Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Bad Munki
Nov 4, 2008

We're all mad here.


MarshallX posted:

Woodworkers, I challenge you:

http://woodgears.ca/eyeball/index.html


Measure twice cut once, bro




e: Damnit, a new page with that? :(

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

MarshallX
Apr 13, 2004
Oh, also I have an update on my Cherry Mantle Clock project:



It's coming along nicely. (Crappy Blackberry picture, my apologies) I'm accepting finishing suggestions, I'd like to do something different than my typical Danish Oil + Lacquer duo. Do not want to do Poly.

MarshallX fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Jan 26, 2011

GEMorris
Aug 28, 2002

Glory To the Order!
Wormil, I need to get your e-mail, I don't have plat.

Sorry for the "local content" guys, but if anyone else is in the Raleigh/Triangle area, this just popped up on craigslist and would be a smokin' deal.

http://raleigh.craigslist.org/tls/2181080849.html

Bad Munki
Nov 4, 2008

We're all mad here.


What I wouldn't do for a table that long on my jointer...

mcrandello
Mar 30, 2001

Well, the tax return is en-route right this very moment and the second it drops I'm planning on buying a new table saw. At least new to me. The ryobi plastitable is completely unfit for cutting anything other than flesh, and I'm hesitant to even list it on craigslist. Maybe I could beef it up somehow and turn it into a router table or something.

Anyway speaking of craigslist and locals I found this while looking for deals:

http://orlando.craigslist.org/tls/2178678626.html

Any ideas on what that is above the elevation knob? A hinge to pop the table open for easy access to change the blade/retrieve fingers? A skeleton-key power switch? Also were saw tops like that ever common(hint: I don't think that's rust?)

Bad Munki
Nov 4, 2008

We're all mad here.


I find it at least a little amusing that when I look at that ad, I instantly start singing in my head, "hiiiighwaaaaay toooo theeee danger zone!"

Not an Anthem
Apr 28, 2003

I'm a fucking pain machine and if you even touch my fucking car I WILL FUCKING DESTROY YOU.
You're asking about the hinge? I think the crank is on the right side of the machine and therefore the hinge is just to fold down part of the table surface, doesn't look that weird if its the case. I guess a wood top isn't that weird either because we build MDF outfeed and extension tables all the time. Is it smart? No. Would solve problem of stupid architecture people using our lab and loving up all the metal tables by leaving stuff on them that stains..

The only thing that screams "ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh" to me is the top left image it looks like the motor is hardly below the table surface or maybe above it due to the angle of the camera. That would weird me out.

On second look I'm totally wrong, the top left is the right side view and the skeleton keyhole thing is a total mystery. For some reason I thought maybe just the right side of the table drops, yknow, if you.. hell I don't know.

Dielectric
May 3, 2010
Oooh, Gil-Bilt. They were kits and plans from way back. No way would I use a power tool that some jackhole built 30 years ago in a dark basement. At least if I built it, I'd know where I cheated!

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!

GEMorris posted:

Wormil, I need to get your e-mail, I don't have plat.





MarshallX, this is after 4 glasses of Wild Turkey...

Ishamael
Feb 18, 2004

You don't have to love me, but you will respect me.

GEMorris posted:

Heh, I'm right on the Raleigh side of the Raleigh/Garner border. Don't bother checking the Garner Home Depot, the only one they have left is the display. No $40 belt sander either.

I used to work part-time at the Knightdale Lowes when I first moved to the area in 05.

That is all.

Ampersand-e
Feb 25, 2007

Cinders and ashes bitch!
Yes Im fucking cross!

Ampersand-e posted:



Well, I bit the bullet and ordered this saw from Home Depot. It's going to be a big improvement over that little Ryobi I've got.

Update:

The saw was delivered today! I am totally amazed because when I placed the order it was back ordered and I was expecting the thing to take a month to get here.

