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Sjurygg posted:
Yes, but as raised in Dr. Strangelove, a deterrent you don't publicize isn't very useful.
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May 7, 2011 16:46
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We all like nuke photos, right?
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May 7, 2011 18:09
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Craptacular posted:Also the building was most likely full of intel that would be impossible to recover if it was blown up. Also it becomes problematic to get a DNA sample and positive confirmation that he was there. We would have still needed to send a team on the ground to recover some sort of Osama-bits for proof to the rest of the world.
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May 7, 2011 18:14
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LavistaSays posted:Also it becomes problematic to get a DNA sample and positive confirmation that he was there. We would have still needed to send a team on the ground to recover some sort of Osama-bits for proof to the rest of the world. Who wants to bet we had a b2 orbiting in case the mission went south?
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May 7, 2011 19:12
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Flikken posted:Who wants to bet we had a b2 orbiting in case the mission went south? A B2 full of SEALs.
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May 7, 2011 22:48
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Ygolonac posted:A B2 full of SEALs. Did John Ringo plan this raid?
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May 7, 2011 22:51
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Flikken posted:Did John Ringo plan this raid? Not enough rape for him to have planned this.
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May 7, 2011 23:42
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Helter Skelter posted:We all like nuke photos, right? This is extremely terrifying. Yet, strangely beautiful. 
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May 8, 2011 00:55
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Helter Skelter posted:We all like nuke photos, right? That animated gif of the house is great.
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May 8, 2011 14:15
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I've seen that house gif as a video probably 100 times. The images that still astound me are the expanding fireball of the initial detonation. It's like a glimpse into the most amazing and terrifying thing ever made by humans.
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May 8, 2011 14:34
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SopWATh posted:I've seen that house gif as a video probably 100 times. That's because they ARE the most amazing and terrifying things ever made by humans! Harnessing elemental forces of the universe, tranforming matter directly into energy, creating new elements, and loving DESTROYING EVERYTHING IT TOUCHES! There are several videos similar to the house video available. These weapon effects tests were set significantly beyond the reach of the actual physical fireball. Note that the radiant heat from detonation lights the loving entire house on fire on the side that's facing the explosion. There's a video out there from the Grable shot (the 280 meter atomic cannon) where there are pigs outside in a pen, doing piggy things, right at the moment of detonation. The goddamn pigs LIGHT ON FIRE from the radiant heat of the fireball. There were two coffee table books that I saw in a bookstore many years ago that had wonderfully pretty images of nuclear weapons. These were your typical coffee table book style very high resolution images of glamor shots of US nuclear weapons and missiles, going all the way back to fat man and little boy. Stuff mounted on aircraft, stuff on pads, stuff in silos, all kinds of nukes. The other book was "100 suns", which is 100 images gleaned from hunting through gubmint archives of nuke tests and picking the 100 most neato looking ones. Couldn't justify the price, but they're worth getting from the library.
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May 8, 2011 15:11
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Trinity and Beyond could be one of the most amazing documentaries ever and anyone interested in the development of nuclear weapons should check it out. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JvnWXf6UZXY
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May 11, 2011 04:55
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bomb dropping mishaps http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=959_1305530249
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May 17, 2011 17:26
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^^^ Terrifying and hilarious at the same time! Here's a Lockheed concept from the 70s:  A big boring flying boat right? Actually it's more like a cross between an AC-130 and a warship. Called Seasitter, it was designed as a Sea Control plane, and armed with a 105mm gun sticking out the port side, two 20mm CIWS guns, a Seasprite ASW helicopter and a bunch of Lance missiles in vertical launchers.   It's like something you'd find in an Ace Combat game.
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May 17, 2011 17:57
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VikingSkull posted:Trinity and Beyond could be one of the most amazing documentaries ever and anyone interested in the development of nuclear weapons should check it out. Reflections of a Nuclear Weaponeer by Frank Shelton is an amazing book. Frank is the nuclear weapon designer who is talking about weapon effects and design in much of Trinity and Beyond. It's out of print and stupid expensive on the used market (like a thousand dollars), but I got a copy from the library extension service and it's worth the read. A bit dry in parts, but if you were at all engaged when Frank was talking on the video, it's worth the read.
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May 17, 2011 20:03
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Sunday Punch posted:^^^ Terrifying and hilarious at the same time!
