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Longinus00 posted:The vulcan got really lucky there. If he hadn't crited, with his flamer of all things, he'd be pretty screwed right now. Also, our jenner rolled a six 4 times! So close...soooo cloooose. What are you guys going to do with the damaged, prone Vulcan with a magnificent hole in it? Edit: Update on previous page. Worst 1st page post ever.
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Jan 27, 2011 08:36
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It's all in the "what might have been" category now, so it doesn't harm anything to point out. Did you notice that if you'd have moved to 1110 and 1209 you'd have been in complete defilade from Jenner? Whether you'd have killed both Hussar and Spider (especially with those rolls) is up to anyones guess. As things stand, you just killed half the effective firepower of enemy lance. Can't argue with results, I guess.
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Jan 27, 2011 08:36
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Strategy wise! I don't know much about BattleTech, so sorry is this unsound for some reason, but it looks like CD can move one hex back to get get cover from that Spider, and have a clean shot to fry the back of the enemy Hussar with his weapons. Meanwhile it looks like that Spider is standing at the peak of a tall hill, which should give everyone else LOS to pick him apart with any long range weapons they have?
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Jan 27, 2011 08:48
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Hob_Gadling posted:It's all in the "what might have been" category now, so it doesn't harm anything to point out. Did you notice that if you'd have moved to 1110 and 1209 you'd have been in complete defilade from Jenner? Whether you'd have killed both Hussar and Spider (especially with those rolls) is up to anyones guess. I hinted at this in my strategy suggestion for last turn. There were moves available last turn that would have let all the mechs, besides the griffin of course, shoot at the hussar/spider without any ability for the jenner to shoot back. Almost certainly destroying/crippling one of the two without relying on through-armor ammo explosions and exposing onself to nasty returnfire. After the battle is over it might be worthwhile to do some "replay analysis" to help couch the newer pilots (Pladdicus and Cthulhu Dreams)? Gothsheep posted:Strategy wise! I'm not sure what you mean? The spider is no problem anyway, what you want to worry about is the 8 damage large laser the hussar has. Longinus00 fucked around with this message at 08:53 on Jan 27, 2011 |
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Jan 27, 2011 08:49
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All told, though, this is a pretty solid result. The enemy is down their highest-firepower mech after the Dragon, our Vulcan is hurt but certainly not out of the fight, and everyone else is absolutely fine. We have the Dracs at half firepower, with better positioning and better long-range firepower in the form of our Griffin. I vote next turn we keep up the pace. Let's teach these Kurita dupes what happens when you toss fresh meat to Morgan Kell's dogs.
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Jan 27, 2011 08:54
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Agent Interrobang posted:All told, though, this is a pretty solid result. The enemy is down their highest-firepower mech after the Dragon, our Vulcan is hurt but certainly not out of the fight, and everyone else is absolutely fine. We have the Dracs at half firepower, with better positioning and better long-range firepower in the form of our Griffin. A question. Doesn't the Vulcan's lack of armor make it so that it is now supremely vulnerable to critical hits from, say, SRMs? Edit: Answered. Thanks. Artificer fucked around with this message at 09:46 on Jan 27, 2011 |
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Jan 27, 2011 08:57
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Longinus00 posted:
Yeah, but why expose yourself to fire when you don't need to?
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Jan 27, 2011 08:57
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Gothsheep posted:Yeah, but why expose yourself to fire when you don't need to? I don't see how mech D can move one step and get cover from anything. The spider is on a hill so can "see over" the treetops and therefore they don't block vision. My point was that he should try to stay out of the line of fire of the hussar as the spider's weapons are more survivable with his low armor spread. VVV Higher position negates partial cover. You're also confusing your facings. Please see http://www.classicbattletech.com/downloads/CBT_Introductory_Rulebook.pdf Longinus00 fucked around with this message at 09:10 on Jan 27, 2011 |
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Jan 27, 2011 09:02
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Longinus00 posted:I don't see how mech D can move one step and get cover from anything. The spider is on a hill so can "see over" the treetops and therefore they don't block vision. Neither would put him in range of the Hussar's weapons, but isn't that a hill right next to 0810 which would provide at least partial cover, while still keeping him aimed firmly at the Hussar's rear armor?
