel suppliers near me. The cheaper one does not deliver, but has reasonable charges for cutting 20 foot shapes in half. The other one is slightly more expensive, but will deliver to me for free as long as I spend more then $150 or something. I'm lucky in that I have yet to purchase a full sized piece of plate that I need a forklift to unload... I've only had to deal with buying shapes. Up until now I've scrounged all my plate from previous employers, welding school, and poo poo on the side of the road.
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Jan 17, 2011 13:20
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I've never bought steel online, actually, I was just talking about using search terms to help find a local business. Seems like some of these places are still not exactly with the 21st century yet, though; so don't expect that you'll definitely find an online presence for the local steel supply place. Definitely check the yellow pages. Alco sold me a 4'by4' sheet of steel plate (I think it was 1/4"? might be 3/8ths?) for a pretty good price a few years back. That and a full length of 2" schedule 40 pipe, plus some angle iron and flat bar, and my stepdad and I welded up a big welding table for me. It was pretty heavy but they forklifted it into my truck for me and then we were able to wrestle it up the driveway ourselves when we got home. I've bought bar stock a half-dozen times, just driving up and checking the cuttoffs bin.
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Jan 17, 2011 20:43
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http://www.metalsupermarkets.com/MSC-Home.aspx I get my metal there. There are a ton of stores around North America. I love going to my local one. Seeing a 9inch diameter piece of steel that is 8 feet long makes my body tingle. It gets even more tingly when I think of the lathe you would need to turn it!
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Jan 18, 2011 01:00
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Leperflesh posted:
God isn't that the loving truth. Everyone in the industry is near retirement i swear. And yes, a pro move is to pick up a forklift, or have the company you buy from bring a forklift.
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Jan 18, 2011 05:19
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duck hunt posted:God isn't that the loving truth. Everyone in the industry is near retirement i swear. Yeah I was just talking to my buddy's dad, who's a machinist, and whose dad is a machinist, and he was people just don't learn these trades anymore. Now, that could easily be just one of those things seasoned vet.s of the industry say. Or he could be absolutely right. I've looked in to getting an apprenticeship as a machinist, and it seems like slim pickings these days. Offering an apprenticeship prolly means that the company has to take a risk training someone who might either be a complete bone head or quit. And it probably doesn't make a whole lot of fiscal sense for them right now. All though, in my opinion, that's pretty short-sighted; its gonna make a lot less fiscal sense when theirs a huge deficit of skilled workers in the future. Also the advent of CNC technology means less and less people are needed to do manual machine work. Also, duck hunt, did you just recommend someone getting their own fork lift? Hell. 
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Jan 18, 2011 16:29
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Oh, the fun of picking up raw materials! I live in Southeast Wisconsin, if it matters to anyone (howdy neighbor?). I have a few options that I've found or developed. Aluminum - I was trolling around on Ebay, found a guy selling a bunch of drops of some high-zoot aluminum (Fortal). Ebay said he was a few miles away, so I ended up visiting his home garage and just picking up what I need, no shipping! Super convenient and the most beautifully machining aluminum I've ever had. Second option is going to the local recycler, found via the Yellow Pages, and being flexible with my demands because who knows what they have at any given time. I pay scrap or just a tick more. You just have to dodge homeless guys with shopping carts full of cans, and bring cash. Steel - I scored a bunch of scrap steel just by asking for it via Freecycle. Told them I was looking for steel whatevers for welding practice, etc. You meet some cool dudes this way. Retail, I visited Metal Supermarket in Chicago, pretty awesome, you can browse the full lengths, plus the drops barrel is fun to rummage through. I can also trip up to Speedy Metals outside of Milwaukee, but haven't had the occasion to yet. For small and really specific stuff like drill rod, I've used McMaster-Carr. The depot is pretty close, so I actually ordered at like 5:30PM one day, and had my stuff the next day via UPS ground which wasn't real expensive, plus I didn't feel like leaving the house for ten inches of drill rod. Pretty rad if you ask me.
