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Xander77 posted:Eh? I remember it was only useful for enemies specific to TNM ( I seem to remember being able to use it on regular bots, but it has been a while. It was pretty much essential for those goddamn floating bots in the PDX storyline.
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Jan 13, 2011 22:15
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). For everything else, there was the GEP gun (the gep gun could be useful)
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ErIog posted:Unrelated question, are there any goodies I missed by not fully exploring that weird sunken lab room in Versalife? I noticed they had augs locked up there, but I couldn't see any real way to get at them. Before getting in the helicopter in Hong Kong I went back to Versalife in an attempt to completely clean it out, but I just couldn't deal with all the guys in that room with their exploding armor and plasma rifle nonsense. When you beg, borrow, or steal your access pass prior to stealing the DT out of the labs you can use a computer to the left of that chamber with the augs to turn off the radiation inside and open the locks.
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Jan 13, 2011 22:19
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StickySweater posted:Finally, is there any additional Deus Ex material to go through other than the Bible? I can't think of anything except maybe looking through the script for emails/conversations you might have missed. If you're also interested in the development history and not just the fiction, there's interesting stuff like the postmortem.
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Jan 13, 2011 22:25
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StickySweater posted:Another (probably much simpler) question. How do you get General Carter to approve of your methods after the second mission. I always use non-violent methods to knock the NSF people unconscious, but it never satisfies him. Do I have to avoid them altogether? You mean the Castle Clinton mission? Off the top of my head, if you use the hidden entrance behind the snack machine then you have to leave that way as well. If you climb up and out of the base and leave through castle clinton it triggers the UNATCO troops to charge in and kill everyone.
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Jan 13, 2011 22:26
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...of SCIENCE! posted:You mean the Castle Clinton mission? Off the top of my head, if you use the hidden entrance behind the snack machine then you have to leave that way as well. If you climb up and out of the base and leave through castle clinton it triggers the UNATCO troops to charge in and kill everyone. Yeah, I think that bit is bugged. Goddamn it JC, don't claim responsibility for gleefully gunning all the terrists down, that was Anna and her goons.
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Jan 13, 2011 22:46
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You know, it's been awhile, but aren't you specifically told that Greene works for MJ-12?
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Jan 14, 2011 00:34
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Pope Guilty posted:You know, it's been awhile, but aren't you specifically told that Greene works for MJ-12? You're even given a photo of him chatting with some uniformed MJ12 troops.
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Jan 14, 2011 00:36
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BattleMaster posted:You're even given a photo of him chatting with some uniformed MJ12 troops. You're told a lot of things in Deus Ex and that photo doesn't really prove a whole lot since MJ12 could have been forcefully questioning him on the street when that picture was taken.
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Jan 14, 2011 00:42
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I can't remember exactly what JC or Greene say when you choose to talk to him about what you know, but he does go hostile after the conversation. Could have sworn it was a "guess you found me out" sort of response. In any case, it's more interesting if he really was working for MJ12 and the Illuminati weren't lying. If the Illuminati are lying to you, you're just silencing a reporter to stop secrets from getting out, and that's pretty boring. If he really is with MJ12, they purposefully set up Greene to kill any credibility to the rumors about the very real conspiratorial stuff he reports on in the Deus Ex world by associating the ideas with tabloid tinfoil hat nonsense. "Ambrosia"? Oh hell, not another loving Joe Greene dittohead...
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Jan 14, 2011 01:11
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Every time I play DX I kill Joe Greene the first time you meet him, just because it saves time in the future and because he's so obnoxious. Also, I love that when you first see him the title on your crosshairs is "Used car salesman?" until you talk to him and learn his actual name.
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Jan 14, 2011 01:17
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Is everyone supposed to be bad at this the first time around, or am I the only one pretty much doing things by trail and error? The game is so big, and there are so many ways to do things, that I find myself just making silly "mistakes" and then having to go down a different path. For example, in the second mission I killed the civilians in the subway station and got reprimanded for it, and am now on a different task. I feel like I'm playing the game "wrong", but I guess that can't happen? Just wondering, I feel really stupid playing right now, and I'm assuming that everyone else knows where to go and what to do the first time.
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Jan 16, 2011 23:34
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I don't want to spoil things for you, but there's no real danger of loving yourself up in the game, so keep playing also don't do the main mission in Hell's Kitchen until you've explored the area thoroughly, there's a ton of content in that area that you can miss if you just concentrate on the main objective. past that, I don't want to spoil you.
