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poo poo Battlemaster, I remember you telling about that It's hosed up that everything has come to this.
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# ? Apr 23, 2011 20:09 |
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# ? May 30, 2024 08:42 |
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Oh yeah, I think I mentioned it in the last Cops on the Beat thread. Just to elaborate a little, I was grabbed and held in place while the attacker felt up my breasts and crotch. I wasn't hurt, or threatened with a weapon or anything but it was definitely non-consensual. It was only about 5:30pm but being in December it was quite dark so I never got a great look at the guy - the streetlamps really suck in my area. It didn't last very long before he had his fun and let go at which point I ran home as fast as I could. If I knew I was running the risk of getting arrested myself I would not have called the police. I figured I'd have a better chance of avoiding abuse as a victim rather than a suspect but thanks to this situation and others I've read about I now know better. I've spoken in person with victims of police abuse and I definitely walked away from this assault in better shape than they did from their police encounters. This encounter put me in a bad mood for weeks and I've never felt so violated and I'm still afraid to go outside when it's even a little dark, but some police victims I know are still incredibly traumatized years later even to the point of sudden panic attacks when seeing police officers or police vehicles. BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 20:38 on Apr 23, 2011 |
# ? Apr 23, 2011 20:35 |
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BattleMaster posted:Oh yeah, I think I mentioned it in the last Cops on the Beat thread. It seems like the sensible thing to do would be organizing citizens support groups, and encourage people to talk to someone who's not a cop, then. This is so hosed up I can't get my ahead around it..
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# ? Apr 23, 2011 20:37 |
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Are officers trained to treat any individual as a potential perp? Are they looking to arrest people who call them because they might be attention whores? It seems like the perfect example of an Orwellian nightmare, where innocence is guilt. So many people I know like to talk about all the nice, sweet cops they know. I am sure any fat, well fed pig is kind enough, until they get a chance to feed their gun toting notches.
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# ? Apr 24, 2011 01:45 |
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I can't speak for the U.S. but here in Denmark regular officers are instructed to be "alert and suspicious" - this involves sussing out citizens just minding their business until you can be sure they're not likely to have been involved in criminal activity - but once that happens, they have to leave you alone. Of course, this is not always the case, particularly with undercover and riot cops.
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# ? Apr 24, 2011 02:46 |
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A.S.H. posted:Are officers trained to treat any individual as a potential perp? From what I recall from the previous incarnations of the cop thread, it's a combination of warped perception from being around real criminals all the time, messed-up training and policies that are designed more to protect police from citizens than the other way around, and militarization of police forces. That and the well-known fact that authority turns a lot of people into complete assholes.
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# ? Apr 24, 2011 04:34 |
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I'm sure it comes as no surprise, but look, the NOPD are literally monsters:http://www.newstatesman.com/north-america/2011/04/orleans-city-jail-police posted:Something terrible lies at the heart of New Orleans - a rampant, widespread and apparently uncontrollable brutality on the part of its police force and its prison service. The horrors of its criminal justice system from decades before Hurricane Katrina and up to now lie somewhere between, with little exaggeration, Candide and Stalin's Gulags.
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# ? Apr 25, 2011 15:59 |
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Pope Guilty posted:I'm sure it comes as no surprise, but look, the NOPD are literally monsters: God drat. I've read that three times in the past 24 hours. Between Angola, New Orleans, and their overall incarceration rate, is Louisiana the last place in the United States you'd want to be a "criminal?"
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# ? Apr 27, 2011 05:27 |
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It sounds like the last place you'd want to be.
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# ? Apr 27, 2011 05:59 |
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Yeah, it's definitely pretty low on my list of preferred destinations in the US. I mean the entire US is pretty unappealing to me but Louisiana is definitely rock-bottom.
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# ? Apr 27, 2011 06:24 |
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Hey now, I've met several rich old white people who think it's positively charming.
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# ? Apr 27, 2011 06:37 |
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When I was growing up in Louisiana we had a saying. "At least we're not in Mississipi." Then Mississipi passed us up in the national rankings. Do you have any idea how bad it is when Mississipi is looking down on you for having bad schools?