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Jan 18, 2011 17:42
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The Scientist posted:Also, duck hunt, did you just recommend someone getting their own fork lift? Hell.
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Jan 18, 2011 18:08
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The Scientist posted:Yeah I was just talking to my buddy's dad, who's a machinist, and whose dad is a machinist, and he was people just don't learn these trades anymore. I'm in the process of applying/endless interviews for a machine shop offering an apprenticeship. They say the only thing that's been holding them back for the past 10-15 years is a lack of skilled people to hire. Most of their employees were hired as apprentices with little to no experience. Their pay and benefits are also significantly better than competing shops which don't offer apprenticeships. I think the trades in general are down-played by high school advisers and parents, like they're a last resort if you can't get into college. As a result, a lot of the people in the trade schools wind up being the people who struggle with basic algebra and trig. As a part of the application process I took a "math and reasoning skills" test. The HR lady said most people don't make it to the second page in the time allowed. I made it to the second to last question on the second page.  CNC is going to take over in production work, but one-off jobs, time critical stuff, and repair work will still need a manual machinist. The good news is that a talented machinist who can program will just be that much more valuable.
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Jan 18, 2011 23:58
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oxbrain posted:I'm in the process of applying/endless interviews for a machine shop offering an apprenticeship. They say the only thing that's been holding them back for the past 10-15 years is a lack of skilled people to hire. Most of their employees were hired as apprentices with little to no experience. Their pay and benefits are also significantly better than competing shops which don't offer apprenticeships. Scientist and oxbrain, you guys really hit the nail on the head. The trades have changed so much in the last 20 years (not like I can speak from experience as I am in my 20's). It used to be that they would take anyone who applied. High school drop out? You're in. Can't do basic reading/writing/math? You're in. Then they would pay these people while they trained them. Seems like "on the job training" has completely been replaced by "must have min. x years experience with x, y, z, ..." So now you have journeymen in the union who came from nothing are are now very well paid high skill workers. They may not even have a GED or have read more than 5 books in their life, but they are journeyman. I'm not complaining, don't get me wrong. Then there are the tools of the trade that have changed even faster. CNC is getting rid of the need for lots of workers. However, most people think that automation is lowering pay and killing jobs when really, especially in the case of machining and fabrication, technology is making higher paying better jobs for those who can do them. However, the down side is for the person who wants to get into the trade, the learning curve is much higher than it was even 10 years ago. But CNC is giving workers and companies a standard of efficiency, quality, consistency, that they could have only dreamed of. This also means that machining jobs have gotten better. Now you don't have to hire someone to go bat poo poo crazy turning the same part day in and day out. The work is getting safer, faster, and better. Machinists salaries, assuming they have relevant skills, have also been growing and getting better. Now machinists and fabricators make great salaries and enjoy a better standard of living than they did before and the future is only getting better for those with the skills. There are also not very many people in my generation that are interested in those jobs. Everyone my age wants to be a loving reality tv star or a drat lawyer/doctor/fag. Now I am bitching. More realistically, people want to work in offices and work with ideas and people more than they want to create things.
