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Mukaikubo posted:
If the Clanner was really hitting on her wouldn't http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF0HhrwIwp0 be just as good? Speaking of the Clanner he needs to get his rear end into the forest. What is he, chicken?
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Apr 15, 2011 02:34
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Trast posted:If the Clanner was really hitting on her wouldn't http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RF0HhrwIwp0 be just as good? Every turn he wastes is fine by me.
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Apr 15, 2011 02:35
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Defiance Industries posted:Every turn he wastes is fine by me. Yeah might as well let him keep pontificating, maybe we'll run out of turns before he's actually ready to fight.
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Apr 15, 2011 02:43
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The Merry Marauder posted:If it moves in a circle, it's going to run into a lot of Long Tom shells along the way. Longinus00 posted:Dropship uses its shooting while landed mod and hits the madcat mk 2 most of the time while having erppcs and gauss rifles with way more ammunition than the madcat mk 2 has. Dropship also doesn't have to worry about tacs or headshots while the madcat mk 2 does. If you go and use the upgraded tech version then things get different, but at that point you're starting to twink out a smidge, so the Madcat MK II can just replace the Gauss with ERPPC and stay outside all but the range of the two ERPPC on the Dropship. Even stationary there's a good change the Dropship goes down first.
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Apr 15, 2011 02:45
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This battle is ridiculously compelling - like, I'm on the edge of my seat waiting to see how things turn out. I'm anxiously awaiting the results of a minatures wargame being played over the internet by people I don't know. ...what the hell? Seriously, what the hell? This fight hasn't even ended and yet I'm still more emotionally invested in it than I have been in any of the Battletech games I actually played with real people in face-to-face interactions. Kudos, PTN. Big, big kudos.
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Apr 15, 2011 02:46
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If that second LRM had hit there would be no Cyclops right now. Artemis FCS makes LRMs scary.
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Apr 15, 2011 02:52
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Arquinsiel posted:Have you seen how Artillery is actually fired on the same mapsheet? I'd still give the Madcat II the favourite spot in this race, what with the +4 to hit for the Dropship and auto-hitting at worst for the 'Mech. If you're going to swap out weapons on the Madcat 2 why not swap out the gauss rifles on the fortress to erppcs as well?
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Apr 15, 2011 02:55
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^^^^ Fortunately, the Clans didn't think to invent the OmniShip or we'd be in serious trouble.KnoxZone posted:If that second LRM had hit there would be no Cyclops right now. Artemis FCS makes LRMs scary. Cyclops keeps its AC20 ammo in the right torso; so he was damned lucky I didn't roll over a '7' on the crit table. It would've been a very Steiner way to go. VVVV He has initiative. He's moved, you just don't get to see where. (I'll give you a hint, there will be face-to-face punchings) PoptartsNinja fucked around with this message at 02:58 on Apr 15, 2011 |
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Apr 15, 2011 02:55
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Defiance Industries posted:Every turn he wastes is fine by me. Negative, I demand epic robot fights. I walk Samantha "Mukai" Clover's mech to punch the other mechs clean off. I want the head to roll to the foot of Star Colonel Dusk's assault mech. Then as she ponders what hell the Steiners have wrought Clover places her right leg atop the now smoldering wreck and flexes her mech arms. Unexploded LRM rounds in the forest suddenly ignite behind her setting off a pyrotechnic explosion worthy of song and praise.
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Apr 15, 2011 02:56
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PoptartsNinja posted:VVVV He has initiative. He's moved, you just don't get to see where. (I'll give you a hint, there will be face-to-face punchings) As the Steiner Rules intended. 
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Apr 15, 2011 03:03
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Longinus00 posted:If you're going to swap out weapons on the Madcat 2 why not swap out the gauss rifles on the fortress to erppcs as well?
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Apr 15, 2011 03:07
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Dammit, this thread kinda makes me want to start a Let's Play Warhammer 40k thread. I've already figured out Logistics too. (Grid with each square representing 1 inch perhaps)
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Apr 15, 2011 03:11
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DivineCoffeeBinge posted:This battle is ridiculously compelling - like, I'm on the edge of my seat waiting to see how things turn out. That, my friends, is the power of the Pasty Assassin. Also, yeah. I want to see what's going on here. I want to see some face-to-face action. I want to see Sammy Clover start taking Clanner heads with a burning fricking tree as a melee weapon.