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# ? Apr 27, 2011 09:41 |
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BattleMaster posted:Oh yeah, I think I mentioned it in the last Cops on the Beat thread. This fucks me off completely. I worked with the ministry of justice in australia dealing with sex abuse and child abuse cases (not as a cop of course, but rather with the courts) and the cops here are trained excellently and the general procedure tends to be to use women cops where possible in dealing with victims (who are generally percieved as less threatening to a rape victim than a powerful armed male). To hear about cops doing that, I honestly got to wonder what the gently caress are they teaching cops over there?. I'm sorry to hear about what happened to you. Its a stain on everybody anywhere that worked in this sort of field to hear about victims treated like poo poo by the people that are there to (try and) guarantee safety. I do know we used to have a lot of problems back in the 80s and early 90s, but after a lot of agitation from feminist, victim support and rape crisis groups the procedures improved immensely from first contact right up to how its handled in court (Ie videoing testimony so the victim doesnt have to be in contact with the offender). Surely its a model thats neither expensive or difficult to follow.
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# ? Apr 27, 2011 10:25 |
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Yes but if she didn't want to be raped she shouldn't have worn those provocatiamkfjgkiahih The average person's view of gender politics is horrible.
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# ? Apr 27, 2011 11:19 |
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quote:God drat. I've read that three times in the past 24 hours. Between Angola, New Orleans, and their overall incarceration rate, is Louisiana the last place in the United States you'd want to be a "criminal?" Lived in Louisiana all my life (29 years) and if you mean "criminal" as "poor & black" then you'd be correct. But mainly don't gently caress with the Police here or you're in trouble regardless of color. White with money, unless you know someone in the system, your rear end is in as much danger as a poor black person if you cross a cop down here. I had the luxury of being brought up a white male in a middle class family so my experience has been very tame compared to friends but even I've been on the recieving end at times during a night out drinking. Cops literally had/have free reign and like anywhere else you just don't argue with the police if you don't want any problems, just here they can get physical with you and nothing is really done. At least in other states I read about lawsuits/charges/investigations. It took almost 3 years and fellow police officers turning on their own before they finally did something about the Danziger bridge and those Police Officers killed someone AND burned the body. Do what they say and try to sort it out later because something will happen because they can. It's really disgusting and hope something comes from all this because this really isn't a terrible state to live in, it's just the problems (Corrupt Politicians/Corrupt Police/Economy) make it undesirable. The food, the people, the night life, the atmosphere and the people, it's just amazing and I've yet to find another city like it. PTBrennan fucked around with this message at 14:41 on Apr 27, 2011 |
# ? Apr 27, 2011 14:35 |
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My father was mugged in New Orleans whilst we were there on Holiday (from Australia). He was slugged over the head half a dozen times with the handle of a pistol. An onlooker called the police who picked him up, drove him around to some poor black bastards house, bashed the door in and dragged some bleary eyed fucker in his pyjamas out of bed and asked "this him?". It wasn't. This was pre-Katrina. Obviously nothing has changed. Interesting system you guys got there. KingEup fucked around with this message at 14:59 on Apr 27, 2011 |
# ? Apr 27, 2011 14:50 |
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duck monster posted:This fucks me off completely. I worked with the ministry of justice in australia dealing with sex abuse and child abuse cases (not as a cop of course, but rather with the courts) and the cops here are trained excellently and the general procedure tends to be to use women cops where possible in dealing with victims (who are generally percieved as less threatening to a rape victim than a powerful armed male). To hear about cops doing that, I honestly got to wonder what the gently caress are they teaching cops over there?. Responding to sexual abuse cases is something police are actually trained here and somewhere that police will tread lightly around because they do believe it (well, at least against women who aren't prostitutes but that is another thread) is an extremely serious crime and the officers who think she was asking for it have mostly retired by this point. What is most disgusting about that story is still true, that officers could do that and not get loving fired. Sure every other officer might think they're a loving scumbag, but they won't actually do anything about it. KingEup posted:My father was mugged in New Orleans whilst we were there on Holiday (from Australia). He was slugged over the head half a dozen times with the handle of a pistol. An onlooker called the police who picked him up, drove him around to some poor black bastards house, bashed the door in and dragged some bleary eyed fucker in his pyjamas out of bed and asked "this him?". http://www.nola.com/news/t-p/frontpage/index.ssf?/base/news-7/11712631133140.xml&coll=1 nm fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Apr 27, 2011 |
# ? Apr 27, 2011 16:08 |
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duck monster posted:This fucks me off completely. I worked with the ministry of justice in australia dealing with sex abuse and child abuse cases (not as a cop of course, but rather with the courts) and the cops here are trained excellently and the general procedure tends to be to use women cops where possible in dealing with victims (who are generally percieved as less threatening to a rape victim than a powerful armed male). To hear about cops doing that, I honestly got to wonder what the gently caress are they teaching cops over there?. To be fair, the victim handlers (don't know if there's a proper title for them) who arrived after those shitheads were male and treated me very well, and were very non-threatening. The detectives at the station who interviewed me also treated me pretty well and took my problem seriously. But yeah, unless the crime is very, very serious in the future I'm not going to risk calling the police and getting arrested myself in the future. Having those guys bust into my apartment and rummage around bugs me even more than the groping. BattleMaster fucked around with this message at 16:34 on Apr 27, 2011 |
# ? Apr 27, 2011 16:30 |
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So I'm writing a paper about private prisons, and while the argument against them is pretty easy to make out, I think my professor will want to at least see me entertain the other side of the argument? Anyone know any of any books/sources arguing in favor? (Bonus if they aren't by paid CCA shills.)