This thing is heavy! I'm going to need help lifting the saw cabinet onto the stand because I weigh about 150lbs soaking wet and I estimate that it weighs more because the shipping invoice listed the box as 280lbs.

edit:
The table isn't cast iron, I think it's 1/8" steel but I haven't measured it yet.

The table is cast iron but the leaves are 1/8" steel.

Ampersand-e fucked around with this message at 01:59 on Jan 30, 2011

mcrandello
Mar 30, 2001

Ampersand-e posted:

Update:

The saw was delivered today! I am totally amazed because when I placed the order it was back ordered and I was expecting the thing to take a month to get here.

This thing is heavy! I'm going to need help lifting the saw cabinet onto the stand because I weigh about 150lbs soaking wet and I estimate that it weighs more because the shipping invoice listed the box as 280lbs.

The table isn't cast iron, I think it's 1/8" steel but I haven't measured it yet.

Awesome, after comparing quite a few models I'm down to between this one or the Porter Cable PCB270TS from Lowes. That is unless I find some sort of widow's special on the craig. I'm looking at replacement parts/accessories right now to see which is better supported.

fake edit: I actually clicked on something from a review site and got sucked over the event horizon at woodgears.ca again, oops.

GEMorris
Aug 28, 2002

Glory To the Order!

mcrandello posted:

Awesome, after comparing quite a few models I'm down to between this one or the Porter Cable PCB270TS from Lowes. That is unless I find some sort of widow's special on the craig. I'm looking at replacement parts/accessories right now to see which is better supported.

Get the Ridgid, if only for the warranty.

TheVertigoOfBliss
Jan 29, 2007

GEMorris posted:

I'm not familiar with this one. Is it granite topped or did they go back to cast iron?

EDIT: Answered my own question, its cast iron. I wish they had stuck with granite, it really is an ideal material if you need something to be flat, stable, and dampen vibration.

Not to mention the fact that it doesn't corrode. I love my INCA tools' aluminum tables for the same reason.

I know nothing about woodwork but the grain structure of cast iron makes it extremely good for absorbing vibrational energy so it's actually a pretty good choice of material for this. :)

Cobalt60
Jun 1, 2006

TheVertigoOfBliss posted:

I know nothing about woodwork but the grain structure of cast iron makes it extremely good for absorbing vibrational energy so it's actually a pretty good choice of material for this. :)

The compromise being that granite can be made "dead flat," and will stay that way unless you completely destroy the surface, regardless of humidity, temperature, oxidizing chemicals, etc. Especially the most pervasive oxidizer, "water." Plus no chance of unrelieved internal stresses working themselves out over years, which iron can (shouldn't, but can) have.

I actually wonder why more "high end" products don't use granite or synthetic stone as their surfaces for these reasons.

LordOfThePants
Sep 25, 2002

Rigid's lifetime warranty is awesome, but when I sent my paperwork in for my drill, they were really backed up on processing stuff and it took them over 6 months to activate mine.

It wasn't a huge deal because it was covered by the factory warranty during that time. I started to get worried that they lost my paperwork, but an email to their CS staff resulted in a quick response with them saying they were just behind.

mcrandello
Mar 30, 2001

GEMorris posted:

Get the Ridgid, if only for the warranty.

I'm about to go ahead and do just that, the tax return just dropped. Apparently it's the same saw as the craftsman 21833, although from all the reviews I've just spent the last 2 days going through the craftsman badged ones don't seem to be set up with near as much care by the factory. Also Sears appears to have been throwing the boxes around and the end result is a lot of saws that were misaligned, had broken trunions and various other cases of shipping damage. It's $55 less but I can't justify giving up a better warranty, especially with the huge numbers of bad reviews the Craftsman was getting. I was hoping to have a homogeneous power tool selection one day but I figure I can just as easy paint the Ridgid red and silver. :)

MarshallX
Apr 13, 2004
Anyone got tips on getting nice even shellac coats on multi surface/edged pieces (see my mantle clock up above)

It's not too bad but the alcohol evaporates to the point of being a sticky finish in seconds, so it's tough to go back and clean up corners and such using a rubbed on shellac method.

