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When I was like 10, I once saw a video of some sort of Star Wars arcade game where you had a big joystick that you either flew around with or used as a lightsaber. My little town in Iowa never had an arcade, so I never saw it. Anyone ever played it?
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Feb 5, 2011 19:12
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Yeah, I think its just called Star Wars Trilogy Arcade. Come to think of it nearly every single arcade Ive been in has had one, but I dont think Ive ever played it.
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Feb 5, 2011 19:13
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Pretty much, what it all boils down to, is that the overpowered nature of the Jedi in the prequels, EU and especially the Force Unleashed simply kill any suspense there might be at all. It's the "Superman Problem". Superman is so powerful, there is no doubt in your mind that he's gonna win. Superman is still better than the Prequels because in the hands of talented writers, Superman can be a complex, interesting character. If George Lucas could write worth a drat, this would be okay, but he can't. There are good Superman stories, but making him an interesting character is a monumental task and happens way less often than say, Batman. You know, people gush over Samurai Jack and the Clone Wars, but I just don't like them. I just can't stand the recent trend in movies where you can have one ridiculously superpower guy take on an entire army without breaking a sweat. If you are like Goku from DBZ and you can pretty much kill a whole army with ease, that doesn't make you a badass. If you are super over-powered, odds are you're going to win. Its when the odds are against you and you succeed by pure willpower and luck that I can appreciate. John McClane taking down a building full of terrorists single handedly is badass. Why? Because it was hard. He's just a regular guy. At every second, he was an inch away from death's door. Jedi Knights mowing down battle droids and Stormtroopers is not badass because they suck and the person doing it is god-like. Starkiller from TFU is about as far from badass as you can get. The harder you try to make yourself badass, the less you are. And let's be honest here, I use the term "you" because he's basically a fanfic self-insert Mary Sue nerd fantasy. I've noticed the people who love anime characters who can slice buses in half with katanas and blow up planets with their minds often do so because their lives are so meaningless and worthless, they fantasize about total godlike power. So, it makes total sense to my why the Star Wars prequels appeal to these kinds of people. The Prequels are essentially live action anime crossed with with-fulfillment fanfiction. tl;dr Take what Sombrerotron said: the Force is a handy tool, but it isn't a be all end all.
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Feb 5, 2011 19:15
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Mister Roboto posted:When I was like 10, I once saw a video of some sort of Star Wars arcade game where you had a big joystick that you either flew around with or used as a lightsaber. I wasted so much money on this when I was a kid, and I don't think I ever made it past the first Death Star run. To this day I'm not sure if it was really hard or I was just terrible at it.
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Feb 5, 2011 19:16
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Mister Roboto posted:When I was like 10, I once saw a video of some sort of Star Wars arcade game where you had a big joystick that you either flew around with or used as a lightsaber. Yeah It's amazing, and I still see them around from time to time as well. Well, I know of one place at least that I know for sure has one (It's this aweseome sci-fi bar that has a carbonite Han Solo in the wall and glass topped tables to play contra and pac man on. I could spend SO much money there.), but they're still around in arcades occasionally. The speeder bike and lighsaber sections are pretty drat fun. Hell, the whole thing is. RedTeam fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Feb 5, 2011 |
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Feb 5, 2011 19:18
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RedTeam posted:The speeder bike and lighsaber sections are pretty drat fun. Hell, the whole thing is. Yes. I loved those too. However, I've seen some very confusing setups. Some cabinets have the joystick controls inverted for all levels, including the saber levels. Other cabinets have the controls inverted for the flight levels ONLY, but the saber controls are normal. It's pretty confusing the first time when you screw up the saber levels because of the damned controls.
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Feb 5, 2011 19:21
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Rev. Bleech_ posted:I'M NOT SUUUURE I thought that game was pretty good, and enjoyed it more than either of the more recent Jedi Knight games. The saber control was fantastic, and actually made the game feel right as a third-person game. It's one of the only games from the old xbox that I regret selling.
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Feb 5, 2011 19:22
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Joe Don Baker posted:Yes. I loved those too. However, I've seen some very confusing setups. Some cabinets have the joystick controls inverted for all levels, including the saber levels. Other cabinets have the controls inverted for the flight levels ONLY, but the saber controls are normal. It's pretty confusing the first time when you screw up the saber levels because of the damned controls. I've noticed that on some machines the joysick can be really unresponsive and loose too, probably due to general use over the years. Makes driving an X-Wing much more annoying (that's my excuse for failing so quickly at least...). But if you can find one with good controls, it's golden.
