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Metonymy posted:But he really doesn't! I don't know. The story is entertaining enough, if wordy and juvenile at times. I enjoy reading it, but I also don't like thinking too hard about it. It's like Harry Potter if it was written by a GBS goon.
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Apr 13, 2011 07:50
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Keep in mind, while some of the events may seem ultimately irrelevant and just "fat" to be cut out, I find most everything builds up quite nicely to an overall thematic message about the nature of storytelling and how we shape the world around us through them, instead of the world shaping our stories. Also, a little fat never hurt. Edit: Okay, fine, maybe it's more than a little fat. It's just a double cheeseburger though. You finished it, right?
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Apr 13, 2011 10:53
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When I pick up a book I literally sit down and read it until I am physically incapable of reading anymore. I read WMF in two sittings, and so the more drawn-out parts of the book didn't really bother me at all. I'm not defending them, though. His editor really needs to grow a pair and tell him that his stuff just rants on and on.
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Apr 13, 2011 13:42
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I just finished Wise Man's Fear - goooood god, that was a long book. I read it on my Kindle, and I swear I was at 98% for like, two hours. Even though a lot of it drove me crazy and probably half could have been edited out, I still find myself... missing it? I don't know, I got so wrapped up in the world of Kvothe that it's kind of disappointing to pick up my Kindle and not have more to read.  Also, with Felurian, was I the only one who thought of Avatar? When the bioluminescent moths gathered around them I just started giggling.
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Apr 13, 2011 14:22
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Metonymy posted:But he really doesn't! Usually "tells a good story" is a colloquialism for someone telling a story well, not telling a story that is good. I read a lot, and with his books I have to physically blink myself out of them because I'm so engrossed in the world. That is a good storyteller. When you're done and look back, you definitely wonder if the story was worth telling, but he writes very well.
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Apr 13, 2011 14:35
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Junk Science posted:Except Rothfuss has said in interviews that not everything has a purpose. Something along the lines of (paraphrasing) "It's a biography. Every part of someone's life isn't about some big overarching plot."
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Apr 13, 2011 14:57
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I think Rothfuss is quite good at pacing on a page-by-page level. Within the individual narratives, things progress very comfortably; descriptions are interesting and not overlong, dialogue and action and dramatic tension all flow together with the gift of a good storyteller. The breakdown is when he is stringing these narratives together to tell an overarching story, and I kind of believe that the grand plot just isn't as important to him.
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Apr 13, 2011 15:30
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Habibi posted:It's going to turn out that he has to sex the Chandrian to death, and that all of his adventures learning sympathy / naming / how to be a ninja are going to be incidental to him literally raping the Chandrian with whispering hands. If this were true, I would send that man so much money.
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Apr 13, 2011 21:03
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Habibi posted:It's going to turn out that he has to sex the Chandrian to death, and that all of his adventures learning sympathy / naming / how to be a ninja are going to be incidental to him literally raping the Chandrian with whispering hands. If the series had this ending I would withdraw all my criticisms of it. One Chandrian's weakness is fire, one is iron, and one is RAPE.
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Apr 13, 2011 22:44
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It is the only logical conclusion because Nina described some of the Chandrians on the pot as "there was a woman with no clothes on, and a broken sword, and a fire ...."
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Apr 13, 2011 22:57
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Rape..... and Lemoncakes. Oh god, it's happening. G.R.R.M. George Rothfuss Rothfuss Martin.
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Apr 14, 2011 07:34
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I haven't read any of GRRM's stuff, can someone enlighten me about the lemoncakes? Google wasn't very helpful.
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Apr 14, 2011 14:03
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Above Our Own posted:I haven't read any of GRRM's stuff, can someone enlighten me about the lemoncakes? Google wasn't very helpful. Lemoncakes cannot be explained, only experienced. Now, bend over.
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Apr 14, 2011 14:26
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It's basically what the nobility considers a tasty treat, and they are a few characters favourites from what I remember. Goons blew it out of proportion like they do everything else.