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May 18, 2011 15:02
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Chantilly Say posted:Yes, but as raised in Dr. Strangelove, a deterrent you don't publicize isn't very useful. MAD was still the relevant wargame in question, Dead Hand or not, and NATO knew this, and the Soviets knew that NATO knew this. The assuredness of mutual annihilation in case of all-out nuclear strike by one part was prevalent at this point in the Cold War. As far as I understand the history, Dead Hand more than anything served to assure old, conservative generals, often veterans of WW2, who were unsettled by IRBM deployment and advances in MIRV technology and the like and unacquainted with the finer points of nuclear war game theory, that they would indeed get the baddies no matter what.
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May 18, 2011 15:25
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B4Ctom1 posted:bomb dropping mishaps This is why separation testing is really, really important.
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May 18, 2011 15:40
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Did you know that you can land a C-130 on an aircraft carrier? Unassisted in 1963.
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May 20, 2011 02:24
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_firehawk posted:Did you know that you can land a C-130 on an aircraft carrier? Unassisted in 1963. I would literally scream the entire flight.
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May 20, 2011 02:36
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Flanker posted:I would literally scream the entire flight. No poo poo. Actually, there would be poo poo everywhere. I can only imagine being the guy on the plane who was the last to know thats where they planned on landing.
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May 20, 2011 03:54
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_firehawk posted:Did you know that you can land a C-130 on an aircraft carrier? Unassisted in 1963. Guy that was flying the Herk eventually became a Rear Admiral. His dad was a WWII Naval Aviator who earned a Navy Cross at the Coral Sea and then went on to become one of the Navy's foremost tacticians, among other things being the guy who came up with the name "Thatch Weave." He eventually rose to the rank of Vice Admiral. Dredging up an old topic...there was a discussion several pages back about the two man rule and the strike fighters that were cocked on Victor Alert in Western Europe during the Cold War. Specifically, the question revolved around a statement I made regarding nuclear armed interceptors being the only time the two man rule was violated during the Cold War and whether this was true or not given those fighters cocked on Victor Alert. I gave a pretty non-committal answer about the fighters maybe not flying or something. I was reading a pretty good piece from a former crew chief talking about the time he spent on alert...turns out the aircraft never left the alert facility while they were armed up. The process for getting an aircraft cocked on alert was to move the aircraft into the alert facility and move the weapon separately from the WSA to the alert facility (in a heavily armed convoy, obviously). Once at the alert facility, the weapon was loaded on the aircraft and the aircraft was hot cocked. When the call came down to do an exercise scramble, the aircraft would start engines and be ready to taxi, at which point they would download the weapon, securing it in the alert facility. After this the aircraft would taxi and fly its mission. When it returned, the weapon would be loaded back on the aircraft and it would be recocked on alert.
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May 20, 2011 04:59
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Gray Stormy posted:No poo poo. Actually, there would be poo poo everywhere. I can only imagine being the guy on the plane who was the last to know thats where they planned on landing. I would poo poo so hard it would cause the pilot to break his arms trying to keep the nose up. And that is  as gently caress.
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May 20, 2011 19:29
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iyaayas01 posted:Dredging up an old topic...there was a discussion several pages back about the two man rule and the strike fighters that were cocked on Victor Alert in Western Europe during the Cold War. Specifically, the question revolved around a statement I made regarding nuclear armed interceptors being the only time the two man rule was violated during the Cold War and whether this was true or not given those fighters cocked on Victor Alert. I gave a pretty non-committal answer about the fighters maybe not flying or something.
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May 21, 2011 16:18
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mlmp08 posted:Well, there are ways to make them far, far quieter and SOCOM has done this and it's not a secret, really. Also, they may be loud, but masked helicopters are very hard to hear because of the hill/mountain/whatever in the way. If you can hear a chopper, it is at VERY close range relative to air defense systems. The only chopper that comes to mind that is distinctly loving loud and has led to me hearing it before I see it is the Huey. That thing "slaps" something fierce. I got buzzed by an entire squadron of CSH-2 Rooivalks recently. That's 12 of them. By time I had pulled my iphone out, unlocked it and tried to focus for a picture, I was looking at the last one disappearing from site. Which theoretically may indicate I'd get a shot at one with a MANPADS, but I'd have been a sitting duck for ages if they were hunting with the Mokopa missile. There is no way you'd hear them.