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Jan 19, 2011 03:52
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The Scientist posted:Yeah I was just talking to my buddy's dad, who's a machinist, and whose dad is a machinist, and he was people just don't learn these trades anymore. ... The machinist trade in the USA is a dying profession--just as you noted, most of the guys doing it are older and near retirement. Two areas that still require it (in the US) are oilfields and defense contracting--but the Secretary of Defense just talked about cutting $150 billion over the next five years. ----- There are a LOT of technical jobs in the US that are slowly getting offshored and the problem the US is eventually going to have is that in a lot of technical professions the entire chain of advancement has been broken by that. If you are young you need to investigate online what is happening in the field or not before you sink your personal credit history into a big student loan. Find forums online where people who are already working in that industry talk about what's going on, and read carefully. For machinists, one forum is "shop management and owner issues" over at practicalmachinist. I love making stuff but what they say about the outlook for their profession is not very encouraging. ~
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Jan 19, 2011 15:16
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duck hunt posted:"must have min. x years experience with x, y, z, ..." Quoted for "ain't that the" truth. My problem currently is that I'm finishing an Associate of Arts degree, intedning to off to a University for a Bachelor's or greater in Computer Science/Electrical Engineering. I've been programming in C++ since I was 12 (22 now), but I don't happen to know any of these proprietary CNC languages, so I couldn't say honestly that I have "5 years experience" in any of them. Also, being a student, I couldn't take part in a conventional apprenticeship program (at least it seems like) because: 1. Scheduling 2. Some apprenticeships require concurrent schooling - which I would enjoy as much as anything in the world, but these classes don't jive with my AA courses, and I'm not changing my major in the last semester... Same problem for welding. My community college offers vocational courses - which break down to earning some weird classification of certification, KIND OF like a degree program, but not exactly welding cert.'s either - its not like "pipe welding I cert", its like "vocational certificate in welding from Brevard Community College". And not only would taking ONE MEASLY LITTLE WELDING COURSE OUT OF SHEAR INTEREST require that I change majors from college degree to vocational program, but there's a 1 year waiting list. My grand dad on my mom's side was a machinist for RCA, my dad was an engineering manager at Kennedy Space Center for 28 years, and still is with company Boeing, albeit in a different sector at a different physical location. I sometimes feel like I got it in my blood, and sometimes I imagine my grandfather looking down on me when I'm working, sending subtle signals that I'm about to gently caress up. My friends dad, the machinist, said he took the courses in middle and high school  and the went to V.O. (which I don't know what that is). All of MY dad's brothers learned welding in the F.F.A (Future Farmers of America), but that was in Kansas and we now live in Florida.Sorry for the wall of text. Especially if much of it sounds like it'd be more relevant in E/N.
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Jan 19, 2011 16:11
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Posted this in AI, but someone suggested I send it here for more responses. I need to weld four pieces of 3 inch wide half inch steel together to form a sleeve around a piece of 3 inch square box steel. I can't find any box thats a size bigger to fit over this poo poo so I have to make my own. I had a few minutes today so I put held the pieces together the way I'm hoping they'll turn out and noticed that there will be a slight gap between where they *should* be touching at the corners. I've got a scrap piece of 3 inch box to use as a jig for fitting and welding these plates together when I have finished doing everything else I need to do, and I was wondering what would be my best option for closing this gap? Should I: A: use a piece of thin (1/16") aluminum to back the pieces while I'm welding that gap closed to prevent it from sticking to the scrap piece, or B: should I get some thin pieces of steel wire and tack them between the pieces? The outsides of the corners will be reinforced with some angle iron, but I'd obviously still like to have a good strong weld holding the two pieces together if possible. This would be using a stick welder with likely 6011 rods to tack it together and then 7018s to finish it up. I'm reasonably experienced with metal fabrication, though certainly not an expert, most of what I make isn't pretty, just functional. In the attached diagram, the black square is the piece of box steel, the red represents the pieces that I'm going to put over them , the green, the welds and purple, the angle. E: For those of you having trouble finding metal, is there one of these near you?: http://www.metalsupermarkets.com/ scapulataf fucked around with this message at 00:58 on Jan 20, 2011 |
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Jan 20, 2011 00:30
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How tight does it have to be? There's going to be some shrinkage that you will have to account for. If you use the aluminium backing, that might help.
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Jan 20, 2011 01:01
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It doesn't need to be that tight, it will be pinned in place most of the time, but will have to move occasionally. Forgive my ignorance, but how will it shrink? I know about things like when you're tacking stuff at one end and the other end will pull apart for example, but I've never heard of this sort of thing shrinking. Not saying you're talking BS, I've just never heard of this before.
