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Has anyone mentioned ECN's Violation Photo Forum? It's got a ton of really great examples of things not to do. Ever.
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Jan 23, 2011 14:40
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I've been selling a lot more of the Fluke 28IIs over the 87Vs since they introduced them. If you need a DC voltage detector what about this one?
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Jan 23, 2011 20:08
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What does a True RMS meter do for me? My meter is an old Simpson True RMS DMM. I've taken a circuits class and a signals class, so I have a pretty good idea of what RMS means. I guess what I really would want to know is what the "false" RMS meters are doing.
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Jan 23, 2011 21:07
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Three-Phase posted:Has anyone mentioned ECN's Violation Photo Forum? It's got a ton of really great examples of things not to do. Ever. I did, way the hell back on page 8. kid sinister posted:I can't remember the site, but there is some forum for inspectors on the interwebs that was just full of pictures of awful wiring jobs just like these. My favorite one was somebody finished their basement and built a shower with the fuse box in it. Does anybody know the site I'm talking about?
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Jan 23, 2011 21:21
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It was worth a re-mention. I got caught browsing it for almost an hour today. Endless supply of incredible photos. As for that shower...ppllleeease tell me it was drywalled over and they found these during renovation. I mean..I can't see why someone would be dumb enough to dry over such fuse panels, but that conflicts with how much I can't see why someone would be dumb enough to install them IN AN EFFING SHOWER.
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Jan 23, 2011 22:49
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Guy Axlerod posted:What does a True RMS meter do for me? My meter is an old Simpson True RMS DMM. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_F3x5rAJpE Basically they calculate it in a different way, the true rms is generally more reliable when you don't have a sine wave.
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Jan 24, 2011 00:38
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Nemico posted:I've been selling a lot more of the Fluke 28IIs over the 87Vs since they introduced them. Nah, I was meaning a non-contact sensor that could detect DC. Where I work, we have large circuit breakers, a little smaller than a washing machine (typically 2400V or 7200V at 1000A or so, depending on the breaker type and size). Inside the breaker compartment, all the controls like the trip/close coils are run off of 125VDC, +62.5 to ground and -62.5. Then all your protective relays and metering (SEL and GE Multilin) also run off 125VDC. tworavens posted:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_F3x5rAJpE Good video. I was doing some measuring at work on this. I've seen UPS units that put out lovely sinewaves with 3% THD, and then I've seen some ugly bastard systems that put out butt-ugly waveforms. Harmonics suck. One thing it looks like he missed was systems that USE SCRs. Those act as a controlled diode, like a one-way gate you can "fire" and it lets a section of the sinewave through. If you have a dimmer switch at home, it most likely uses two SCRs. It's simple and efficient, but due to the very rapid dv/dt, it also creates a ton of harmonics and radio noise. Three-Phase fucked around with this message at 01:09 on Jan 24, 2011 |
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Jan 24, 2011 00:59
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chedemefedeme posted:It was worth a re-mention. I got caught browsing it for almost an hour today. Endless supply of incredible photos. Nope! Look at the layering. The shower stall is on top of the fusebox. It was always there, the shower was added later. Probably a DIY attempt at finishing their basement. Someone installed a shower stall directly in front of their panel on purpose.
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Jan 24, 2011 06:26
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House lighting question - In the horrible concrete house I'm renovating I spent a weekend moving all the upstairs lights to sensible positions (i.e. not 2' from the corner of a 13' square room). Spending all that time in the attic I realised I need to fit a permanent light - can I 'spur' off the upstairs lighting ring or do I need to put this new light into the current lighting ring?
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Jan 24, 2011 14:02
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kid sinister posted:Nope! Look at the layering. The shower stall is on top of the fusebox. It was always there, the shower was added later. Probably a DIY attempt at finishing their basement. Someone installed a shower stall directly in front of their panel on purpose. My first thought was the "Postcards from the Field" section of ASHI reporter. (https://www.ashireporter.org) It's a trade magazine for home inspectors, and each issue has a section where they publish sent-in pictures of crazy poo poo like this.
