|
Slantedfloors posted:The Empire's reasoning against the X-Wing is that they are supervillains - shielded fighters make pilots overconfident, and hyperdrive-equipped fighters mean they can defect easier. Thus, the standard Imperial starfighter was changed to short-range shitbox that explodes if you look at it too hard.
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 19:46
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 08:35 |
|
|
There's an early mission in Empire at War which involves stealing x-wing prototypes from an empire controlled planet. Might explain why he empire didn't have them in EpIV. Can't think why they never developed anything similar (beyond the obvious eviltude). Am I alone in thinking that the basic TIE-fighter looks incredibly stupid. Maybe it's the engineer in me, but I think it just doesn't look very threatening. The interceptor was better, and the bombers look fit its purpose, but the fighter was just daft. And then of course there's the TIE-defender EDIT: A little wookieepedia-ing turned this up; quote:They [the x-wings] were originally meant for the Galactic Empire but when the entire Incom design team defected with the prototypes to the Rebel Alliance this deal was over. Bene Elim fucked around with this message at 20:24 on Jan 19, 2011 |
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 20:09
|
|
|
Bene Elim posted:There's an early mission in Empire at War which involves stealing x-wing prototypes from an empire controlled planet. Might explain why he empire didn't have them in EpIV. Can't think why they never developed anything similar (beyond the obvious eviltude). The TIE fighter has no shields, plus those enormous solar panels make it a huge target. They were going to phase it out and replace it with the Interceptor, but by the time they started producing the Interceptor in mass quantities, the Rebels had blown up the second Death Star and killed the Emperor and the Empire started losing the war. A couple years after the battle of Endor, it became harder for the Empire to produce Interceptors and they had to use their old outdated TIEs. Speaking about old and outdated, I think it's retarded that 40 years after the battle of Yavin, they're still using the same old X-Wings. I'd be cool with a new crafted based on the X-Wing, though - the X-Wing came from the Z-95 Headhunter (and later ARC-170) Of course, Luke, Leia and Han were probably in their 60's and still going on adventures... I think it would have been logical for the EU to end with Vision of the Future, but noooo. Or they should have at least retired the main cast and skipped ahead 20 years. Can't they have a couple decades of peace?
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 20:34
|
|
|
One reason I really enjoy I.M.P.S. is because it really breaks down each craft/position in the Empire and makes things seem functional. In the EU, a Star Destroyer might blow up every 15 seconds just because a Jedi decides to throw it into the sun. But watching I.M.P.S. and seeing an orbital bombardment requested from the ground, the ship orienting itself, and the blasts coming in - it makes it feel more substantial. I wish there was more fiction/etc. in the way of focusing on individual roles and functionality as opposed to just using these things as setpieces for the adventures of Luke Skywalker and the other 70 year olds running on adventures without cracking their hip joints out of place.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 21:03
|
|
|
I loved the Tie Defender in the Tie Fighter game. Just ended up buying the lego version of it and when I was done I held it in my hand and went "pew pew"
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 21:04
|
|
|
Gammatron 64 posted:I think it would have been logical for the EU to end with Vision of the Future, but noooo. Or they should have at least retired the main cast and skipped ahead 20 years. Can't they have a couple decades of peace? Lucas forbid there should ever be a single month of Luke/Han/Leia's lives left unchronicled, or a year without them thwarting a doomsday plot of some kind.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 21:06
|
|
|
Ham Session posted:Guys I think we know what is happening here I guess that's why the blurays are coming out in 2011.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 21:09
|
|
|
Gammatron 64 posted:I think it would have been logical for the EU to end with Vision of the Future, but noooo. Or they should have at least retired the main cast and skipped ahead 20 years. Can't they have a couple decades of peace? LLJKSiLk posted:In the EU, a Star Destroyer might blow up every 15 seconds just because a Jedi decides to throw it into the sun.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 21:27
|
|
|
Sombrerotron posted:I don't know if he started it, but Kevin J. Anderson (the horrible man who invented Daala, incidentally) will always be the main culprit for me regarding abuse of the Force. In Anderson's hands it became The Ultimate Plot Device, capable of accomplishing absolutely anything in order to serve the most diabolically absurd and stupid purposes. What midichlorian count is required to reach Deus Ex Machina?
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 21:52
|
|
|
That reminds me, I haven't read any EU books since the prequel trilogy was released in theaters. How have they fit the whole midichlorian thing into it?
