|
rcman50166 posted:So when something like that happens, how do they clean up the mess? Do they repair the trains or just trash them? Or maybe it's like a car where it depends on the damage? I would vote repair seeing how heavily they are built, but I don't know much about the subject Apparently there is money in it: http://www.paducahbilt.com/Pages/locos_wreck.asp
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 00:35 |
|
|
# ? May 16, 2024 17:28 |
|
BrokenKnucklez posted:The worst kind of collision FRA accident report: http://www.fra.dot.gov/downloads/safety/Accident_Investigation/2006/hq200648v.pdf I found this impressive... FRA Accident report posted:All crew members from both trains sustained non life-threatening injuries; one required an extended hospital stay. I would have figured multiple fatalities with train-on-train action at a combined head-on speed of 60 MPH. Geoj fucked around with this message at 01:09 on Jun 3, 2011 |
# ? Jun 3, 2011 00:56 |
|
wow... Damages were estimated at: equipment, $4,932,528; track and structures, $392,000; no damage to signals. also:
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 01:40 |
|
CommieGIR posted:Apparently there is money in it: There is a trucking company in Nevada that got it's start, and still does, and has it's own railyard in WY doing tanker car repairs and refits.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 02:03 |
|
bisticles posted:also: FRA FACTUAL RAILROAD ACCIDENT REPORT posted:Train #1's engineer received a flashing intermediate yellow over red aspect at milepost 1027.2, indicating he should “proceed prepared to pass next signal not exceeding 40 mph and be prepared to enter diverging route at prescribed speed” ... Train #1's speed was a constant 44 mph in throttle 2 from at least milepost 1028 ... milepost 1026.3, Train #1 received a solid yellow over red aspect, indicating “proceed prepared to stop at next signal; trains exceeding 30 mph immediately reduce to that speed” ... milepost 1026.4, at a speed of 44 mph, a distance of 7,716 feet prior to impact ... 4,059 feet prior to impact, speed was 43 mph, and the throttle raised from throttle 1 to throttle 2 position ... At 3,413 feet prior to impact, the locomotive was momentarily dropped to throttle 1 and returned to throttle 2; speed approximately 43 mph. At 1,059 feet prior to impact, the engineer placed the train into emergency Grateful Dead posted:Drivin' that train, high on cocaine.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 02:21 |
|
B4Ctom1 posted:Here is a scary cam view Hopefully the engineer lived long enough to kick the everloving poo poo out of whoever hosed the dog on that one.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 07:18 |
|
B4Ctom1 posted:people I used to ride this rail line. That line has like 1 jumper/idiot a month. On more train news... http://www.chicagobreakingnews.com/news/local/chibrknews-fire-crews-respond-to-union-station-derailment-report-20110603,0,3250401.story Trains play bumper cars at chicago union station.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 15:12 |
|
bisticles posted:But there is a new number 1. A cause so insidious as to have the public opinion so on edge, so upset, something that actually HAS been the cause of transportation accidents. Buses, trucks, cars and trains have all wrecked and people have died because of it. This cause is the dreaded cellphone. The result has been the FRA Emergency Order #26. Emergency Order To Restrict On-Duty Railroad Operating Employees' Use of Cellular Telephones and Other electronic devices. On March 28th this ban became law with stiff fines (tens of thousands of dollars) and even bigger fines for willful violation. If you violate and there is a resulting crash you would probably go to jail. You are not even allowed to have it turned on. It must be turned off and put into a bag. Another is a result there is a rush for new technology, the Massachusetts Bay Transportation Authority is piloting some equipment that will be installed in the cab of a locomotive that will stop the train if a cellphone is detected. So as to not be tripped by nearby cellphones or plain cellular tower signals, this equipment can detect the special signal changes that a cellphone goes through when a call is made or received, data is used, which includes send or receive messaging. It is said to even be able to detect a phone as it does the "handoff" from one tower to another. This equipment is antenna-ed in a way so as to be able only to detect within the confines of the cab to prevent false triggers. Basically if your train is moving, and the device detects a cellphone within the cab in a state other than off, an alarm will sound, train brakes will apply, and the operator will have to answer for why this happened to at least his employer. The procedure now in the event of an accident, the FRA will subpoena your cellular records to check to see if your phone was on or off. It will be the new "drug test". Some train ran into the back of you? Well records show YOUR cellphone was on, case solved. As a result, I turn mine off. There are a few hold outs, mostly conductors, but I figure eventually the FRA will start handing out warnings that will curb most of this. The fact of the matter is this, cellphones are a distraction. Any guy who violates this law can't expect any sympathy from the public or the FRA. If he has an accident even more so. There have been fatal accidents since the law went into effect March 28th. It is rumored that these guys had phones on or in use. They made allowances for small amounts of cell phone use while still on duty in the law and the railroads