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Jan 27, 2011 09:07
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I really don't see a problem here. The Dragon isn't going to do anything but trade long range shots with the Griffin, and the Vulcan can stand back up and get back into the fight. As long as the lights gang up on a target at a time they should be fine.
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Jan 27, 2011 09:09
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Artificer posted:A question. Doesn't the Vulcan's lack of armor make it so that it is now supremely vulnerable to critical hits from, say, SRMs? Any weapon that gets through armor automatically gets a chance to cause a critical hit. So long as the vulcan keeps his backside away from weapons it should be fine. wiegieman posted:I really don't see a problem here. The Dragon isn't going to do anything but trade long range shots with the Griffin, and the Vulcan can stand back up and get back into the fight. As long as the lights gang up on a target at a time they should be fine. The results of last turn were perfectly fine really. The vulcan didn't really take that much damage and so long as he can stand up without taking more damage the loss of two lasers isn't super terrible (he can alpha with no heat issues now!). I hope someone notices the big reveal from last turn soon.
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Jan 27, 2011 09:22
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Artificer posted:A question. Doesn't the Vulcan's lack of armor make it so that it is now supremely vulnerable to critical hits from, say, SRMs? The Vulcan should definitely fall back somewhat once Pladdicus stands it back up, but it can still keep shooting back with the medium lasers it has remaining. Right now the Dracs have bigger worries than a seemingly crippled anti-infantry mech: with that Jenner gone we have them significantly outclassed in terms of firepower. More than that, it is further hampered since the Dragon pilot is honor-bound not to go after anyone but the Griffin, thus leaving the enemy lights even more vulnerable.
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Jan 27, 2011 09:24
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[You know what? I'm tired of this tactical analysis. I'm running an infomercial on you bitches.] "Oh, hi! I didn't see you there. Hey, while you're here, you might want to stick around for today's iteration of..." BATTLEMECHS SURE ARE AWESOME, brought to you by Defiance Industries. Defiance Industries: The Biggest. The Baddest. Today's episode: GRF-1* Griffin  Now, I couldn't help but notice you were admiring that Griffin the Kell Hounds are running around in. Sure is a nice machine, isn't it? That's the craftsmanship you only get from Defiance Industries of Hesperus II. Did you know that the Archons of House Steiner are such fans of the design, they have two of them IN their throne room? You'd never see some second-rate slapdash pile of junk built by a Marik firm in ANYONE'S throne room, that's for sure. The Griffin dates back to 2492, before the Star League was established. Because the technology was so new, the original primitive Griffins were Assault designs, before new, lighter-weight equipment allowed them to be scaled down in pre-production to Heavy and finally the modern Medium-weight Griffins we've seen on the battlefield for about 500 years. As a fire-support design, the standard GRF-1N Griffin is armed with a Fusigon PPC, shearing off nearly two-thirds of a ton of armor with each hit at ranges of up to 540 meters. To exploit the holes made by this formidable weapon is a LRM-10 launcher (TharHes Reacher-10 if you're lucky enough to be driving a Lyran machine, likely the inferior Delta Dart otherwise), with ammunition for two minutes of continual fire. Added to this is it's maneuverability, with a top land speed of 86.4 km/h and the ability to jump 150 meters on its top-of-the-line Rawlings 55 jump jets, allowing it to keep pace with many lighter designs and stay at range from heavier designs, though its nine and a half tons of armor is certainly sufficient to hold up to punishment in a pinch. We at Defiance Industries are proud at how the design has endured over five centuries, but we never quit working for you, the MechWarrior. Our team of researchers and test pilots poured over battlefield reports on Griffins, looking for ways to improve the design. Despite its solid performance, we analyzed it and concluded that it had an exploitable weakness at short range. Keeping this in mind, we designed the GRF-1S, the perfect surprise for anyone who thinks your fire lance should be easy pickings. We downscaled the LRM launcher to a five-missile rack, and replaced the PPC with a Defiance Industries B3L Large Laser and a pair of B3M Mediums, allowing you to bring maximum firepower to bear even at point blank range. In addition, four additional heat sinks were added, allowing you to put additional shots downfield with nary a care of overheating. Remember, when you buy a Griffin from Defiance Industries, you're buying a Griffin you know you can trust, because unlike those other firms, we can actually figure out how they work and change the parts inside. Unfortunately, I think that's all the time we have for today. We've gotta get back to work here; we may know a lot about Griffins, but we still don't know how to make a -1N OR a -1S build itself!  Defiance Industries: So Hard, People Are Scared of Us.
