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Sporadic posted:Really? First, the hardcover is from the marketplace where people can ask for whatever they want. That's not Amazon. Second, the point was that I bought it in 2010 for $6.39 and now it is $13.99 when the paperback is $11.39, on a twenty four year old book. Can you show me like 1000 books with the prices out of whack? That would be only about 0.1% which is hardly "tons" but still. Yes that article tells you that advances are a gamble that the book will make enough money to cover the advance payment of royalties.
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May 4, 2011 03:03
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fishmech posted:The fact that your example has the hardcover listed for $1000 proves it's one hell of an anomaly bro. Additionally the list price in print for the paperback is $18 ... Amazon had the paperback on sale and that brought it below the Kindle price. That $1000 is on the Amazon Marketplace, not the actual Amazon price. edit: I opened this thread like an hour ago, oops
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May 4, 2011 03:42
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fishmech posted:Can you show me like 1000 books with the prices out of whack? That would be only about 0.1% which is hardly "tons" but still. I'm not trying to get on either side of this argument, buy anyone who purchases a significant number of ebooks from the Kindle store will have seen tons of examples. I just looked through my 3-page Wish List, and more than half of them had the price set by the publisher. Of those, in all but one example the Kindle price was HIGHER than the paperback price. In than lone exception, it was the same as the paperback price. edit: this list is likely skewered by the fact than I'm less likely to purchase an ebook with this pricing structure, but the point is, it happens a lot. Fly Ricky fucked around with this message at 03:53 on May 4, 2011 |
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May 4, 2011 03:51
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fishmech posted:Can you show me like 1000 books with the prices out of whack? That would be only about 0.1% which is hardly "tons" but still. Am I being trolled? Yes, advances are gambles. The publishers are betting bigger amounts of money on more "celebrities". That's the problem. the article I linked posted:But given the current economic climate, some have been questioning whether such big advances make sense. Carol Schneider, the head of public relations for the Random House Publishing Group, has been around long enough to remember when a seven-figure book deal was a big deal. But, she says, no one at Random House blinked when comedian Kathy Griffin reportedly landed a $2 million deal with one of its imprints, Ballantine Books. Actually, it was quite the opposite: They gave a two million dollar advance to Kathy Griffin when she never written a book before and only had a title. It's hard to find Call Me Charlie fucked around with this message at 04:36 on May 4, 2011 |
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May 4, 2011 04:31
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petewhitley posted:I'm not trying to get on either side of this argument, buy anyone who purchases a significant number of ebooks from the Kindle store will have seen tons of examples. I just looked through my 3-page Wish List, and more than half of them had the price set by the publisher. Of those, in all but one example the Kindle price was HIGHER than the paperback price. In than lone exception, it was the same as the paperback price. I agree. Its really discouraging, and I imagine most people are likely to pass those books up unless they really really want to read that book. Doesn't help when theres a series priced the same way. You can argue that the convenience factor might make up for it but not for me. A kindle book priced 1-2 dollars above paperback is likely to be one I'll pass up, but I wouldn't feel like I was getting such a sour deal if it was priced 1-2 below.
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May 4, 2011 04:59
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Sporadic posted:Ebooks are more expensive than hardbacks/paperbacks because... because apparently people are paying that amount to buy them. There is no other logic at play here.
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May 4, 2011 05:49
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fishmech posted:The whole discussion is more than a little silly because ebooks are very rarely above the price of the paperback, and are almost always well under the hardback price. Define "very rarely". A quick look at the New York Times trade paperback fiction bestseller list shows that of the top 10, 4 Kindle books are cheaper than the paperback and 5 are more expensive (one is unavailable). Of the top 10 nonfiction paperbacks, 6 Kindle versions are cheaper and 4 are more expensive. Granted, the bestseller lists obviously contain more recent releases which haven't yet had time to be discounted, but it's quite inaccurate to say that ebooks are rarely more expensive than paperbacks. Florida Betty fucked around with this message at 07:22 on May 4, 2011 |
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May 4, 2011 07:18
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Florida Betty posted:Define "very rarely". A quick look at the New York Times trade paperback fiction bestseller list shows that of the top 10, 4 Kindle books are cheaper than the paperback and 5 are more expensive (one is unavailable). Of the top 10 nonfiction paperbacks, 6 Kindle versions are cheaper and 4 are more expensive. Granted, the bestseller lists obviously contain more recent releases which haven't yet had time to be discounted, but it's quite inaccurate to say that ebooks are rarely more expensive than paperbacks. The Kindle versions all appear to be cheaper than the print list price, Amazon is well known for discounting physical books, but the price stamped on the book itself is what it is. Try going to a brick and mortar store and seeing what the prices actually are, they're probably not all 30-60% off like they are on Amazon!