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# ? Apr 29, 2011 02:50 |
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BattleMaster posted:To be fair, the victim handlers (don't know if there's a proper title for them) who arrived after those shitheads were male and treated me very well, and were very non-threatening. The detectives at the station who interviewed me also treated me pretty well and took my problem seriously. Your best move generally is to go straight to a hospital if you've been penetratively abused, or to a sexual assault referal center (or whatever they are called there) and get someone whos sympathetic and professional to handle much of this for you and be your advocate. Neither of these groups ought (unless there is mandatory reporting regimes, like is oft the case with child victims) call the cops without your consent, and both are likely to keep a sympathetic nurse or counsellor around to help you through it when the cops start drilling for info. To some degree intrusive questioning will happen whatever the circumstances, cos cops do need to cross their t's and dot their i's to be careful of frame-ups (or frame-up defenses by making sure the groundworks done right), but a well trained cop can do this without making the victim feel like poo poo for it. Theres absolutely no need to go poking around your stuff with stupid cop nosiness. I'm glad you feel comfortable to speak out about it. Many, maybe most, women don't because it can bring back old traumas. What I do suggest is you talk to your local womens group and make sure they are up to speed on the issues with how cops handle sex assault cases. Here in west aust, it was the womens groups (and queer groups too. There was a lot of concerns back in the day about how gay men where being treated when they reported sexual assault, nowdays we actually have a gay/lesbian taskforce of queer cops to deal with the queer communitys concerns*) heavily agitating for reform and training that forced the cops to get up to speed on the right way of doing this, and thats benefitted victims ever since here. Not saying we got it right yet, but its definately an improvement. duck monster fucked around with this message at 03:48 on Apr 29, 2011 |
# ? Apr 29, 2011 03:39 |
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yronic heroism posted:So I'm writing a paper about private prisons, and while the argument against them is pretty easy to make out, I think my professor will want to at least see me entertain the other side of the argument? Anyone know any of any books/sources arguing in favor? (Bonus if they aren't by paid CCA shills.)
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# ? Apr 29, 2011 03:53 |
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yronic heroism posted:So I'm writing a paper about private prisons, and while the argument against them is pretty easy to make out, I think my professor will want to at least see me entertain the other side of the argument? Anyone know any of any books/sources arguing in favor? (Bonus if they aren't by paid CCA shills.) Private Prisons: Cons and Pros, by Charles H. Logan
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# ? Apr 29, 2011 05:36 |
I don't think I've ever posted here in D&D before now, but I just wanted to say that I've been reading this thread and links in it over the past few days, and drat Goro. You are such an inspiration man, you make me want to get out and do something about this stuff. I didn't even realize this was such an issue until I read this thread. Thanks for opening my eyes up to these horrors and atrocities. I had a few questions though about the prison gang 'system'. As morbid as it sounds (and I'm not trying to troll or sound ignorant, if it sounds that way), but prison gang life is very intriguing to me on an informational level. I enjoy reading about the types of brotherhood these guys have, and exactly how they take care of or speak to/honor one another. 1. On the outside, there are several different gangs that are made up of the same race/creedo/etc., and they war with each other for different reasons. Blacks killing blacks, whites killing whites, all that jazz. What my question is, is inside of prison, is it like the outside stuff doesn't matter and you are accepted into the big prison gang just because of race? If so, do those members in the gang just up and forget any of the bullshit on the outside and just make it work? 2. In a prison gang, exactly what does it take to move up in rank, and what would it take for someone high up in rank to drop to zero at once, if there is such a thing? Like, what would make a captain become a 'bitch' (I'm just using that term loosely) overnight?