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Jan 24, 2011 16:36
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Went outside to take the trash out this morning and heard a loud buzzing coming from the breaker box, and when I opened it there were sparks coming from one of the breakers. Turned off the main power and replaced the breaker that was sparking, and found a hole melted into the side of it:  (crappy picture, sorry) Everything seems to be fine with the new breaker in, so is this anything I need to worry about? What would cause something like this? Should I have an electrician check it out just to be safe?
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Jan 24, 2011 22:07
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Cakefool posted:House lighting question - In the horrible concrete house I'm renovating I spent a weekend moving all the upstairs lights to sensible positions (i.e. not 2' from the corner of a 13' square room). Spending all that time in the attic I realised I need to fit a permanent light - can I 'spur' off the upstairs lighting ring or do I need to put this new light into the current lighting ring? It depends how much else is on that circuit (yyou don't want to overload it), but the easy answer is yes, you can tap off another lighting circuit. Use the maximum size bulb allowed for each fixture in your calcs.
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Jan 24, 2011 23:22
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a handful of dust posted:Went outside to take the trash out this morning and heard a loud buzzing coming from the breaker box, and when I opened it there were sparks coming from one of the breakers. How much load was on that breaker, has it tripped in the past?
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Jan 24, 2011 23:27
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Speaking of burning your house down i had a neighbor have the following email dialog with me. Neighbor: On Sunday night we had something happen in our house. We heard an very loud pop and started looking. The kids computer, I think is fried. We noticed that the Fridge was off the phone charge was not working so David started testing the plugs. He found out that we had 220 running though the plugs in the Kitchen and in the dinning room. We had a electrician out yesterday and he could not find anything but the plugs were reading 110 again. We plugged a light in to see if it would blow. The electrician is coming out to replace all the plugs in those areas today. Me: Wow! That's an extremely dangerous problem to have. Thats amazing. I wouldn't let the electrician stop until they find it. I'm really hardpressed to think of a situation in which this could even happen in theory. Is he sure it was reading 220? Neighbor: Yes I am sure 220. He has checked the breakers and tightened everything up. He said this is common and most of the time you never figure out where the problem is. You just start replacing stuff and tightening things up and you fix the problem. Scared the ___ out of me when we smelled burning wires and could not find the problem. Me: I'll forward the description to some licensed electricians I know. I'm a bit wary your electrician just thinks this is normal. Her electrician has decent reason to believe an ordinary 110v circuit in a home can just randomly have the neutral go hot and its "common" and you "sometimes never figure out where the problem is""??!! I was pretty tempted to call this guy a dangerous idiot but wanted your input first. Im also really curious how this can "commonly" happen...or happen at all.
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Jan 26, 2011 06:02
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I.m amazed her electrician is still alive. Also, replacing sockets when he acknowledges he has no idea what's wrong is an obvious money gouge.
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Jan 26, 2011 09:46
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Check the integrity of the neutral to ground. If the neutral is improperly bonded, or the ground bond is floating, neutral is left to float, and a line-neutral fault will put 110V through the neutral, causing half your house to go dark and the other half to explode.
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Jan 26, 2011 13:26
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What should my official neighborly advice to her be? I'm honestly just afraid this home is going to burn down if the electrician has no idea where this problem originated and thus made no appropriate repairs. Should I let them borrow my socket tester to read all their neutral and ground and polarity of the outlets? Should they consult a different, more competent electrician entirely?
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Jan 26, 2011 16:22
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chedemefedeme posted:What should my official neighborly advice to her be? I'm honestly just afraid this home is going to burn down if the electrician has no idea where this problem originated and thus made no appropriate repairs. It's probably a loose neutral in a junction box somewhere, unless it's the entire house that has the problem. If it's just one set of outlets and the house is more than 10 years old (roughly), then someone probably didn't pigtail a neutral to an outlet or light on a multiwire circuit. You used to be able to send a 12/3 from the panel and feed two circuits worth of stuff from one cable. You just had to make sure the continuity of the neutral didn't depend on a device, so if an outlet fried, it wouldn't suddenly float the neutral and fry everything on both circuits. Now, pretty much every circuit everywhere requires its own neutral, so that's not so much of an issue. My wife's parents' house had the neutral connection fail at the transformer, so they had 30-50V on all their lights, and 200ish volts on all their appliances. Bad load balance, sure, but the TV still caught fire.