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Feb 5, 2011 19:25
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stawk Archer posted:(I'm jumping ahead here, but I think it started to go wrong when Zahn got her started on the part with being Luke 2.0). Gammatron 64 posted:Pretty much, what it all boils down to, is that the overpowered nature of the Jedi in the prequels, EU and especially the Force Unleashed simply kill any suspense there might be at all.
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Feb 5, 2011 19:45
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Sombrerotron posted:While I fully agree with your argument about Jedi being far too overpowered, is that really the case in the prequels? They do some fairly crazy poo poo, yeah, but then in the original trilogy we never really got to see Jedi/Sith Masters at the top of their game giving it their all, and even they managed to pull off some fairly wild stuff. I think the prequels actually do a fairly good job of showing their limitations and demonstrating how vulnerable they really are. Hell, RotS basically ends with Jedi being shot to bits left and right by prototype stormtrooopers. It really isn't comparable to the entirely over-the-top things you get in the EU and the Clone Wars (at least in the Tartakovsky series, I really don't know anything about the CGI series). Eh... I think the prequels are definitely way over the top. Mostly anytime there's a lightsaber battle. There's stuff like Anakin jumping out of a car, falling like 500 feet, landing on the car he was supposed to be chasing, and in the same scene you have Obi-Wan hanging on to this little droid in a speeding highway. You have Yoda flipping around, absorbing lightening like it's nothing, people swinging sabers around super fast, Jedi mowing down entire armies of droids... until they start killing them off at the end of Episode 3, the Jedi seem invincible. If they can mow down droids with ease, and if Stormtroopers are useless and can't hit anybody, it makes no sense that the Jedi get taken down that easily. They just die because the plot said they have to. Then you look at the last battle with Anakin vs. Obi-Wan and it's ridiculous as hell. They're swinging on ropes, climbing this big collapsing tower, hopping on little droids like they're platforms in a videogame... A dangerous environment adds to the tension a lot. Look at the Empire Strikes Back. Luke and Vader fight over these platforms where one could easily slip and fall to his doom. In theory, something like lava or big spinning blades or whatever could get this same effect, but it doesn't in the prequels, because the Jedi can just force jump their way out of any problem and they are so agile and aware of everything around them, they're not gonna slip off in the first place. There's lava everywhere but I don't feel any danger. Basically the flippy anime poo poo kills all tension, although there wouldn't be much anyway because we have no reason to give a poo poo about the characters. I hate the recent Hollywood trend to use super duper fast cuts and have a million things going on at once. I can't tell what the gently caress is going on and it makes me feel a little dizzy. It's information overload.
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Feb 5, 2011 20:03
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RedTeam posted:I've noticed that on some machines the joysick can be really unresponsive and loose too, probably due to general use over the years. Makes driving an X-Wing much more annoying (that's my excuse for failing so quickly at least...). I used to remember that game as a kid and finding its graphics absolutely stunning. I'm not quite sure what year the game came out, but it's graphics still look pretty good even in 2011 IMO. I still suck rear end at it though, before the Gameworks here closed, the only way I could get through it were on the nights where it was $20 for unlimited play, and I'd manage to stay alive long enough between cooldowns.
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Feb 5, 2011 20:21
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Is it accurate to say that George Lucas is basically the Al Davis of the film industry? Why won't he just die already. I know this quote is from months ago, but as an Oakland Raiders and Star Wars fan, this comparison is painfully accurate. God drat.
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Feb 5, 2011 20:38
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Gammatron 64 posted:Eh... I think the prequels are definitely way over the top. Mostly anytime there's a lightsaber battle. There's stuff like Anakin jumping out of a car, falling like 500 feet, landing on the car he was supposed to be chasing, and in the same scene you have Obi-Wan hanging on to this little droid in a speeding highway. You have Yoda flipping around, absorbing lightening like it's nothing, people swinging sabers around super fast, Jedi mowing down entire armies of droids... until they start killing them off at the end of Episode 3, the Jedi seem invincible. If they can mow down droids with ease, and if Stormtroopers are useless and can't hit anybody, it makes no sense that the Jedi get taken down that easily. They just die because the plot said they have to.