followed suit. If your train is stopped, and nobody is performing any duty other than holding down a chair, nobody is working on or around your train, no other train is near you or approaching, you can make a phone call. No texting at all ever while on duty. It is also rumored that in the future we will no longer be allowed to even possess personal electronics of any kind on the train. This means you will have to get a second phone and put it into your locker at the away from home terminal to stay in touch with your family. Those of us who have gotten really familiar with the rules because of their ease of access through our laptops, phones, or PDA's will have to give them up as an official legal source. Every man will have to go back to carrying the huge clunky General Code of Operating Rules which becomes outdated every 5 days or so. This means all the separate printed changes in the form of booklets, amendments, orders, special instructions, timetables, subdivision orders, superintendent notices, and MTO circulars we runn off of the printers will also have to be carried again. Basically enough books and stuff to fill a box used for printer paper. Gone will be the days of just looking in the computer for an update before going to work and downloading it to your laptop or PDA and just having it all right there. Need to know a rule right now? No more Ctrl + F, no more little magnifying glass to help you instantly find it. Back to the days of sorting through a ream of paper to find out what you are supposed to do when you encounter a situation that doesn't happen that often. This is what I will miss the most.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 16:53 |
|
B4Ctom1 posted:More stupid Laws Join the retarded law club! What still gets my goat. 8 hours from bottle to throttle for pilots.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 17:21 |
|
B4Ctom1 posted:This used to be the number 1 issue on the railroad. When there is an incident of any kind, a bolt comes loose a mile back in your train, then some part falls off because of it and derails a car. The crew goes in a piss tests and because one of the guys thought it would be cute to eat a brownie while on vacation 25 days earlier in Amsterdam the cause of the derailment is automatically assigned to him. Something damaged? Failed the drug test? Case solved, paperwork filed. Well its a more tech savvy way to gently caress with the trains than the tried and true fake FRED on a tomato stake in the middle of the ballast on a curve at 3AM on a snowy January Sunday method... Cell phone with a little boost plus high gain yagi aimed right can probably freak it out at a large enough distance that nobody will see you. It'll never happen. To make it work they'd basically have to RF-seal the entire cab. Take a guess how much a test chamber for cell phone systems costs, and its a scenario where the room is stationary and you can go heavy on the concrete and rebar. Even if they try it, once the false positives cause losses greater than the actual cost of the system in the first place it will all be silently swept under the rug... The easier way to do it would be to just jam the signals in the cab, but the FCC isn't going to allow them to run a wideband noise source, let alone one that's mobile!
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 17:49 |
|
B4Ctom1 posted:This used to be the number 1 issue on the railroad. When there is an incident of any kind, a bolt comes loose a mile back in your train, then some part falls off because of it and derails a car. The crew goes in a piss tests and because one of the guys thought it would be cute to eat a brownie while on vacation 25 days earlier in Amsterdam the cause of the derailment is automatically assigned to him. Something damaged? Failed the drug test? Case solved, paperwork filed. Also, yay for unions that force rules meant for drivers/operators regarding drugs are enforced throughout the company, so even some desk monkey that couldn't do a bit of damage if he lived on space cakes gets jumped on just as hard as someone who could get a dozen other people killed.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 18:52 |
|
I loving love GG1s. My dad worked for Pennsy and later SEPTA (and now he works in Disney Word ) and I live near Philadelphia so I have a lot of affection for the railroad. I live only a couple blocks from the NEC and, trust me, there's nothing more of a rush then sitting around at one of the SEPTA stations for a couple hours and waiting for Acelas, Regionals, and stuff coming up from the South to rush by at near 100 mph. I love how you can hear the catenary vibrating before the train comes, and all of the sudden -- WHAM! The entire ground rumbles.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 19:01 |
|
Being 2' from amtrak or metra doing 70mph is a hell of a rush too. It's eerie how steady the engine note is from a locomotive. You know it's hauling, and there's a sense of power. But the motor just seems loping along.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 19:31 |
|
InterceptorV8 posted:Join the retarded law club! The rule is actually somewhat stricter than that, but it's still no better than DUI laws in most states. FAR 91.17 posted:(a) No person may act or attempt to act as a crewmember of a civil aircraft— At least with airlines, alcohol and flying isn't a massive problem, but the FAA likes to do a dog-and-pony show any time a pilot gets caught violating those rules in order to cover the fact that their duty-day rules date from the 1930's, and some of their medical requirements only recently got updated from the 1960's.