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Apr 14, 2011 17:24
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I just finished it and then read the thread. I thoroughly enjoyed it and felt the only major criticisms I had were the eye-rolling sex stuff and that it dragged a bit too much at the University and with the Bandit Hunting. Overall though I think it was a fantastic read. I am the only one who doesn't mind that he spends extra time detailing the smaller pieces of the character's life? I have to agree with a poster on the previous page that if the author gets one thing right, it's his ability to really engross you in his Kvothe's world. After 200 page binges I also felt I had to blink a few times and snap myself out of it back into the real world. However, like everyone else I wonder how he is going to manage to pace the story correctly with so much left to tell in the 3rd book. He mentioned in that interview linked earlier that he already wrote the entire thing, but ended up adding a lot to the original story and then consequently had to make a lot of changes to book 2. My guess is that when he goes back to change book 3 he will end up splitting it into 2 books. As for spoiler stuff I think the spoiler article linked is pretty much right on the money about most things: Bredon is most probably both amyr and Denna's patron The Amyr are not going to be bad guys Kvothe's mother was lackless for sure. As for the argument about whether he has been expelled yet or not. I'm pretty sure Hemme becoming Chancellor in the last 25 pages of the book is an obvious set up to get him kicked out of the university right at the beginning of the 3rd book. Some questions I'll throw up for discussion: What role do you think the Chtaeh will play? As in do you think Kvothe will find some way to "beat it" by not having everything end in poo poo for both himself and the entire world? Denna is obviously very important to the story, but I'm not sure exactly how she will end up affecting it. I wonder what plot twist will be used to tie her elegantly into everything. Do you think Abenthy will ever show up again? It would be pretty amusing if all of this was just a very long winded way of setting up Baast as the main character for another arch where he goes and fixes everything. Baast and Elodin are the best characters by far. Now that this is over I find myself wanting more. I've read GRRM and attempted to read Jordan (ugh), but haven't touched Abercrombie, Erickson, or Sanderson's stuff yet. I'm not sure which one to go to next. Are there any other awesome series I should be aware of? Megasabin fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Apr 14, 2011 |
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Apr 14, 2011 23:04
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Megasabin posted:Now that this is over I find myself wanting more. I've read GRRM and attempted to read Jordan (ugh), but haven't touched Abercrombie, Erickson, or Sanderson's stuff yet. I'm not sure which one to go to next. Are there any other awesome series I should be aware of? Of those three, I'd recommend Abercrombie. Erickson is very dense and complicated and can be a bit of a slog at times. Sanderson is pretty much the exact opposite, his plots tend to be very by-the-numbers and his characters aren't particularly well developed, although his settings are interesting. If it's just good fantasy you're after, I'd recommend David Gemmell. Start with Legend or maybe the Rigante series.
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Apr 14, 2011 23:52
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Megasabin posted:Now that this is over I find myself wanting more. I've read GRRM and attempted to read Jordan (ugh), but haven't touched Abercrombie, Erickson, or Sanderson's stuff yet. I'm not sure which one to go to next. Are there any other awesome series I should be aware of? Abercrombie for some very [almost intentionally overly-] gritty, character-level enjoyment. Erickson if you want to see some masterful world/story-building, but as Flatscan said, it is not the easiest of reads - if nothing else, just because there's so much going no and so much you need to learn. Sanderson I find to be a pretty good writer of fairly generic fantasy. He's not as bad as Eddings, but I wouldn't put him near the same category as Martin, Erickson, Abercrombie, etc...
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Apr 15, 2011 00:07
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Megasabin posted:Now that this is over I find myself wanting more. I've read GRRM and attempted to read Jordan (ugh), but haven't touched Abercrombie, Erickson, or Sanderson's stuff yet. I'm not sure which one to go to next. Are there any other awesome series I should be aware of? Read Gene Wolfe's Book Of The New Sun. In fact, that goes for everyone reading this thread. Wolfe does the world-building/unreliable narrator thing better than anyone (yes, even Erikson).
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Apr 15, 2011 04:10
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Read Faulkner's As I Lay Dying. In fact, that goes for everyone reading this thread. Faulkner does the world-building/unreliable narrator thing better than anyone (yes, even Erikson). Good Books Crew.
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Apr 15, 2011 16:03
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Why should I trust someone whose name is Liesmith? 