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Feb 5, 2011 20:55
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movax posted:I used to remember that game as a kid and finding its graphics absolutely stunning. I'm not quite sure what year the game came out, but it's graphics still look pretty good even in 2011 IMO. quote:The game also features two bonus stages that become available only once after completion of both conventional stages. The first has the player deflecting blaster shots from Boba Fett back at him with a lightsaber in order to knock him into the Sarlacc pit behind him. Which sounds completely brilliant, but also dosen't sound familiar to me at all. Wierd seeing as one of the bonus stages is the Vader duel, which I'm completely sure Ive played  Probably because, as you say, it could be pretty difficult. I only managed to get even a decent way through by throwing money at it, there's no doubt loads of stuff I've missed. drat, next time I see one, I'm playing the hell out of it so I can see that level. 
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Feb 5, 2011 21:01
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I was terrible at the trilogy arcade game, I'd love an pc 'port' of it Did anyone play the pod racer arcade games? The one with actual podracer controls?
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Feb 5, 2011 21:28
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Sombrerotron posted:Fair enough. I suppose I was mainly thinking of the kind of exotic abilities and effortless manipulation of matter regardless of volume or distance seen in the EU that turns Force users into full-blown space Elminsters. It is true that Jedi and Sith in the prequels are frequently rather too superhuman. Perhaps the biggest problem with making the Force too goddamn powerful and suited to every conceivable purpose is that it becomes the ultimate plot device, being able both to cause and to solve absolutely everything. Yeah. It makes the Force into a deus ex machina. Whenever our heroes are in trouble, they just use the force to solve it. When the story requires them not to solve a problem, they just don't. It's some of the most contrived writing I've ever seen. Events don't flow naturally or logically, things just happen. Why? Because Lucas needs to take one status quo, and force it into the status quo that is the original movies. Lucas knows what the endpoint is, and has to bring everything to that endpoint, but he didn't think things over that well as to how he would make things end. I.E. the Jedi get owned by Stormtroopers. Although if you were use some kind of internal logic from the films, they probably wouldn't have been killed that easily. We know Anakin gets tempted by Palpatine, goes evil, and fights Obi-Wan on a lava planet where he gets his injuries, but the way events transpire just don't make much sense. George Lucas wants Anakin to have a serious dark side, but he also wants him to have a romance to sell tickets (and has to make baby Luke and Leia). Logically, the Anakin character is a horrible person and Padme should see all the warning signs and stay the gently caress away. These two different things just don't fit with each other. But Lucas forces it. In other words, it's not a story that develops naturally, its a story where everything is forced and contrived because he had to make them fit with the originals. I'd say its easier to write a story that doesn't have any predetermined endpoint as you can simply make events unfold the way you'd think they would. That, and nobody really needs to ever explain why nigh-invincible heroes against weak useless bad guys is a bad thing. Although flipping it around works wonders. People love David vs. Goliath. Not Goliath vs. David. Some of the best film villains ever, such as Darth Vader, Michael Myers, Anton Chigurh, etc. appear to be practically unstoppable. We worry about our heroes because they are so outclassed and we don't know how they're ever going to survive. Bad guys like General Grievous, Count Dooku, and the Trade Federation are a joke. Jango Fett could have been a good bad guy if the Jedi weren't so powerful, but since no normal human could stand a chance against a Jedi, there was no suspense, and he then got easily dispatched by Mace Windu. Out of all the bad guys, the only one that was remotely scary was Darth Maul, just because he looked a little scary. But he certainly didn't do anything scary. Or much of anything at all.
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Feb 5, 2011 21:55
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Basically, turning the force into a super powerful plot device instead of limited tool that still needed some luck timing and skill ruined Star Wars combined with crappy writing and milking of the cash cow.
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Feb 5, 2011 22:13
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Cheesus posted:I'm not sure why you're ignoring the Dark Empire series which kicked off the current EU in the early 90s. The idea of the Emporer being back because he can clone himself at will? The idea of Luke joining him to "understand" what his father went through? That's like a poo poo in the mouth the original trilogy right there. You're right that it was poo poo, but it didn't kick off the current EU. It came out in December 1991, while Heir to the Empire came out in May 1991. The Thrawn trilogy is the reason the EU exists now, because the first thing we received in this incarnation of the EU was just so drat good we've had a hard time letting go. If Dark Empire was first, I'm not sure it would still be around.