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Jan 20, 2011 01:23
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Could you do it like this ricthear? As you can see from my extremely technical drawing, where the sides are made of bars or plate with 2 45o bevels, and have small like rectangular or square pieces of the same thickness, so the effect produced is like a 45o chamfer. Then grind a radius on the inside to fit the profile of the solid tube in the middle (maybe assemble 2 corners, grind the radii, then weld it all up). Prolly quadruples the amount of work you'd have to do.
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Jan 20, 2011 04:21
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scapulataf, First, what are you trying to accomplish here? I understand that you want to weld metal around a piece of square tubing, but I don't understand why, or what the application is. Second, regarding the "shirnkage" SB was discussing... Whenever you put heat into a piece of steel (such as from welding) it will expand and contract. The heat is usually spread out unevenly throughout the workpiece. When it contracts it may not be precisely the same size or shape it used to be. (Think thousands of an inch.) In any event, after reading your posts a couple times, I think you were asking how to deal with welding a gap. This is what welders call an "open root". You certainly don't want to put any aluminum in there, and steel wire is not necessary. It takes a little bit of practice, but 6011 and 6010 both belong to the "fast freeze" electrode group which allows you to use a whipping action to control the puddle. Essentially you can fill the gap with nothing behind it. I would recommend looking at some youtube videos or something, since I really don't know how to put it in words. The technique used is often called "keyholing". You can realistically expect to fill a gap of 1/8" with an 1/8" electrode. Any more then that, while possible, won't look nice or be very strong, and you'd want to look at using other piece of steel to act as a backing plate. That all being said... if you tell us more about the problem you are trying to solve, perhaps we can suggest a better solution. I say this, because welding flat bar and angle iron around a piece of square tubing really seems weird to me.
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Jan 20, 2011 05:16
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Yeah the shrinkage is really more of a nuisance thing. If you make the initial fit too tight and then weld it, it can bind up on you so you can't move your tubing in and out of it.
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Jan 20, 2011 19:28
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E: /\/\/\/\ THe reason I thought of using aluminum backing was just to keep it from sticking to the scrap piece that I'm using as a jig. My thoguht was, four pieces are making up this sleeve, so tack 2 pieces together at 90*, tack 2 more pieces at 90*, put them together, tack, check alignments and then finish weld. O.k., here goes nothing... My company's drill rig has a mast, that when set up is 16 feet in height. It has 2 positions, one at 16 feet, and one at 12 feet for situations where we don't have enough overhead clearance for the "tall tower". To switch positions, we pull out a couple pins and the tower slides in. What I'm hoping to do is allow it to have a third position somewhere in the middle, because when its in the "short tower" position, its a real fuckin pain in the rear end. Trust me, I've been running this machine since it was brand new and every time I have to use short tower, I want to hang myself. When we use short tower, the pins are pulled, and the tower slides in and is pinned again in to position so my hope is that I can make these "sleeves" that will be slid over top of the existing 3 inch square that comprises the tower extension. The idea being that the other two pinholes in the tower that are normally exposed when the tower is fully extended will serve as stops to allow us a few more feet of tower height to make my life easier. So, in theory, I make these drat things, pull the tower right out and slide them over top, pin them in place through the existing "short tower" holes and when necessary, I can remove the normal pins, and these will sit on top of where the tower slides in to make a "mid tower" set up. Observe in my lovely MS paint. The red part is that which slides in or out depending on the height required. Blue are where the pins would go through and the sissy purple represents the sleeves that I'm hoping to make when I've got the time. The zig zaggy thing is supposed to be an auger. Note that there is no necessity for the tower to be pinned in to place to prevent upward movement of the tower when the machine is actually working. When in transit, it is secured so that the tower doesn't fly out if we have to slam on the brakes. Obviously the drawing is not to scale. scapulataf fucked around with this message at 03:09 on Jan 21, 2011 |
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Jan 21, 2011 02:59
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scapulataf posted:... Sorry man, I ... kinda still don't understand. Is the auger part attached to the top of the tower, so that when you want to change the height, you're sliding a significant portion of the upright structure upward? Or is there like a carriage that's free to move about?