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Jan 26, 2011 21:16
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chedemefedeme posted:What should my official neighborly advice to her be? I'm honestly just afraid this home is going to burn down if the electrician has no idea where this problem originated and thus made no appropriate repairs. Tell her to get a second opinion, ideally someone you already trust.
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Jan 27, 2011 13:53
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Quick question - think I've found what's wrong with my washer dryer: But how do I confirm this? The coil isn't open circuit and I don't know what the original resistance was to compare. edit: A - Holy poo poo didn't realise how big that was B - Not worth fixing, the whole heater box needs replacing, the fan seized so the heater cooked itself, the wiring is toast & the 'stat has split open. cakesmith handyman fucked around with this message at 23:12 on Jan 27, 2011 |
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Jan 27, 2011 21:54
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I recently moved into a new house and while I've been able to deal with most things, I have two issues that I need help with. 1-I've got two light switches that I cannot find what they control. I've checked every outlet and I have no lights that aren't turning on. One is in a double switch box. The other switch controls a ceiling mounted light. The switch has power going to it, measured it with a meter, I just can't track down what it controls. The other switch is outside of a shared bathroom (Jack and Jill style) in the master bedroom. I've tested all the outlets in the bedroom and none are being controlled by the switch. The switch does have power to it, tested again with a meter. In the bathroom there is a non-functioning exhaust fan. I've checked the power socket that is built into the fan and was getting a power reading, but only 3 volts. I'm planning on replacing the fan within the next few days. So how do I chase down what these switches actually do. I was going to buy a circuit tester (http://www.homedepot.com/Electrical...catalogId=10053) but I didn't want to waste my time trying to get that to work since it appears to be primarily used for breakers. I can borrow a fox and hound set from work, and try and trace the wires with the power off from the panel. Is there something I'm missing that would be easier? 2- The second issue is I have a staircase with two ceiling mounted lights. The lights are controlled by two 3-way switches. What I would like to do is swap one of the lights with a ceiling fan. Both lights would be controlled by the switches and the fan would be turned on and off via the pull chain. Can I use the existing hardware I have, or will I need to buy different switches? Do I need to pull new cable?
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Jan 30, 2011 09:47
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The plate with two switches and one controls a light is almost certainly a location where they pre-wired the light location for a ceiling fan; there's just one additional hot line going up to the fixture so you could wire in the one extra line required to switch a fan separately. All the bedrooms in my house were done this way by the builder and it made it a piece of cake to later add fans with switch control over both light and fan. As for the one on its own...it seems like the dead fan would be the thing it goes to? Can you step up into the attic and trace the wires where they come up from the wall in this location? Finally, if you're asking if you can use a multi-way switch setup with a ceiling fan without modification to the switches/wiring the answer should be yes so long as you're OK using a pull chain for turning the fan and lights on and off separately. No need for new wiring. The concern about putting a fan where there is currently only a light fixture is whether or not the ceiling box the light is mounted to has the ability to handle the weight of the fan. You must have a lot more support behind a box (typically a metal cross brace allowing the box to get strength from two nearby ceiling beams) to hold up a fan. chedemefedeme fucked around with this message at 20:34 on Jan 30, 2011 |
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Jan 30, 2011 20:32
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chedemefedeme posted:The plate with two switches and one controls a light is almost certainly a location where they pre-wired the light location for a ceiling fan; there's just one additional hot line going up to the fixture so you could wire in the one extra line required to switch a fan separately. All the bedrooms in my house were done this way by the builder and it made it a piece of cake to later add fans with switch control over both light and fan. This is probably the case, diremonk. It's easy to check too. Take the faceplate off the switches and look inside. The incoming hot should be connected to both switches. Connected to the other poles of those switches should be one black wire and one red wire. I'm willing to bet that your dead exhaust fan still works and it's your switch that's broke. Jack and Jill bathrooms are pretty old-fashioned, old enough for switches to start failing. Try turning off the circuit and swapping it to the other switch. chedemefedeme posted:Finally, if you're asking if you can use a multi-way switch setup with a ceiling fan without modification to the switches/wiring the answer should be yes so long as you're OK using a pull chain for turning the fan and lights on and off separately. No need for new wiring. Not necessarily, it might be possible to wire up his fan like he intended, with the fan always hot and the lights switched. There are lots of ways to wire 3 way switch circuits, it depends on which box the hot originates for that circuit. Look at these diagrams. If his circuit was originally wired in Option 4 (with the second fixture daisy chained off the first), Option 6, or 8, and that box he wants that fan at has the entering hot, then he will have an always-hot in the box to pigtail off of for the fan. If he has Option 6, then he even have an always-hot pigtail in the second box. Granted, most electricians don't do it this way because the more complicated diagrams make their heads spin, not to mention several of those options aren't code as of the NEC 2011 saying neutrals must always accompany hots to boxes and can't be repurposed anymore.