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May 4, 2011 07:47
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fishmech posted:The Kindle versions all appear to be cheaper than the print list price, Amazon is well known for discounting physical books, but the price stamped on the book itself is what it is. Try going to a brick and mortar store and seeing what the prices actually are, they're probably not all 30-60% off like they are on Amazon! Comparing Kindle price to Amazon hardback/paperback price is the only way to make a sensible comparison.
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May 4, 2011 08:00
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BrainParasite posted:Comparing Kindle price to Amazon hardback/paperback price is the only way to make a sensible comparison. It ignores the reality of book stores. You can almost always buy physical books cheaper on Amazon then in stores. Of course, tack shipping fees onto them books you're talking about too if you must insist on Amazon.
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May 4, 2011 08:03
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fishmech posted:It ignores the reality of book stores. You can almost always buy physical books cheaper on Amazon then in stores. I don't know about other countries, but Amazon shipping is free in Japan and free for orders over $25 in the US, so I would assume other Amazons have free shipping as well. Does anybody actually pay for shipping on Amazon for normal orders?
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May 4, 2011 08:36
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Ara posted:I don't know about other countries, but Amazon shipping is free in Japan and free for orders over $25 in the US, so I would assume other Amazons have free shipping as well. Does anybody actually pay for shipping on Amazon for normal orders? Not everyone has prime, or orders enough books to get over $25 in one go. Also if Japan has free shipping why not post the prices form Japan for Kindle and non-Kindle?
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May 4, 2011 08:41
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Ara posted:I don't know about other countries, but Amazon shipping is free in Japan and free for orders over $25 in the US, so I would assume other Amazons have free shipping as well. Does anybody actually pay for shipping on Amazon for normal orders? In Australia yes. And it can be a lot more than the price of the book.
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May 4, 2011 08:46
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Sporadic posted:Well, the issue with that is that the ebook comes out at the same time as the hardback and can potentially eat into its sales (it shouldn't really since the people who want to still read books grab the hardback or wait for the paperback while the people with ereaders grab the ebook version, like vinyl and CD/MP3). The publishers have tried two solutions. Staggered releases where the ebook is released months after the hardback (which failed..although that could have been because it was still priced high) and pricing the ebook at the same or higher price than the hardback (which also failed) I agree that's what's driving this...but the argument is over the cost to produce, and everyone points out that the hardback price and works backward. That's incorrect. The cost to produce, that includes copyediting and so forth, is more accurately reflected in a paperback that had no hardback run. fishmech posted:It ignores the reality of book stores. You can almost always buy physical books cheaper on Amazon then in stores. It makes an apples to apples comparison. Those books are sold by online sellers (Walmart to Barnes and Noble to Amazon) all for almost exactly the same price. The suggested retail price is no longer a realistic comparison because you're comparing the highest available price versus the market price. As for shipping costs? You're arguing that we have to act in the most inefficient way possible because it's the only way your argument comes close. I don't know anyone who doesn't factor how to get free shipping into their book buying on Amazon, either thru prime, or $25 or more purchased.
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May 4, 2011 09:05
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fishmech posted:Not everyone has prime Since everyone chatting here is a goon, I'm shocked if they are not in prime with how easy it is to set up a shared account via SAMart. @$15/yr for prime is a no brainer though may be limited to US goons only.
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May 4, 2011 12:44
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So this argument is that if the Kindle price for a book available in hardcover was $20 and a list price of $28, I should thank the publisher for saving me $8 and ignore that Amazon sells the same hardcover for $14? Just to be clear... Personally, I still consider a hardcover to be quite a bit more valuable than a Kindle book, and I'll buy the hardcover if it's only a couple of dollars more. For instance, Tina Fey's Bossypants is $12.99 on Kindle and $13.97 for hardcover, with a retail price of $26.99. Maybe my mindset will change over time, but I will gladly pay $1 more for the "real book". smackfu fucked around with this message at 16:55 on May 4, 2011 |
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May 4, 2011 16:50
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Sporadic posted:This is the biggest problem with ebooks today. (I noticed this while putting together recommendations for my Dad while browsing my archive) Ara posted:That $1000 is on the Amazon Marketplace, not the actual Amazon price.
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May 4, 2011 17:24
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Cardboard Box A posted:I still want to know what the gently caress is up with those marketplace prices for both Hardcover and Mass Market Paperback though. 3rd party sellers have automatic rules for setting prices that can cause problems. I read an article recently where some obscure book was priced at $2,600,000 or something equally ridiculous because two 3rd party sellers let their auto rules run amok.