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Jan 21, 2011 04:27
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I think I kind of get it but what is confusing me, now, is: why is it important to fill in at the corners? As long as the sleeve is snug, it shouldn't matter at all that it's square instead of slightly rounded at the corners. Unless it's going to trap something in there?
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Jan 21, 2011 06:06
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While open root uphill welding is the best for strength and maximum penetration, if the part you are making isn't super critical, try to fit things up without a gap. And while xx10 series electrodes are great for pipe roots and boiler plate, if there's still a gap and the part isn't going on the loving space station, you can just mig weld it.
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Jan 21, 2011 07:25
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duck hunt posted:And while xx10 series electrodes are great for pipe roots and boiler plate... Are you using this term in the literal or colloquial sense? And as for the original inquiry, I feel like I'm not really qualified to contribute in any meaningful way. But just out of curiosity, did he specify what process he's gonna use? Was it TIG?
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Jan 21, 2011 07:49
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Leperflesh posted:I think I kind of get it but what is confusing me, now, is: why is it important to fill in at the corners? As long as the sleeve is snug, it shouldn't matter at all that it's square instead of slightly rounded at the corners. Unless it's going to trap something in there? Er, I THINK he was concerned that, when he welded plate into a large square tub section that fits on the smaller square tubing of the frame of the upright thing that is the structure on which the auger operates, would the welds cause the entire part to shrink to a degree that it would no longer slide freely. In other words would welding plate into a section of square tubing configuration, would shrinkage caused by the welding processes be great enough to significantly reduce the inside diameter of the tube.
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Jan 21, 2011 07:53
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The Scientist posted:Are you using this term in the literal or colloquial sense? Oh god, no. Not loving tig. Oh and, boilerplate (colloquial) i.e. structural/heavy plate. Word to your mom.
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Jan 21, 2011 08:07
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Leperflesh posted:Also "metal". Like, "metal supply". Edit: I do have a phone book! "Steel distributors and warehouses" has several options. Huzzah! Chillbro Baggins fucked around with this message at 09:48 on Jan 21, 2011 |
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Jan 21, 2011 09:43
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The Scientist posted:Sorry man, I ... kinda still don't understand. Is the auger part attached to the top of the tower, so that when you want to change the height, you're sliding a significant portion of the upright structure upward? Or is there like a carriage that's free to move about? gently caress, I should have left that out, it was more from a perspective point. The part the auger attaches to moves up and down via hydraulic cylinder and aside from giving a sense of what is there, has nothing to do with what I'm trying to accomplish, so disregard. The scientist: originally I never knew about the shrinking thing. I was more concerned with how to fill in a gap when welding. Leper flesh: I just want to make sure its strong and going to last. I'll try and post some actual pictures of the machine when I get some time this weekend, hopefully that will help.
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Jan 21, 2011 13:31
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It wouldn't be easier to drill a pair of pin holes in between the current pin holes?
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Jan 21, 2011 15:40
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scapulataf posted:The scientist: originally I never knew about the shrinking thing. I was more concerned with how to fill in a gap when welding. Ok. So IDK if you planning on doing two mitred corners meeting, or just a butt joint (I'm talking about how you're planning on welding the 4 corners of the square tubing sleeve). But did you consider just grinding bevels on the each side of the plate, on both plates, when attaching them, so it makes a groove which you can fill up with welding filler and also give you better penetration into the plate? gently caress me, time for another extremely technical drawing. 
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Jan 21, 2011 18:36
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| # ? May 26, 2024 00:56 |
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To fill up gaps, you could just make some shims out of like 1/8"x[thickness of plate you're using]x3" flat bar that you can buy at any lowe's or Home Depot. edit: forgot this
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Jan 21, 2011 18:38
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