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May 21, 2011 17:39
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ming-the-mazdaless posted:I got buzzed by an entire squadron of CSH-2 Rooivalks recently. That's 12 of them. By time I had pulled my iphone out, unlocked it and tried to focus for a picture, I was looking at the last one disappearing from site. We have a south African tfr goon? Cool. According to Wikipedia you got buzzed by all of those choppers in existence
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May 21, 2011 18:18
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Flikken posted:We have a south African tfr goon? Cool. Since 2005 dude.
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May 21, 2011 19:02
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All this cold war airplane talk reminded me of a story my warrant officer(artillery) told me when he was just a young private in West Germany. He had duty on the line and was sitting in his bunker just staring at the other side (this was mid-80's) and generally pretty boring. All of a sudden he saw a jet flying overhead. He was on the phone immediately as he watched the jet fly over the line and all the guys on the other side start moving around and sirens going off. Imagine the fear this guy must have thought as WWIII was about to unfold right in front of him. Thankfully the jet did an about face and got the hell out of there. He said he almost poo poo his pants.
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May 21, 2011 21:05
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djdanno13 posted:All this cold war airplane talk reminded me of a story my warrant officer(artillery) told me when he was just a young private in West Germany. He had duty on the line and was sitting in his bunker just staring at the other side (this was mid-80's) and generally pretty boring. All of a sudden he saw a jet flying overhead. He was on the phone immediately as he watched the jet fly over the line and all the guys on the other side start moving around and sirens going off. Imagine the fear this guy must have thought as WWIII was about to unfold right in front of him. Thankfully the jet did an about face and got the hell out of there. He said he almost poo poo his pants. Zulu alert (think I may have posted that one already). Cool footage of F-106s and a T-33 taxiing at Otis ANGB. More footage from Otis, including a two seat F-106B. Make sure to watch this one all the way through...the end includes FRED arriving painted up in European-1 camouflage, and a low level pass from a Six that looks like it's about 60 feet off the ground. Night time take off of a couple of Sixes from Otis...it sounds like a little bomb goes off when the afterburner ignites. One bad thing about the Raptor...they normally only use military thrust for takeoff, so nighttime departures aren't nearly as impressive. iyaayas01 fucked around with this message at 01:33 on May 22, 2011 |
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May 22, 2011 01:21
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ming-the-mazdaless posted:I got buzzed by an entire squadron of CSH-2 Rooivalks recently. That's 12 of them. By time I had pulled my iphone out, unlocked it and tried to focus for a picture, I was looking at the last one disappearing from site. Exactly. When the US uses MANPADS they are on an alert system varying from something like being ready to fire in an hour, which permits them to sleep, do hygiene, eat, whatever, to having the MANPADS on their shoulder, fully deployed with both members of the 2 man crew actively scanning the sky. Now, a stinger is kind of heavy to be holding and scanning the sky, so they rely heavily on early warning from either other units spotting choppers in the area or a surveillance radar like a Sentinel or ATNAVICS or the like. When doing exercises with red air, Patriot/Hawk/Nike-herc and similar systems will be sent to the highest level of readiness and left there for hours on end. Meanwhile, MANPADS gets constantly switched from being told they have 5 minutes to fire to being told to be ready to fire within 10 seconds. IIRC, 10 seconds is supposedly the time to fire if the MANPADS is sitting on the ground or in a truck and you're quick. Realistically that's something people can execute when sititng there with a stop-watch knowing when an evaluator will say "go" rather than something you can execute on the fly when a chopper shows up. If it's already on your shoulder, you can have a missile in the air in maybe 4-5 seconds if your spotter is giving you good guidance and you are a good operator.