MarshallX fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Jan 29, 2011

mcrandello
Mar 30, 2001

MarshallX posted:

Anyone got tips on getting nice even shellac coats on multi surface/edged pieces (see my mantle clock up above)

More alcohol, lighter touch and maybe a bit more squeezing out the excess so there's less shellac/solvent in the muneca, straight along the shaped edges and small circles on the open plains. Before starting each session rub the piece down with triple or 4 ought steel wool and then compressed air/tack cloth really well. If you're doing french rub the coat should be pretty much dry within a few seconds, maybe a little cloudy but the muneca shouldn't be dragging at all if you're getting a good mixture and not too much shellac on at once. If things are going well and it starts dragging out of nowhere you probably have enough on there to let it sit for a while.

Nice carpentry on that thing BTW. Sorry I don't have more specific advice, french polishing is one of those things that is hard to learn or pass on with just words.

mcrandello fucked around with this message at 09:43 on Jan 29, 2011

MarshallX
Apr 13, 2004
Nah, not doing a french polish. I think the problem is that Zinsser / Bullseye comes as a 3LB cut which is pretty heavy. After a couple of coats everything started to even out...too bad Lee Valley gave me the wrong clock face so I can't finish this weekend:


Click here for the full 600x800 image.


It looks quite chunky/thick in that image but I plan on flattening it out and tossing on a coat of paste wax for shine.

Acid Reflux
Oct 18, 2004

Would there be anything inherently wrong with buying this if I just wanted to dip my toes into the wood lathe pool? I know it's a very basic machine, but I figure in the end I'm not out much if it turns out either (a) I don't like turning as much as I thought I would, or (b) I end up really sucking at it.

truncated aardvar
Jan 21, 2011

WARNING: Contents may contain traces of nuts.
I've been reading this thread pretty much exclusively since I joined here - and before I joined too. It's a long thread!

I like doing things with my hands and I enjoy making things with wood so I want to get into woodworking. I've watched a lot of videos, mainly the video podcasts from woodsmith.com. I've also followed a few threads and watched a few blogs. I have had limited experience with DIY stuff but nothing very demanding.

I'd like to start off with small hardwood pieces and larger furniture like shelves and cabinets with ply and MDF. From there I can build up my skill and feel. Eventually I'd like to handle some cool looking furniture - I'm a fan of Art Deco and Modernist furniture and really don't like traditional furniture. I like the idea of working with hand tools as much as possible (where it makes sense) because it's cleaner, quieter, more relaxing and usually safer. Saying that, I do plan to build a router table some time in the future.

I've decided to follow the following strategy:

Acquire handtools:
    Chisels
    Planes
    Saws
    Others

Acquire table saw

Build semi-serious workbench

Profit

I already have a reasonable plunge router, hammer drill, jig saw and a cheap circular saw along with a cheap cross cut hand saw, hammers, screw drivers, clamps,tape measure, etc..

So far I've ordered a six piece chisel set and some Wood River planes (low angle block, a number 3 and a number 5). I went to the local flea markets on the weekend and there were quite a number of old Stanley planes but I don't know if they're 60 years old or 30 years old and I really don't know what I'm looking for since it's been a number of years since I used a plane in anger so I decided to play it safe and get some decent new planes that I know won't need much done to them. I live in Australia and ordered them from the US - just the number five plane was $90 cheaper from the US but they haven't gotten back to me on freight costs - I'm hoping to save at least a couple of hundred dollars for three planes and some chisels.

I've resisted the urge to buy a work site saw and I'm hunting on ebay for a decent contractors saw. I'll patiently wait instead of rushing into it - but it's hard when the calibre of table saws on ebay in this country often look like this:

It's probably owned by someone called Todd. Nice lawn Todd!

Anyway, a few questions:

What other tools would you recommend for a beginner? I already have more-clamps and a set square/straight edge on my shopping list.