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May 4, 2011 17:29
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smackfu posted:So this argument is that if the Kindle price for a book available in hardcover was $20 and a list price of $28, I should thank the publisher for saving me $8 and ignore that Amazon sells the same hardcover for $14? Just to be clear... No but when the paperback list price is $18, the Kindle price is $9 and Amazon has the paperback on sale for $8 that's not really a problem. You wouldn't find the book in a physical store for the Amazon sale price most likely so it's a question of waiting days for it to ship to save a dollar, or buying Kindle. Not to mention that again, if I look around on the Amazon store I see way more books cheaper than paperback on Kindle, in many cases with books that cost $5 on Kindle and $9 new (oh and for some reason nearly every book on Amazon has 5 guys ready to sell it for $0.01 to $0.29 + $3.99 shipping). There's also stuff like this: http://www.amazon.com/Ultimate-Hitc...04526529&sr=1-1 The 5 Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy books in one for $9.99 versus http://www.amazon.com/Hitchhikers-Guide-Galaxy-ebook/dp/B000XUBC2C/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&m=AG56TWVU5XWC2&s=digital-text&qid=1304526529&sr=1-2 Each individual book like this for $7.99
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May 4, 2011 17:31
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fishmech posted:No but when the paperback list price is $18, the Kindle price is $9 and Amazon has the paperback on sale for $8 that's not really a problem. You wouldn't find the book in a physical store for the Amazon sale price most likely so it's a question of waiting days for it to ship to save a dollar, or buying Kindle. This sounds a lot like a defense for Ticketmaster charging convenience fees. Selling kindle books is much more convenient and cheaper for Amazon than selling a paperback. But you're forced to pay extra for the store's convenience. Kindle books don't take time to physically manufacture on a machine, then bind, freight to warehouses, ship to customer, ect. Yet, we're still expected to pay the same price as if all of that overhead is still there for a lot of e-books. Which is even more puzzling when the kindle book is higher than the paperback.
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May 4, 2011 18:36
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Sperg Victorious posted:This sounds a lot like a defense for Ticketmaster charging convenience fees. Selling kindle books is much more convenient and cheaper for Amazon than selling a paperback. But you're forced to pay extra for the store's convenience. Kindle books don't take time to physically manufacture on a machine, then bind, freight to warehouses, ship to customer, ect. Yet, we're still expected to pay the same price as if all of that overhead is still there for a lot of e-books. Which is even more puzzling when the kindle book is higher than the paperback. again: you guys are acting like there's some sort of equation starting with the cost to produce a product and ending, after a set series of steps, on its price. the price is the highest they think people will pay, and as long as people keep paying it, they'll keep charging it. Same as Ticketmaster.
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May 4, 2011 19:00
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Sperg Victorious posted:This sounds a lot like a defense for Ticketmaster charging convenience fees. Selling kindle books is much more convenient and cheaper for Amazon than selling a paperback. But you're forced to pay extra for the store's convenience. Kindle books don't take time to physically manufacture on a machine, then bind, freight to warehouses, ship to customer, ect. Yet, we're still expected to pay the same price as if all of that overhead is still there for a lot of e-books. Which is even more puzzling when the kindle book is higher than the paperback. Those books aren't going to be on sale forever - you know this right? Most books are not more expensive on Kindle. Many books that are will only be so for limited times. This happens on amazon's selling physical CDs vs. their MP3 store, a given CD will cost $7 at random while the MP3 album is being sold for $10, then go back to being $17 for the CD in a few weeks.
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May 4, 2011 19:04
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I'm just going to drop by and interrupt this sad-fest to say, hello thread! I should have a Kindle 3 and lighted cover showing up in the mail within a few hours - and I just got laid off! :iamafag: so I'll probably be around. The job I got laid off from was graphic design, so maybe I'll do some cool screen savers or something. 
dont eat a carb fucked around with this message at 20:23 on May 4, 2011 |
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May 4, 2011 20:17
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maxnmona posted:again: you guys are acting like there's some sort of equation starting with the cost to produce a product and ending, after a set series of steps, on its price. I'm not disagreeing. I, and I believe others in the thread, are merely articulating why those price points are too high and pass them over for purchase, especially in comparison to physical copies of the book. fishmech posted:Those books aren't going to be on sale forever - you know this right? Most books are not more expensive on Kindle. Many books that are will only be so for limited times. There is a 7 year old book that I have been thinking about buying and the kindle version is still higher. Granted, the kindle version is set by the publisher. How much longer should we wait for the kindle version to become cheaper and a better deal? I wouldn't mind so much if the books were new releases, but for a 7 year old book? Thats what I think a lot of people are complaining about. Not so much that the newest books are slightly higher, but the books that have been around for years are still cheaper if you buy a physical copy. And its not as though the older books I've seen with this price structure actually fluctuate.
