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Here's some useful resources, gleaned from the Classic Battletech forums: Army Reports 3025: Distilled excerpts from the old House books, giving an overview of the militaries of the Successor States. Random Mech Assignment Tables: Random mech selection tables, grounded pretty well in the fluff.
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Feb 7, 2011 20:29
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Arglebargle III posted:I'll try to avoid derails from now on, sorry guys. I seem to be a major source of track-breakage. I don't know where you're getting the idea that they're changing the timeline. The reboot is more about being able to reset the game mechanics and tell the story again to a new generation of players. http://uk.pc.ign.com/articles/100/1002164p2.html quote:But we have some great history that travels to us from the previous versions of MechWarrior, but there are also some things that were artifacts of the era and technology that was available at the time to build those games which are things that we think we really have to avoid. One of those, for instance, in terms of dealing with the types of mechs, is to make sure that each class of mech really has its own unique role on the battlefield. So a light [mech] is not just something you pilot on your way towards a medium, a heavy, and eventually an assault; that a light [mech] has a really different play dynamic, and a reason why in any larger scale game that people are going to want to take lights; the same for mediums and all the way up the scale through the four classes. So we definitely see this, especially when you get into multiplayer, but even in the single-player and co-op, which we hope to incorporate into the campaign, that it really is all based on lance dynamics... What's really great about this game is that it looks like we're finally going to get 'proper' urban combat ala the teaser trailer.
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Feb 7, 2011 21:05
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Assuming it ever comes out. Harmony Gold can crash and burn at this point for their insane refusal to license the designs.
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Feb 7, 2011 21:31
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Kenlon posted:Here's some useful resources, gleaned from the Classic Battletech forums: Just as long as Mech of the Week doesn't start stealing my mojo. You all saw how much AIB hurt me last time.
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Feb 7, 2011 22:22
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Alchenar posted:I don't know where you're getting the idea that they're changing the timeline. Oh I don't think they will, I just kinda took the idea of a reboot and ran with it. I think most people aren't terribly thrilled with the post-Tukkayid timeline. Arglebargle III fucked around with this message at 23:06 on Feb 7, 2011 |
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Feb 7, 2011 23:02
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Meh, the best era is the War of 3039. Awesome historical SB, I recommend it so highly.
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Feb 7, 2011 23:20
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Polaron posted:Harmony Gold can crash and burn at this point for their insane refusal to license the designs. Did Harmony Gold ever give an actual reason they were holding up the designs? It seems almost like they're just hamstringing the project in order to sink another company. I mean, at this point I'd just say gently caress it and put in new and totally original mech designs so that the drat game could finally go forward. Holding out for the Unseen is just going to waste a ton of money. vvvvv: Well, at least it's a reason. But seriously, HG needs to actually do something with the Macross/Robotech franchise. It's been too long and I need more Veritechs in my life. Veyrall fucked around with this message at 01:01 on Feb 8, 2011 |
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Feb 8, 2011 00:40
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Veyrall posted:Did Harmony Gold ever give an actual reason they were holding up the designs? Answer one: Because they're dicks. Answer two: Because they're the legal license holders and prefer to retain absolute control over their property. They're likely afraid (and rightly) that giving any ground would weaken their hold on said license, which is basically the only thing they have that's worth even half a poo poo.
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Feb 8, 2011 00:46
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Defiance Industries posted:Meh, the best era is the War of 3039. Awesome historical SB, I recommend it so highly. The 4th was better. The 4th Succession War Military Atlas was amazingly cool - especially for the assorted acts of heroism on the part of the CCAF as the FedRats swarmed us. If only Max hadn't been bugfuck and Justin had really been on our side, Ridzik's counterattacks would have worked. 
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Feb 8, 2011 00:54
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Tempest_56 posted:Answer one: Because they're dicks. But...it's copyright, not trademark. They're going to keep the IP for ages since Battletech isn't anywhere near being genericized. Is the law somewhere outside the USA so completely different on copyrights that you have to vigorously enforce them lest you lose them? E: VVVVVVVV Fair enough whowhatwhere fucked around with this message at 01:44 on Feb 8, 2011 |
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Feb 8, 2011 01:23
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The last thing I'm gonna say on this subject is that, after thinking about it, Harmony is most likely trying to passive-aggressively bully its way into getting some royalties out of FASA. Which is, as Tempest said, a dick thing to do.
