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Juaguocio posted:Good stuff indeed, though I hope ICE comes up with some better titles for his upcoming books. CITY IN THE JUNGLE
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Apr 6, 2011 05:04
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I'd recommend any book with Tehol/Bugg in it, these two deserve their own book.
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Apr 6, 2011 09:40
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Complaining that the villains of the tenth book didn't have enough time to develop is very silly when you're praising the second and third book which also had only one book to develop their villains.
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Apr 6, 2011 18:38
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Tahirovic posted:I'd recommend any book with Tehol/Bugg in it, these two deserve their own book. A thousand times this.
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Apr 6, 2011 18:43
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Vanilla Mint Ice posted:Complaining that the villains of the tenth book didn't have enough time to develop is very silly when you're praising the second and third book which also had only one book to develop their villains. you should think about what you said here
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Apr 6, 2011 18:52
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Even though you only get brief glimpses into her thinking, Tavore is one of my favorite characters. I'm most of the way through Reaper's Gale but I'm still a little unclear about how everything unfolded. As I understand it: In GoM, Ganoes ends up casting suspicion on the nobles and tarnishes the Paran family name. Sometime after this, Tavore becomes adjunct and a culling of the nobles occurs. Do they ever explain how she ends up getting the position? In order to prove her loyalty to Laseen, she sends her sister Felisin to the mines but secretly assigns Baudin to protect her. Felisin believes that Tavore is throwing her to the wolves for personal gain, but wouldn't everyone in their family be killed anyway if Tavore doesn't become adjunct? Her character is especially compelling because your initial impression is that she's a cold-hearted bitch and you slowly begin to uncover that maybe that's not really true. Since you never get a point of view directly from Tavore, most of what you know about her is biased by Felisin's point of view.
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Apr 6, 2011 19:56
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Juaguocio posted:Good stuff indeed, though I hope ICE comes up with some better titles for his upcoming books. "I like bars. Topless bars."
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Apr 6, 2011 20:53
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Tahirovic posted:I'd recommend any book with Tehol/Bugg in it, these two deserve their own book. Instead of a korbal bauch miniseries, he should make one for these.
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Apr 6, 2011 23:49
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Ika posted:Instead of a korbal bauch miniseries, he should make one for these. I would like a series of Erikson-written short stories about Iron Bars running through crowds, effortless breaking the necks of various badasses without breaking his stride.
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Apr 7, 2011 00:14
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Another good interview with Erikson: http://fantasyhotlist.blogspot.com/2011/04/steven-erikson-interview.html Calling it, Lostara Yil is his wife.
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Apr 7, 2011 00:53
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Junk Science posted:I would like a series of Erikson-written short stories about Iron Bars running through crowds, effortless breaking the necks of various badasses without breaking his stride. I would read this.
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Apr 7, 2011 01:01
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Another interview: http://fantasyhotlist.blogspot.com/2011/04/steven-erikson-interview.html And a couple of questions are mine. EDIT: ah, sorry, it was just posted...
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Apr 7, 2011 01:15
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Junk Science posted:I would like a series of Erikson-written short stories about Iron Bars running through crowds, effortless breaking the necks of various badasses without breaking his stride. That was one of my favorite scenes in the series. He pops out, throws a punch and keeps going like nothing happened.
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Apr 7, 2011 03:39
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Abalieno posted:Another interview: I love this, especially considering that we were arguing about it just a few pages ago: quote:- Is there enough information dropped along in the series for the fans to piece together, with some degree of accuracy, who Quick Ben really is?
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Apr 7, 2011 07:30
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Kjoery posted:So I've been reading Memories of Ice, and I got to the point where Toc derped off with Panon.
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Apr 7, 2011 19:04
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" -Toc
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- Is there enough information dropped along in the series for the fans to piece together, with some degree of accuracy, who Quick Ben really is? No. This is one of the cases where I need to know more. We understand why so many people are as powerful as they are. Rake, Ruin, Stormy and Gesler and so on. And I do understand needing to leave Ben as an enigma for a good long time, but I really hope at some point Erickson gives us some insight into who Quick Ben really is.
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Apr 7, 2011 19:28
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Phummus posted:- Is there enough information dropped along in the series for the fans to piece together, with some degree of accuracy, who Quick Ben really is? He'll string us along for years until it turns out that, ta-da, QB is an illusory manifestation along the lines of Nefarious Bredd.
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Apr 7, 2011 20:42
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I'm thinking that of all the characters in MBotF, he's one of the most likely to end up having some part in the Karsa Trilogy. He's got his fingers in a lot of pots.