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May 4, 2011 21:52
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Sperg Victorious posted:There is a 7 year old book that I have been thinking about buying and the kindle version is still higher. Granted, the kindle version is set by the publisher. How much longer should we wait for the kindle version to become cheaper and a better deal? I wouldn't mind so much if the books were new releases, but for a 7 year old book? Thats what I think a lot of people are complaining about. Not so much that the newest books are slightly higher, but the books that have been around for years are still cheaper if you buy a physical copy. And its not as though the older books I've seen with this price structure actually fluctuate. Most books aren't like this tho. Don't buy the ones that are, because that just encourages the publishers. Also you people would poo poo yourselves if you ever dealt with ebook prices before eink readers came out.
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May 4, 2011 22:00
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dont eat a carb posted:I'm just going to drop by and interrupt this sad-fest to say, hello thread! Bummer to hear it dude, if you want PM me your amazon username/email once you get your Kindle, I can loan you a great business/motivational book I just finished. Thankfully I would think graphic design is always in some kind of demand, be it full time or just project to project!
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May 4, 2011 22:27
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maxnmona posted:again: you guys are acting like there's some sort of equation starting with the cost to produce a product and ending, after a set series of steps, on its price.
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May 4, 2011 23:07
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smackfu posted:When the publishing industry is crying about their costs being almost the same for eBooks and hardcovers, and that is why they can't charge less for the eBook, who are the ones suggesting there is an equation? Yes. The publishers are the ones that say cost of production drives price. We're pointing out that you are correct, that in fact, they're charging what they think they can get, not charging based on cost.
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May 4, 2011 23:38
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Just made the only screensaver I can see myself having:
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May 4, 2011 23:52
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dont eat a carb posted:I'm just going to drop by and interrupt this sad-fest to say, hello thread! Not to derail the thread but Mozilla might have something up your street: http://hire.jobvite.com/CompanyJobs/Careers.aspx?k=JobListing&c=qpX9Vfwa&v=1 I've heard a few things here and there about Amazon maybe releasing an Android tablet at some stage. While this rumour is nothing new, I take it that no matter what happens they'll still produce a Kindle with an E-ink screen? It's one of the main reasons I love reading on the thing - I have zero interest in an LCD, wrist-breaking tablet.
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May 4, 2011 23:52
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WattsvilleBlues posted:Not to derail the thread but Mozilla might have something up your street: No way in hell is Amazon ever not producing an e-reader that doesn't look like ink on paper - no worries there.
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May 4, 2011 23:55
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I picked up a Kindle 3rd gen and noticed in the first post that reading PDF files suck, how does it suck though? Do the files just not render properly? Besides calibre, are there any other solutions people use to convert from PDF to a readable format for the Kindle?
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May 5, 2011 00:03
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cLin posted:I picked up a Kindle 3rd gen and noticed in the first post that reading PDF files suck, how does it suck though? Do the files just not render properly? Besides calibre, are there any other solutions people use to convert from PDF to a readable format for the Kindle? Theres no reflow, so you're basically looking at an image and having to zoom in. If you can do reflow, i don't know how to.
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May 5, 2011 00:05
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PDF is probably useful for binding together a series of pre-prepared 600x800 images I guess.
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May 5, 2011 00:11
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So if everyone is waiting for ebooks to drop in price or go on sale, is there a website that will monitor the prices for you and alert you when it is on sale or drops so you can pick it up before it increases again?
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May 5, 2011 00:43
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SB35 posted:So if everyone is waiting for ebooks to drop in price or go on sale, is there a website that will monitor the prices for you and alert you when it is on sale or drops so you can pick it up before it increases again? Stupid_Sexy_Flander posted:I use the kindle store for some of my purchases, I mainly just use https://www.inkmesh.com for the best prices and just crack the drm. I thought about starting a blog or something updated with all the current promotions and specials, similar to the one a guy in the Games forum had for online digital distribution sales from places like Steam, but it seems like it would be a lot more involved to gather everything and keep it up to date.
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May 5, 2011 01:21
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cLin posted:I picked up a Kindle 3rd gen and noticed in the first post that reading PDF files suck, how does it suck though? Do the files just not render properly? Besides calibre, are there any other solutions people use to convert from PDF to a readable format for the Kindle? As I see it, here are the good bits:
and, here are the bad bits in my experience:
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May 5, 2011 02:04
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doctorfrog posted:
Sadly this is not my experience with the one pdf I really want to be able to read well on my kindle.
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May 5, 2011 02:30
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SB35 posted:So if everyone is waiting for ebooks to drop in price or go on sale, is there a website that will monitor the prices for you and alert you when it is on sale or drops so you can pick it up before it increases again? I might be thinking of something else, but doesn't Amazon do this? Like, "Notify me if the price drops below _____"?
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May 5, 2011 03:02
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SB35 posted:So if everyone is waiting for ebooks to drop in price or go on sale, is there a website that will monitor the prices for you and alert you when it is on sale or drops so you can pick it up before it increases again? http://www.ereaderiq.com/ works mostly, but people have had trouble selecting regions other than United States.
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