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# ? May 2, 2011 02:05 |
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overshottoast posted:1. On the outside, there are several different gangs that are made up of the same race/creedo/etc., and they war with each other for different reasons. Blacks killing blacks, whites killing whites, all that jazz. What my question is, is inside of prison, is it like the outside stuff doesn't matter and you are accepted into the big prison gang just because of race? If so, do those members in the gang just up and forget any of the bullshit on the outside and just make it work? overshottoast posted:what would it take to move up in rank overshottoast posted:, and what would it take for someone high up in rank to drop to zero at once, if there is such a thing? Like, what would make a captain become a 'bitch' (I'm just using that term loosely) overnight? HidingFromGoro fucked around with this message at 03:00 on May 3, 2011 |
# ? May 3, 2011 02:57 |
Is it fair to say that no one should ever call the police under any circumstances, or even fire or EMS because these guys usually bring cops with? I would rather burn to death or die of other injuries than risk the kind of things you can get from contact with the police.
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# ? May 3, 2011 06:25 |
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HidingFromGoro posted:Main facility on Silverlake or the MSF annex on Mission? 45 days apiece. The Mission is much better for people on work/school release (me), but worse for people on the work-gang wing, where I hear there's a lot of politics that you don't even get in the main jail.
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# ? May 3, 2011 06:36 |
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shovelbum posted:Is it fair to say that no one should ever call the police under any circumstances, or even fire or EMS because these guys usually bring cops with? I would rather burn to death or die of other injuries than risk the kind of things you can get from contact with the police. No, that is taking it too far. Anyone who says they would rather die in a fire than ever talk to a cop has never been on fire. If my house gets broken into I am going to call the police. I'm just going to be very careful about who I let in and what I tell them. Because my alternative is "welp, I guess all my stuff is gone". Plus, if you rent rather than own your landlord will call the police anyway to have a record of what happened, so it may not even be in your control. If there is a fire I am drat sure going to call the fire department, and if I am hit by a car I expect an ambulance to be called. Not doing those just because you (rightfully) don't trust the police is cutting off your nose to spite your face.
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# ? May 4, 2011 19:34 |
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Dominion posted:No, that is taking it too far. Anyone who says they would rather die in a fire than ever talk to a cop has never been on fire. Yup. I'll still call the police for serious problems but if it's just another groping it's not worth the risk of being arrested myself. Especially since processing of female suspects in my city often involves arbitrary stripsearches (bras are considered concealed weapons if they have underwires!) and sexual assault.
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# ? May 4, 2011 20:01 |
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Dominion posted:No, that is taking it too far. Anyone who says they would rather die in a fire than ever talk to a cop has never been on fire. If your house gets broken into the cops won't give a poo poo, they'll just write an incident report and ask about the value of the things stolen. If its under 5k they won't really give a poo poo and if its over they might care a tiny bit. Either way your never seeing your poo poo again if you rely on them for any help. On the other hand if you are smart and stay in the loop in your community then you should be able to find out who has your poo poo, and if you were smart and didn't call the cops you should be able to get your poo poo back and things straightened out. Relying on cops is not only retarded because it doesn't work for poo poo, but they are just as likely to turn you from witness to suspect. They don't believe anyone but other cops and have the power to throw you in a hole. People who say the stuff you do have probably never been kidnapped and thrown in a cold hole in the ground. Firefighters don't really have the ability to hurt or kill you, not to mention do it legally and get away with it. edit: If you have an issue with regular fires in your dwelling and not being able to put them out, or being robbed a lot, or generally needing ambos with any kind of regularity... You might be an idiot who's life is merely a collection of poo poo you cause for yourself. In that case you will probably die in a fire regardless. On a separate note, I know this isn't prison related, but does anyone know if I can go to the US once I'm discharged? I've got to satisfy terms of my probation first but it was a federal drug conviction and I know they aren't hot about letting those types in. iceberg sleaz fucked around with this message at 21:16 on May 4, 2011 |
# ? May 4, 2011 21:07 |
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iceberg sleaz posted:If your house gets broken into the cops won't give a poo poo, they'll just write an incident report and ask about the value of the things stolen. If its under 5k they won't really give a poo poo and if its over they might care a tiny bit. Either way your never seeing your poo poo again if you rely on them for any help. No, I have never been kidnapped and thrown in a hole, but I have had my house broken into, and while you are correct that the police weren't a huge help, they did get a small portion of the goods back. And to be fair, if I were a minority I probably wouldn't have called them to begin with. And if you are smart and stay in the loop and find out what pawn shop your stuff went to, you are then in the envious position of having to buy your own property back. quote:Firefighters don't really have the ability to hurt or kill you, not to mention do it legally and get away with it. No, but if you call the fire department the police come too, and usually get to the scene first. They often come when you call an ambulance as well. Do you think you should avoid calling either of those because it has a high chance of bringing cops as well? If you were being raped or assaulted in an alley and a cop walked by, would you want him to help you?