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Jan 27, 2011 10:54
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@Longinus: Yeah, I really blew it on that Spider Mech. That was insanely bad. I had a realistic chance of getting critical with that salvo and.. nothing Sixes everywhere, like a plague.  So team, what should I do? I'm keen not to fire too much to let some heat dissipate, so should I run past the Hussar, into say 0815, and fire 1 medium laser and 1 SRM at it?
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Jan 27, 2011 11:28
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Defiance Industries posted:[You know what? I'm tired of this tactical analysis. I'm running an infomercial on you bitches.] I haven't had a good chuckle through all my webcomics today, but that made me chuckle. For an encore, how about some House Liao propaganda?
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Jan 27, 2011 11:29
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A while back, when you guys were trying to figure out what the unknown Light was, a few people were saying that things wouldn't be too bad as long as it didn't turn out to be a Puma. I ended up trying out one in MW4:Mercs now and man -- I see why people were so terrified of it. Normally I'd rush to Mediums or Heavy as fast as I could, but I've knocked out two planets with this thing. It's so fast and carries such heavy weapons in the default that I've been wrecking mediums and heavies without much problem. If Griffin is in it I'll have to give that a spin. I know jack all about the lore, and following this is getting me to try some different mechs. And things besides Assaults. -- Is it possible to gain some semblance of cover while beginning to push on towards the Dragon?
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Jan 27, 2011 11:37
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hcenvirons posted:A while back, when you guys were trying to figure out what the unknown Light was, a few people were saying that things wouldn't be too bad as long as it didn't turn out to be a Puma. I'm pretty sure the Puma is a clan design.
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Jan 27, 2011 11:38
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Defiance Industries posted:
I like the part that goes unspoken here: "Yeah, we cut the weight in half in a couple of generations, and since then we haven't done a loving thing to advance 'mech-building technology. Huzzah for the Succession Wars!"
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Jan 27, 2011 11:48
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Notgothic posted:I like the part that goes unspoken here: "Yeah, we cut the weight in half in a couple of generations, and since then we haven't done a loving thing to advance 'mech-building technology. Huzzah for the Succession Wars!" I don't think the Griffin was ever an Assault as we know it, I think it was more a case that weight it always has been was once considered an Assault because that was the heaviest they could build, then they could build heavier and the Griffin was reclassified as a Heavy and finally they walked the Atlas off the assembly line and the Griffin was thenceforth a Medium.
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Jan 27, 2011 12:09
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You know i should have stayed up another hour like i thought i should have... We got the jenner, now just to get the hussar first, and then the spider The spider is a variant with 2 mgs, that means somewhere in it is sweet sweet ammo to detonate If i wasn't at work, (which oddly enough blocks waffleimages) I would have done a map and all that... oh well, time to wait till after i get home. That Vulcan took a Large Laser to the back and survived so something to be said about that, and at only the loss of 2 medium lasers? I would say we are doing well so far!
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Jan 27, 2011 12:25
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ShadowDragon8685 posted:I haven't had a good chuckle through all my webcomics today, but that made me chuckle. I was thinking next time, something on the Jenner or Panther. Gonna see a lot of those. "Panther: not using one disgraces your whole family, relegating them to the Unproductives and forcing your wife to prostitute herself to support your children." Also re: weight, Primitive level components weigh a shitton more than level 1 stuff. But yeah, spin. Keep in mind that in 3025 DefHes was a super advanced company because not only did they use fiber optics in some of their systems, they were able to design new variants of mechs they built, like the Banshee. Most facilities, they just kept the automated plant running as best they could. Defiance Industries fucked around with this message at 13:30 on Jan 27, 2011 |
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Jan 27, 2011 13:18
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Axe-man posted:You know i should have stayed up another hour like i thought i should have... 'Cause that would be hilarious.
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Jan 27, 2011 13:29
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paragon1 posted:Hey, do you think the enemy commander will commit seppuku if you kill all his troops? I almost guarantee it.