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 21:56
|
|
|
Gammatron 64 posted:You win, man. You win. I just can't argue against that. The hell we can't 
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 22:22
|
|
|
Quick KotOr question: how badly did the inhabitants of Taris fare from the Sith bombardment? When that happened I cheered because that dumb planet's main questline goes on far longer than it needs to, but then I realised all the good work I did stopping people getting assassinated and leading slumdwellers to their promised lands meant dick-all from an in-universe point of view.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 22:24
|
|
|
Taris got almost entirely wiped out. Over 90% of the population were killed, along with the complete destruction of infrastructure. While everyone hates Taris, it's destruction is a bit of a dick move. The first time through the game you feel a bit sad that the place got destroyed, but then you realize that nothing you did there, for good or ill, mattered one bit. The only good that can come from Taris is escaping with as many credits as possible. As for the slum-dwellers; no-one knows. The planet is going to be in The Old Republic MMO, so it might get answered then. My bet is that they all died 
Bene Elim fucked around with this message at 22:40 on Jan 19, 2011 |
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 22:34
|
|
|
Biplane posted:The hell we can't Holy gently caress. Why wasn't Cage cast in any of the prequel movies. It's not like he ever turns down a role.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 22:48
|
|
|
Sombrerotron posted:To be fair, VotF ended with the revelation that Thrawn was seriously concerned about whatever was lurking out in the Unkown Regions, providing a good setup for a new series of books. So, of course, they decided to capitalise on this by trotting out the Yuuzhan Vong, a species straight out of a Star Trek/Babylon 5 crossover fan fiction story. I'm pretty sure Zahn already knew the NJO series was in the works when he was writing the Hand of Thrawn books, so he directed his books in about as good a direction as they could have gone, with finally wrapping up the war with the Imperial Remnant (an honorable peace, etc.), opening up some of the Unknown Regions, tossing out some foreshadowing via Mara's vision at the very end, FINALLY WRECKING the overused Bothan/Fey'lya politics bullshit, etc. The only thing that was terrible with the duology was that somebody decided the New Republic's Chief of State was literally a chicken. And then they made Borsk Fey'lya the next Chief of State. quote:And who in the Maker's name thought it was a good idea to dredge up Daala - quite possibly the most incompetent and irrelevant antagonist in the entire New Republic series - and put her in charge of the galaxy? The mind boggles. I totally hate the TotJ comics for that, because basically everything is a Force Deus ex Machina. Also the Sith Alchemy and Sith Sorcery poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 23:01
|
|
|
Bene Elim posted:While everyone hates Taris, it's destruction is a bit of a dick move. The first time through the game you feel a bit sad that the place got destroyed, but then you realize that nothing you did there, for good or ill, mattered one bit. The only good that can come from Taris is escaping with as many credits as possible. I didn't feel sad, I was just angry that it took so long, then even angrier when I realised all that time was a waste. Taris! 
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 23:14
|
|
|
RagnarokAngel posted:In addition to just supervillian the x-wing wasn't as cost efficient. The imperials have a lot of pilots to accomodate for, cheaper to make a bunch of barely functioning ships. The rebels are smaller and need to make every pilot count, so better to give them ships that will last more than a week. Tie fighters actually make a fair amount of sense for the stuff imperials do. The spherical shape gives it a low rotational mass, it's small, doesn't have a hyperdrive and it seems reasonably fast. This all works well for carrier style combat like the imperials used. X wings work well in small numbers but if you have anything too big you've spent a lot of money putting a hyperdrive on each ship.
|
|
#
?