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# ? May 4, 2011 21:21 |
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What the gently caress has happened where you cannot call the police without being at risk from harassment or worse
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# ? May 4, 2011 22:52 |
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Touchdown Boy posted:What the gently caress has happened where you cannot call the police without being at risk from harassment or worse At this point I would only call the cops if someone was actively breaking into my house, trying to rape me, directly trying to harm me. I will never call them for suspicious activity any more or for someone elses altercation. I hate even talking to transit cops any more and I work for the regional transit people.
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# ? May 5, 2011 00:19 |
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Dominion posted:No, I have never been kidnapped and thrown in a hole, but I have had my house broken into, and while you are correct that the police weren't a huge help, they did get a small portion of the goods back. And to be fair, if I were a minority I probably wouldn't have called them to begin with. Its still the only way you get your money back, and being a part of the commmunity, its on you for making yourself a target-- because if you're known and liked no one should be breaking into your place. Not long ago I knew there was a couple people that wanted to rob or kidnap me but it didn't happen because I know whats going on and kept abreast. I think that gov't shouldn't be involved in anything they don't absolutely have to be. One of the main reasons being that are incredibly inefficient and expensive in anything they do, that goes for any gov't employee. I routinely see like 2 squad cars and 2 ambos dispatched to 1 drunk homeless guy on a corner, and they usually hang around shooting the poo poo for about 30 minutes... do you know how much money has just basically burned for nothing? Its unbelievable. Firefighters are probably the only gov't employees that aren't more concerned with covering up their incompetence, neglect, or total waste of resource than actually fulfilling their job description. They also happen to be volunteers much of the time, figure that out. Why would I be getting raped or assaulted in an alley? Is there any likelihood that if I was, there would happen to be a cop strolling by and I'd be able to get their attention, at which point they would save me (and not charge me with anything)? Thats one hell of a hypothetical.
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# ? May 5, 2011 00:55 |
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iceberg sleaz posted:I think that gov't shouldn't be involved in anything they don't absolutely have to be. One of the main reasons being that are incredibly inefficient and expensive in anything they do, that goes for any gov't employee. So about that privatized police force...
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# ? May 5, 2011 01:01 |
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iceberg sleaz posted:Its still the only way you get your money back, and being a part of the commmunity, its on you for making yourself a target-- because if you're known and liked no one should be breaking into your place. Be sure to be really popular wherever you happen to live, or it's your fault what happens to you... Thanks, prison thread!
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# ? May 5, 2011 01:28 |
HidingFromGoro posted:Generally speaking, white stays with white, black stays with black, Northern Mexican with Northern, Southern with Southern; and with some exceptions everyone else stays the hell out of the way. You put aside whatever differences you had on the outside and stick with your color, for the most part. Thanks for the info man. Are there any links to videos I can watch online with info on prison gangs? The only other alternative I've found are the prison porn shows, and I feel like they aren't conveying much of anything of importance.
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# ? May 5, 2011 01:42 |
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Interesting fact:quote:A 2010 Pew Research Center study found that “Incarceration reduces former inmates’ earnings by 40 percent and limits their future economic mobility.” http://www.globalpolicyjournal.com/blog/04/05/2011/economic-consequences-war Way to keep the poor, poor.
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# ? May 5, 2011 03:05 |
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overshottoast posted:Thanks for the info man. Are there any links to videos I can watch online with info on prison gangs? The only other alternative I've found are the prison porn shows, and I feel like they aren't conveying much of anything of importance. To be honest with you, I don't watch prison documentaries anymore. I used to, years ago, for background noise while doing housework and such. But after really sitting down and watching them critically I've come to dislike them. That said, there is a Vanguard episode if you like Vanguard. I haven't watched the whole thing, though. There are problems with trying to really get into gang politics on a documentary, problems with access mostly. Only certain inmates will be allowed on camera by the facility, and likewise only certain inmates will be allowed on camera by the other inmates; things like that.
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# ? May 5, 2011 03:49 |
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Dean Golberry posted:45 days apiece. The Mission is much better for people on work/school release (me), but worse for people on the work-gang wing, where I hear there's a lot of politics that you don't even get in the main jail. The important part is that you came out in one piece. You still in the 520? I might have some resources for you, if you need them.
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# ? May 5, 2011 03:52 |
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# ? May 30, 2024 08:42 |
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Solkanar512 posted:Here's a thought - why not make the legislators take a drug test? They're being paid from the public coffers, what do they have to hide? Everyone has their drug, it's just whether or not it's legal. I would imagine most of the people in politics are on anti-anxiety meds, sleeping meds, antidepressants, etc. I would love to see people in power have to take drug tests with public results. It will never happen though.
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# ? May 5, 2011 04:03 |