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Jan 31, 2011 01:22
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chedemefedeme posted:Neighbor: Holy crap! An electrician said that it would be normal to have 220V at some 120V outlets? You don't simply tighten things at random to find where a problem is occurring; You work your way through a circuit until you pinpoint what's causing the problem. I agree that this sounds like the neutral circuit is broken. I would say that this might be a dangerous "electrician" that isn't trained or bonded (carrying insurance).
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Jan 31, 2011 01:43
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chedemefedeme posted:The concern about putting a fan where there is currently only a light fixture is whether or not the ceiling box the light is mounted to has the ability to handle the weight of the fan. You must have a lot more support behind a box (typically a metal cross brace allowing the box to get strength from two nearby ceiling beams) to hold up a fan. I think I might be ok on the support for a ceiling fan. The location where I would like it to be is vaulted with the studs on the other side of wooden ceiling panels. At least I think they are, haven't gotten up on a ladder to check yet. kid sinister posted:Not necessarily, it might be possible to wire up his fan like he intended, with the fan always hot and the lights switched. There are lots of ways to wire 3 way switch circuits, it depends on which box the hot originates for that circuit. Look at these diagrams. If his circuit was originally wired in Option 4 (with the second fixture daisy chained off the first), Option 6, or 8, and that box he wants that fan at has the entering hot, then he will have an always-hot in the box to pigtail off of for the fan. If he has Option 6, then he even have an always-hot pigtail in the second box. Granted, most electricians don't do it this way because the more complicated diagrams make their heads spin, not to mention several of those options aren't code as of the NEC 2011 saying neutrals must always accompany hots to boxes and can't be re-purposed anymore. But with this information, I'm thinking that putting a ceiling fan up there might not be feasible or possible. I'd like to keep everything within code. I'll probably replace it with another light and get rid of the dated/ugly thing that is there now. quote:This is probably the case, diremonk. It's easy to check too. Take the faceplate off the switches and look inside. The incoming hot should be connected to both switches. Connected to the other poles of those switches should be one black wire and one red wire. I bought a wire tracker yesterday and traced the wiring. Looks like both the switches that I've been wondering about are three-way. Which if I had actually looked at the toggles with missing on/off labels might have saved me some time. Looks like the double gang one goes to the overhead kitchen lights which is nice. This might be a dumb question, but can one 3-way switch fail and the other still work? Since I'm replacing one switch, should I replace both switches or should I wait until the other fails? The other one outside the Jack and Jill bath controls both the exhaust fan and a overhead light.I'm going to replace the light and fan with a combo unit and rip out the old fan next month when I run some cat-6 in the attic. Probably going to put in a ceiling mounted speaker where the old fan was as a start to a whole house audio system. On a different note, for a condo this place has a lot of three-way switches. I've got two on the bottom floor, one for the staircase, and another outside of the upstairs bath. And while tracing the circuits yesterday, I finally opened up several blank face plates. Each plate has two runs of what looks like either speaker wire or low voltage wire. I checked it with a meter and they have no power. The two runs from my office end downstairs in the living room which has four runs total. The other two wires lead up to the master bedroom. I'm thinking about re-purposing the wire for my planned speaker system, but it seems odd that this wire was just wadded up and shoved into the wall cavity. Least I know now that I won't have to do much when I do my cat-6 runs later on, I can just use the existing holes in the studs. One more thing of strangeness is I had four alarm looking things mounted in various places. I took one down and it is a wind-up heat detector. Are these still required by code? California code at least? I have several smoke detectors already and this just seems like overkill. diremonk fucked around with this message at 13:28 on Jan 31, 2011 |
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Jan 31, 2011 13:20
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Subpanel question. Right now my house has a 200a main service with a 60a breaker feeding a subpanel with 4x20a breakers, and a 40a breaker for the dryer but no main breaker. Ive got a spare 100a panel that i wanted to use to replace the smaller panel with the 5 circuits. Do I need to simply take out the 100a and replace it with a 60a breaker. And how does floating the neutral work, do i simply get spacers for the neutral bar so it goes off the neutral/ground at the main?