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Jan 16, 2011 23:38
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The one thing you might want to know beforehand is saving Paul from Unatco. If you go into Paul's apartment and leave out the front door of the building, he will survive. If you leave through the window, like he tells you to, he dies. and even then, there's no real gameplay differences.
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Jan 16, 2011 23:58
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I can't find it anymore, but wasn't Joe Green in one of the bylines for the mockup newspaper that came with some editions of the game?
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Jan 17, 2011 00:23
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Momomo posted:The one thing you might want to know beforehand is saving Paul from Unatco. If you go into Paul's apartment and leave out the front door of the building, he will survive. If you leave through the window, like he tells you to, he dies. and even then, there's no real gameplay differences. This among other things is fixed in the Shifter mod to make more sense. (If you leave Paul to the MIB then he dies as normal, but unlike vanilla you can leave out of the window after defeating them and he will survive.) Shifter should be standard for playing through DX these days anyway.
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Jan 17, 2011 00:27
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Furret Basket posted:
But...But... My laser sight! I love my pinpoint accurate 10mm Pistol too much to deal with the fact laser sights don't work right with Shifter. Or did they change that?
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Jan 17, 2011 00:42
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Biomod is shifter : better edition. Everyone should be using that.
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Jan 17, 2011 00:44
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K8.0 posted:Biomod is shifter : better edition. Everyone should be using that. Really? The whole passive augs thing seems kind-of game-breaking to me, but that's really all that I know about it. Also, isn't there very little difference between either medium and hard or realistic and hard difficulty? I tried playing through on hard about a month ago and either my Deus Ex skills have waned or it was substantially more difficult than I remember it being.
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Jan 17, 2011 01:03
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Ugly In The Morning posted:But...But... My laser sight! I love my pinpoint accurate 10mm Pistol too much to deal with the fact laser sights don't work right with Shifter. They work the way they're supposed to - the shot always goes where the laser sight is, but the sight wavers. Stop using it as a crutch! OregonDonor posted:Really? The whole passive augs thing seems kind-of game-breaking to me, but that's really all that I know about it. Also, isn't there very little difference between either medium and hard or realistic and hard difficulty? I tried playing through on hard about a month ago and either my Deus Ex skills have waned or it was substantially more difficult than I remember it being. Hard is probably harder than realistic if you're stealthy because the enemies can take more bullets.
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Jan 17, 2011 01:17
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As far as I know if you open up the level in the editor there are comments that state Greene works for MJ12. So unless the conspiracy extended to the halls of Ion Storm consider this case closed.
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Jan 17, 2011 01:33
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OregonDonor posted:Really? The whole passive augs thing seems kind-of game-breaking to me, but that's really all that I know about it. Also, isn't there very little difference between either medium and hard or realistic and hard difficulty? I tried playing through on hard about a month ago and either my Deus Ex skills have waned or it was substantially more difficult than I remember it being. Biomod is as much about balance as convenience. Download it and take a look at the readme, configurations you would NEVER use in core DX/shifter are suddenly worthwhile. None of the passive mods are that strong, it just makes them not useless, and it makes some of the mods you would always want on in a certain situation only draw power in those situations, but the ones that were really overpowered in core DX have their costs increased and poo poo. You can just go into your inventory and instantly configure your augs at any time anyway, so the automation is not a real advantage, just less annoying. And yes, hard is the only remotely hard mode in Deus Ex. Realistic makes you do so much damage that you can just massacre everyone easily.
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Jan 17, 2011 01:47
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I seem to recall that the rationale for what was a pretty significant power-up for the player was that it makes the player less likely to play resource miser with their augs and items, which I can appreciate as a massive sperg. Wasn't the Realistic = enemies are weaker thing debunked in this very thread? I thought someone opened up the game to check and found enemies have no more health on Hard than they do on Realistic.
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Jan 17, 2011 02:42
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^^ Yeah. According to the readme, what he observed is that augs are such a pain in the rear end to manage that he tended to save them for emergencies - which often happened so fast that by the time he realized he needed the augs, it was too late. And if he died, that meant a reload and usually a change in tactics that removed the need for the augs in the first place. Net result: almost no aug use, huge amounts of excess power cells. This parallels my own experience, incidentally, and auto-managing augs are something I've considered modding into the game myself. UnrealEd is sufficiently annoying that I've never gotten around to it, though. Also, now that I know about the existence of BioMod, I think I need to replay DX at some point this year...maybe after my current stack of games is dealt with.
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Jan 17, 2011 03:10
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MrL_JaKiri posted:They work the way they're supposed to - the shot always goes where the laser sight is, but the sight wavers. Stop using it as a crutch! It's a laser sight- it's SUPPOSED to make aiming easier.
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Jan 17, 2011 03:50
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Pope Guilty posted:It's a laser sight- it's SUPPOSED to make aiming easier. It shouldn't make you a no-aim-or-scope-necessary sharp shooter at any distance. (That's what the skill levels and gun mods are for.)
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Jan 17, 2011 04:02
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Ugly In The Morning posted:But...But... My laser sight! I love my pinpoint accurate 10mm Pistol too much to deal with the fact laser sights don't work right with Shifter.
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Jan 17, 2011 04:15
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Man. Haven't seen you post in here since you put fire grenades in Deus Ex, Lork.
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Jan 17, 2011 05:19
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Wankie posted:I'm hoping someone can post a Deus Ex:IW saved game at the start of the Return to Cairo segment. http://www.2shared.com/file/DtQWr8ke/Current_Save.html In that save so far, I've used the baton+strength+EMP for lasers/cameras/turrets/bots/humans (I had never tried it before), but I also kept some other toys. It's on realistic, which is still significantly less difficult than the original so far. When you hit templars, pretend it's Quake with a rocket launcher, otherwise baton with the baton. Also, I'm still waiting for a version of Shifter that's just the bugfixes, and then a version of Biomod built off of that instead. Mantling is actually kind of neat, but XP on kills is bad.
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Jan 17, 2011 05:32
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Positronic Spleen posted:Seattle was a lot more painful than I remember with all the loading, and half of the internet decided to randomly stop working, so it's pretty lucky that I'm able to help like this.
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Jan 17, 2011 06:07
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Hogburto posted:Man. Haven't seen you post in here since you put fire grenades in Deus Ex, Lork. I still plan to update BioMod though. Some day, possibly within the next decade, I will fix up the last few remaining bugs, find a couple places to put the flame grenades, add a few challenges and the option to turn off Shifter's XP for kills sytem, and call that 1.0.
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Jan 17, 2011 08:22
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I'm playing through with Shifter+Biomod (first time with a modded playthrough) and it seems like mantling is a little finicky - half the time it flings me 10 feet in front of whatever I was climbing over. The aug changes are cool I suppose. Since a few of the augs are now passive I don't really notice them making a difference, though I'm constantly short on biocells so they must be doing something right.
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Jan 17, 2011 08:25
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ToxicFrog posted:^^ Yeah. According to the readme, what he observed is that augs are such a pain in the rear end to manage that he tended to save them for emergencies - which often happened so fast that by the time he realized he needed the augs, it was too late. And if he died, that meant a reload and usually a change in tactics that removed the need for the augs in the first place. Net result: almost no aug use, huge amounts of excess power cells. I've experienced this phenomenon not only with biocells in my own first play-through, but with almost all consumables save for bullets/multitools/lockpicks. I pretty much only ever use my running, healing, and power saving augs. I use those pretty sparingly, and so the number of biocells I hold is usually greater than 10. My tendency to quick reload to try again and quick save way too often means that I enter a lot of fights with single legs already blown off/red damage on more than 2 limbs. There's usually a way to win most fights while taking zero damage, and so by the time I do win the fight that's usually what has happened. So I was carrying a full stack of medkits with me most of the game. I've tried using ballistic armor and thermoptic camo before, but it never feels like it makes a big enough difference to have it be the reason I die or survive. So when I do end up getting through whatever battle I wanted to get through, I'll find that it was my positional approach or overall speed that made the most difference, not whether I used my camo or armor. Consequently, I'm carrying around 3 ballistic armors and 3 thermoptic camos. I fully admit and realize that these are all decisions I've made about how I'm going to play this game. Combat happens too quickly to be able to really use all augs strategically, and there's absolutely nothing you can do to passively reduce the amount of power your augs take. The power recirculator aug takes energy to maintain itself, and so even it's kind of a pain in the rear end to use despite helping. If they had just made the power recirculator a passive aug in the base game then I think it would fix a lot of the weird things people do to conserve energy when they don't need to. This really all kind of comes down to balance issues in the base game as well. I really like Deus Ex a lot, but it is not in any way a balanced experience. There's lots of ways to get 1 or 2 hit kills on most enemies while using very little in the way of energy or consumables. So when you learn the ropes of Deus Ex, you find yourself with no reason to ever use a lot of the augs because what you're currently doing is working fine. It's a more granular version of the problems the Bioshock wrench had. There's also the issue that since the game can be kind of slow to dole out augs to newbies, you play significant portions of the game with very few augs. So by the time you get augs, they're nice to have, but you've been making do without them just fine. You pretty much start the game without augs, and so the first thing the game is really teaching you is that augs don't really mean a whole lot. These are all my impressions from a first play-through, though. I can definitely see how augs add a ton to the replayability once you know where most of the repair bots are and how to get augs earlier. There's a lot of fun stuff you can do if you plan your play-through a little bit. ErIog fucked around with this message at 14:37 on Jan 17, 2011 |
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Jan 17, 2011 14:28
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1. The power recirculator is a passive aug in the base game. It only activates when it actually saves power. It might have been patched in though. 2. The speed aug is really amazing to use in your first game, and totally not useless. 3. Same with regeneration, ballistic armor, strength aug. They are really no-brainers (run up to a firefight, switch on regen/armor/strength and kill em all with the DTS/baton  )I had a ton of fun with augs in my first run. Yes, you can do it boring sneakystyle and not use them and silently kill everyone, but that's quite boring. Deus Ex is one of the few shooter/rpg's where you feel like a wuss at the start and a god at the end, without truly breaking.
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Jan 17, 2011 15:16
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ErIog posted:Speaking of Joe Greene, is it normal for everyone in the Free Clinic during that portion of the game to run away from you screaming on sight? I've only done one playthrough of DX, I used mods that made it easier to run it on a modern system but nothing else. Is the general consensus that one should use Shifter or Biomod? My understanding is that one includes the other (Biomod, I think?). The Nameless Mod appears to be somewhat controversial in this thread, but I can probably tolerate the plot if the gameplay is there. I guess what I'm asking is, is the gameplay there?
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Jan 17, 2011 16:29
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A Quiet American posted:I know this is from a page back and you may no longer care, but yeah this is normal. Even if you roll in there completely incognito, as soon as you confront Greene everyone heads for the hills. If people are terrified of you before you've confronted Greene, then you must have done something at some point to make them fear you. Biomod is Shifter plus stuff. As for TNM, the gameplay is definitely there, and the plot gets less "LOL internet" after the opening area. Which kinda blows but what're you gonna do.
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Jan 17, 2011 16:36
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A Quiet American posted:I know this is from a page back and you may no longer care, but yeah this is normal. Even if you roll in there completely incognito, as soon as you confront Greene everyone heads for the hills. If people are terrified of you before you've confronted Greene, then you must have done something at some point to make them fear you. Use Biomod, but a clean playthrough is recommended. The Nameless Mod has some nice gameplay, the plot is okay, but I confess to turning the volume off when ever the voices came in, they aren't the greatest on the "evil" side.
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Jan 17, 2011 16:38
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Post poste posted:Use Biomod, but a clean playthrough is recommended. The player character and main villain (both the same, professional, actor, incidentally) are great, I thought. On the other hand, it wouldn't be Deus Ex without atrocious voice acting.
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Jan 17, 2011 16:42
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A Quiet American posted:The Nameless Mod appears to be somewhat controversial in this thread, but I can probably tolerate the plot if the gameplay is there. I guess what I'm asking is, is the gameplay there? I'd say stick with it at least until a bit after the part where you have to collect money in the beginning. Then you too shall see the light.
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Jan 17, 2011 16:42
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Dr Snofeld posted:The player character and main villain (both the same, professional, actor, incidentally) are great, I thought. On the other hand, it wouldn't be Deus Ex without atrocious voice acting. I think I was just jaded because I did the good side first, so my main impression of the main bad guy is him screaming gently caress at me repeatedly.
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Jan 17, 2011 16:44
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Post poste posted:I think I was just jaded because I did the good side first, so my main impression of the main bad guy is him screaming gently caress at me repeatedly. Thanks to that bit the phrase "poo poo drat son of a whore" entered my vocabulary.
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Jan 17, 2011 16:46
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