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Feb 5, 2011 22:33
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One thing that struck me is that, for people who read Heir to the Empire in 1991 and wanted to read Dark Empire to fill the time while waiting for book 2 to come out...The very first sentence of the first issue of Dark Empire spoils the fact that Thrawn is defeated and killed.
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Feb 5, 2011 22:54
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Gammatron 64 posted:Yeah. It makes the Force into a deus ex machina. Whenever our heroes are in trouble, they just use the force to solve it. When the story requires them not to solve a problem, they just don't. It's some of the most contrived writing I've ever seen. Events don't flow naturally or logically, things just happen. Why? Because Lucas needs to take one status quo, and force it into the status quo that is the original movies. Lucas knows what the endpoint is, and has to bring everything to that endpoint, but he didn't think things over that well as to how he would make things end. With respect to tension, I'm a little doubtful whether toning down the Force supremacy in the prequels would've made very much of a difference. The fact is that they're centred around a few characters whom we know will survive, so they will never ever be in any true danger. It's only characters who don't make any appearance or are not referenced in the original trilogy for whom the viewer may reasonably concerned, and in all fairness, most of them do end up dying (even if not all of them do so on screen). I expect that someone seeing the prequels before the original trilogy would have a different experience than anyone who only saw them afterwards. The real problem with making the Force all-powerful, I feel, is not so much that it eliminates the sense of danger, but that it leads to either extremely lazy or absurdly convoluted, fan-fiction-quality writing. It can also lead to the inexplicable situation where some Force-using character fails to use some trick that has proven very effective before in a very similar situation, quite probably because the author's written himself into a corner (cf. the Jedi Academy trilogy, in which Exar Kun first uses the Force to turn his uppity student Gantoris to death, but apparently forgets his ability to do so when he comes across Luke, resorting instead first to separating Luke's spirit (???) from his body, and finally to controlling birds to make them peck it apart).
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Feb 5, 2011 23:00
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If Lucas wrote this encounter Snoop would have Jedi powers.
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Feb 5, 2011 23:02
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bad news brown posted:If Lucas wrote this encounter Snoop would have Jedi powers. He's arm wrestling Vader for the Death Star plans.
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Feb 5, 2011 23:06
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Gammatron 64 posted:Eh... I think the prequels are definitely way over the top. Mostly anytime there's a lightsaber battle. There's stuff like Anakin jumping out of a car, falling like 500 feet, landing on the car he was supposed to be chasing, and in the same scene you have Obi-Wan hanging on to this little droid in a speeding highway. You have Yoda flipping around, absorbing lightening like it's nothing, people swinging sabers around super fast, Jedi mowing down entire armies of droids... until they start killing them off at the end of Episode 3, the Jedi seem invincible. If they can mow down droids with ease, and if Stormtroopers are useless and can't hit anybody, it makes no sense that the Jedi get taken down that easily. They just die because the plot said they have to. Said it in the other thread, but I look at the difference between the new and old trilogy as this: OT swordfights are like Chambara/Samurai movies like Duel at Ganryu Isle. PT is like Chinese Opera/Kung Fu movies, where we aren't expecting realism as much as a pequliar style that isn't supposed to be believed. I don't like that over the top style to begin with, but injecting it into Star Wars seems like they were just trying to find the most extreme form of movie fighting they could, and because it was popular at the time - even "The Musketeer" used this kind of choreography, to bad effect - they put it in there. That and videogames. I guess they could sell videogames with the promise that you'd be able to use all of these powers at a whim. It started off kind of good, with Luke using force jumping and stuff in Empire, but it ironically became harder to believe and appreciate when it lost its mysticism and started working like an app or one of many powers that the characters have at their control, just like Superman or other superheroes. Stormtroopers and their inability to kill anything was really ruined in Return of the Jedi. I've said before that I think the first half of the movie (Jabba's scenes) fit in perfectly and were the best part of the movie. The Stormtroopers never have any menace to them in the Endor scenes. In the original, yeah they miss the central characters all of the time, but we have already seen that they are effective (scene one) and ruthless (Luke's Aunt and Uncle) killers, and that it is better to run than to fight them (the whole movie). That