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The Warszawa posted:True story, I actually got extensive, mind-numbingly detailed feedback on my 5-hour civil procedure exam, complete with an A-F "shadow" grade. Then again, it was my small group. I hate your school
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Feb 12, 2011 07:57
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Ainsley McTree posted:I hate your school that's just natural resentment towards your betters
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Feb 12, 2011 08:10
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Ainsley McTree posted:I hate your school [ASK] me about my unsolicited job offers!
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Feb 12, 2011 08:51
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There's no way HLS would have wait-listed instead of rejecting me if they averaged LSATs.
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Feb 12, 2011 08:58
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Petey posted:I'm just asking because I got a 166 on the December '08 test and a 173 on the February '09 test. While I'm not seriously planning on law school, I had figured I'd probably throw HLS and YLS apps when my five years are about to expire just to see if my old dream of being a big gay internet law professor would be an option. it worries me when you talk this way, Petey...
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Feb 12, 2011 09:18
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atlas of bugs posted:it worries me when you talk this way, Petey... Relax man!! Just...just making small talk with the bros!! *looks longingly after tenured professorships of gay Internet bullshittery*
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Feb 12, 2011 13:29
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Anyone know if Sam Glover still posts in this thread?
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Feb 12, 2011 13:46
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Can you be a straight internet law professor?
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Feb 12, 2011 14:22
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The Warszawa posted:True story, I actually got extensive, mind-numbingly detailed feedback on my 5-hour civil procedure exam, complete with an A-F "shadow" grade. Then again, it was my small group. I'm having a hard time justifying my feelings of wanting to murder you and everyone you ever loved because you seem like such a nice guy.
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Feb 12, 2011 15:04
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Defleshed posted:I'm having a hard time justifying my feelings of wanting to murder you and everyone you ever loved because you seem like such a nice guy. Heaven forbid not everyone in law school/who works as a lawyer has a miserable existence? So I am on my two week leave from work to study for the bar, and I missed out on my 6 month feedback to HR about how I like the job because of it. But my coworker didn't, and he basically said he hated the department, and now they're trying to move him to a new department, which would leave me as the only junior associate there, working my long hours all by myself (and probably longer hours since I'd have to take over his half of the work). I have essentially stopped studying and started applying for new jobs in a panic.
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Feb 12, 2011 16:39
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Petey posted:Where did you hear this from? I thought the Wisdom was that they only care about your top score b/c that's what they show to the college board. HYS are fairly secure in their position: they don't need to be jockeying for position.
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Feb 12, 2011 16:49
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evilweasel posted:HYS are fairly secure in their position: they don't need to be jockeying for position. Makes sense - they can exercise more discretion about scores since they're going to get a bunch of top scores anyway and they're not going to drop out of the top 3. Though I'm not sure if that helps or hurts me in my situation...
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Feb 12, 2011 17:23
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The Warszawa posted:True story, I actually got extensive, mind-numbingly detailed feedback on my 5-hour civil procedure exam, complete with an A-F "shadow" grade. Then again, it was my small group. So to what extent does the average Yalie even try to learn the material? I know if my grading was done this way I wouldn't bother doing any studying besides straight reading. I'd probably spend all my free time trying to write interesting notes and/or "networking". Is that what happens at Yale or is the typical law student there competitive/neurotic enough to study and learn like the rest of us who have an avalanche of debt coming down, where the sole helicopter out of the danger zone seats only 5% of our class? And yes I'm totally jealous, although it makes it easier to accept the existence of Yale when there are cool people like you in it.
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Feb 12, 2011 17:26
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drat Phantom posted:So to what extent does the average Yalie even try to learn the material? I know if my grading was done this way I wouldn't bother doing any studying besides straight reading. I'd probably spend all my free time trying to write interesting notes and/or "networking". Is that what happens at Yale or is the typical law student there competitive/neurotic enough to study and learn like the rest of us who have an avalanche of debt coming down, where the sole helicopter out of the danger zone seats only 5% of our class? And yes I'm totally jealous, although it makes it easier to accept the existence of Yale when there are cool people like you in it. This would be my question too. I realize it's hard because Warsz has only been at one school, but just personally I wouldn't do anything other than read and keep up with the class and then review for like four hours or so the night before the exam to ensure I didn't fail.