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Apr 15, 2011 03:15
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So is physical combat effectively simultaneous with shooting? Or does the Cyclops not only have to survive incoming fire, but survive with all its parts intact to swing that club? Bonus points if the Colonel knocks the Mugger's head into the bleachers while standing on one leg.
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Apr 15, 2011 03:16
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Narsham posted:So is physical combat effectively simultaneous with shooting? Or does the Cyclops not only have to survive incoming fire, but survive with all its parts intact to swing that club? No, the Physical Combat phase comes after shooting. That said, she challenged him to physical combat. That means that he's probably not going to shoot if she doesn't. She has the advantage in a slugging brawl, so it's in her best interests to stick to "Steiner Rules Dueling".
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Apr 15, 2011 03:17
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Arquinsiel posted:Have you seen how Artillery is actually fired on the same mapsheet? I'd still give the Madcat II the favourite spot in this race, what with the +4 to hit for the Dropship and auto-hitting at worst for the 'Mech. Artillery fire is only forced to be Direct if the target is w/n 18 hexes, even on the same mapsheet. KnoxZone posted:If that second LRM had hit there would be no Cyclops right now. Artemis FCS makes LRMs scary. Maybe on a 20. You get, what, 3ish extra damage expectation? FCCW and later battles tend to be awash in ECM in my experience, so I usually give it a miss if I have selection.
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Apr 15, 2011 03:19
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bunnyofdoom posted:Dammit, this thread kinda makes me want to start a Let's Play Warhammer 40k thread. I've already figured out Logistics too. (Grid with each square representing 1 inch perhaps)  This would be awesome, and I heartily approve.
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Apr 15, 2011 03:24
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The Merry Marauder posted:Artillery fire is only forced to be Direct if the target is w/n 18 hexes, even on the same mapsheet. Artemis FCS can still be useful if you can spare a ton and 1 crit slot for an ECM suite of your own, then have it in ECCM mode. ECM Suites are rarely a bad idea.
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Apr 15, 2011 03:30
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ShadowDragon8685 posted:No, the Physical Combat phase comes after shooting. It's not Lt. Clover I'm worried about, it's Rossi. Maybe the Mauler pilot's trigger finger will slip or something. It's time for this Viper to roll some snake-eyes.
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Apr 15, 2011 03:35
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The odds are not in Rossi's favour. He's got really no choice but to try, of course, and maybe he'll beat the odds hard and crush that clanner, but the raw numbers aren't friendly. Looks like it'll be down/up to Samantha to play run-and-hide for as long as she can. Good luck!
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Apr 15, 2011 03:51
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bunnyofdoom posted:Dammit, this thread kinda makes me want to start a Let's Play Warhammer 40k thread. I've already figured out Logistics too. (Grid with each square representing 1 inch perhaps) I wouldn't even bother with a grid, the uncertainty of it all would be interesting when we're saying "move that way fast" rather than "4.5 inches so I'm just inside range but outside charge range" etc.
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Apr 15, 2011 03:58
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Yeah, Colonel Rossi looks to be pretty screwed. If he can survive the shooting round with the clanner, I guess he could try swinging his tree club and perhaps bashing the gently caress out of the Mugger. Maybe if he managed to land a hit with that AC20 before swinging the thing... I dunno, things aren't looking good to my admittedly inexperienced eye...
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Apr 15, 2011 04:09
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Arquinsiel posted:If you play it as Imperial Guard then that'd totally rock. One would assume he'd have multiple factions available for the various players, that's part of what is great about the 40k universe. Lots of variety in who fights what, and everyone hates everyone else (with some basic exceptions like the Space Marines getting along okay-ish with the Guard). I haven't actually played the tabletop version of 40k, because honestly... I'm way too lazy for all that. But I had friends who played it back in the day, and I enjoy the 40k video games and I've read some of the novels. So a 40k thread would still be very interesting. (And it needs Orks.  )
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Apr 15, 2011 04:11
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Arquinsiel posted:I wouldn't even bother with a grid, the uncertainty of it all would be interesting when we're saying "move that way fast" rather than "4.5 inches so I'm just inside range but outside charge range" etc. Yep, ditching the grid system would be good. If you have the units, or even just bases and cutouts to proxy for units and terrain if you can paint good word-pictures, photo-documenting the turns on a real board/floor would be great and fit the uncertainty of the measuring of a real game. Or you can work up computer graphic battlemaps like PoptartsNinja's and a scaled ruler. Either would be fine. The trick would be whipping up something like the fluff and character that Poptarts brings to this thread. Another suggestion: build out the rosters for each faction with people signing up for a specific one who play for that faction when they show up in battles. Hell! You could even take the Goon vs Thread formats like the SPMBT thread. Goons sign up to have the thread play their army. The thread chooses the opposing force and commands it against a goon who plays and photo-documents the battle on their own board with their own pieces and (if necessary) opposing proxies.