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May 22, 2011 01:26
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Most of these have shown up a half-dozen times already in other threads, but y'all had 21 pages without me, so here are a few pictures from the family archives that are cold-war-ish. Here is the flight deck of the USS Midway on her shakedown cruise, Post WWII, and not quite into Korea.  corsairsonmidway by RReiheld, on Flickr This isn't much account as a photo, but a less-documented bit of history, here are the Blue Angels flying straight-wing Grumman F9F Panthers.  blueangels1949 by RReiheld, on Flickr The best looking, most modern, first combat aircraft in service with an afterburner, least effective fighter in Navy history, the F7U 'Gutless' Cutlass  f7uback by RReiheld, on Flickr Seriously, lookit dat fukkin' airplane:  cutlassblue by RReiheld, on Flickr One of the test pilots involved in the development of the aircraft said something along the lines of "The F7U could have been a pretty good flying airplane, if they had double the thrust, cut the nosewheel in half, gave it a conventional tail, completely redid the flight controls, and got somebody else to fly it" They don't make 'em like they used to. No really.  oldherc by RReiheld, on Flickr Barely even looks like a herc with 3 blade props, and no radome. This, oddly enough, is the most-searched image on my flickr. The XC-99. Based, loosely, on the B-36, but with a mid-wing and two decks for cargo and pax. Only built one, which they let rot for 40 years in Texas, before moving it to rot in many small pieces at the USAF museum. It is on the list for restoration, but it's been there for 10 years and counting.  XC99 by RReiheld, on Flickr Harrier with USAF markings? Ok.  Airforceharrier by RReiheld, on Flickr Here is an XB-52 with the old style tandem cockpit, and the wrong engines on  xb-52 by RReiheld, on Flickr I reckon this is a T-58VD, a multi-engine short takeoff modification of the SU-15 Flagon.  sukhoi-stol by RReiheld, on Flickr F-4, A-6  nam1big by RReiheld, on Flickr I like this one, a lot going on. The well discussed up-thread A-5, the tail of an A-6, And A-3 Destroyer, an F-4, and a case of beer. The man who appears to be a hippy is very likely a Tech Rep with North American, who flew around behind the A-5 wherever it went, and put the parts that fell off it or broke on every flight back on.  Vigilante by RReiheld, on Flickr This is the TU-16/H-6 that dropped China's first Hydrogen Bomb.  TU-16 by RReiheld, on Flickr This is the ladder to the tailgunners position, that wasn't locked when I dragged a picnic bench over to jiggle the handle.  enterme by RReiheld, on Flickr This is pictures from the inside of the tailgunners position of the TU-16/H-6 that dropped China's first Hydrogen Bomb. Labled alternately in Russian and Chinese.  DSC_3220 by RReiheld, on Flickr  Picture 113 by RReiheld, on Flickr  Picture 112 by RReiheld, on Flickr This is why I went to China, the TU-4 Bull. Also discussed at some length earlier in the thread  tu4again by RReiheld, on Flickr This is another  TU-4 by RReiheld, on Flickr Whitewall tires were classy in 1949, they will be classy in 2049  linofmigsB by RReiheld, on Flickr
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May 22, 2011 05:12
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Really fascinating stuff, especially everything about Elmendorf. About 13 years ago, I was lucky enough to visit the (control room? radar room?) at Elmendorf, I can't remember what it was called. A friend of mine was the daughter of the Lt. Col. who was in charge of the radar/intercept operations (I'm sure I'm getting the name for everything wrong, I don't remember what they called everything). I was staying overnight with his daughter, and he asked me if I wanted to see where he worked, and I jumped on the chance. He took me into a building on Elmendorf, then down an elevator to an underground hallway. He then pressed an intercom button on an unassuming door, asking if he could bring a guest in. They told him that we had to wait 5 minutes for them to put some sensitive materials away. After the 5 minutes passed, we were buzzed into a room that I remember thinking looked like a scaled down version of the NORAD command center in the movie Wargames, instead of a map of the world on the front screen, it was one of Alaska. I remember a defcon status lightboard (I think there was a seperate one for the Pacific, and one overall?), banks of radar screens, and most strikingly, dozens of plaques of red stars on the walls. I asked what the plaques were for, and was told that each one was a russian flight that had been detected and successfully intercepted. What really struck me that there were plaques from after the collapse of the Soviet Union. I also remember his office, which had a great framed picture of f-15s escorting a Bear. Thanks for all of your posts, it brought back a lot of memories. Not entirely related, but I sell alcohol in rural Alaska, and one of my accounts was Clear Air Force Station, where they have the immense BMEWS array. The size and scale of the radar system impressed me each time that I visited: three radar screens, each 165ft tall and 400ft wide. Are those used anymore, or do they just use the new Solid State radars now?
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May 22, 2011 09:29
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paradigmblue posted:Not entirely related, but I sell alcohol in rural Alaska, and one of my accounts was Clear Air Force Station, where they have the immense BMEWS array. The size and scale of the radar system impressed me each time that I visited: three radar screens, each 165ft tall and 400ft wide. Are those used anymore, or do they just use the new Solid State radars now? They have been using SSPARS for about 10 years.