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Feb 12, 2011 17:39
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Ainsley, what do you actually do at your job? Like, what's it called. I need more general, non-law office type jobs to search and apply for.
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Feb 12, 2011 17:52
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sigmachiev posted:Also Vander I was wondering what grad school program and what school and the plan for that and poo poo. Idaho has only one law school and I'm in it!
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Feb 12, 2011 17:55
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HooKars posted:Heaven forbid not everyone in law school/who works as a lawyer has a miserable existence? Skulls for the skull throne.
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Feb 12, 2011 18:44
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HooKars posted:Ainsley, what do you actually do at your job? Like, what's it called. I need more general, non-law office type jobs to search and apply for. Would you have any interest in teaching? It's worked out great for me, and I think we both had the same sort of complaints about working in law firms. The pay can be good depending on where you are, and I'm at a state school so the benefits are also good. Of course, our stupid new governor has it out for state employees so it might not be so great pretty soon. But regardless it's still better than practicing. And there are little community colleges all over the place that offer paralegal programs. Of course, with your credentials, you could maybe get a law school job too. Plus, you get summers, spring break and semester break off! Just a suggestion. Teaching definitely isn't for everyone.
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Feb 12, 2011 19:05
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drat Phantom posted:So to what extent does the average Yalie even try to learn the material? I know if my grading was done this way I wouldn't bother doing any studying besides straight reading. I'd probably spend all my free time trying to write interesting notes and/or "networking". Is that what happens at Yale or is the typical law student there competitive/neurotic enough to study and learn like the rest of us who have an avalanche of debt coming down, where the sole helicopter out of the danger zone seats only 5% of our class? And yes I'm totally jealous, although it makes it easier to accept the existence of Yale when there are cool people like you in it. It really depends, both on the student and the professor. I had a fairly legendary Torts professor who spent a good deal of time talking about moral quandaries of legal practice. As a result, I learned there were intentional torts about three hours before the exam. On the other hand, my ciivl procedure syllabus had about a 50% overlap with Complex Civil Litigation and the professor was a fairly notorious hardcase. During the first semester, there isn't much incentive do to more studying than necessary to make you look not-like-an-idiot on the exam. That being said, most of us try to learn it, though probably not quite like other law schools. Once that's done, though, we're on an incredibly lax, discretionary grading system so there's, at least for me, a greater focus on learning the material as we progress, with an eye towards the exam. Basically, if you want to clerk for an Article 3 judge, you may want to approach it more like your friends at other law schools. There's also a lot of emphasis on participation in stuff outside of class. 1Ls can join secondary journals and participate in a moot court competition, and I'm doing both of those, but it's hard to say what's typical. Personally, I try to learn the material as much as possible because I'm paying a lot of drat money to go here. Hell of a shot to waste. But I have fun, too. The Warszawa fucked around with this message at 19:21 on Feb 12, 2011 |
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Feb 12, 2011 19:19
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quepasa18 posted:Would you have any interest in teaching? I have a pretty intense hatred/fear of public speaking that I'd have to get over - which also prevents me from applying to a lot of the more easy going litigation attorney jobs -- though having that kind of vacation time would be a big incentive to get over it. I think jobs that sound ideal for me are things I see labeled as "Contract specialist" for the government or for a company or something completely different like a copywriter type job or something firm related but on the admin side like a conflicts analyst. I just have a hard time coming up with those generic bachelor's degree entry level jobs when I'm playing around with indeed.com.