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 21:07 |
|
Hello fellow train fans, not sure how I've missed this thread so far. This is one of my favorite books of all time, I've had a copy since I was about 8, picked up at some steam museum in the midwest, possibly Nebraska. http://www.amazon.com/Train-Wrecks-Robert-Carroll-Reed/dp/0517328976 In other rail nerdery, Railroad Tycoon 2 plays perfectly on Windows 7 and I have been putting a ridiculous number of hours into it since getting it on Steam a few months back for $5. You can even make RRT3 work on 7, even though Steam says it's not compatible. I keep wanting to get one of the more modern games, for those of you have tried the more recent offerings, is Railworks2 the better choice? (over Trainz or MSTS?)
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 21:27 |
|
They are always creating scare tactics with these phones. Sadly they never work. I still work with guys that like to text about where they are at... usually they are on facebook talking away. I usually look at them like they just ran over my dog, wife, my e39, and my mom at the same time and then pooped on every thing they just hit. I tell them to put it away, But hey if they want to get slapped with a huge fine, lose a really good paying job, fine with me!
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 21:32 |
|
Nerobro posted:Being 2' from amtrak or metra doing 70mph is a hell of a rush too. It's eerie how steady the engine note is from a locomotive. You know it's hauling, and there's a sense of power. But the motor just seems loping along. Locomotive diesels only wind out to about 900 rpm, at that
|
# ? Jun 3, 2011 21:36 |
|
I was driving south from tacoma WA a while back, and along the interstate there appeared to be many miles worth of abandened SP doublestacks. Is there any story behind that, it seems pretty wasteful to not sell/reuse those cars.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 02:18 |
|
Ika posted:I was driving south from tacoma WA a while back, and along the interstate there appeared to be many miles worth of abandened SP doublestacks. Is there any story behind that, it seems pretty wasteful to not sell/reuse those cars. Storage. Nothing is ever really abandoned... just put away for a while
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 02:19 |
|
So I guess when china/japan/korea starts shipping over more stuff they'll be put back in service? makes sense.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 02:38 |
|
Ika posted:I was driving south from tacoma WA a while back, and along the interstate there appeared to be many miles worth of abandened SP doublestacks. Is there any story behind that, it seems pretty wasteful to not sell/reuse those cars. You should see the line of engines in L.A. out by Redlands. I swear there is 5 miles of Locomotives just sitting there. I've come across what looks to be grain bellydumps in the middle of LA almost to AR that had to be 8 miles on tracks that looked like hell. I kinda wonder what kind of crazy poo poo they have parked in the middle of Nevada.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 05:04 |
|
InterceptorV8 posted:You should see the line of engines in L.A. out by Redlands. I swear there is 5 miles of Locomotives just sitting there. I've come across what looks to be grain bellydumps in the middle of LA almost to AR that had to be 8 miles on tracks that looked like hell. I kinda wonder what kind of crazy poo poo they have parked in the middle of Nevada. Drove by that today. Crazy.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 07:54 |
|
Ether Frenzy posted:In other rail nerdery, Railroad Tycoon 2 plays perfectly on Windows 7 and I have been putting a ridiculous number of hours into it since getting it on Steam a few months back for $5. You can even make RRT3 work on 7, even though Steam says it's not compatible. I can't speak for sims, but if you like the RRT games then a more "casual" version of those is Sid Meier's Railroads! It's a bit light and definitely unrealistic, but perfect for a game where you pick it up for a quick 30-45 minute game and crush the computer with your perfectly optimised railway system. It's really designed for multiplayer pickup games of which I've only managed to get one going but it was great fun.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 09:24 |
|
porkfriedrice posted:From what I've read on a rail forum (railroad.net), those trains have recording devices that are similar to the "black boxes" on aircraft. There is. For example, this incident (url to report here, scroll down to the Rungoo incident) happened a couple of years ago. It killed both of our drivers in the train at the time. You'll note that if you open the report and go to page 39 of the PDF, you'll see that all of the track infrastructure (in this case, level crossing lights, track circuitry, etc.) are logged, to the point of it only going haywire when the control box was cleaned up by the derailed power car. Secondly, the same is done in the power car itself. Page 43 of the PDF shows everything logged, from horn/headlight status, to brake pipe pressure, etc. We record everything that happens in a locomotive for this very reason. All of this, as you can see, is published by the Australian Transport Safety Bureau, whom investigate every transport incident that occurs be it rail, air, sea, etc. There is a free mailing list you can sign up to where they send out messages informing you of when reports are completed or when major updates are made. It's all freely available for public viewing on their website, too. The investigation process is pretty thorough. They go into behavioural theories as to what may have caused it, interview eye-witnesses, scour data recordings and log books, etc. It's a pretty good process to have and I'd be throughly surprised if the US didn't have an equivalent in place. rcman50166 posted:So when something like that happens, how do they clean up the mess? Do they repair the trains or just trash them? Or maybe it's like a car where it depends on the damage? I would vote repair seeing how heavily they are built, but I don't know much about the subject They do whatever's the most financially sensible. I know of old rollingstock that derailed and are just dumped on the side of the track on network-owned property and left there because it's a remote site where you can't get trucks/cranes in and it'd cost more than the vehicle's worth to recover. Hell, one of the coal carrying companies in Queensland has a few wagons laying on the side of the major highway in to the closest city, where they derailed, simply because they're write-offs and they're in no hurry to go grab them since they're worthless now. Others will get dragged in for repair. Others again may get recovered, sent to workshops and stripped for parts then shoved as an empty shell in the yard to just rust away until someone disposes of it. It's a business so, exactly like insurance, it depends on what's the most financially sensible decision. The only case I know of when this hasn't happened is when Qantas re-built a jet because they have the safety record of 'never having lost an airframe in the jet age'. After one overshot the runway and suffered significant structural damage (I think in Signapore), it was technically a write-off but Qantas spent more money than the jet's value to repair it, so they could keep their record of 'never having lost an airframe in the jet age'. Nam Taf fucked around with this message at 15:20 on Jun 4, 2011 |
# ? Jun 4, 2011 15:16 |
|
I have heard that might be out of the window now because of that A380 that blew up an engine- I've heard from people in Aviation that when it went kaboom and the subsequent full load landing, its pretty much written off the airframe.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 15:44 |
|
B4Ctom1 posted:
I remember when this happened, it wasn't too far from where I live. Killed 5 people. http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/07/09/national/main5147200.shtml Oh god you can almost see their faces before they're crushed to death. Mental Hospitality fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Jun 4, 2011 |
# ? Jun 4, 2011 18:30 |
|
SouthLAnd posted:I remember when this happened, it wasn't too far from where I live. I love the YouTube comments with idiots -- all claiming to be the victims' friends -- claiming that it "wasn't their fault," "the gates weren't working," and "WHERE R U BITC IM GONNA gently caress U UP U DISRESPECTIN MY FRIENDZ U DONT EVEN KNO RIP."
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 19:01 |
|
Fixed Gear Guy posted:I love the YouTube comments with idiots -- all claiming to be the victims' friends -- claiming that it "wasn't their fault," "the gates weren't working," and "WHERE R U BITC IM GONNA gently caress U UP U DISRESPECTIN MY FRIENDZ U DONT EVEN KNO RIP." The driver had a suspended license because he was basically just a poo poo driver and didn't feel like obeying traffic laws. Too bad he won't have to live with the horrific guilt of knowing he killed those kids. Mental Hospitality fucked around with this message at 19:14 on Jun 4, 2011 |
# ? Jun 4, 2011 19:10 |
|
Fixed Gear Guy posted:I love the YouTube comments with idiots -- all claiming to be the victims' friends -- claiming that it "wasn't their fault," "the gates weren't working," and "WHERE R U BITC IM GONNA gently caress U UP U DISRESPECTIN MY FRIENDZ U DONT EVEN KNO RIP." People like that kill me. In 2005 in a city just north of where I live a 16 year old girl was killed at a railroad crossing when she attempted to cross immediately behind a southbound train and walked right into the path of a northbound train that through some freak occurrence happened to go through the crossing just as the other train was clearing it. For about two weeks afterwards there were protests at the crossing every weekend with the protesters carrying signs saying "CSX kills kids" (etc.) and throwing rocks and eggs at trains as they passed through.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 19:24 |
|
Geoj posted:People like that kill me. In 2005 in a city just north of where I live a 16 year old girl was killed at a railroad crossing when she attempted to cross immediately behind a southbound train and walked right into the path of a northbound train that through some freak occurrence happened to go through the crossing just as the other train was clearing it. People don't like to accept that people they care about may actually be part of the lower 50th percentile. Also, why do diesel locomotives only have 8 throttle notches? Why not 10? 16? Why even have notches and not just a back and forth lever between idle and loud?
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 19:45 |
|
Geoj posted:People like that kill me. In 2005 in a city just north of where I live a 16 year old girl was killed at a railroad crossing when she attempted to cross immediately behind a southbound train and walked right into the path of a northbound train that through some freak occurrence happened to go through the crossing just as the other train was clearing it. It definitely seems a freak occurrence for freight, but out here in SEPTAland it happens every evening rush hour at my station. The outbound train is pulling out and a hoard of idiot commuter-drones are crowed around the pedestrian grade crossing, meanwhile an inbound train is about to pull into the station. Unfortunately the inbound train is blocked from view by the outbound one, so it's real easy to get killed. To solve the issue, SEPTA has a special operading order which requires the outbound train to wait for the inbound one to pull into the station before throttling up. Unfortunately, the engineers seem to love death and destruction because once every other week they just roll on out. I know for a fact someone died in this scenario a couple years ago .
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 19:56 |
|
Geoj posted:People like that kill me. In 2005 in a city just north of where I live a 16 year old girl was killed at a railroad crossing when she attempted to cross immediately behind a southbound train and walked right into the path of a northbound train that through some freak occurrence happened to go through the crossing just as the other train was clearing it. I'm wondering about the accident I saw yesterday in which someone ran into the rear end end of a Walmart truck. People don't understand how much this happens. Do people not look both ways before crossing a street? I'm surprised people figure out how to wide their own asses anymore.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 19:58 |
|
ijustam posted:Also, why do diesel locomotives only have 8 throttle notches? Why not 10? 16? Why even have notches and not just a back and forth lever between idle and loud? That is a big "it has been this way since diesel locomotives came out and to bad deal" type of situation. Pretty much most stuff thats out here has been done for a 160 years the same way. No one has figured out a better way and so far I think thats the way it will stay. Railroaders do not like change at all.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 21:08 |
|
BrokenKnucklez posted:That is a big "it has been this way since diesel locomotives came out and to bad deal" type of situation. Wrong! It has to do with synchronous power production. To make the generators produce the correct frequencies for the AC traction motors and head-end power it has to run at certain multiples of rpm.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 21:23 |
|
Sponge! posted:Wrong! What about the DC units then?
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 21:26 |
|
BrokenKnucklez posted:What about the DC units then? Same thing, the prime mover is coupled to the alternator, and head end power is tapped off as AC, and the juice for the traction motors is passed through the rectifiers and sent on down the line to the motors themselves.
|
# ? Jun 4, 2011 21:29 |
|
Ether Frenzy posted:I keep wanting to get one of the more modern games, for those of you have tried the more recent offerings, is Railworks2 the better choice? (over Trainz or MSTS?) You'll hear fans of all of them come up with some more or less reasonable arguments for their favorite sim. There's not really a right or wrong choice, but I'd go with Railworks. It's newer, smoother, prettier and has quite a bit of content in the base game. Elukka fucked around with this message at 23:39 on Jun 4, 2011 |
# ? Jun 4, 2011 23:34 |
|
InterceptorV8 posted:You should see the line of engines in L.A. out by Redlands. I swear there is 5 miles of Locomotives just sitting there. I've come across what looks to be grain bellydumps in the middle of LA almost to AR that had to be 8 miles on tracks that looked like hell. I kinda wonder what kind of crazy poo poo they have parked in the middle of Nevada. If they are new locomotives, then this is exactly what I was told about. The Chinese are buying durable goods like crazy with their "extremely stable no reason to worry" US dollars. I hauled a train of like 320 top of the line john deers tractors a while back. Just one of many trains like it. All bound for china. They have had the money for years but never bought on this scale before. B4Ctom1 fucked around with this message at 04:00 on Jun 5, 2011 |
# ? Jun 5, 2011 03:58 |
|
B4Ctom1 posted:If they are new locomotives, then this is exactly what I was told about. The Chinese are buying durable goods like crazy with their "extremely stable no reason to worry" US dollars. I hauled a train of like 320 top of the line john deers tractors a while back. Just one of many trains like it. All bound for china. They have had the money for years but never bought on this scale before. Imagine if you could drive those trains across the sea!
|
# ? Jun 5, 2011 04:25 |
|
|
# ? May 16, 2024 17:28 |
|
If you get hit by a train it is your fault. I don't care if there are crossing gates working or not. The train isn't going to swerve to hit you, they run on tracks. I cross a railroad crossing by my home multiple times per day. I always stop to look regardless of gate position and regularly get honked at for slowing down and stopping. If other people want to trust the gates that's fine but i will check for myself.
|
# ? Jun 5, 2011 05:57 |