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Apr 15, 2011 05:19
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This has absolutely proven to me that PTN and my GM used two different systems. My GM gave bonuses if what we wanted to do was sufficiently Awesome. Of course, if PTN was doing that the Unwearied Second would be undefeatable. As it should be.
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Apr 15, 2011 05:24
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If we were playing the 'Mechwarrior RPG? I'd consider that. But since it doesn't benefit anyone to flub the rules in a tabletop wargame (slippery slope: if I can do it for the players I can do it for myself and then it just becomes as case of 'welp, this is what I want to happen' as opposed to 'welp, that happened, now I write about it')
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Apr 15, 2011 05:45
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I don't think it would do much to improve the thread to fudge the rolls for either side. What's the fun in winning if the GM is basically helping you cheat? We've seen the players kill opposing mechs in one shot (or at least disable them horribly), and opposing mechs score lucky headshots. Part of what drives the game is that at any point, you could get a really lucky shot that changes the battle. Or your machine gun ammo could cook off and take out a city block.
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Apr 15, 2011 06:10
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Zaodai posted:One would assume he'd have multiple factions available for the various players, that's part of what is great about the 40k universe. Lots of variety in who fights what, and everyone hates everyone else (with some basic exceptions like the Space Marines getting along okay-ish with the Guard). WEll, poo poo son, of course. I would be doing that. I was thinking of doing it kinda like PTN did this thread, with a slight alternative universe feel to it. Like I'm thinking, what if Abaddon actually took Cadia in the 13th Crusdade? Or what if Yarrick died from his wounds during the second Armageddon war? And Yes there would be Orks. This is all theory at this stage. If I did do it, it would be well after finals finish for me on the 27th.
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Apr 15, 2011 06:19
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So can someone with a stronger understanding of Battletech rules than me give us a best-guess on the players' chance to win, partially and/or totally?
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Apr 15, 2011 06:50
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bunnyofdoom posted:WEll, poo poo son, of course. I would be doing that. I was thinking of doing it kinda like PTN did this thread, with a slight alternative universe feel to it. Like I'm thinking, what if Abaddon actually took Cadia in the 13th Crusdade? Or what if Yarrick died from his wounds during the second Armageddon war? If you're going to go that route, how about the ultimate What-If scenario: The Emperor survives the Heresy. In fact, he's not even wounded. Sanguinus arrives before Horus, and the two meet the traitor head on. Horus is slain, but Sanguinus is mortally wounded. He is placed upon the Golden Throne, and the Emperor resumes his conquest. Now aware that keeping Humanity in the dark about Chaos is worse than not, the Emperor openly reveals their existence. They are presented as being incredibly powerful alien beings that seek only the complete destruction of Man and all his Works. The Emperor also ruthlessly seeks out and destroys as many religions that revere him as a god that he can find. So, let's explore what grimdark would be like without the Space Church of Man.
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Apr 15, 2011 06:56
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ZeeToo posted:So can someone with a stronger understanding of Battletech rules than me give us a best-guess on the players' chance to win, partially and/or totally? I'd say the Colonel needs to win initiative on the Mugger and keep it, and just go to town with the ac 20 and the club/fists. He outweighs the Mugger and in theory the Mugger won't respond with physical attacks -- but the LRMs are a bitch. He should still be able to out-damage it and hopefully leave it crippled. Samantha needs to win her duel. She outweighs and severely out-armours the Lucerne, so she should be able to. If the Colonel can at leave the Mugger in bad shape she could challenge it to a physical duel as well, maybe leaning on the fact that she's dumped her ammo for 'honourable duels' under Steiner rules. If she continues challenging mechs to come after her in the forest fire (which she should be able to sink merrily without weapons fire or engine crits) she can wait for the assaults to come lumbering after her. That's pretty much it. If they can win their current duels and keep up the duelling, the reduced damage from physical combat makes Samantha the best bet for dragging this out. IMO.