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Feb 12, 2011 19:24
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MEET ME BY DUCKS posted:The highly scientific TLS forums. Someone did an analysis of last cycle and found that HYS generally appeared to actually assess retakes by averaging the scores, as some schools claim to do. I have no doubt that a 178+ retake would get someone in to HYS, and if they otherwise like you a median retake might get you in, but it seemed rather conclusive that 173 retakes weren't being treated the same as 173 single scores. I'm not sure why you're worried about retaking to begin with. You're in at H and S, and if you wanted to take time off, Harvard should still allow you to defer your acceptance for 1-2 years and I'm sure Stanford has a similar option. Your score would be good to re-apply for five years at any rate, so it sounds like the retake would only be playing the small chance that you score high enough to get into Yale. You also run the risk of wrecking your average at schools who look at that, not to mention paying / studying for the LSAT a second time around. People tend to over-think the weather part of it; Boston's an awesome city, especially if your plan is to spend a few years and then move back to the best coast. The difference to me would be that if you know you want to work in California - the Bay Area in particular - going to Stanford makes it easy to demonstrate your interest in working there when you start applying for jobs. Otherwise prospects from both are solid, but not as guaranteed as a certain hippie commune in CT. zzyzx fucked around with this message at 00:33 on Nov 3, 2022 |
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Feb 12, 2011 19:33
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zzyzx posted:I'm not sure why you're worried about retaking to begin with. You're in at H and S, and if you wanted to take time off, Harvard should still allow you to defer your acceptance for 1-2 years and I'm sure Stanford has a similar option. Your score would be good to re-apply for five years at any rate, so it sounds like the retake would only be playing the small chance that you score high enough to get into Yale. You also run the risk of wrecking your average at schools who look at that, not to mention paying / studying for the LSAT a second time around. I think Ducks was considering a retake before H and S acceptances rolled in. Might be mistaken. Also Warszawa is quickly turning my (probably mistaken) TLS fueled HYS or bust mantra into Y or bust. Trash Can Man fucked around with this message at 20:25 on Feb 12, 2011 |
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Feb 12, 2011 20:23
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Trash Can Man posted:Also Warszawa is quickly turning my (probably mistaken) TLS fueled HYS or bust mantra into Y or bust. If it's Yale or bust then you probably don't really want to actually be a lawyer and you shouldn't even go to Yale.
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Feb 12, 2011 20:36
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HooKars posted:If it's Yale or bust then you probably don't really want to actually be a lawyer and you shouldn't even go to Yale. Eh, not sure where the justification for that is coming from. I'm definitely not going to get into Yale, but was just taking what I hear on TLS to its logical justification. I do want to be a lawyer, but the aspersions cast on employment prospects from most of the T14 make me wonder if it's worth entering the profession with career possibilities already hamstrung. If I've already decided it's the profession I want, it seems the only responsible decision would be to retake the lsat for HYS. I am aware that the above makes me sound like a huge tool, so I am just going to listen to prussian, go to CLS, and die alone. Unloved. At my own hand...
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Feb 12, 2011 20:53
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HooKars posted:If it's Yale or bust then you probably don't really want to actually be a lawyer and you shouldn't even go to Yale. Wait, why would Yale say that you don't really want to actually be a lawyer?
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Feb 12, 2011 21:13
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The Warszawa posted:Wait, why would Yale say that you don't really want to actually be a lawyer? Going to Yale doesn't say you don't want to be a lawyer - obviously if you get into Yale, you should go. But if it's Yale or bust for someone, do they REALLY want to be a lawyer? I know law students and lawyers are risk adverse, but if you're only to go to law school if you're 99.9% sure you'll get a job vs. 93% at Harvard/Stanford - then you probably don't really want to be a lawyer that badly. If you did, you would take that 7% risk to pursue your dreams. Also, once you have a high enough LSAT score, it's going to be tough to improve. You could just as easily get a few points lower, and while they don't average the scores, I'm sure that doesn't look as good as just having one score. And it's not going to look good to Harvard or Stanford either. I think it's actually more risky to retake at that point then to settle for Harvard or Stanford, personally. Those schools consider softs and I think having a later lower score would be a bad soft factor. I asked a little while ago if there were any 2Ls at T14s without firm offers (if that's what they had wanted) for the summer and nobody responded - everyone seemed to have a job. Those might not turn into offers, I guess, but the law firm hiring has definitely picked up, and a lot of firms are back to hiring a lot because they have to make up for layoffs, smaller class sizes, deferred classes, etc. A lot of people got burned the past few years, myself included, but that doesn't mean things haven't changed since then. And a lot of people who got burned got burned regardless of what school they went to. You're still getting a lovely bonus if you're a Yale grad at Cravath and you still were out of a job if you were a Yale grad at Thatcher Profitt when it went under and so on. I'm all for only going to a T14 or local T1 to maximize your chances of employment, but I think the people who think it's only HYS or T14 with full scholarship are ridiculous.