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Apr 7, 2011 22:00
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A Nice Boy posted:I'm thinking that of all the characters in MBotF, he's one of the most likely to end up having some part in the Karsa Trilogy. He's got his fingers in a lot of pots. TCG spoilersIf anything Calm should've been one of the characters involved in the Karsa trilogy instead of being decapitated by Ubala Pung. Another big fat hint about the nature of Karsa's destiny when she was freed by Karsa back in House of Chains, it was another plot-thread that could've been picked up. Instead it was wasted.
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Apr 8, 2011 00:01
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Boogle posted:TCG spoilersIf anything Calm should've been one of the characters involved in the Karsa trilogy instead of being decapitated by Ubala Pung. Another big fat hint about the nature of Karsa's destiny when she was freed by Karsa back in House of Chains, it was another plot-thread that could've been picked up. Instead it was wasted. I wouldn't say it was wasted... I think it was meant to be a statement of sorts. It was very, very deliberate. From what I make out, with her thinking it's Karsa at first, her predictions that she'd be his downfall, and her asking his friends to betray him, only for them to end up in a position to do just that in the most lethal way, I think it's a statement on destiny. On how we're not tied to it. Nothing can ever truly be forseen. We all know she'd face Karsa, his sword would shatter as his friends "stood aside", and she'd quite possibly kill him. Instead we have her killed, and not even by Karsa himself but rather a follower of his. It's both a comment on destiny and one final word on the whole "old vs new" theme that's ran through the series. The meanest mofo from a few thousand years ago might wake up to find itself barely a threat in the new world.
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Apr 8, 2011 00:18
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Karsa would have beaten the crap out of her with his bare hands and everyone knows it. I still like how he resolved that thread just because it was unexpected and fresh.
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Apr 8, 2011 02:17
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Boogle posted:TCG spoilersIf anything Calm should've been one of the characters involved in the Karsa trilogy instead of being decapitated by Ubala Pung. Another big fat hint about the nature of Karsa's destiny when she was freed by Karsa back in House of Chains, it was another plot-thread that could've been picked up. Instead it was wasted. I agree it would have been pretty interesting, however I disagree saying that any instance of Ubala kicking rear end is a waste. By the way, I still wonder how well Ubala can keep Icarium's anger in check since he doesn't even really know about it and what it can do.
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Apr 8, 2011 09:45
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Decius posted:I agree it would have been pretty interesting, however I disagree saying that any instance of Ubala kicking rear end is a waste. [spoiler]Knowing Ubala, he probably recognizes that Icarium can, like Draconus, probably kick his rear end, and will aim to keep him as happy as possible by dancing, screwing chickens, eating chickens, screwing then eating chickens, etc...[/spoiler
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Apr 8, 2011 18:05
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you forgot a closing bracket there 
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Apr 8, 2011 19:32
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Decius posted:I agree it would have been pretty interesting, however I disagree saying that any instance of Ubala kicking rear end is a waste. If Ublala does a good job, he won't ever have to know Icarium's anger is a thing to be worried about.
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Apr 9, 2011 04:03
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I do like the maybe not so big reveal that Shadowthrone was ICE's character and Cotillion is Erikson's. I think phrasing it as 'post-modern fantasy' is a little much, though. Edit: also this quote:epic fantasy literature is the spine of genre (SRD went on to say that in fact it’s the spine of Western Literature) ahahahahaha  Erikson sounds a little up his own rear end, to tell you the truth. HeroOfTheRevolution fucked around with this message at 08:19 on Apr 9, 2011 |
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Apr 9, 2011 08:15
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Habibi posted:He'll string us along for years until it turns out that, ta-da, QB is an illusory manifestation along the lines of Nefarious Bredd. Did SE bombadil the intarwebs?
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Apr 9, 2011 09:36
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HeroOfTheRevolution posted:Erikson sounds a little up his own rear end, to tell you the truth. I don't think he (Donaldson - it wasn't Erikson who said it) is that far off. Look how much of the literature "canon" has fantastical elements in it, some bordering outright into Epic High Fantasy. And things like the Gilgamesh epos, Homer etc. is pretty much the foundation of much of our literature. Decius fucked around with this message at 11:18 on Apr 9, 2011 |
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Apr 9, 2011 11:09
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Decius posted:I don't think he (Donaldson - it wasn't Erikson who said it) is that far off. Look how much of the literature "canon" has fantastical elements in it, some bordering outright into Epic High Fantasy. And things like the Gilgamesh epos, Homer etc. is pretty much the foundation of much of our literature. When I think of epic fantasy, I think Lord of the Rings, not the Iliad. While mythology is a hugely important part of Western literature, it's not 'epic fantasy.' Drizzt books and Malazan books are not the newest wave in the foundation of Western literary tradition. Also Gilgamesh isn't Western.