I plan to do a bit of work with MDF and plywood, especially at the start. Should I swap irons in my planes when working with these materials? I can imagine that squaring ply on a shooting board would dull them quite quickly.

Any particular style of vice I choose for my work bench, considering I'll be planing and sanding with it?

If I were to buy one type of power sander, would a random orbital be the most useful?

I'm guessing the path of a random orbital sander isn't truly random. How is the path produced? Perhaps different cambered shafts rotating at different speeds that produce a pattern that isn't repeated very often? Hmmm...

On a side note, I just checked, and the owner of that table saw isn't called Todd :(

whose tuggin
Nov 6, 2009

by Hand Knit
That is the most counter-intuitive table saw I've ever seen. The craigslist ad must have said something like "Giant Table Saw with cast iron housing! (actual table is like 12"x12")

Also, very dumb question, but when you were looking at the planes and their prices in the US, did you take into account the conversion between USD and Australian dollars?

Bad Munki
Nov 4, 2008

We're all mad here.


truncated aardvar posted:

If I were to buy one type of power sander, would a random orbital be the most useful?

I'm guessing the path of a random orbital sander isn't truly random. How is the path produced? Perhaps different cambered shafts rotating at different speeds that produce a pattern that isn't repeated very often? Hmmm...

If I recall, the path of a single grain in a ROS is something more like a spirograph with made with a big outer wheel and a small inner one, to which the marker is attached. So yeah, it may repeat, but it might take ages to do so. Since I bought mine, I haven't pulled out my regular sander at all. Bear in mind, however, that a cheap-rear end sanding block is a must-have. It won't take down material like a ROS, but then you probably shouldn't be relying on sanding to take down material anyhow. ;)

e: something like this, I think, but with much smaller minor loops, of course:

MarshallX
Apr 13, 2004

Bad Munki posted:

If I recall, the path of a single grain in a ROS is something more like a spirograph with made with a big outer wheel and a small inner one, to which the marker is attached. So yeah, it may repeat, but it might take ages to do so. Since I bought mine, I haven't pulled out my regular sander at all. Bear in mind, however, that a cheap-rear end sanding block is a must-have. It won't take down material like a ROS, but then you probably shouldn't be relying on sanding to take down material anyhow. ;)

e: something like this, I think, but with much smaller minor loops, of course:



The reason it's still considered "random" is because you can't hold your hand in the same place long enough for it to make an actual pattern, so unless you are mounting it on something it is as random as you'll get.

Bad Munki
Nov 4, 2008

We're all mad here.


Right, I was just describing the path of a single grain relative to the sander itself. In practice, it doesn't really matter, like you said.

I've occasionally used my ROS pretty aggressively and even with the meanest grit and tons of pressure, I don't see marks, which is really nice.

MarshallX
Apr 13, 2004

Bad Munki posted:

Right, I was just describing the path of a single grain relative to the sander itself. In practice, it doesn't really matter, like you said.

I've occasionally used my ROS pretty aggressively and even with the meanest grit and tons of pressure, I don't see marks, which is really nice.

I used 60 Grit on my table top to flatten most of it and had no issues at all. Probably wasn't the best way of doing things, but it worked.

I also used my ROS to polish a lacquer finish from 600 grit all the way up to steel wool (bought a sheet and cut it to size)

truncated aardvar
Jan 21, 2011

WARNING: Contents may contain traces of nuts.

The Scientist posted:

That is the most counter-intuitive table saw I've ever seen. The craigslist ad must have said something like "Giant Table Saw with cast iron housing! (actual table is like 12"x12")

Also, very dumb question, but when you were looking at the planes and their prices in the US, did you take into account the conversion between USD and Australian dollars?


The AU$ and US$ are pretty much at parity right now ( AU$1 = US$0.99669 to be exact).

It's one of the reasons I looked at buying and air freighting such heavy items to Australia - Aussie prices haven't fallen much in recent times despite the Australian dollar's comparative strength against other major currencies since the GFC. I found out freight is going to be around $110 but it's still going to save me a fair bit.