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Jan 27, 2011 13:30
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Wow, I clearly went to sleep too early.  One thing I didn't see in all the post-turn chatter... that Hussar might be preparing to get the gently caress out of dodge, guys, to be sure at least one mech reports back to the Combine with our strength and position.
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Jan 27, 2011 13:39
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 We had more ammo explosions in these couple of turns, than I have seen in twenty games together in the past when I was still playing.
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Jan 27, 2011 14:05
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That was a drat lucky turn. It could have gone wrong in a LOT of worse ways. But it didn't, and that's great. Tactical observations: - The Vulcan is actually not as vulnerable as it seems. Yes, it's got a hole in the back. However, it has 6 internal left there, and so is relatively safe - the torso won't go out unless the Hussar pegs it in the same place again, and the odds are relatively low, nil if you can keep facing it. Criticals are also of little note, since all that's left in that location is a medium laser and two jump jets. Things that are nice to have, but their loss won't cripple the mech. - The Jenner is basically worthless this turn due to heat, so it should concentrate on evasion. It doesn't help that he's kinda exposed right now. - Target priority should be the Hussar. It's got the least armor and the most firepower. It's gonna be tough though, you don't have it in a good kill position. - Watch the Spider, it's very likely to concentrate on flanking the Vulcan now, so keep that in mind and possibly use the Blackjack to keep cover.
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Jan 27, 2011 14:40
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Mukaikubo posted:Wow, I clearly went to sleep too early. Imho, it's going to be the spider that is going to run, but yeah. Possible orders - I could either run past the Hussar to 0815 (can he shoot me there?), or a better plan might be to jump set into the water. I could reach 1211, which would probably let me dump all my heat, then be prepared for a counter attack or volley fire from the water as the Hussar likes standing on hills. Edit: Wow, that guy is a crack sniper. He's got a turret, so that won't work. Jumping into the water is looking better and better. Cthulhu Dreams fucked around with this message at 15:04 on Jan 27, 2011 |
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Jan 27, 2011 14:45
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Longinus00 posted:I hope someone notices the big reveal from last turn soon. I don't see what's a big deal. I mean, there's just... PoptartsNinja posted:K1 Hussar  Kill the Hussar Kill the Hussar
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Jan 27, 2011 14:47
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Base gunnery 2? Wow, we've got a real sniper there. 
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Jan 27, 2011 14:55
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Man, I wish I had attended this thread earlier. That said, I'd like to buck the trend and sneak in as an administrative or intel idiot; I might well explode, but dammit, it won't be because I decided it would be funny to pilot a light mech.
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Jan 27, 2011 15:19
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Cthulhu Dreams posted:
Mechs don't have turrets. Even if it looks like one, mechanically they do not. He can still torso-twist, but no mech has a turret without going into really unusual and obscure optional rules.
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Jan 27, 2011 15:26
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My orders as they stand: Movement Orders Orders: Jenner Mech D - Jumps: * Jump from 0711 to 0716 (Distance 5) * Facing at landing 0715 (North) * Point Torso at Hussar. Fires: Branching request here: If and only if the Hussar shows me its back -> 4 x Medium Laser at Hussar (K1) + 1 x SRM at Hussar (K1) Otherwise: 1 x SRM at Hussar (K1) Commanders intent: I think the Hussar cannot attack me here, the turret can apparently only fire forwards, and he can only kick there, so I am going to chill out behind him.
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Jan 27, 2011 15:43
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Tempest_56 posted:Mechs don't have turrets. Even if it looks like one, mechanically they do not. He can still torso-twist, but no mech has a turret without going into really unusual and obscure optional rules. That explains the lack of quadrupedal mechs, then.
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Jan 27, 2011 15:45
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Cythereal posted:That explains the lack of quadrupedal mechs, then. There actually are quad mechs, but they're rare. Quads have some advantages (a bonus to piloting rolls and the ability to side-step), but are pretty uncommon and have their own disadvantages (four legs, reduced crit space, looking silly).