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Feb 12, 2011 21:33
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zzyzx posted:I'm not sure why you're worried about retaking to begin with. You're in at H and S, and if you wanted to take time off, Harvard should still allow you to defer your acceptance for 1-2 years and I'm sure Stanford has a similar option. Your score would be good to re-apply for five years at any rate, so it sounds like the retake would only be playing the small chance that you score high enough to get into Yale. You also run the risk of wrecking your average at schools who look at that, not to mention paying / studying for the LSAT a second time around. Yeah, I'm not going to retake it myself, it was just some retake talk that came up and I had remembered reading an analysis on HYS and retakes. I have absolutely no desire to retake and I feel for anyone in a position seriously considering it after already scoring well. I like the west coast but not so much that I know I want to come back. HLS seems like it will be better for keeping my options open.
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Feb 12, 2011 21:35
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diospadre posted:Can you be a straight internet law professor? Not until the University of Phoenix School of Law starts up HooKars posted:Ainsley, what do you actually do at your job? Like, what's it called. I need more general, non-law office type jobs to search and apply for. I am a copywriter for a travel company. I write and edit (mostly edit so far) marketing materials. Postcards and flyers and e-mails and catalogs and such. Sometimes the details of a trip will change (like going to a new hotel or an optional tour to an anti-government riot) and I'll help make sure all our information is kept up to date across channels. Next week I'm writing about the top places to go in Athens or Dubrovnik or somewhere in that region, which will be weird because I've never been there But I basically only got the job for being lucky (and awesome, but mostly lucky). A friend of mine who works there heard about a temporary data entry type job, so he dropped my name and they hired me for it without even asking for my resume or interviewing me. Then I got lucky again and the job opened up while I was there, and because I was the World's Best Data Entry Temp they considered me for it and I got it. I don't think they'd have even interviewed me if it weren't for the temp job. Most of them don't even know I'm a lawyer, I've been keeping it under my hat. I officially lied about it last week, when a manager type casually asked me what I'd been doing before I started working here and I just said I came from undergrad. I dunno I guess I'm supposed to feel guilty about not practicing law or something but honestly the job is pretty easy and I get to go home after 8 hours and I don't take anything home with me. The pay is fine for my lifestyle and the benefits are pretty sweet so I don't really see any reason to be unhappy edit: Oh! There is another data entry job going on that we need a temp for. If you wanted to fly down to Boston and work for a week and hope you get as lucky as I did I can make things happen I'm a pretty major player Ainsley McTree fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Feb 12, 2011 |
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Feb 12, 2011 22:34
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Ainsley McTree posted:I am a copywriter for a travel company. I write and edit (mostly edit so far) marketing materials. Postcards and flyers and e-mails and catalogs and such. Sometimes the details of a trip will change (like going to a new hotel or an optional tour to an anti-government riot) and I'll help make sure all our This is pretty much exactly what I want in life. We'll see how applying for regular jobs while actually employed as a lawyer plays out. I figure at least part of not being considered for non-law jobs while unemployed is the fear the person really wants to be a lawyer and will leave as soon as a lawyer job becomes available. If they're already a lawyer and want out, I wonder if there are the same type of boundaries. Guess I'll see. I applied to a few copywriter positions. So far I'm not trying to omit my law experience on my resume but I might reconsider in a few weeks.
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Feb 12, 2011 23:24
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quepasa18 posted:Would you have any interest in teaching? It's worked out great for me, and I think we both had the same sort of complaints about working in law firms. The pay can be good depending on where you are, and I'm at a state school so the benefits are also good. Of course, our stupid new governor has it out for state employees so it might not be so great pretty soon. But regardless it's still better than practicing. And there are little community colleges all over the place that offer paralegal programs. Of course, with your credentials, you could maybe get a law school job too. Sorry about your union getting decertified 
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Feb 12, 2011 23:49
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JudicialRestraints posted:Sorry about your union getting decertified On the plus side, no more union dues!
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Feb 12, 2011 23:56
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Ainsley McTree posted:I am a copywriter for a travel company. I used to do exactly that job. It's the best job in the world. Don't ever leave that job.
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Feb 13, 2011 00:23
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atlas of bugs posted:I used to do exactly that job. It's the best job in the world. I have no immediate plans to! But I am kind of concerned because all these revolutions are kind of eating out our bottom line and my position is sort of new, so...I dunno. Can't they just settle down over there? Don't they know that they're putting my job at risk? Where are their priorities?
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Feb 13, 2011 00:28
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HooKars posted:Ainsley, what do you actually do at your job? Like, what's it called. I need more general, non-law office type jobs to search and apply for. HooKars posted:This is pretty much exactly what I want in life. higher ed administration. do it. Petey fucked around with this message at 00:37 on Feb 13, 2011 |
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Feb 13, 2011 00:34
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quepasa18 posted:Would you have any interest in teaching? It's worked out great for me, and I think we both had the same sort of complaints about working in law firms. The pay can be good depending on where you are, and I'm at a state school so the benefits are also good. Of course, our stupid new governor has it out for state employees so it might not be so great pretty soon. But regardless it's still better than practicing. And there are little community colleges all over the place that offer paralegal programs. Of course, with your credentials, you could maybe get a law school job too. Quepasa18 when you have the time and/or the inclination you should drop by #lawgoons so I can ask you some questions about this. Also hope your teaching job is continuing to go really well 
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Feb 13, 2011 01:14
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So I don't know if this is the right thread for this, but people here know about student loans and taxes and we're all bros so what the hell I consolidated my loans in 2010 and I've been getting 1098-E forms from all my former creditors about the interest that got paid off. I can't deduct that, can I? I feel like that couldn't possibly be right because I didn't actually pay for any of that, the DoE did it. But I looked at IRS publication 970 and before I got bored it said that refinanced loans counted as included interest so...I don't know. I guess it doesn't really matter, I didn't make enough in 2010 to owe anything anyway but I feel like this information could be useful to other people so I wanted to ask anyway.
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Feb 13, 2011 01:26
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Ainsley McTree posted:So I don't know if this is the right thread for this, but people here know about student loans and taxes and we're all bros so what the hell Sounds complicated. You might want to consult a lawyer. (I don't know, when I did my taxes, I just entered in whatever information was in the 1098 form from dl.ed.gov into TurboTax. And whether or not you owe anything, this can help you get a refund on taxes withheld, if I understand correctly). Petey fucked around with this message at 01:33 on Feb 13, 2011 |
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Feb 13, 2011 01:30
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HooKars posted:I asked a little while ago if there were any 2Ls at T14s without firm offers (if that's what they had wanted) for the summer and nobody responded - everyone seemed to have a job.
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Feb 13, 2011 01:47
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My understanding is that the entire Wisconsin crowd is unemployed (not that this should be a huge surprise) E: Except Yojimbo is still working hourly doing shitlaw. God I wish i had a shitlaw job.
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Feb 13, 2011 02:33
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JudicialRestraints posted:My understanding is that the entire Wisconsin crowd is unemployed (not that this should be a huge surprise) 
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Feb 13, 2011 04:15
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