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Apr 15, 2011 07:09
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ZeeToo posted:So can someone with a stronger understanding of Battletech rules than me give us a best-guess on the players' chance to win, partially and/or totally? My understanding of the rules isn't terribly strong, in all honesty, but it's non-zero; I figure that qualifies me to give an opinion but keep in mind that other peoples' opinions may differ and they're probably right because they're smarter than me. Anyways, the players' chance to win looks to me to be low but non-zero. Next round is the key - if the Cyclops survives and gets to that Mugger to lay some HTH smackdown and if the dice go his way, then there's a chance that the Mugger could get put down... but really, Rossi's Cyclops isn't the main attraction here. That distinction belongs to Fan Favorite Lt. Samantha Clover and her "Steiner Rules" punch-out with the Lucerne. Even if Rossi's Cyclops gets cored by the Mugger, chances are that the Mugger will be constrained by honor rules to stop shooting and/or hitting things until the Zeus/Lucerne duel is complete, so the chances are reasonably high that Clover will be able to draw the battle out for several rounds; the fact that you get only one physical attack per turn limits the damage-throwing potential of both 'Mechs, which will keep the fight lasting longer than it might otherwise (not to mention negating the Clan advantage of superior gunnery skill and mo' better guns to use it with - hell, if memory serves the Clan pilots are actually penalized for physical attacks). I don't think the fight is going to last 9 turns, but if Clover can make the fight last at least, say, five turns then she may be able to issue a similar challenge to the Mugger's pilot, and if Rossi is successful in battering the Mugger up a bit then there's a decent chance that the Mugger may have to spend, say, 2 turns reaching her, and then it's just a matter of staying alive for just 2 more turns... A lot of things have to go right for the Unwearied Second to pull out a win, and the dice could well screw the pooch for them (hell, if Clover gets stupidly lucky and KOs the Lucerne with a punch in the proverbial nose and knocks out its pilot or something, that fantastic victory could actually screw the Steiners in the long run). At present I'd give them... say 30% odds, but that could all change very shortly. So, yeah. Rossi's the sideshow right now unless he gets ridiculously lucky; Clover's the main event. I think the current course of action is probably the best one the team has available - the "Steiner Rules" challenge was sheer fuckin' brilliance - and gives them their best shot of winning, but even that best shot is longer'n one might hope. (edited to add - I actually think that, depending on how Rossi does, the odds of a total victory might actually be better than the odds of a partial; if Rossi gets shot to poo poo by the Mugger, then Clover might be able to keep the duel alive long enough to hit the 20-turn mark pass while the Mugger is still standing. If Rossi kills the Mugger dead, though, it's anyone's guess, because then Clover has to draw out the duel for as long as possible to keep the Assault Star out of action for as long as possible.) DivineCoffeeBinge fucked around with this message at 07:19 on Apr 15, 2011 |
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Apr 15, 2011 07:16
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bunnyofdoom posted:Dammit, this thread kinda makes me want to start a Let's Play Warhammer 40k thread. I've already figured out Logistics too. (Grid with each square representing 1 inch perhaps) I would really love to see this.
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Apr 15, 2011 07:30
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RickVoid posted:If you're going to go that route, how about the ultimate What-If scenario: Wouldn't that pretty much cripple the Imperium? I mean all their voodoo magic poo poo is attuned to the continual psychic presence of the Emperor. I guess they'd never really lose most of their technology at that point (because I assume the Emperor wouldn't let that poo poo stand), but that'd lead to entirely different armies and technology and the like. It'd be impossible to write a game like that and have it actually be 40k. But as far as the LP setting goes, you could always have us fighting a smaller aspect of a more famous battle. There were plenty of fights not directly covered in the Wars for Armageddon and the like. You can use the overall setting without making it a reenactment of a famous battle. Or use the location as a reason but change who is attacking or why. Plenty of directions you could go without having to change the timeline up for it. 40k has a shitload of wars against everyone, which makes it a little easier to insert your own battles compared to BattleTech where PTN needed to make an alternate universe because so many of the major wars were pretty firmly on rails. Don't get me wrong, I think PTN has done a great job so far fluff wise (even if he won't send Mechwarrior Knox away in shame.  ), but I think his alternate universe was more out of necessity than choice. Otherwise it's pretty much "Well, you can fight the Succession Wars, or you can fight the Clan Wars. Or you can open the big bag of retardation that is the Jihad and the after effects."