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Feb 8, 2011 01:37
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Kenlon posted:The 4th was better. The 4th Succession War Military Atlas was amazingly cool - especially for the assorted acts of heroism on the part of the CCAF as the FedRats swarmed us. If only Max hadn't been bugfuck and Justin had really been on our side, Ridzik's counterattacks would have worked. The 4th War is a story of "biggest guy kicks the poo poo out of littlest guy and nothing littlest guy tries helps him much at all." I just can't get into it. Despite what efforts the CCAF made it was basically an unending string of victories for Davion until ComStar pulled him off the CC. Plus, 3039 has reintroduced SL tech but it is stupid rare. Let's you have "boss" enemies in a campaign like how the Manei Domini tried to be. Also it has Caesar Steiner clapping up the 2nd Sword of Light, maintaining his Undefeated record.
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Feb 8, 2011 02:35
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Question for those who've been doing the BattleTech thing forever: I've noticed people referring to pre-Clan Invasion mechs as being "Tech Level 1" and Clan Mechs and the LostTech ComStar releases to combat them as "Tech Level 2". How many tech levels are there total? Just those two?
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Feb 8, 2011 02:41
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W.T. Fits posted:Question for those who've been doing the BattleTech thing forever: I've noticed people referring to pre-Clan Invasion mechs as being "Tech Level 1" and Clan Mechs and the LostTech ComStar releases to combat them as "Tech Level 2". How many tech levels are there total? Just those two? If memory serves, there are 3 tech levels, but the third one is for zany or overly technical poo poo nobody uses.
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Feb 8, 2011 02:47
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Yeah, Tech Level 3 isn't very fun to play in, because there's really just too MANY rules to keep track of, and it often devolves into Warhammer 40K-ish 'I have the MOST special rules, therefore I win' stuff. By that point the actual combat is pretty boring, too, since while from a purely stat-based standpoint the Mechs tend to be better-designed, there's no real flaws you have to work around, which is always what I LIKED about Battletech, having to compensate for the flaws in your units by using strategy and forethought. Way more interesting than just 'my lance of perfectly-built Omnimechs attacks your lance of perfectly-built Omnimechs, keep rolling dice until one side falls over.'
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Feb 8, 2011 02:59
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Agent Interrobang posted:Yeah, Tech Level 3 isn't very fun to play in, because there's really just too MANY rules to keep track of, and it often devolves into Warhammer 40K-ish 'I have the MOST special rules, therefore I win' stuff. By that point the actual combat is pretty boring, too, since while from a purely stat-based standpoint the Mechs tend to be better-designed, there's no real flaws you have to work around, which is always what I LIKED about Battletech, having to compensate for the flaws in your units by using strategy and forethought. Way more interesting than just 'my lance of perfectly-built Omnimechs attacks your lance of perfectly-built Omnimechs, keep rolling dice until one side falls over.' Yeah, nobody EVER runs with all the Tech 3 rules (to give you an idea, in the current setup there's an entire rulebook dedicated to the optional rules that's over 100+ pages longer than the main rulebook, and that technically doesn't include some of them like nuke rules). Even with Megamek handling the math you'd probably have issues just working out what you want to do with them. On the other hand, I will credit Catalyst for doing a remarkably good job of hitting their stated goal of "Yes, there IS a rule for that". As for the lostech stuff being batted around, there is one in-game quote I remember that summed it up - "Only in the Successor States can you board a starship to travel several light years then wind up riding a donkey from the starport." What gets lost varies a ton, and more importantly what does stay around tends to be not evenly spread. Pretty much every nation in the IS has a handful of important worlds with reasonable education and 20th century+ tech in common use and a whole bunch of worlds like the Federated Suns "Outback" where people are barely above subsistence farming at best. There was a reason a lance of mechs could take or hold many worlds back in the 3020s era; even in the more modern Battletech era the tech renaissance didn't make it everywhere in the IS (most of it wound up going to the war machines for the most part). And the Clans of course, being A. relatively resource poor and B. complete dicks, don't tend to give their civilian castes much beyond what they "require" either.