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Jan 27, 2011 15:51
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Cthulhu Dreams posted:Just a reminder... the mechs have already moved, you lucky ducks able to see and plan where i have to you know stay gainfully employed and stuff 
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Jan 27, 2011 15:51
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Tempest_56 posted:There actually are quad mechs, but they're rare. Quads have some advantages (a bonus to piloting rolls and the ability to side-step), but are pretty uncommon and have their own disadvantages (four legs, reduced crit space, looking silly). Yeah, I know quad mechs are rare. I meant that lacking turrets is a good reason why there aren't many - turrets would be a distinct advantage for quad mechs over most bipeds.
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Jan 27, 2011 15:53
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How did that hit do four crits? Doesn't a 11 do three crits, and a 12 blow the section off?Axe-man posted:It's all a trade off the RAC is all new tech through, mech4:merc is where most of my experience with RACs come from and they do AC damage terribly there :-/ elitebuster posted:This is going to be the reason the Kell Hounds get a reputation in this timeline isn't it. Longinus00 posted:
Arglebargle III posted:... the bridge to the last dropship was plum blown away by the artillery barrage. Karl and Reinhardt knew they were gonna have to jump the General Kerensky across the river... Defiance Industries posted:Now, I couldn't help but notice you were admiring that Griffin the Kell Hounds are running around in. Sure is a nice machine, isn't it? That's the craftsmanship you only get from Defiance Industries of Hesperus II. Did you know that the Archons of House Steiner are such fans of the design, they have two of them IN their throne room? You'd never see some second-rate slapdash pile of junk built by a Marik firm in ANYONE'S throne room, that's for sure. ShadowDragon8685 posted:I don't think the Griffin was ever an Assault as we know it, I think it was more a case that weight it always has been was once considered an Assault because that was the heaviest they could build, then they could build heavier and the Griffin was reclassified as a Heavy and finally they walked the Atlas off the assembly line and the Griffin was thenceforth a Medium.
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Jan 27, 2011 16:07
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Axe-man posted:Just a reminder... the mechs have already moved, you lucky ducks able to see and plan where i have to you know stay gainfully employed and stuff Yeah, but our esteemed host pointed out to me last time (when I tried to get the spider in the back) that the torso rotation happens in the shooting phase, so it's possible the hussar could turn his back plates away from me.
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Jan 27, 2011 16:19
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Arquinsiel posted:Yup, except the first ever mech was a 100 ton Mackie.... the fluff makes no sense. Well, the Mackie may have been an assault by weight but it certainly wasn't much to fight in. Here, let's timeline mech development! 2439 - The MSK-6S Mackie is developed by the Terran Hegemony and is the first mech ever created. 2455 - Agents of the Lyran Commonwealth steal the Mackie's plans, causing the technology to spread. 2459 - Prototype of the Battleaxe is fielded, which eventually will evolve into the Warhammer. 2460 - Development of the Helepolis. 2466 - The Commando is designed. 2471 - First appearance of the Wasp, the first mech to ever use jump jets. 2474 - Production begins of the Archer. 2475 - Appearance of the Hammerhands, successor to the Battleaxe and predecessor of the Warhammer. 2479 - The Stinger is developed. 2481 - Genesis of the Toro. 2490 - Appearance of the Gladiator. 2491 - The Thunderbolt begins production. 2492 - Finally, the Griffin shows up. Keep in mind that most of those mechs didn't exist when the original Griffin fluff was written - only the Commando, Wasp, Stinger, Archer and Thunderbolt did.
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Jan 27, 2011 16:28
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Cthulhu Dreams posted:Yeah, but our esteemed host pointed out to me last time (when I tried to get the spider in the back) that the torso rotation happens in the shooting phase, so it's possible the hussar could turn his back plates away from me. Unless I'm completely wrong, torso rotation only affects your own shooting arcs and has no effect on incoming fire. So yeah, if you're behind him, you're going to nail him in the rear armor. Some problems: The Hussar is K1 and your jump ends 4 hexes away, meaning all your shots would be mid range. Add the Hussars movement and the forest cover and you're unlikely to do much from there. Additionally, firing an alpha-strike after maximum jump in this round would leave you with 17 heat. Thatmeans that there's a chance of your Mech going into auto-shutdown. You'll also lose two more MP and take a huge hit to gunnery, rendering you de facto useless in the next round. And even if you're standing perfectly still next round, you won't be able to shed enough heat to get rid of all penalties. Magni fucked around with this message at 17:20 on Jan 27, 2011 |
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Jan 27, 2011 17:17
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