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Apr 15, 2011 18:19
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Sophia posted:Usually "tells a good story" is a colloquialism for someone telling a story well, not telling a story that is good. I read a lot, and with his books I have to physically blink myself out of them because I'm so engrossed in the world. That is a good storyteller. When you're done and look back, you definitely wonder if the story was worth telling, but he writes very well. I think you've hit the nail on the head. Rothfuss' prose is excellent but the plot? Eh, just ok.
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Apr 15, 2011 20:53
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Could someone please tell me what chapter Exal Dal(?) showed Kvothe that he knew the name of Fire. I can't seem to find it.
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Apr 16, 2011 00:17
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Hughmoris posted:Could someone please tell me what chapter Elxa Dal showed Kvothe that he knew the name of Fire. I can't seem to find it. Near the start, Chapter 22.
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Apr 16, 2011 00:44
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Rothfuss reading another author's sex scene dialog with her at a book reading: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3Q7FziQb44 ...
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Apr 18, 2011 18:12
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God I can smell him through my computer screen
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Apr 18, 2011 19:50
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Jesus, he looks like the bastard child of George Martin.
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Apr 18, 2011 19:54
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Inbred bastard child. With George around, you know incest can't be far behind.
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Apr 18, 2011 19:55
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Flatscan posted:Jesus, he looks like the bastard child of George Martin. George R. R. Snow.
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Apr 19, 2011 14:04
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Does anyone else find Bast's reactions and generally feelings toward Kvothe very strange to the point of creepiness. I kind of think he's his son/ related to him some how
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Apr 21, 2011 20:56
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Hollis posted:Does anyone else find Bast's reactions and generally feelings toward Kvothe very strange to the point of creepiness. I kind of think he's his son/ related to him some how Anything is possible, of course, but Bast was specifically introduced as "Bastas, son of Remmen, Prince of Twilight and the Telwyth Mael." Someone brought up that same theory in the Tor.com re-read of this series that now exists for some reason. Although now that I think about it, the phrase I just quoted doesn't specify whether Bast or Remmen is the Prince; Remmen might turn out to be the Queen, which would make her vulnerable to whichever supernatural powers allow Kvothe to seduce every woman he happens across.
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Apr 22, 2011 05:05
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I am reading Name of the Wind. This book went from interesting to boring in a hell of a hurry. By the time of the he goes to Trebon to hunt Chandrian, I already knew he'd somehow run across Denna there. This is the most boring romance to which I have ever been subjected. I was bitching to a friend about how Kvothe is purported to be this sort of morally gray character, when in he fact he simply comes across to me as a nerd Mary Sue. He thinks he's a badass, but he is always entirely benevolent, with the exception of a little a stealing as a starving child on the streets of Tarbean, which I believe we would all forgive. My friend said that he thought this was intentional. That Kvothe pictures himself this way, and that's one of his flaws. This sort of egotistical uberdork (who also happens to be just really, really good at everything and handsome and speaks seven languages and is the most talented wizard... er sympathist that has maybe ever even been to University). Either way. He's an annoying, hover-handing, dork. edit: Urgh. Parts of this feel like they were ripped from a smug and misguided E/N post. Some neckbeard posted:I have known her long, my smile said. True, you have been inside the circle of her arms, tasted her mouth, felt the warmth of her, and that is something I have never had. But there is a part of her that is only for me. You cannot touch it, no matter how hard you might try. And after she has left you I will still be here, making her laugh. My light shining in her. I will still be here long after she has forgotten your name. Mr. Belding fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Apr 24, 2011 |
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Apr 24, 2011 19:03
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Finished the book last night and I do look forward to the 3rd chapter. Yes, the sex\romance parts could have been toned down. The first 300 pages feels exactly like the first book. It should have been edited more. However, I really enjoy the way Rothfuss writes and I find the plot(s) very interesting, especially Chtaeh. Hope he explores Chtaeh more in book 3. Although, I did not understand Basts huge reaction to when Kvothe told he had talked to Chtaeh. To me it felt like a huge overreaction or that there is more to this than what Kvothe have revealed so far.