Jan 19, 2011 23:55
|
|
|
Gammatron 64 posted:The TIE fighter has no shields, plus those enormous solar panels make it a huge target. They were going to phase it out and replace it with the Interceptor, but by the time they started producing the Interceptor in mass quantities, the Rebels had blown up the second Death Star and killed the Emperor and the Empire started losing the war. A couple years after the battle of Endor, it became harder for the Empire to produce Interceptors and they had to use their old outdated TIEs. XJ-7 X-wings are a lot different than the original Incom T-65s.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 01:13
|
|
|
Shimrra Jamaane posted:XJ-7 X-wings are a lot different than the original Incom T-65s. About the only difference I know of between the two is that they painted the XJ-7 ones all black, like my soul, when I cut myself I bleed but I won't die.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 01:39
|
|
|
Gammatron 64 posted:The TIE fighter has no shields, plus those enormous solar panels make it a huge target. They were going to phase it out and replace it with the Interceptor, but by the time they started producing the Interceptor in mass quantities, the Rebels had blown up the second Death Star and killed the Emperor and the Empire started losing the war. A couple years after the battle of Endor, it became harder for the Empire to produce Interceptors and they had to use their old outdated TIEs. In the Rogue Squadron properties as well they talk about how the Imperial combat philosophy is that pilots will fly better if they don't have niceties like shields and life support. The lack of hyperdrive has been explained as a deterrent to Imperial pilots deserting or defecting. I just imagine too that the Star Wars universe has hit an apex due to interspecies cooperation and technological exchange. Advancements do come but they are rare and do not come as frequently as they do in post WWII real world society.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 02:01
|
|
|
RocknRollaAyatollah posted:In the Rogue Squadron properties as well they talk about how the Imperial combat philosophy is that pilots will fly better if they don't have niceties like shields and life support. The lack of hyperdrive has been explained as a deterrent to Imperial pilots deserting or defecting. Also that pilots who survive their first engagements will be of high quality, bettering the skill level of the entire force. Seems like a retarded philosophy, but I guess it kind of works when you control so many planets.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 02:11
|
|
|
Der Luftwaffle posted:Also that pilots who survive their first engagements will be of high quality, bettering the skill level of the entire force. Seems like a retarded philosophy, but I guess it kind of works when you control so many planets. I don't really understand this because they must be spending a lot of effort and money into training those pilots, but maybe if it's one of those cost:volume ratios then it all balances out?
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 02:34
|
|
|
If they are conscripting merchant and civilian pilots then it probably does not cost much. I think in cut EP 4 scenes Biggs talks about getting conscripted.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 02:38
|
|
|
I believe the logic is that the Imperials have a near limitless stock of people to conscript for the Empire's military and that training them is not an issue since the Empire has near limitless resources.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 02:46
|
|
|
Its also if you look at it in the way WWII was, the Alliance being the US with durable fighters and Japan using kites that are maneuverable and deadly. Also I don't think the X-Wing plans were stolen, I believe the Incom team that was working on it defected. The remaining team did make the I-7 Howlrunner which is fucktarded. Also the problem with getting rid of the X-Wing for future Star Wars is like removing an iconic legend. People can see an X-Wing and say "Thats Star Wars". They had the successor to the X-Wings, which retained the general shape except used updated droids, more powerful lasers in the form of the E-Wing but you never hear about it. Ugh there needs to be a new X-Wing Space Sim game. I want to blow up smugglers.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 03:22
|
|
|
Heh, they did replace the X-Wing in one of Kevin J Andersons novels I think. It didn't last long.
|
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 03:31
|
|
|
RocknRollaAyatollah posted:In the Rogue Squadron properties as well they talk about how the Imperial combat philosophy is that pilots will fly better if they don't have niceties like shields and life support. This always struck me as propaganda for the emperor to defend himself from being accused of being cheap. A libertarian type philisophy. Works in real life.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 03:55
|
|
|
Ringo Star Get posted:Its also if you look at it in the way WWII was, the Alliance being the US with durable fighters and Japan using kites that are maneuverable and deadly. E-Wings were cool. Then they replaced the E-Wings with X-Wings again.  Luke Skywalker and X-Wings are iconic, but it's time for them to retire. Darth Vader is the most iconic character in all of Star Wars - thank God nobody brought him back from the dead. I love Luke Skywalker, Han Solo, Princess Leia, X-Wings and the Falcon. How can you not love them? But you gotta change things if you want your story to move forward and not be stuck in a perpetual state of boring. And yes there really, really needs to be a new space sim. GET IN THE ROBOT fucked around with this message at 04:29 on Jan 20, 2011 |
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 04:27