gunbattle in the prison is also the best example. Han, Luke, and Chewie can take out a room full of officers and regular empire guys standing firewatch, but as soon as the Stormtroopers show up they have to get out of there. In Empire, they outmatch their rebel opponents (again) and are never beaten in a fight with the main characters. They are shown to miss Luke on purpose or just to keep him pinned, and if they have you surrounded (like in the dining room scene), it's over. Compare that with any time the Battle Droids surround even one or two characters in the prequels. In Jedi, they have to be outsmarted but once the fighting begins in earnest, they really don't do anything. So there's more to Jedi's problems than just the Ewoks. In the prequels, the battle droids remind me of a side scrolling beat-em up. There are a couple of tough ones, but the majority are just the generic punk guy who doesn't have a chance of beating you and is just there to make it a game. quote:This is true, but I'm not sure if Vader is really comparable to Michael Myers or Chigurh. I don't believe the original trilogy ever suggests that Vader is like the latter, who are able to miraculously survive/luck their way out of absolutely anything. They're also a different type of antagonist: Vader seems inhuman because of his outfit, the others seem inhuman because they are complete sociopaths. To that extent, I feel Vader's not fundamentally different from the antagonists in the prequels. He's been given much more screentime, however, so he becomes a true nemesis rather than This Film's End Boss. What's more, the revelation that he's Luke's father and that he might yet be saved (and is in fact saved in the end) will obviously have a much greater impact on the viewer than some kind of scary-looking dude/alien whom the viewer doesn't really know getting chopped in half. I liked how in Empire you aren't told in any way that he might be redeemed. It was really a big revelation for Luke and made true all of that stuff that Yoda had told him about the dark side and how it seduces people. Of course we all thought it was meant that even good people could be seduced until the prequels, when it all had to do with manipulating someone through their loved ones, which sucked, of course. stawk Archer fucked around with this message at 23:21 on Feb 5, 2011 |
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Feb 5, 2011 23:15
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thrawn527 posted:Heir to the Empire came out in May 1991. Does that mean we're coming up on the 20th anniversary of the EU? I feel like there should be some kind of party. Or a memorial. Perhaps a wake. Growing up in the mid 90's, browsing the sci-fi section of the library, I got the impression that the EU was this old, established thing, since there was already a Star Wars shelf and some of the books were rather beat up. But I guess they couldn't have been more than a few years old at the time. And I still haven't read the Thrawn trilogy. I'd get it in a heartbeat if it was on Kindle. stawk Archer posted:In the prequels, the battle droids remind me of a side scrolling beat-em up. There are a couple of tough ones, but the majority are just the generic punk guy who doesn't have a chance of beating you and is just there to make it a game. Oddly appropriate: in Republic Commando, when faced with a room full of basic battle droids, I usually just run around knifing all of them to save ammo since they're such a non-threat. Wingnut Ninja fucked around with this message at 23:22 on Feb 5, 2011 |
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Feb 5, 2011 23:19
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On pre90s EU: I've been trying to remember the name of one of those "Learn to Read" books that had a record that went along with it reading it to kids. All I remember about it was some sort of crystal cave, that may have hummed? Came out in the early 80s (as evidenced by the fact that it came with an actual record). VVV Are you kidding? I just bought a new freaking copy! Can't find my originals.VVV KaosFactor fucked around with this message at 23:57 on Feb 5, 2011 |
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Feb 5, 2011 23:54
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Wingnut Ninja posted:Does that mean we're coming up on the 20th anniversary of the EU? I feel like there should be some kind of party. Or a memorial. Perhaps a wake. There is this: http://www.starwars.com/vault/books/heir20thdetails/index.html I already own Heir (even have it autographed by Zahn) but I really like that cover and the allure of both a new novella and annotations by Zahn make it very appealing, although as usual in the end I'll probably try and just see if any library that's part of the local inter-library loan program has it.
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Feb 5, 2011 23:54
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Mister Roboto posted:When I was like 10, I once saw a video of some sort of Star Wars arcade game where you had a big joystick that you either flew around with or used as a lightsaber. Shame the lightsaber parts kinda blew. They were just QTEs but required a weird way of thinking to win at them. Left and Right worked as normal but up and down were reversed, since it was a flight stick. So when the arrow pointed to the upper left you had to think "OK I go left...but pull DOWN". And I think you needed a perfect to win them.