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Apr 25, 2011 10:27
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Mr. Belding posted:This is the most boring romance to which I have ever been subjected. I think it's been fairly well-foreshadowed in his stories that Denna is going to end up being an integral part of the Chandrian stuff, and possibly even a villain, so I'm willing to reserve judgement on the arc of their romance until it's complete. The writing of it is a totally different subject, but I don't want to pass judgement on the merits of their story until I know how it plays out. Tolli posted:Although, I did not understand Basts huge reaction to when Kvothe told he had talked to Chtaeh. To me it felt like a huge overreaction or that there is more to this than what Kvothe have revealed so far. I think it's the same way you'd react if you'd been hanging out with someone for a few months and they were like "Oh by the way I have a really virulent strain of typhoid. Don't worry, I wash my hands a lot." He's basically hanging out with what he sees as a ticking time bomb of misery, and now he's an integral part of the bomb's life. That's not a good sign for him. Sophia fucked around with this message at 16:29 on Apr 25, 2011 |
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Apr 25, 2011 16:25
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Just finished the second book. I enjoy the series at times it's really entertaining others though it reads like fan fiction. Some of the prose is cringe worthy. I realize that you have to give some allowance for Kvothe being 15 but his friends are all older and are just as silly while supposedly being very wise not to mention this is all a retelling by narration of a supposedly wiser and more mature Kvothe yet none of this is actually reflected in the text. The second book definitely reads at times like author masturbation. And Kvothe is definitely a Mary Sue: at times he's brilliant and others he's incredibly dumb for plot reasons. The world is also not very fleshed out relying on fantasy tropes to get readers to identify with the world which works but isn't a hallmark of great writing. This is definitely guilty pleasure reading comparing this to Jordan or Martin is blasphemy though.
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Apr 25, 2011 20:10
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I don't think comparing one set of fantasy novels to another set of fantasy novels fits any definition of blasphemy that I've ever heard.
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Apr 25, 2011 20:28
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Think you're taking the use of blasphemy too literally. I mean that they're much better writers than Rothfuss.
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Apr 25, 2011 20:39
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IBentMyWookie posted:Think you're taking the use of blasphemy too literally. I mean that they're much better writers than Rothfuss. I wouldn't say that Jordan is a much better writer than Rothfuss, but it definitely took him longer (like book 4) before he started making the huge steps backward that WMF was compared to NotW. Both guys have a LOT of immaturity in their writing styles, and interestingly, a lot of it for both of them has to do with their female characters. But other than that, they have similarly large faults but in different areas.
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Apr 25, 2011 22:07
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Habibi posted:I wouldn't say that Jordan is a much better writer than Rothfuss, but it definitely took him longer (like book 4) before he started making the huge steps backward that WMF was compared to NotW. Both guys have a LOT of immaturity in their writing styles, and interestingly, a lot of it for both of them has to do with their female characters. But other than that, they have similarly large faults but in different areas. Rothfuss is on his second book, Jordan had written for 30 years as a professional writer. Jordan's characterization of women may not be to some people's tastes but his writing is much more consistent in form and word choice than Rothfuss. I'm not saying that one is more creative than the other but just in terms of the quality of writing you can tell one is more polished than the other.
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Apr 25, 2011 23:05
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Yes and that would have nothing to do with the 30 years of experience you just stated. Let's come back to this thread in 2037 and see how the two (or three if you want to toss Martin in, he's been writing longer than Jordan) compare since they'll be on even footing, experience-wise, by that point. Wow I just looked at Jordan's bibliography and he put out the first four WoT books in less than three years. That's likely why it seems to have taken him "longer" (in terms of books published) to start backsliding - he just didn't take a break for a long rear end time. Once he did, the series took a turn for the worse.
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Apr 26, 2011 01:01
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I am listening to this as an audiobook, and I just got past the bandits robbing him, and now he just back to Severan.. Every time I hear "Denna" I just roll my eyes  . I am getting why people said he needed an editor. Jesus ... I am also pissed at this idea of "banging supermodels ... awesomeness" and then he can't even beat up two soldiers. I find it silly to build up this guy as superman, and then have him be useless. It almost comes to the idea of unreliable narrator. If he didn't have Bast licking his boots I would think we had a Usual Suspects thing going on. If Rothfuss wanted to show him as less than omnipotent, he picked a rather blunt way to do it. [/rant] All in all, I am like 80% done with this book. I think it could have been edited down by half.
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Apr 27, 2011 18:19
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