|
|
|
RagnarokAngel posted:In addition to just supervillian the x-wing wasn't as cost efficient. The imperials have a lot of pilots to accomodate for, cheaper to make a bunch of barely functioning ships. The rebels are smaller and need to make every pilot count, so better to give them ships that will last more than a week. Which is actually the opposite of how real life rebel-funded armies vs. nationally-funded armies operate, but it makes sense in fantasy. Good guys need the coolest ships.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 05:39
|
|
|
RagnarokAngel posted:This always struck me as propaganda for the emperor to defend himself from being accused of being cheap. A libertarian type philisophy. Works in real life. The Emperor came into power promising to smash up the moneyed interests and trade unions but was in reality really a tyrant at heart. Sounds like every "successful" populist and libertarian I've read about. The prequels are just All the King's Men in space.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 05:40
|
|
|
Sombrerotron posted:And who in the Maker's name thought it was a good idea to dredge up Daala - quite possibly the most incompetent and irrelevant antagonist in the entire New Republic series - and put her in charge of the galaxy? The mind boggles. That individual would be Karen Traviss. Or rather I seem to remember she was dead-set on having an Imperial female show up to take command of the Empire (because you know, she's so into feminism) and one of her sycophants who have Mando'a signatures on TFN told her to use Daala (because Traviss of course could not be expected to do research on other people's EU work on her own). And then Denning is the one who decided to make her head of the Galactic Alliance So basically Daala's return and rise to power is, respectively, the work of Traviss, a Traviss-worshiping fan, and Denning, which comes to no surprise as those are also the three worst aspects of modern EU.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 06:05
|
|
|
Chairman Capone posted:That individual would be Karen Traviss. Or rather I seem to remember she was dead-set on having an Imperial female show up to take command of the Empire (because you know, she's so into feminism) and one of her sycophants who have Mando'a signatures on TFN told her to use Daala (because Traviss of course could not be expected to do research on other people's EU work on her own). And then Denning is the one who decided to make her head of the Galactic Alliance I just really can't comprehend it. I mean for the love of god she attempted to destroy all of Coruscant in a massive terrorist attack at one point.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 06:33
|
|
|
Suenteus Po posted:I guess that's why the blurays are coming out in 2011. But the 3D re-release is supposed to be in 2012. It all makes sense now.  The Phantom Menace in 3D will bring about the apocalypse. I have foreseen it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 06:53
|
|
|
In fairness to Daala all that terrible poo poo was due to being a KJA character, so much like the dumber things Luke did, or Kyp Durron being a respected member of the Jedi Council despite his huge crimes and ridiculous introduction in the Jedi Academy books, I don't feel too bad for the larger EU to say "Well, it was Kevin J Anderson so we'll just pretend it didn't quite go down like that." Yeah, it's a retcon and no respect to continuity and blah blah blah, but honestly who gives a crap. I hope more lovely plot threads get ignored in this fashion, like basically the whole Swarm War and everything Karen Traviss wrote about Mandalorians.
yronic heroism fucked around with this message at 10:00 on Jan 20, 2011 |
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 07:17
|
|
|
Noghri_ViR posted:I loved the Tie Defender in the Tie Fighter game. Just ended up buying the lego version of it and when I was done I held it in my hand and went "pew pew" The most badass level I remember is when you escort Lord Vader and he says all sorts of awesome poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 07:52
|
|
|
RocknRollaAyatollah posted:The Emperor came into power promising to smash up the moneyed interests and trade unions but was in reality really a tyrant at heart. Oh no, it's Space Thatcher!!
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 09:49
|
|
|
Duckman2008 posted:The most badass level I remember is when you escort Lord Vader and he says all sorts of awesome poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 10:16
|
|
|
T-1000 posted:The most badass level is the one where your wingmen turn on you and a star destroyer comes to rescue you. You neglected to mention that this all happens IN THE MIDDLE OF A LASER MINEFIELD AND YOU'RE IN AN INTERCEPTOR WITH NO SHIELDS.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 11:14
|
|
|
Party Boat posted:Oh no, it's Space Thatcher!! Fear will keep the local systems in line. Fear of this poll tax.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 12:37
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 08:35 |
|
|
Noghri_ViR posted:I loved the Tie Defender in the Tie Fighter game. Just ended up buying the lego version of it and when I was done I held it in my hand and went "pew pew" The Tie Defender was a great ship in the game, but it, and the missile boat always struck me as odd. They were basically sort of over the top. Like the designers were trying to one up each other. And they ended up with a Tie Fighter that has 4 lasers, ION cannons, shields, and hyperdrive, and then another ship with like five million lasers. It felt to me like the game jumping the shark, I guess, but then reading some of the EU stuff in this thread, it's not so bad.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2011 12:52
|
|