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Feb 5, 2011 23:56
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KaosFactor posted:On pre90s EU: I've been trying to remember the name of one of those "Learn to Read" books that had a record that went along with it reading it to kids. All I remember about it was some sort of crystal cave, that may have hummed? Came out in the early 80s (as evidenced by the fact that it came with an actual record). Planet of the Hoojibs. I had the book-and-tape version as a kid.
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Feb 6, 2011 00:15
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Sombrerotron posted:This is true, but I'm not sure if Vader is really comparable to Michael Myers or Chigurh. I don't believe the original trilogy ever suggests that Vader is like the latter, who are able to miraculously survive/luck their way out of absolutely anything. They're also a different type of antagonist: Vader seems inhuman because of his outfit, the others seem inhuman because they are complete sociopaths. To that extent, I feel Vader's not fundamentally different from the antagonists in the prequels. He's been given much more screentime, however, so he becomes a true nemesis rather than This Film's End Boss. What's more, the revelation that he's Luke's father and that he might yet be saved (and is in fact saved in the end) will obviously have a much greater impact on the viewer than some kind of scary-looking dude/alien whom the viewer doesn't really know getting chopped in half. Well, in the context of the whole trilogy, you're right. Vader redeems himself and isn't pure evil like Myers or Anton. Although we don't really learn that he isn't a complete sociopath and has a human side until ROTJ. In ESB, he is insanely evil, killing people daily because they simply annoyed him. And he seemed totally unstoppable and completely outclassed Luke. And he beat Luke with little effort. Vader tons tons of grativas and he's intimidating. We know he means business. Vader, Heath Leger's Joker, Anton Chigurh, Hannibal Lecter, etc. are some of the best movie villains of all time, but they're not all the same, and I don't want them to be. stawk Archer posted:Said it in the other thread, but I look at the difference between the new and old trilogy as this: OT swordfights are like Chambara/Samurai movies like Duel at Ganryu Isle. PT is like Chinese Opera/Kung Fu movies, where we aren't expecting realism as much as a pequliar style that isn't supposed to be believed. I don't like that over the top style to begin with, but injecting it into Star Wars seems like they were just trying to find the most extreme form of movie fighting they could, and because it was popular at the time - even "The Musketeer" used this kind of choreography, to bad effect - they put it in there. That and videogames. I guess they could sell videogames with the promise that you'd be able to use all of these powers at a whim. It started off kind of good, with Luke using force jumping and stuff in Empire, but it ironically became harder to believe and appreciate when it lost its mysticism and started working like an app or one of many powers that the characters have at their control, just like Superman or other superheroes. Yeah, I always hated that style, too. The whole Asian over the top superhuman style just doesn't jive with me, not in Star Wars, the Matrix, Samurai Jack, anime, those movies where people are on wires, nothing. I know Star Wars is fantasy, but even in fantasy you have to make it somewhat believable. Even if the prequels were well written, the way over the top sequences would still be a problem for me. And personal preferences aside, you can't deny that going for the XXXTREME videogame style really, really devalues what happens in the original. When Yoda lifts the X-Wing in Empire, it's supposed to be amazing. In the PT Yoda can flick ships around like they're nothing without breaking a sweat.
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Feb 6, 2011 00:31
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Powered Descent posted:Planet of the Hoojibs. I had the book-and-tape version as a kid. I like the the idea of the Jedi being slightly super-human in strength and speed by augmenting themselves with the Force. But it has its limits. I liked most of the fights in the new movie, but the stand way to in contrast with the original trilogy fights. I guess we can talk that up to the ages of Vader and Kenobi and Luke's inexperience. But some of the superhumanness went to far: the Flash like speed running away from the Destroyers in the opening of TPM, 500 foot falls in the AOC speeder chase.. But then again, if Yoda can lift an X-Wing why can't he make himself fly?
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Feb 6, 2011 00:42
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_changes_in_Star_Wars_re-releases This is actually an interesting read. Not just for :sperg: but for genuinely interesting cut scenes. For example, it says there was a longer fight with Qui-Gon and Maul on Naboo that had Maul try to get on board the ship. Has ANYONE ever seen this?