GEMorris
Aug 28, 2002

Glory To the Order!

truncated aardvar posted:

So far I've ordered a six piece chisel set and some Wood River planes (low angle block, a number 3 and a number 5).

Congrats on picking three of the four primary planes that you need for handplaning wood. Now return them or cancel your order because Wood River is "mid grade" which for handtools means it isn't awesome enough to merit its price. They aren't terrible, but they are no better than an old Stanley with an hour or two of time put into it. With hand tools it is best to buy Good (Lie Nielsen/Veritas) or cheap/old (Old Stanley's etc).

What you are missing is a jointer plane, something along the lines of a Stanley 7 or 8, i.e. 22-24" long.

truncated aardvar posted:

Saws

get the pair of Veritas carcass saws: http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=66066&cat=1,42884

Use them for a month. Then try to convince me that you really need anything else when it comes to backsaws. Minor exception if you are cutting gigantic tenon cheeks all day.

As far as panel saws go, find old ones at flea markets and refub them.

truncated aardvar posted:

I went to the local flea markets on the weekend and there were quite a number of old Stanley planes but I don't know if they're 60 years old or 30 years old

it really doesn't matter how old they are, but I'd take 60 or 160 over 30 any day when it comes to Stanley. Take some time to learn about the different "types" i.e. "eras" of planes that Stanley made. Start here, it is good info with two exceptions. Patrick is inexplicably biased against the #6 fore plane, and all transitional planes. It may be that he thinks this makes him edgy, but he's completely wrong on these two counts. http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan0a.html

Find some reasonable old planes, spend an afternoon cleaning them up. There are lots of guides on the internet about how to do this. If rust is a problem look into electrolysis.

truncated aardvar posted:

I've resisted the urge to buy a work site saw and I'm hunting on ebay for a decent contractors saw.

I'm not sure what is common down under as far as brands etc. Don't rule out Radial Arm Saws if you come across a good one for cheap. Small contractor saws tend to cause as many problems as they solve, the table saw (if you have decided that you must have one) is one place where I'd go big if possible.

truncated aardvar posted:

What other tools would you recommend for a beginner?

Router plane, absolute must have in my book. Stanley 71 or 71_1/2 or a miller's falls equivalent.

Chisels, a set of 4-6 bench chisels, some skew or dovetail chisels, and a proper english mortising chisel.

I really do love and frequently use my Brace (i.e. Bit & Brace for auger bits) and my eggbeater drills, but these can come later.

You've already nailed three of the four basic planes you need. i.e. Rough (14-18" plane, Stanley 5, 5.5, 6), Joint (22-24" plane, Stanley 7, 8), Finish (9-13" plane, Stanley 3, 4, 4.5), and a Low-angle block plane.

truncated aardvar posted:

I plan to do a bit of work with MDF and plywood, especially at the start. Should I swap irons in my planes when working with these materials? I can imagine that squaring ply on a shooting board would dull them quite quickly.

Hand tools and sheet goods CAN be done, but that doesn't mean it should, or that you will be pleased with the results. Doubly so for hand tools on MDF.

truncated aardvar posted:

Any particular style of vice I choose for my work bench, considering I'll be planing and sanding with it?

Get Christopher Schwarz's Workbench book before making many workbench decisions please. Or at least read his blog.

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!

truncated aardvar posted:

- but it's hard when the calibre of table saws on ebay in this country often look like this:

It's probably owned by someone called Todd. Nice lawn Todd!

I'm pretty sure that is a tile saw into which someone put a 7.25" 24 tooth construction blade.

jvick
Jun 24, 2008

WE ARE
PENN STATE
Hello Folks!

I've been reading through this thread sporadically for about the last 3 - 5 months. I must say that there are some amazingly talented people in here. I am very new to this hobby and still haven't even really got into it much. I've built a TV stand (I'll try to post pictures later) that has held up for over a year now, and I'm pretty excited about that. For a while I've been wanting to build a new dresser for myself, and am only in the planning stages for the time being. I realize this is going to be a HUGE task and I may be taking on too much too soon, but I'll have the help of my brother and father who both have years of experience.