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May 22, 2011 14:36
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paradigmblue posted:Really fascinating stuff, especially everything about Elmendorf. Sounds like you visited ANR (Alaska NORAD Region). As for the Bears, we will be intercepting those things until the end of the world.
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May 22, 2011 15:29
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Flikken posted:According to Wikipedia you got buzzed by all of those choppers in existence Yes, it was all of the completed airframes in active service. I think, given their flight path they were coming from weapons integration testing at Denel Dynamics. It's the only plausible explanation I can come up with, since they were flying clean. mlmp08 posted:Exactly. When the US uses MANPADS they are on an alert system varying from something like being ready to fire in an hour, which permits them to sleep, do hygiene, eat, whatever, to having the MANPADS on their shoulder, fully deployed with both members of the 2 man crew actively scanning the sky.
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May 22, 2011 17:21
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Styles Bitchley posted:They have been using SSPARS for about 10 years. Yup, just to add to this, the other BMEWS sites (Cape Cod and RAF Fylingdales) were just straight upgraded, but the site at Clear was actually retrofitted with pieces from the decommissioned PAVE PAWS sites at Eldorado in Texas and Robins in Georgia. No real difference as far as end result, just a fun fact. BadgerMan45 posted:Sounds like you visited ANR (Alaska NORAD Region). As for the Bears, we will be intercepting those things until the end of the world. That's what it sounded like. I've never been to the ANR command post, but I have visited the CAC (Combat Alert Center, the facility where the alert fighters are scrambled out of). They have a map in the CAC with all the intercepts for at least the last several decades marked on it...all of them out of Elmendorf, Galena, King Salmon, and Eareckson/Shemya. Lots of stars on there. ming-the-mazdaless posted:It's not much different to Strela teams in the SANDF and I'd wager every other Western military. Does the SANDF actually use Strelas? I figured they'd have some sort of Western kit...although I imagine they're quite familiar with the Eastern Bloc weapons from the various Bush Wars. Slo-Tek, those pictures were awesome, especially the engine test bed pre-BUFF. Regarding the Cutlass, it's amazing just how much the Westinghouse engine debacles of the '40s and '50s hosed US military aviation, specifically Naval Aviation.
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May 23, 2011 08:48
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iyaayas01 posted:
Yeah, apparently they're moving over to the Starstreak VSHORADS - I'd like to believe it's a supplement to MANPADS, but there has been no mention of this, and I am not sure how far along that program is. The initial purchase was a low volume, near portable multiple launch system back in 2000 with a variety of integrated acquisition systems added in. A month or so ago another order was placed, but no details of the launch platform were included. I'll wager it's just a missile restock.
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May 23, 2011 09:16
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iyaayas01 posted:Slo-Tek, those pictures were awesome, especially the engine test bed pre-BUFF. Regarding the Cutlass, it's amazing just how much the Westinghouse engine debacles of the '40s and '50s hosed US military aviation, specifically Naval Aviation. The Allison turboprops did in their share of promising programs as well. No amount of aerodynamic cleverness can get around a bad engine. A good engine can make a marginal aircraft, like the F-4 for instance, into a world beater. Speaking of engines and aerodynamics and so on, kind of a funny story about the F-16. The F-16 was the first production aircraft to enter service dynamically unstable. Without computer assistance, the F-16 is pitch unstable. It 'wants' to tumble rear end over teakettle. When they were designing the F-16, they designed two different wings, one was unstable, if they got their computer automation working, and the other was a conventional wing, if the computers weren't up to the task. As it turned out, the computer stability augmentation worked, and the YF-16 that was competing for the Lightweight Fighter Competition flew with the unstable wing, and won the fly-off against the Northrop YF-17. Then the Navy declined to purchase the F-16, had Northrop re-design the F-17 bigger, then gave the resulting design and the production contract to McDonnell-Douglas to built the F-18 Hornet. Military procurement is weird. Slo-Tek fucked around with this message at 18:01 on May 23, 2011 |
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May 23, 2011 17:53
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Being the first test pilots on that had to be a particularly rear end clenching experience. "Ok, this plane wants to jerk wildly out of control but we're pretty sure the computer will stop you from dying horribly."
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May 24, 2011 10:40
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Alaan posted:Being the first test pilots on that had to be a particularly rear end clenching experience. "Ok, this plane wants to jerk wildly out of control but we're pretty sure the computer will stop you from dying horribly." Best way to win medals outside of warfare son.
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May 24, 2011 13:42
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