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Feb 6, 2011 01:12
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I'm mostly okay with having strongly superhuman characters, Jedi or not, but it requires two things to "click": it has to be grounded in something I as viewer can follow, and it has to still be about the characters. The former means no superspeed crazy blurred things, no bizarre stuff where you can't follow what's going on, and that the story has to give clear limits on what the character can do. If Jedi are capable of force pushing a whole division of droids single-handedly... okaaaay. I've no problem following that, though it does cause problems compared to what OT Jedi could do, but now that it's been established that a Jedi can do that, they'd better not forget that they can do it later on. (This is the mook droids vs. instant clonetrooper death problem) The latter means that it can't just be about the effects. All effects get outdated eventually, and often pretty quickly. The story of Luke rushing off to confront the superior Vader, with it foretold that doing so will destroy all that they have worked for... that's about the characters involved. In contrast, what was the Maul/Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan fight about? Maul hates Jedi for no clear reason, so they all clear away from everyone else to have a mostly meaningless battle?
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Feb 6, 2011 02:36
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Mister Roboto posted:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_changes_in_Star_Wars_re-releases Not outside of Lucasfilm. I used to be a huge cut scenes junkie, and footage of this doesn't exist. There are a couple of still pictures, though, iirc.
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Feb 6, 2011 03:23
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Chairman Capone posted:There is this:
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Feb 6, 2011 03:42
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Has anyone actually seen The Phantom Edit? I'm kind of curious to track it down
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Feb 6, 2011 08:46
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Fid posted:Has anyone actually seen The Phantom Edit? I'm kind of curious to track it down I did. It obviously doesn't fix the movie, I dont think anything outside of an actual remake could, but it does take a lot of steps to make it more bearable to watch. It cuts out the silly stuff, and one thing I really liked is that he reverses the audio for all the aliens so it lets them speak in "alien language" and rewrite the dialouge (with subtitles) to be more compelling. Although we obviously still don't see it, Nute Gunray makes more threatening remarks about slavery and killing hostages if Padme doesn't comply, meaning it at least feels ALMOST like we can take this guy seriously. I also liked what he did with Jar Jar. Since he cut out the "Jar Jar antics" as the article called them and does the whole audio reverse thing for him, he makes Jar Jar sound more like an every man who gets swept up into this by Jedi who are impulsive.
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Feb 6, 2011 08:53
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RagnarokAngel posted:I did. It obviously doesn't fix the movie, I dont think anything outside of an actual remake could, but it does take a lot of steps to make it more bearable to watch. It cuts out the silly stuff, and one thing I really liked is that he reverses the audio for all the aliens so it lets them speak in "alien language" and rewrite the dialouge (with subtitles) to be more compelling.
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Feb 6, 2011 10:03
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RagnarokAngel posted:I did. It obviously doesn't fix the movie, I dont think anything outside of an actual remake could, but it does take a lot of steps to make it more bearable to watch. It cuts out the silly stuff, and one thing I really liked is that he reverses the audio for all the aliens so it lets them speak in "alien language" and rewrite the dialouge (with subtitles) to be more compelling. Just so you know, that wasn't the Phantom Edit. Phantom Edit was a quick cutting job done back in the early 2000s that mainly removed Jar Jar and some other slower parts. The edit with the changed alien dubs is the Magnolia Edit. Magnoliafan is the guy who actually tries to EDIT the films, both cutting and adding scenes. Mister Roboto fucked around with this message at 13:25 on Feb 6, 2011 |
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Feb 6, 2011 10:19
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Fid posted:Has anyone actually seen The Phantom Edit? I'm kind of curious to track it down It's mainly a trimming of the bits that riled people in the first place, such as Jar Jar and Anakin's antics. But as with editing an already edited film there's not much you can really do as you lack additional rushes to work from. There was one done for Attack of the Clones that at the most removes the Kamino dart subplot, Obi just gets told by Wessel to head to Kamino. Again it's mostly edits to remove redundancy or irritating lines "Oh we're safe". There's a commentary track where the editor notes his reasons for making the changes. There's actually a whole genre of fan edits out there for all sorts of things, mainly it's to cater for people's ideas of a "pure" version of the film.
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Feb 6, 2011 12:50
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| # ? May 15, 2024 07:01 |
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Mister Roboto posted:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_changes_in_Star_Wars_re-releases "During the end celebration, a brief shot of Luke hugging Wedge Antilles was inserted." 
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Feb 6, 2011 13:08
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