To design my dresser I've been using SketchUp (got the idea from the Pantarouter genius), and have come up with the design below. Basically before I go much further into designing details I would like to get any feedback and advise from you fellas. Basically I'm looking for help with tips/tricks from previous experiences, general feedback, Wood type (preferably a hardwood), etc.

Thanks in advance guys...


Full size

Cobalt60
Jun 1, 2006
truncated aardvar: I'm just going to put a personal second vote for everything GEMorris said, with a couple notes:

-- Other plane to consider is a Shoulder. I love mine, and once you realize it's not just for shoulders, you can really get amazing and unique use from it.

-- I haven't used the WoodRiver stuff. It looks good, seems to have thick irons, etc. But.... yeah, if you can cancel, maybe do it and just get the Lie-Neilsen or Veritas Low-angle Block plus a reasonably refurbished Stanley #5 from ebay or similar.

-- GE has an deep unsatiated love for RAS's. Nobody in the retail world will ever recommend them. He's right about everything he says, but don't worry yourself if you don't actually get one, or if other folks tell you they are "dangerous."

-- Read Schwarz's book in a store or library. You'll see he's a bit of a nerd, and very particular. He's also correct, IMO, but it may turn you off big time. If so it's better to do your own thing.

GEMorris posted:

Hand tools and sheet goods CAN be done, but that doesn't mean it should, or that you will be pleased with the results. Doubly so for hand tools on MDF.



Jesus don't use handplanes on MDF ever at all not even at all ever. Good god please just don't.

truncated aardvar
Jan 21, 2011

WARNING: Contents may contain traces of nuts.

GEMorris posted:

Congrats on picking three of the four primary planes that you need for handplaning wood. Now return them or cancel your order because Wood River is "mid grade" which for handtools means it isn't awesome enough to merit its price. They aren't terrible, but they are no better than an old Stanley with an hour or two of time put into it. With hand tools it is best to buy Good (Lie Nielsen/Veritas) or cheap/old (Old Stanley's etc).
I'm still considering it - I have until the 14th to change my mind on the order. I might do some research into the Stanleys from that link you listed and go back to the flea market on the weekend. There were quite a few there, mostly fives.

Is there much difference between planes made in the US and ones made in England? Most planes I saw on the weekend were of UK origin.

quote:

What you are missing is a jointer plane, something along the lines of a Stanley 7 or 8, i.e. 22-24" long.
I know - I plan to start off with smaller pieces and see if the hobby takes. I guess I don't even need a table saw (or other type of fixed power saw) until I start to move into bigger pieces. I don't think I'll need a jointer for a little while. (edit) Hmmm...seems a jointer plane will probably be beneficial on smaller jobs.

quote:

get the pair of Veritas carcass saws: http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/page.aspx?p=66066&cat=1,42884

Use them for a month. Then try to convince me that you really need anything else when it comes to backsaws. Minor exception if you are cutting gigantic tenon cheeks all day.
I'll check those out - thanks.

quote:

Find some reasonable old planes, spend an afternoon cleaning them up. There are lots of guides on the internet about how to do this. If rust is a problem look into electrolysis.
At this stage I don't know what's "reasonable" - I'll investigate further though. I'm really not in any rush - it's hot as hell at the moment and changing the oil in my car on the weekend had sweat running into my eyes so I'm in no mood to be hacking at bits of wood until it starts to cool down a bit.


quote:

I'm not sure what is common down under as far as brands etc. Don't rule out Radial Arm Saws if you come across a good one for cheap. Small contractor saws tend to cause as many problems as they solve, the table saw (if you have decided that you must have one) is one place where I'd go big if possible.

Router plane, absolute must have in my book. Stanley 71 or 71_1/2 or a miller's falls equivalent.