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Feb 8, 2011 03:25
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W.T. Fits posted:Question for those who've been doing the BattleTech thing forever: I've noticed people referring to pre-Clan Invasion mechs as being "Tech Level 1" and Clan Mechs and the LostTech ComStar releases to combat them as "Tech Level 2". How many tech levels are there total? Just those two? They actually did away with that (very) recently and went to a different tiering system. Largely because of the late-era proliferation of new and weird toys. But to answer: Level 1 was the stuff we've got now. More limited options meant fewer unusual rules and niche cases to remember. The fighting was slower, heat was more important and ranges were shorter. Level 2 was the standard post-Clans stuff. A wide range of options, but fairly well balanced. Combat tended to be quicker and deadlier, but you had a lot of different things you could do and a pretty wide range of tools. Level 3 was mostly 'this is poo poo in old sourcebooks we realized were bad ideas but we won't tell you to never use them'. It was wild and weird experimental things that almost never appeared in actual canon designs. Frequently unbalanced (both too strong and too weak), and lots of really narrow case optional rules. This is the range you start to find things like 10 ton mechs, mechanical jump boosters (read: mechs with springs on their feet) and laser heat sinks (which make you cooler by LASERS).
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Feb 8, 2011 03:29
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Tempest_56 posted:They actually did away with that (very) recently and went to a different tiering system. Largely because of the late-era proliferation of new and weird toys. But to answer: Wait, I thought laster heat sinks were just normal heat sinks. (See: Night Gyr)
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Feb 8, 2011 03:51
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raverrn posted:Wait, I thought laster heat sinks were just normal heat sinks. (See: Night Gyr) No the Night Gyr was basically an experiment in Laser Heat Sinks, and designed as a test-bed for them. Then they found out that they really weren't as awesome as they thought (basically not producing any better results than the regular Double Heat Sink) and phased it out. As for the difference, normal heat sinks use radiators and heat-conductive fluids, laser heat sinks use lasers to convert heat exhaust into a higher energy state, converting gas into light, and then expelling it in a garish display out through various polished surfaces. 
Angry_Ed fucked around with this message at 04:02 on Feb 8, 2011 |
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Feb 8, 2011 03:58
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raverrn posted:Wait, I thought laster heat sinks were just normal heat sinks. (See: Night Gyr) In practical terms, yes. But Maximum Tech gave additional rules for L3 laser heat sinks - basically, it trades a slightly lower chance of ammo explosions for not being affected by water/weather conditions and making you easier to see at night. The idea is still idiotic. You fire your laser to generate heat, then your mech's laser heatsinks turn that heat into more lasers which make you cooler. It's goddamn stupid.
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Feb 8, 2011 04:09
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So I reinstalled Mech Commander 2 because of this thread, and it bugged in the middle of the Atlas saving mission, everything was going great but one of the mechs seemed to get stuck on the geometry I guess, probably cause I had it jumping around constantly still was very frustrating. The thing that annoys me is that they changed the names of some of the equipment, "Heavy Autocannon" for instance still it's a fun blast from the past.
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Feb 8, 2011 04:46
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Defiance Industries posted:The 4th War is a story of "biggest guy kicks the poo poo out of littlest guy and nothing littlest guy tries helps him much at all." I just can't get into it. Despite what efforts the CCAF made it was basically an unending string of victories for Davion until ComStar pulled him off the CC. Believe me, I know. That just makes those moments where we gave the FedRats bloody noses that much sweeter.
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Feb 8, 2011 05:09
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Tempest_56 posted:In practical terms, yes. But Maximum Tech gave additional rules for L3 laser heat sinks - basically, it trades a slightly lower chance of ammo explosions for not being affected by water/weather conditions and making you easier to see at night. Eh, I'd take poor concept items that are basically just quirks over the sort of hard-line realism rules that some of the aperture CBT types propose. Bad idea, but at least it's not a total game changer like Tandem Charge and mag pulse warheads.
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Feb 8, 2011 05:19
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Tempest_56 posted:The idea is still idiotic. You fire your laser to generate heat, then your mech's laser heatsinks turn that heat into more lasers which make you cooler. It's goddamn stupid. To quote that awesome Half-Life LP from a while back, "I thought this was Battletech, not Exalted." Jesus, even after reading the wiki entry on those things I still can't figure how laser heat sinks are supposed to work. Though a 10 ton mech at least approaches the realm of real-life plausibility (not practicality though). But seriously, wouldn't a 10-tonner be better off just being a tank? I can't imagine what you could even fit on the drat thing. Maybe a Laser and a heat sink? Mr. Despair posted:Proof that Laser Cooling is actually a thing. Well, I'll be damned... 
Veyrall fucked around with this message at 06:09 on Feb 8, 2011 |
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Feb 8, 2011 05:54
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Pretty much. You are way better off just building a hovertank at that weight.
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Feb 8, 2011 05:57
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Veyrall posted:To quote that awesome Half-Life LP from a while back, "I thought this was Battletech, not Exalted." Jesus, even after reading the wiki entry on those things I still can't figure how laser heat sinks are supposed to work. Though a 10 ton mech at least approaches the realm of real-life plausibility (not practicality though). It'd probably be good as something of a light scout for extremely rough terrain. A jeep or humvee analog, as it were.
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Feb 8, 2011 05:58
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Tempest_56 posted:The idea is still idiotic. You fire your laser to generate heat, then your mech's laser heatsinks turn that heat into more lasers which make you cooler. It's goddamn stupid. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_cooling Laser cooling is awesome, albeit unpractical for what they're using it for.
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Feb 8, 2011 05:59
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Zaodai posted:It'd probably be good as something of a light scout for extremely rough terrain. A jeep or humvee analog, as it were. I think you'd cover more ground with a jumping 20-toner myself. Half-ton JJ are too heavy for an ultralight to mount sufficiently.
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Feb 8, 2011 06:32
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Mr. Despair posted:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_cooling Laser cooling is awesome, albeit unpractical for what they're using it for. People often forget that heat is just another form of electromagnetic radiation.
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Feb 8, 2011 06:33
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Longinus00 posted:People often forget that heat is just another form of electromagnetic radiation. It's 12:30 in the morning and I'm tired and I don't really want to derail further, so imagine I wrote a thousand word post chastising you for conflating infrared radiation with a thermodynamic quantity such as the average kinetic speed of molecules in a gas. And then forget it, because it's a dumb argument.
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Feb 8, 2011 06:37
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Mukaikubo posted:It's 12:30 in the morning and I'm tired and I don't really want to derail further, so imagine I wrote a thousand word post chastising you for conflating infrared radiation with a thermodynamic quantity such as the average kinetic speed of molecules in a gas. And then forget it, because it's a dumb argument. Yea, sorry. I should have been clearer. I meant that dissipation of heat also occurs via electromagnetic radiation. 
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Feb 8, 2011 06:45
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Tempest_56 posted:
Of course, don't lasers make everything cool? 
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Feb 8, 2011 08:39
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and laser heat sinks (which make you cooler by LASERS).
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Defiance Industries posted:Pretty much. You are way better off just building a hovertank at that weight.
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Feb 8, 2011 09:29
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Hovertanks can ram. Which does damage on the kick table. And only on one leg if you set the angle right. Those Jedgars we saw last mission can be holy terrors if you use them like this; you can rip legs off assault mechs. Though if you do that you probably deserve to be punched.
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Feb 8, 2011 09:34
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Zaodai posted:It'd probably be good as something of a light scout for extremely rough terrain. A jeep or humvee analog, as it were. Isn't a ten ton mech just a protomech?
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Feb 8, 2011 10:26
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DatonKallandor posted:Isn't a ten ton mech just a protomech? Depends on the source material. In one of the old, old computer games certain special units we may be seeing in the future were also classified as 10 tons.. But that is by no means canon, obviously.
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Feb 8, 2011 10:35
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DatonKallandor posted:Isn't a ten ton mech just a protomech? Those have their own special construction rules. 10-ton mechs used normal mech designs but frankly, their super-low weight threw everything off, so they're now illegal.
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Feb 8, 2011 10:48
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Will Battletech ever introduce aliens to stir things up and how do you feel about that. Zerglings versus a Firestarter 
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Feb 8, 2011 11:06
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Sair posted:Hovertanks can ram. Which does damage on the kick table. And only on one leg if you set the angle right. Zaodai posted:Depends on the source material. In one of the old, old computer games certain special units we may be seeing in the future were also classified as 10 tons..
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Feb 8, 2011 12:39
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Arquinsiel posted:One of the local guys got the rules on vehicle skids changed when they went to a tournament and abused Savannah Masters and concrete skids. Details, please?
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Feb 8, 2011 14:52
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