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Apr 15, 2011 07:48
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Zaodai posted:I haven't actually played the tabletop version of 40k, because honestly... I'm way too lazy for all that. Spoiler Alert: It's actually not a great game system. The turn structure takes forever, tanks are generally either incredibly hard targets or so fragile they're a liability, armies that focus on close combat are overpowered (but less so than in past editions when they were virtually unstoppable) and, worst of all in many people's opinion, GW churns out a constant stream of special rules that bog down play and muck up balance to no end. 40K is popular because the fluff is really fun and the art direction has improved consistently for years. The game itself is ridiculously expensive and time-consuming before you even get to the tabletop. When you finally finish that army many people discover that playing a 4+ hour game with "standard" army sizes isn't their cup of tea after all. Then you discover that your army is not competitive because the meta-game is dominated by specific lists that mostly focus on extremely powerful mechanic X, and that in fact the top tier of play consists of only 1 or 2 army lists because that list happens to have unit A that both exploits powerful mechanic X and unbalanced special rule Y. The worst offender was the CybOrk Nob Biker unit that had an entire suite of special rules that literally rewrote the basic damage-allocation and armor rules that applied to everything else in the game. The unit quickly came to dominate play because it was literally subject to a different basic ruleset than the rest of the game. I would actually totally be interested in running an LP like this because it's so easy to do fluffy 40K stories that are fun, but I have no idea what kind of tool (is there a java tool for 40K?) to use or how to run a game that wouldn't take three weeks of updates just to get halfway through. If anyone is really interested in talking about setting up a 40K LP send me a PM, but we definitely shouldn't poo poo up the BattleTech LP with endless 40K fluff discussions that seem to already be starting! Zaodai resist! RESIST! Arglebargle III fucked around with this message at 08:12 on Apr 15, 2011 |
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Apr 15, 2011 07:53
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So if we hold for 20 turns the DropShips come online and take off, right? What happens to the people on the ground?
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Apr 15, 2011 08:07
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Defiance Industries posted:So if we hold for 20 turns the DropShips come online and take off, right? They'd get captured if they couldn't board the dropships in time I guess. This fight is getting metal as gently caress.
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Apr 15, 2011 08:11
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PoptartsNinja posted:If we were playing the 'Mechwarrior RPG? I'd consider that. But since it doesn't benefit anyone to flub the rules in a tabletop wargame (slippery slope: if I can do it for the players I can do it for myself and then it just becomes as case of 'welp, this is what I want to happen' as opposed to 'welp, that happened, now I write about it') Oh trust me, I know. It's just that this entire situation really drove home the difference for me, given the whole "Fistfight in a forest fire" thing v  v
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Apr 15, 2011 08:12
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Defiance Industries posted:So if we hold for 20 turns the DropShips come online and take off, right? This is a really good question. There's a star of Clan assault mechs standing directly in front of a dropship that needs a runway to take off. That could either be very bad or very good for our Steiner heroes, depending on how PTN wants to interpret the relative masses and forces involved. Dude I was just joking about how 40K makes people 'sperg. No need to apologize. \/\/\/
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Apr 15, 2011 08:15
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Arglebargle III posted:Zaodai resist! RESIST! Why am I always the one accused of making GBS threads up the thread? In this case, I didn't even start the derail.  But yeah, I did ramble on a bit. Sorry. Defiance Industries posted:So if we hold for 20 turns the DropShips come online and take off, right? I think the DropShips come online and wreck the Clans poo poo, then pick up the survivors and ride off into the sunset. Or maybe just the sun. The important thing is, Steel Vipers die and we all get pancakes. Hooray!
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Apr 15, 2011 08:15
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