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Feb 1, 2011 03:29
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Error 404 NpH posted:Subpanel question. Right now my house has a 200a main service with a 60a breaker feeding a subpanel with 4x20a breakers, and a 40a breaker for the dryer but no main breaker. Ive got a spare 100a panel that i wanted to use to replace the smaller panel with the 5 circuits. Do I need to simply take out the 100a and replace it with a 60a breaker. And how does floating the neutral work, do i simply get spacers for the neutral bar so it goes off the neutral/ground at the main? So you have a 100A panel lying around, and you want to use it as a 60A subpanel with main? Check with the manufacturer to make sure you can swap out the main breaker; some panels aren't listed with anything other than what they have installed. I don't understand "floating the neutral." You should be running (or have) two hots, a neutral, and a ground at your subpanel. These will connect directly to the normal places in the 100A. You do not install the bonding screw to bond the neutral to the ground in a subpanel. Also, I've got a big book of lighting design behind me which breaks down all the cost/benefit/disadvantage stuff in regards to incandescent, fluorescent, HID, and LED lighting. I may pull it out and divulge some of their wisdom if more people have these kinds of questions.
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Feb 1, 2011 07:17
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Error 404 NpH posted:Subpanel question. Right now my house has a 200a main service with a 60a breaker feeding a subpanel with 4x20a breakers, and a 40a breaker for the dryer but no main breaker. Ive got a spare 100a panel that i wanted to use to replace the smaller panel with the 5 circuits. Do I need to simply take out the 100a and replace it with a 60a breaker. And how does floating the neutral work, do i simply get spacers for the neutral bar so it goes off the neutral/ground at the main? And yes, the neutral bar must be isolated from ground in a sub-panel by means of an insulator. The neutral must be bonded once, and only once, in the system, typically at the main panel (though generator switch and other places are possible); multiple bonds put neutral current on the ground wire, and that's a bad thing. grover fucked around with this message at 11:40 on Feb 1, 2011 |
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Feb 1, 2011 11:37
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quote:Also, I've got a big book of lighting design behind me which breaks down all the cost/benefit/disadvantage stuff in regards to incandescent, fluorescent, HID, and LED lighting. I may pull it out and divulge some of their wisdom if more people have these kinds of questions. I'd be really interested in a megapost of this stuff.
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Feb 1, 2011 12:25
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Though another thread or two around here has covered this information I suppose this thread is a good place for a discussion about lightbulbs. I've been an early adopter to many lighting techs, including the new lines of LED bulbs out today, with almost half my household lights LED. I'll be glad to answer any usability questions. I'll leave the meaga lightbulb post to either an electrician or this dude an his book. Or maybe he's both? 
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Feb 1, 2011 16:16
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And I'm an electrical wholesaler so I can look up products for you guys and it'll make me look like I'm actually working for once!
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Feb 1, 2011 16:21
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Hey, quick question. (Ontario, Canada here) The electrical in my apartment is really, really bad. Like, no GFCI on the socket almost right behind the sink, a junction box (apparently 240v or something) falling out of the bathroom wall, and an exposed subpanel (I am not sure if it's for my apartment or not!) The landlord explicitly gave me the go ahead to hire a contractor/inspector/whatever under his name and money. I want to hire an inspector beforehand to have an itemized list of repairs that need to be done by the contractor, as well as having the contractor get a permit. If I try to get the inspection under my name, I'll be the one on the hook for repairs. Is there a way I can get a contractor or person of authority to do the inspection? (I'll post pictures in a minute of the stuff I'm talking about)
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Feb 1, 2011 16:30
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Well hey! I have two massive 4-bulb fluorescent ballasts in my kitchen that the wife wants me to change for recessed cans. Are there any exciting new retrofit can kits with energy efficient lights that are dimmable? Attic is above the kitchen, and I'll probably only need 4 or 6 cans. We live in a 50-year-old house that was recently updated, and I want to keep it fresh looking. I guess I'm wondering if flood cans are on their way out.
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Feb 1, 2011 16:34
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I'm thinking about partitioning off the back of my large garage into a workshop. I'm going to need some additional power back there for tools (table saw, drill press, etc.). I currently have 100A service coming in to the north wall of the garage, with a 100A serivce disconnect on the inside wall that feeds a 100A main panel on the south wall. This panel is almost full. What I'm envisioning is upgrading the service to 200A, then somehow splitting the service where the disconnect is on the north wall, with 100A to the existing panel and 100A to a new sub-panel. What's the best way to go about this?
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Feb 1, 2011 16:41
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iwannabebobdylan posted:Well hey! I have two massive 4-bulb fluorescent ballasts in my kitchen that the wife wants me to change for recessed cans. Are there any exciting new retrofit can kits with energy efficient lights that are dimmable? Attic is above the kitchen, and I'll probably only need 4 or 6 cans. We live in a 50-year-old house that was recently updated, and I want to keep it fresh looking. I guess I'm wondering if flood cans are on their way out. http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs...locStoreNum=121 These are IC retrofit dimmable fluorescent fixtures. Very important note: Not all dimmer switches work with CFL fixtures! Make sure they are CFL rated!
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Feb 1, 2011 17:10
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chedemefedeme posted:Though another thread or two around here has covered this information I suppose this thread is a good place for a discussion about lightbulbs. I've been an early adopter to many lighting techs, including the new lines of LED bulbs out today, with almost half my household lights LED. I'll be glad to answer any usability questions. I'll leave the meaga lightbulb post to either an electrician or this dude an his book. Or maybe he's both? Okay, a few generic quickies: Under what circumstances would you Not use LED bulbs? Where do you get good LED lighting and how much should people expect it to cost compared to incandescent or cfl? Third slightly more specific question: In the house I'll be moving into in the next few months I'm going to be redoing the kitchen myself - I want to put automatic lighting in the kitchen cupboards/drawers. I was thinking of putting flexible LED strips under the top of the drawers etc turned on either by reed switches or roller-microswitches, with everything fed by a central 12v transformer. Is this a reasonable idea? Have I forgotten something obvious?
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Feb 1, 2011 23:19
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Nemico posted:http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs...locStoreNum=121 Heyo badass. I'ma buy some of these. Will they be cheaper at the supply house, or should I get them from Lowe's/HD? Thanks!
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Feb 1, 2011 23:43
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I would say everything could be cheaper at a wholesaler, since their prices are flexible, but whether or not they'll actually sell it to you, especially at a good price, is not guaranteed. If you have an electrician buddy they might be nice enough to go in for you (I often sell them stuff for side jobs at a really good rate) Plus this model isn't actually in my inventory, so I can't even quote you! 
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Feb 2, 2011 00:01
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iwannabebobdylan posted:Heyo badass. I'ma buy some of these. Will they be cheaper at the supply house, or should I get them from Lowe's/HD? Thanks! You could do LED cans for around the same cost, either a Halo H7RICT or Juno IC22r with a CREE led LR6 insert. Also doing a re-wire the other day, ran across a very interesting three-way going to a garage. Was three wires running out there, one hot,one neutral, and one switch leg. Constant hot for the door opener, then the switch leg ran a three way. I could not wrap my mind around how the hell it was working till I googled it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiway_switching#Carter_system
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Feb 2, 2011 02:04
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Csixtyfour posted:You could do LED cans for around the same cost, either a Halo H7RICT or Juno IC22r with a CREE led LR6 insert. Yeah, hold your horses and do LED. http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202240932/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053 Those have gotten fantastic reviews and Cree is THE manufacturer for quality LED lighting these days. I own numerous other lights in that series and am really pleased with them. LEDs dim much smoother than CFLs and I believe work with more dimmers than CFLs do.
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Feb 2, 2011 06:30
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