Chisels, a set of 4-6 bench chisels, some skew or dovetail chisels, and a proper english mortising chisel.

I really do love and frequently use my Brace (i.e. Bit & Brace for auger bits) and my eggbeater drills, but these can come later.

You've already nailed three of the four basic planes you need. i.e. Rough (14-18" plane, Stanley 5, 5.5, 6), Joint (22-24" plane, Stanley 7, 8), Finish (9-13" plane, Stanley 3, 4, 4.5), and a Low-angle block plane.

Hand tools and sheet goods CAN be done, but that doesn't mean it should, or that you will be pleased with the results. Doubly so for hand tools on MDF.

Get Christopher Schwarz's Workbench book before making many workbench decisions please. Or at least read his blog.
Thanks for the time it took to write your post out. I've added your thoughts to my slowly coalescing knowledge of the dusty craft. I'm not sure where I'll end up so I guess I'll need some kind of versatile workbench. I do like idea of incorporating bench dogs/dog holes into the bench.

wormil posted:

I'm pretty sure that is a tile saw into which someone put a 7.25" 24 tooth construction blade.
Makes sense (your explanation, not why it was done).

Cobalt60 posted:

Jesus don't use handplanes on MDF ever at all not even at all ever. Good god please just don't.

:D I was actually thinking more of ply than MDF when talking about planes. I think that's why God invented routers and smoothing bits.

truncated aardvar fucked around with this message at 10:33 on Feb 1, 2011

GEMorris
Aug 28, 2002

Glory To the Order!

Cobalt60 posted:

Stuff

We should tag team this thread more often. So much of woodworking is personal preference, opinion, and consensus. I hate putting "IMHO" in front of every single statement, but it should be assumed to be there. Having someone else confirm/deny advice, or provide alternatives, is probably the best way for anyone to know if a poster is full of poo poo or not.

You are right about Schwarz, he is a woodworking and tool nerd, but I love that about him. He does all the nerdy research and I benefit from it by not having to do that same research myself.

truncated aardvar posted:

Is there much difference between planes made in the US and ones made in England? Most planes I saw on the weekend were of UK origin.

In the US, we only started getting UK planes once Stanley stopped making them here, and by that time quality had gone to poo poo. So I'm not sure if the UK made planes in AU are from that era, or from a previous era. Basically you want planes from before 1955 or so (type 19 or 20 at the latest) if possible.

As far as what is restorable, here is a good example of planes that are perfectly restorable. http://www.woodworkforums.com/f152/hand-plane-restoration-parts-107107/#post1054653

If you have the chance to get picky, get picky about your jointer planes. They are by far the hardest to flatten properly. In fact, if you do end up buying any plane new, I would recommend that it be the jointer plane. One good way to get a cheap, flat soled jointer plane is to buy a transitional jointer plane (metal hardware, wooden sole, Stanley #29-#34, make sure the sole isn't cracked all to hell) and flatten the sole with a machine jointer. This only works if you have reliable access to a mechanical jointer.

Also, for smaller pieces, the generally unloved and underpriced fore plane (stanley #6) can serve as a jointer.

Basic before & after, shows you what a plane with a bit of surface rust will look like with a little elbow grease: http://www.woodworkingtalk.com/f11/restored-old-stanley-hand-plane-22266/

Really basic restoration/cleaning, if your plane has a flat sole and a frog that beds properly, this is all you really have to do: http://www.themapleboard.com/wordpress/?p=7

Good restoration info: http://home.comcast.net/~rexmill/planes101/planes101.htm

Here is a link to a complete restoration, it's a lot more than you would NEED to do in most cases, but it shows how far you can take it: http://www.majorpanic.com/handplane_restor1.htm

And if you are looking for used tools that someone has done a basic clean up and fettle on, I can't recommend Walt at Brass City Records enough, he will ship internationally as well. I have always been happy with anything I have bought from him. http://www.brasscityrecords.com/toolworks/new%20tools.html

If you want used tools that someone has gone crazy on restoring, i.e. all surfaces reground to within .001" of a gnats rear end, but are still cheaper than new, check out this guy: http://stores.ebay.com/FLATWOOD-TOOLS-and-MORE?_rdc=1

Just found this great resource when searching for info on plane restoration: http://www.cianperez.com/Wood/WoodDocs/Wood_How_To/INDEX_How_To.htm

Cobalt60
Jun 1, 2006

truncated aardvar posted:

:D I was actually thinking more of ply than MDF when talking about planes. I think that's why God invented routers and smoothing bits.


