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Really the response to having people point out the horrible things that are being done in Islamic countries is call them out on the horrific things being done in Christian countries. Female 'circumcision' is practised among Christians in Africa and the practice also generally pre-dates the spread of Islam in North Africa and the Middle East. Most of the people with this view of Islam are pretty much informed by big e-mailed lists of horrible things happening in Islamic countries, the fact that similar poo poo is going on in Christian communities in those countries or in predominantly Christian countries that are also in the region tends to get overlooked ( ) And yeah, historically Islam was far more tolerant than Christianity. It took 700 years to force the Moors out of Spain, by which I mean it took 700 years for nominally Christian kings to launch a series of wars against a North African colonial power that had brought advanced agricultural techniques, architecture and a tolerance for other religions. The noble Christian kings followed this up with the Spanish Inquisition and torturing people whose Jewish parents had converted (because they had to be really, really sure they were Christian and as conservatives know the only way to be sure is burning people with brands). gently caress, I actually don't mind people honestly attacking other countries for barbaric practices as much as I know this drags in a whole host of western imperialist type sentiments but it really pisses me off when people decide to wrap this up in some, "See they're all savages with their savage religion," Type poo poo.
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Jan 18, 2011 16:01
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quote:Fourth, the Queen Mother also has her reasons. Hahaha jesus christ Whatever happened to calling the Obamas ivory tower elitists? 
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Jan 18, 2011 16:02
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Ballz posted:Allen West stuff West's district was gerrymander for years to be solid republican, now it is a toss up and he got lucky during a wave year. Not only did they get 0 information, there is no corroboration with his story and he gets to live as a hero for the Republican party. The man has significant tax liens cause he refuses to pay taxes and oh yah has spoken to criminal biker gangs for "protection". He also thinks abortion is the biggest national security threat and believes in a flat tax and frequently makes horrible claims about history. But hey, he wears a uniform so he must be a great guy.
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Jan 18, 2011 16:03
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WOW, that's a whole bag of race bait!quote:the expensive vacations and state visits that cost the American tax payers billions of dollars un-necessarily when the American people need the resources. India. Literally, they're referencing that India visit where someone claimed he was being escorted by 40 battle cruisers and was costing 9 trillion dollars or something, all because an unidentified Indian dude said so.
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Jan 18, 2011 16:05
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So all I got from that email was that I don't know whether the Obamas have been invited to the wedding. Although the idea that the Royal family would be gleefully telling the press that they think the US head of state and his family are all horrible people and they hate them is pretty hilarious. Pro-tip, if a head of state isn't Gadaffi or some equally hilarious dictator then they didn't actually publically trash talk a head of state/senior political figure of another country.
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Jan 18, 2011 16:21
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Apparently the main source for all of this is an article by the Daily Mail (HAH!) who spoke with a courtier who said except for Nicholas Sarkozy, there probably won't be any heads of state. They're doing an austerity wedding, comparing it to some 1947 wedding. The article goes as far as to say the wedding dress will be paid for with 300 rationing coupons, whatever that means. British folk are fuckin' serious about their money, I guess. E: Prince William is inviting charity workers, friends, and common-folk, and wants it to have a "street party" atmosphere. As few heads of state as possible. Although, I'm sure with this making the headlines, he'll extend an invite to the Obamas. The article also says the queen is fond of the "down-to-earth" Michelle.
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Jan 18, 2011 16:42
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Yeah, snopes has already thoroughly debunked that email. While it's true that the Obama's aren't on the guest list, neither is really any other head-of-state (with the exception of Sarkozy): http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/weddingsnub.asp
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Jan 18, 2011 16:56
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My answer to pretty much everything in that mail is [citation needed]. And I hope they have has a drat good psychic as source when they tell us people's thoughts.
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Jan 18, 2011 17:15
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XyloJW posted:WOW, that's a whole bag of race bait! Interestingly, 200 million rupees is about 4.5 million dollars, and not too far out of line with what these kinds of trips have cost in the past. Also interesting: while I was in India last fall, on many, many, many occasions, my Indian coworkers called rupees dollars. The terms were more or less interchangeable.
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Jan 18, 2011 18:36
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MrNemo posted:Female 'circumcision' is practised among Christians in Africa and the practice also generally pre-dates the spread of Islam in North Africa and the Middle East. Honestly, the West's condemnation of female genital "mutilation" is one of the biggest examples of hypocrisy I can think of. What about the male circumcision that Western doctors perform on infants every day? If it's okay to cut healthy, functioning tissue off of a male child, then it should be okay to do the same to a female child. If you condemn circumcision, you should condemn it in both sexes. 
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Jan 18, 2011 19:57
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Pththya-lyi posted:Honestly, the West's condemnation of female genital "mutilation" is one of the biggest examples of hypocrisy I can think of. What about the male circumcision that Western doctors perform on infants every day? If it's okay to cut healthy, functioning tissue off of a male child, then it should be okay to do the same to a female child. If you condemn circumcision, you should condemn it in both sexes. The practices are different enough to make the comparison pretty abhorrent.
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Jan 18, 2011 20:02
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Pththya-lyi posted:Honestly, the West's condemnation of female genital "mutilation" is one of the biggest examples of hypocrisy I can think of. What about the male circumcision that Western doctors perform on infants every day? If it's okay to cut healthy, functioning tissue off of a male child, then it should be okay to do the same to a female child. If you condemn circumcision, you should condemn it in both sexes. Oh no, what have you done? 
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Jan 18, 2011 20:03
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Ballz posted:Oh no, what have you done? Where's the guy that argues that the briefest unremembered moment of infant suffering is an absolute travesty if there is not a corresponding good. PS uncircumsized penises are weird looking. This thread makes me glad I never email my family.
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Jan 18, 2011 20:13
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dur posted:$200 million dollars a day was the claim bandied around, which is more than the cost of a day of the war in Afghanistan. That is very interesting! However, 4.5 million dollars still sounds pretty high. I recall when this "story" came up, a representative from the Secret Service came forward and said that they never release the cost of these trips because it's a security risk. I have to wonder how any Indian person got ahold of that info, if it's accurate at all.
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Jan 18, 2011 20:45
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XyloJW posted:Apparently the main source for all of this is an article by the Daily Mail (HAH!) who spoke with a courtier who said except for Nicholas Sarkozy, there probably won't be any heads of state. They're doing an austerity wedding, comparing it to some 1947 wedding. The article goes as far as to say the wedding dress will be paid for with 300 rationing coupons, whatever that means. British folk are fuckin' serious about their money, I guess. I think the rationing coupons were a reference to Queen Elizabeth's wedding in 1947. The coupons were a hold-over from WWII until the British economy had sufficiently recovered.
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Jan 18, 2011 21:14
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Pththya-lyi posted:Honestly, the West's condemnation of female genital "mutilation" is one of the biggest examples of hypocrisy I can think of. What about the male circumcision that Western doctors perform on infants every day? If it's okay to cut healthy, functioning tissue off of a male child, then it should be okay to do the same to a female child. If you condemn circumcision, you should condemn it in both sexes. You're pretty stupid. If male circumcision included cutting the head of the penis off, they'd be comparable.
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Jan 18, 2011 21:56
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Pfirti86 posted:Yeah, snopes has already thoroughly debunked that email. While it's true that the Obama's aren't on the guest list, neither is really any other head-of-state (with the exception of Sarkozy):
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Jan 18, 2011 23:19
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dur posted:$200 million dollars a day was the claim bandied around, which is more than the cost of a day of the war in Afghanistan. I posted the email earlier, the entire trip was actually slightly more than 1 day in Afghanistan.
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Jan 18, 2011 23:29
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XyloJW posted:WOW, that's a whole bag of race bait! You ain't kidding. quote:Third, Michelle Obama showed her butt at every major social function endeavoring to be the Queen in the lime light. In other words, just a lack of class.
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Jan 18, 2011 23:48
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There's been a lot commenting on the size of Michelle's rear end I don't really get it.
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Jan 19, 2011 00:27
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Black girl, big rear end, rap videos, etc.
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Jan 19, 2011 00:31
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XyloJW posted:Black girl, big rear end, rap videos, etc. Why is this being made out to be a bad thing? 
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Jan 19, 2011 02:19
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Ballz posted:Why is this being made out to be a bad thing? Because the only reason why many of them oppose Burqas is that they're associated with Arabs.
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Jan 19, 2011 03:24
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So about this Allen West thing. I posted in another forum that was circle jerking over this guy and I brought up the whole torture thing. And this is the response I get.quote:Is that all you get dig up? So he fired a shot over some guy's head, who cares - if it saves American lives, I'm all for aggressive tactics - we're dealing with unreasoning thugs here I mean, how the hell do I respond to this?
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Jan 19, 2011 05:52
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Have you seen my apex seals? I seem to have lost them.
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XyloJW posted:That is very interesting! However, 4.5 million dollars still sounds pretty high. I recall when this "story" came up, a representative from the Secret Service came forward and said that they never release the cost of these trips because it's a security risk. I have to wonder how any Indian person got ahold of that info, if it's accurate at all. Wasn't that comparable to what Clinton's final trip to India cost per day? I think it was somewhere between 4 to 5 million. It could be whoever they quoted may have just been estimating based off of that.
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Jan 19, 2011 06:10
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Aeka 2.0 posted:So about this Allen West thing. I posted in another forum that was circle jerking over this guy and I brought up the whole torture thing. And this is the response I get. Politely point out again that it... didn't save American lives? There is a level of irony with his description of "unreasoning thugs," too.
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Jan 19, 2011 06:26
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Ballz posted:Politely point out again that it... didn't save American lives? There is a level of irony with his description of "unreasoning thugs," too. and here is his response, lol. quote:Post your worthless wiki bullshit elsewhere....if there's one thing I can't stand it's lame attempts at character assasinatio. so typical of the left. I've followed up with this: Are you denying that it happened by calling it worthless wiki bullshit? Ok how about CNN? Quote: military prosecutors said his actions amounted to torture and violated articles 128 and 134 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice. http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/12/12/spr...ing/index.html The man committed a war crime, and pointing that out is "a lame attempt at character assasination?" He did it himself. "Typical of the left?" Have you read the politics section? Oh the hypocrisy. Aeka 2.0 fucked around with this message at 07:33 on Jan 19, 2011 |
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Jan 19, 2011 07:10
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Aeka 2.0 posted:and here is his response, lol. (I know how pleas work, rightwing nutjobs don't). Also, she sent an uncited email from godknows who, even CNN is more reliable than that.
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Jan 19, 2011 09:05
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Aeka 2.0 posted:and here is his response, lol. I'd actually argue that not only did he not save lives, he endangered lives. He tortured the dude to get info, which resulted in bogus info. He compromised the guy as a witness. Anything that guy knew that might have been useful became worthless after you forced him to lie. He knew he wasn't an intelligence officer, but he decided to act like he knew better than one, and hosed it up for the actual intelligence officers. Further, at a critical juncture, he wasted time and resources by taking his men from where they were needed to go investigate a wild goose chase. And honestly, the guy you're directly arguing with in a forum is rarely going to admit he's wrong. What's important is that the people reading it see that you made a point, and he said "Nuh uh!!"
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Jan 19, 2011 15:16
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I'm sure it was mentioned somewhere in D&D, possibly in this thread: A research paper on how people develop political views. All I remember was that repetition was one factor and an absence of challenges was another. It'd be nice if there was any evidence that refuting endless insane claims was worthwhile.
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Jan 19, 2011 15:48
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So the US just elected a war criminal into office? Isn't that the wrong way around?
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Jan 19, 2011 16:22
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XyloJW posted:I'd actually argue that not only did he not save lives, he endangered lives. He tortured the dude to get info, which resulted in bogus info. He compromised the guy as a witness. Anything that guy knew that might have been useful became worthless after you forced him to lie. He knew he wasn't an intelligence officer, but he decided to act like he knew better than one, and hosed it up for the actual intelligence officers. Further, at a critical juncture, he wasted time and resources by taking his men from where they were needed to go investigate a wild goose chase. I basically went ahead and quoted this almost word for word, hope you don't mind. I followed up that neither of us are going to change positions on the matter and said there was no further point in discussing it. I'm out of that crazy thread.
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Jan 19, 2011 18:34
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Aeka 2.0 posted:I basically went ahead and quoted this almost word for word, hope you don't mind. I followed up that neither of us are going to change positions on the matter and said there was no further point in discussing it. I'm out of that crazy thread. I need to say this again, NO ONE WAS ABLE TO CORROBORATE ANYTHING HE SAID. Allen West is just an all around bad person and it's quite tragic he won.
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Jan 19, 2011 18:55
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holy poo poo these guysquote:"War crimes", sure - you're truly clueless
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Jan 19, 2011 19:33
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Aeka 2.0 posted:holy poo poo these guys Talk about his outstanding IRS liens and see them go even farther off the deep end.
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Jan 19, 2011 19:37
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Reminds me of one of my classmates on Facebook who supported killing anyone trying to cross the border from Mexico, and said I "lacked nationalism" when I suggested trying to improve conditions as a solution. There's no reasoning with these people...
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Jan 19, 2011 19:40
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Aeka 2.0 posted:holy poo poo these guys Apparently, so is the United States Army.
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Jan 19, 2011 19:46
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Now I'm getting the whole "torture works read 'My Battle of Algiers'" Correct me if I'm wrong, but that book proves nothing and is a total hack job.
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Jan 19, 2011 20:13
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Dr. Arbitrary posted:I'm sure it was mentioned somewhere in D&D, possibly in this thread: A research paper on how people develop political views. All I remember was that repetition was one factor and an absence of challenges was another. 
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Jan 19, 2011 20:47
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Nucleic Acids posted:Apparently, so is the United States Army. The US Army told him he was going to face a court martial, so he retired to save his pension.
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Jan 19, 2011 20:49
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