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Apr 9, 2011 11:49
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Well, that's what they mean, though. Even Tolkien has its origin in a number of antecedent mythologies that were "rewritten" by Tolkien.
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Apr 9, 2011 13:22
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HeroOfTheRevolution posted:When I think of epic fantasy, I think Lord of the Rings, not the Iliad. Why? Erikson borrows much more heavily from Homer than Tolkien.
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Apr 9, 2011 16:22
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Not really. Mythology still has some basis in fact and is important as a cultural outlet. The Iliad depicts a historical war between two real places at its heart, even if it uses mythical elements to do so, and also depicts the way people of Classical Greece lived. The Malazan world is complete fiction, and I think that is the line between 'fantasy' and 'epic poem.' I think that's the big difference, and why I'd be incredibly hesitant to imply that 'epic high fantasy' is core to Western literary tradition.
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Apr 9, 2011 16:59
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HeroOfTheRevolution posted:I do like the maybe not so big reveal that Shadowthrone was ICE's character and Cotillion is Erikson's. I think phrasing it as 'post-modern fantasy' is a little much, though. Cotillion is a perfect fit for Erikson. They both seem to dwell overmuch on the negative side of life and the consequences of their own actions, and both could use some cheering up. I was kind of confused by that interview too- Erikson seems to ignore several questions in order to make grandiose statements (which I must confess I skipped over- sorry Steve, but I've had just about enough of your verbosity at this point), and he seems to have a pretty lofty opinion of himself and his writing. "Post-modern fantasy?" Give me a break. Malazan is good, but it's not that good. Juaguocio fucked around with this message at 23:38 on Apr 9, 2011 |
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Apr 9, 2011 23:35
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quote != edit
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Apr 9, 2011 23:37
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Decius posted:I agree it would have been pretty interesting, however I disagree saying that any instance of Ubala kicking rear end is a waste. Regarding the story arc of the whole series, I'm not sure myself. I haven't read the early books in a while now, but from what I remember, there is talk of justice throughout the entire series. People abdicating responsibility to gods, and the gods not responding. Then the Crippled God comes along and actively seeks worshippers, and just gives to people. I think that's why he was an "alien" god, and why Koryk breaks down when he sees Cotillion killing him; this is the kind of god people want but he simply can't exist in their world. The Bridgeburners forsake all this and just do their own thing. Then Tavore comes along and directs that freedom towards the greater good. I do think there should have been more emphasis on the Crippled God throughout the series, along with the Forkrul Assail. Some more POV from the Forkrul Assail would have fleshed things out a bit, but I suppose Erikson wanted to make it a story personal to the Malazans.
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Apr 10, 2011 00:06
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Juaguocio posted:I was kind of confused by that interview too- Erikson seems to ignore several questions in order to make grandiose statements (which I must confess I skipped over- sorry Steve, but I've had just about enough of your verbosity at this point), and he seems to have a pretty lofty opinion of himself and his writing. "Post-modern fantasy?" Give me a break. Malazan is good, but it's not that good. so, "post-modern" means "good" to you?
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Apr 10, 2011 03:43
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while I'd say that postmodern literature is pretty much the best you could read of the Western canon of literature, I think he meant that Malazan is good, but it's not good enough to create a whole new genre or anything.
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Apr 10, 2011 09:04
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Self-insert characters aren't exactly groundbreaking in the fantasy genre.
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Apr 10, 2011 09:42
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Azure_Horizon posted:while I'd say that postmodern literature is pretty much the best you could read of the Western canon of literature, I think he meant that Malazan is good, but it's not good enough to create a whole new genre or anything. Pretty much this. There are parts of the series that are obviously influenced by postmodernism, but there are also parts that are clearly taken straight from the author's GURPS campaigns, with no subtext beyond "here's some cool fantasy stuff." I'm not trying to put down Malazan excessively here because I do think Erikson has accomplished something extraordinary with the series, but he ain't exactly Thomas Pynchon.
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Apr 10, 2011 10:00
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ah, i misinterpreted your sentence. i see what you're saying now.
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Apr 10, 2011 11:52
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