MDF of any kind of plywood: I'd never do it myself, and if I saw a friend use my LN shoulder plane (precioussss) on either, I'd ban them from the shop (well, my garage, that is).


Good call on the tag-team, and let me add this one point to your post (all good info). When I first got started, I bought a few Two Cherries chisels, a restored-for-work-use Stanley #4, and a two-sided Ryobi (two-sided Japanese saw). My first 2-3 projects were made using only these tools.

Here's the point of the story: I spent almost as much time buying sharpening stuff, learning to sharpen well, and actually sharpening as I did cutting wood across those three. Thank god I enjoy cutting on the pull stroke -- I'd HATE to sharpen a saw, too!


So here's the REAL point: Learning hand tools is great to do, and I'd recommend doing it first instead of "later." Knowing that you're capable of sizing a tenon and cheek by hand in 2 minutes actually saves time compared to setting up a table saw twice for the same operation -- more accurate, too (maybe). Having a well set-up plane that you only use right after running a side through a jointer is STILL a time-saver in the long-run. I see a lot of folks who know their power tools inside and out, to the point where I'll watch them spend 5 minutes setting up a saw to make a simple cut that would take 2 minutes with the saws GEMorris posted (finer finish with the hand saws, usually too).

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!

truncated aardvar posted:

:D I was actually thinking more of ply than MDF when talking about planes. I think that's why God invented routers and smoothing bits.

You'll cure yourself of this idea pretty quickly.

And you can flatten the sole of any plane, metal or wood, if you have a flat plate (scrap granite works nicely) and a variety of sandpaper. The same method works extremely well for sharpening.

mcrandello
Mar 30, 2001

Thanks for the advice on the saw GEMorris. I picked up the Ridgid across town Saturday, set it up last night and did the final adjustments on it this morning. I had to file the mount holes on one of the wings, as it sat a hair proud of the cast section, and the cast iron table had some sharp edges with need to be deburred. Otherwise assembly was very straightforward, it appears to be set up dead square (I'll try to pick a dial indicator here soon to check but it hits the fence on both sides of the blade) and it made the test cut through some scrap pine like a hot knife through butter. I finally have a TS I can respect and not be terrified of.

Now to get out to the other end of town to pick up one of those remaining routers and make a router table for it.

truncated aardvar
Jan 21, 2011

WARNING: Contents may contain traces of nuts.

wormil posted:

You'll cure yourself of this idea pretty quickly.

And you can flatten the sole of any plane, metal or wood, if you have a flat plate (scrap granite works nicely) and a variety of sandpaper. The same method works extremely well for sharpening.

So flatten the soles the same way you'd use for the "scary sharp" method for chisels and plane irons?

Would there be a concern that you're potentially making the planes non-square or is the fact that you only do this once or twice in a plane's life time make this a non-issue?

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!

truncated aardvar posted:

So flatten the soles the same way you'd use for the "scary sharp" method for chisels and plane irons?

Would there be a concern that you're potentially making the planes non-square or is the fact that you only do this once or twice in a plane's life time make this a non-issue?

Non-square? Only if you push at an angle. It's the same action as planing except with the blade withdrawn and on top your flat plate with grit attached. You could do the same with grinding paste if you have a few weeks to kill. :D

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

truncated aardvar
Jan 21, 2011

WARNING: Contents may contain traces of nuts.
I thought I'd try with toothpaste :)

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply