|
subx posted:Say basically what you just said really. If you are actually interested and think you have the skills for the job, that's what you say (obviously elaborate a bit). Thanks, I did that. If I come off as a jerk to the dude, well, every interview is experience..
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2011 11:06
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 22, 2024 11:34 |
|
|
ancient lobster posted:Thanks, I did that. If I come off as a jerk to the dude, well, every interview is experience.. If you do that and the guy still thinks you're a jerk you probably don't want to work for him anyway.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2011 13:51
|
|
|
So yay I'm getting my first phone interview! How should I prepare besides reading a bit about the company?
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2011 21:22
|
|
|
Whatever you do don't wear a suit  Be prepared to talk about the experience that you have, either in previous jobs / internships / whatever or from projects on your own time. Don't be caught "um"ing if you're asked what interests you about development or about development at that company.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2011 21:36
|
|
|
Wear a suit, usually an interviewer can tell if you're not dressed properly by the tone of your voice.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2011 21:55
|
|
|
Some background, I've been a business analyst for a number of years, doing small time Access/VB development, and I'm looking to make the jump to full time software development. I've been teaching myself C# over the last 6-9 months, working on WP7 games, and looking for a job doing any kind of C# development, as a junior role. Applied for a position, and sent in some code samples, which impressed the hiring manager much more than my resume. After the phone interview, the hiring manager mentioned that she would like for me to take a general C# aptitude test, as she had a bad experience with a previous candidate who looked good on paper but couldn't keep up with the rest of the team. So, now I'm a bit nervous. I'm all self taught, just learning new things in the framework as I run across them. I was looking through the MCTS test for .Net/C#, and it mentions a lot of stuff around assembly management, COM interop, etc. Stuff I haven't used, and really have zero exposure to, and doubt I would ever use. Should I read up on that stuff, or focus on some of the more basic framework stuff like the different collections, delegates, etc. It sounds like a great position, but I don't want to screw it up because of lack of formal education.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2011 21:58
|
|
|
Orzo posted:Wear a suit, usually an interviewer can tell if you're not dressed properly by the tone of your voice. Confidence also comes through in the tone of your voice. If the interviewer sounds hot DO NOT take off your clothes unless you are 100% confident in yourself.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2011 22:26
|
|
|
Mike1o1 posted:Should I read up on that stuff, or focus on some of the more basic framework stuff like the different collections, delegates, etc. * perform basic stream I/O (FileStream, TextWriter, etc) * do something with XML, say load a document and find a node with XPath (it should only take a few minutes) * know your collections, although it sounds like you already do. You really need to understand List<T>, IEnumerable<T>, and you should probably know how Dictionary<K, V> works. Try using some of the IEnumerable<T> LINQ extension methods, they are very intuitive and very useful, and know how to use lambdas. I'm sure others can add some stuff, but you are probably already ahead of the curve.
|
|
#
?
Jun 8, 2011 23:04
|
|
|
Good stuff to know in general: -Abstract classes, interfaces, how the two are different - protection levels (public, private, protected, internal), - design patterns (know at least 2 or 3 and be able to explain what they are and when they're applicable) - generics (try to come up with some use cases that don't involve collections for extra cool dude points) Anyone who comes in to interview with me is miles ahead of the other candidates if they talk about unit testing and inversion of control. I'm still expecting strong fundamentals, but knowing how to unit test properly and build loosely-coupled applications is excellent. Oh, and don't bullshit. If you outright don't know an answer, say "I don't know." If you think you might know, still answer, but let them know that you're taking a stab. If you're stabbing in the right neighborhood, that's at least a good sign. If you try to bullshit on everything you don't know, the interviews will know, and they will not hire you. Software development is a massive field and everyone has gaps in their knowledge. The important thing is to know where you're weak and improve on those areas. Speaking of improving... time to get back to learning MVC. This is a real nightmare for me because my HTML skills haven't been exercised to any degree since Netscape 4-era. New Yorp New Yorp fucked around with this message at 00:21 on Jun 9, 2011 |
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 00:19
|
|
|
Well, took the test already, it was a lot different from what I thought it was. Turns out it was a 20 question on-line timed quiz. Each question only gave 3 minutes to answer, and copy/paste was disabled, so couldn't exactly copy/paste into VS, or do too much googling. Mostly they gave a lot of sample code snippets on exactly what you two mentioned: abstract vs interface, protected, private, internal and the differences. Most of the time it was a 15-20 line sample of inherited classes or interfaces, and I had to select what the run-time or compile-time error would be. Some stuff I really didn't know, mostly around exception handling as I haven't dealt much with that stuff. Some stuff was a stack with a lot of push and pops, and had to step through and mark what the output would be. Fortunately I passed with a 3.46 grade out of 5, which marked me as upper level proficient. I'm hoping this will be enough to move me onto the next step for a face-to-face interview, especially as this is for a junior position.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 01:03
|
|
|
HondaCivet posted:So yay I'm getting my first phone interview! How should I prepare besides reading a bit about the company? Dress comfortably, sit at your desk (ie. Don't lay on your bed or lounge in a lay-z-boy or something; it's a state of mind thing), turn off your computer monitor and speakers, tv, radio, etc. Use a land line rather than a cell phone if that's an option for you, if it's not at least make sure your phone is charged and you have a good signal where you're sitting. Nothing says professionalism like a dropped call. Also, it might help to outline any specific talking points you want to mention, separate from your resume. It helps organize your thoughts, it makes it seem like you aren't just reciting from your resume that they probably already have in front of them, and generally prevents brain farts. Also there's the situation that I ran into the first time I had a phone "interview." They used the word interview, implying a question/answer session or at least some kind of conversation. What I got was, "Okay, you have 10 minutes to tell us about yourself and why you think you would be good for this job. Go." I spent about 8 minutes talking into completely dead air, and the only reason I didn't make an utter fool out of myself was that I had taken the time to jot down an outline of my talking points earlier that day. You think public speaking is nerve-wracking, try doing it without being able to gauge the audience's reaction. Holy poo poo. Good luck.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 03:50
|
|
|
Ithaqua posted:- design patterns (know at least 2 or 3 and be able to explain what they are and when they're applicable) And don't be surprised if you hear "except singleton" for the design patterns question
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 04:25
|
|
|
No Safe Word posted:And don't be surprised if you hear "except singleton" for the design patterns question Is that because they're so simple or because they're pointless? I had never used singletons before my current job, and I keep coming across them littered around various parts of our codebase. I get the point of a singleton is to restrict to a single instance of the class, but I just don't see how they're particularly useful. I especially don't see how our code benefits from them.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 06:34
|
|
|
Mobius posted:Is that because they're so simple or because they're pointless? I had never used singletons before my current job, and I keep coming across them littered around various parts of our codebase. I get the point of a singleton is to restrict to a single instance of the class, but I just don't see how they're particularly useful. I especially don't see how our code benefits from them. The former. Everyone knows what a singleton is.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 07:05
|
|
|
Mobius posted:I get the point of a singleton is to restrict to a single instance of the class, but I just don't see how they're particularly useful. It's a global variable. It's useful for whatever globals are useful for.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 07:09
|
|
|
If they restrict Singleton, use Doubleton.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 14:37
|
|
|
If you can, give condescending nicknames to whatever patterns are mentioned, eg. if they ask you about Strategy say "oh you mean passing a function pointer?" or if they ask about Visitor say "did you mean: map()?"
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 14:43
|
|
|
Otto Skorzeny posted:If you can, give condescending nicknames to whatever patterns are mentioned, eg. if they ask you about Strategy say "oh you mean passing a function pointer?" or if they ask about Visitor say "did you mean: map()?" 
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 16:06
|
|
|
I must be the worst at in person interviews. I just got another call saying that the company I just interviewed for is going with the other candidate. This is becoming a reoccurring theme for me it seems. I get to the in person interview either locally or flown out. Do the normal chat about their company and about some of the stuff I worked on in school. Take their tests which I normally finish quickly as they a simple enough. Possibly meet the rest of the team and tour around the building. I think the interview will have gone well. Wait a few days then I get a call saying they do not want to move forward with me. It is starting to get depressing at how rote this is all become. Submit, talk, visit, denied. Most of my friends found jobs before they graduated and received 30K a year more than what people are even willing to offer me. (I tried once answering the question of what I would like to make with the same amount my friends make. I heard them laughing outside of the room.) Does anyone have any advice?
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 16:51
|
|
|
Hibame posted:I must be the worst at in person interviews. I just got another call saying that the company I just interviewed for is going with the other candidate. This is becoming a reoccurring theme for me it seems. I get to the in person interview either locally or flown out. Do the normal chat about their company and about some of the stuff I worked on in school. Take their tests which I normally finish quickly as they a simple enough. Possibly meet the rest of the team and tour around the building. I think the interview will have gone well. Wait a few days then I get a call saying they do not want to move forward with me. Maybe try some professional interview coaching? I think this would be a tough problem to diagnose over an internet forum.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 17:31
|
|
|
Hibame posted:Does anyone have any advice? If you can stomach some vague answers and flat out BS, ask them what they thought your deficiencies were. It might not all be useful, but you can try.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 17:35
|
|
|
Hibame posted:I must be the worst at in person interviews. I just got another call saying that the company I just interviewed for is going with the other candidate. This is becoming a reoccurring theme for me it seems. I get to the in person interview either locally or flown out. Do the normal chat about their company and about some of the stuff I worked on in school. Take their tests which I normally finish quickly as they a simple enough. Possibly meet the rest of the team and tour around the building. I think the interview will have gone well. Wait a few days then I get a call saying they do not want to move forward with me. I don't mean to be a dick, but are you actually as good as you think you are? If you're a .NET dev, I'd be more than happy to give you our phone screening (via phone/skype, even!) and let you know how you do.
|
|
#
?
Jun 9, 2011 23:43
|
|
|
I guess this is more of a general question but is it generally a waste of time to put your resume in with companies that don't currently have any positions open that you fit into?
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2011 03:07
|
|
|
HondaCivet posted:I guess this is more of a general question but is it generally a waste of time to put your resume in with companies that don't currently have any positions open that you fit into? If you want to work there, go for it. The worst that will happen is they throw your resume in the trash and you never hear back from them. The best that will happen is they love your resume and either have an position that hasn't been posted yet or keep it for when they have an opening down the road and call you up. Even if they don't call back, when you apply again when something does open someone may see that you've spent the time to apply twice and give you extra credit for showing that you really want to work there.
|
|
#
?
Jun 10, 2011 16:15
|
|
|
I am a recent college graduate (2010) with a B.S. in Economics. For the past year, I have been stuck in a lovely dead end job, and I have realized Economics is as terrible of a background as philosophy or English when it comes to getting a job. I have decided to learn Java. I currently have no tangible, marketable skill besides MS Office proficiency which is commonplace these days. In high school I took AP Computer Science and had some exposure to Visual C++, and I found it to be very interesting and fun. My questions are: 1. What is the best way to go about learning Java, on my own? I have a book from a friend, Sam's Teach Yourself Java 2, from 1999. Is this too outdated, or would it be a good place to start? 2. Would I be able to get some sort of decent paying ($40,000+) with a no experience or formal education in Java development, just with 4-6 months of self-study of the language? 3. Are there any Java certifications out there worth getting that would make my self-study look more legit? Pron on VHS fucked around with this message at 18:18 on Jun 11, 2011 |
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2011 17:17
|
|
|
Pron on VHS posted:1. What is the best way to go about learning Java, on my own? I have a book from a friend, Sam's Teach Yourself Java 2, from 1999. Is this too outdated, or would it be a good place to start? You have a lot more to learn than just the Java syntax if you are hoping to get a decent job. I would start off with a book that teaches data structures in Java, maybe this. Leaning Java should be a side-effect of learning the other tools you're going to need to be able to write good software.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2011 20:02
|
|
|
Pron on VHS posted:2. Would I be able to get some sort of decent paying ($40,000+) with a no experience or formal education in Java development, just with 4-6 months of self-study of the language? I can't answer your other two but I can say yes to this one since that's what I did but with .NET, though I took a few community college courses for a semester while I was turning around after finishing a degree in an unrelated field. Cryolite fucked around with this message at 20:10 on Jun 11, 2011 |
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2011 20:04
|
|
|
Pron on VHS posted:I have a book from a friend, Sam's Teach Yourself Java 2, from 1999. Is this too outdated, or would it be a good place to start?
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2011 20:37
|
|
|
Cryolite posted:though I took a few community college courses for a semester while I was turning around after finishing a degree in an unrelated field. Depending on the quality of community colleges in your area, that might be a good option. If you're committed and smart, the bang/buck of CC classes could be very worth it. But yeah, 1999 is probably Java 1.2, which is definitely out of date. Generics have made Java a different (and I would say much better) beast.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2011 20:39
|
|
|
I went ahead and purchased the new edition of that book a few minutes ago, for Java 6.oRenj9 posted:You have a lot more to learn than just the Java syntax if you are hoping to get a decent job. I would start off with a book that teaches data structures in Java, maybe this. Leaning Java should be a side-effect of learning the other tools you're going to need to be able to write good software. Would the first edition of Data Structures and Algorithms for Java be sufficient, or is that also out of date? I already have a copy of the first edition somehow, which is why I ask.
|
|
#
?
Jun 11, 2011 20:56
|
|
|
Pron on VHS posted:I went ahead and purchased the new edition of that book a few minutes ago, for Java 6. It's probably good enough for teaching you some fundamentals. Although this seems to suggests that the first edition didn't cover recursion or linked lists which is just  At any rate, you'll want to eventually look/think of how you would implement certain data structures using generics. And have a look at the C# world - Java hasn't had any major gamechanging features added since 2004. Java isn't getting lambda functions until next year. C# has had them for 4 years now. It's likely any jobs you go for will be for inexperienced programmers - it helps if you can also stick yourself forward for .NET jobs as well as Java ones.
|
|
#
?
Jun 12, 2011 00:14
|
|
|
Pron on VHS posted:I went ahead and purchased the new edition of that book a few minutes ago, for Java 6. I've been slowly clearing books off my shelf and I guess there's no reason to hold onto my Java 2 books if they're already up to 6. I know this is a programming job thread but could anyone give any tips on interviews for a CIO? Out of the blue, some company is apparently really interested in me based off of some resume I handed out about 3 years ago.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2011 00:04
|
|
|
Is getting a Professional Java Programmer certificate from Oracle worth it? I already work as a 'programmer' but I'm looking for something that makes my resume look more legit. I basically just write perl scripts right now, and I'd like to do something a little more substantial. Would this cert look good to a recruiter (not necessarily just for java) or is it just a big waste of time?? Its this btw: http://education.oracle.com/pls/web_prod-plq-dad/db_pages.getpage?page_id=320&p_org_id=28&lang=US
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2011 22:35
|
|
|
Pram posted:Is getting a Professional Java Programmer certificate from Oracle worth it? I already work as a 'programmer' but I'm looking for something that makes my resume look more legit. I basically just write perl scripts right now, and I'd like to do something a little more substantial. Would this cert look good to a recruiter (not necessarily just for java) or is it just a big waste of time?? It doesn't look very impressive. That's equivalent to something I'd expect a university student to be able to do after 2 or 3 weeks - it's mostly on syntax and very basic OO concepts. I've never met anyone who has ever boasted or mentioned being a certified .NET or Java developer. Maybe for networks and stuff it's useful, but programming certification isn't worth the paper it's written on. I'm a certified Tester to ISTQB-BCS Foundation Level, which basically meant I sat through 3 days about very formal, high-level waterfall testing strategies for multi-million defence projects. And stuff like "You should test boundary conditions". I worked on highly RAD, loosely specced systems with relatively small budgets and timescales. There was nothing useful for me there.
|
|
#
?
Jun 14, 2011 23:35
|
|
|
Yes I realize programming certs are useless but I was mostly curious if it has any value as resume fodder. Probably not though I'm guessing.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2011 00:31
|
|
|
Pram posted:Yes I realize programming certs are useless but I was mostly curious if it has any value as resume fodder. Probably not though I'm guessing. It depends on the level of cert. Microsoft's certs are pretty good, especially as you get higher up. Basically, a guy who's an MCPD is probably pretty good, or at the very least, not a total moron.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2011 00:48
|
|
|
Pram posted:Yes I realize programming certs are useless but I was mostly curious if it has any value as resume fodder. Probably not though I'm guessing.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2011 00:59
|
|
|
That's pretty funny, also answers my question. 
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2011 01:10
|
|
|
Cicero posted:Some software engineers from Google visited my school for a recruiting session, and straight up said that putting certs on your resume would pretty much disqualify you automatically from the running.
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2011 01:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 22, 2024 11:34 |
|
|
ignore, wrong thread
|
|
#
?
Jun 15, 2011 01:50
|
|
