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Sorry for poo poo quality of photo.
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Jun 5, 2011 18:57
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They look pretty awesome! Edit: Black Powder kinda put me off with the 'no points no army lists!' stuff. I guess I just want my history made accessible and gamey. Bullbar fucked around with this message at 19:11 on Jun 5, 2011 |
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Jun 5, 2011 19:07
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Jinjin Bemar posted:Sorry for poo poo quality of photo. 15mm? What game do you use them for? A handful-of-minis gladiator game could be fun.
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Jun 5, 2011 19:13
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Galaga Galaxian posted:15mm? What game do you use them for? A handful-of-minis gladiator game could be fun. 28mm! Just a poor pic- they look better int he flesh. I use Red Sand Blue Sky from Two Hour Wargames. Its awesome fun. http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3248082&userid=134151&perpage=40&pagenumber=2#post391590251
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Jun 5, 2011 19:41
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CNN Sports Ticker posted:They look pretty awesome! gently caress points values! ;p
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Jun 5, 2011 19:41
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CNN Sports Ticker posted:They look pretty awesome! Most historicals lack points. Also, BP has a point system in the back.
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Jun 5, 2011 20:50
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So as someone who has never played point-free wargames...how does that work? Is it just set armylists you pick from to use?
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Jun 5, 2011 21:12
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shotgunbadger posted:So as someone who has never played point-free wargames...how does that work? Is it just set armylists you pick from to use? Super historical way: you recreate battles. Did Gustavus Adolphus have 6 200 cavalrymen at Lutzen? Well, then you have that as well if you play the Swedish side (usually with a single miniature being anything from 10 men to thousands, depending on your scale and number of miniatures). The fun comes, largely, from comparing how well you can do compared to the real outcome. For this you use an "Order of Battle" which is basically a list of who were present at a battle, and this leads to the joys of charming, polite discussions between enthusiasts on how accurate different historians are. The earlier the battle and the less documentation available, the better. The other way: "Ok, let's say you defend with a battalion of Frenchies and some artillery, and I attack with a battalion of Brits with some extra cavalry. Go!" lilljonas fucked around with this message at 21:36 on Jun 5, 2011 |
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Jun 5, 2011 21:30
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Alright that's about what I figured, sounds super fun actually, maybe I should look into Black Powder more.
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Jun 5, 2011 21:41
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shotgunbadger posted:Alright that's about what I figured, sounds super fun actually, maybe I should look into Black Powder more. That's exactly what I'm thinking.
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Jun 5, 2011 21:58
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It is definitely a different mindset if you've come from the Warhammer (or similar) world, where everything is all about points. And there's nothing wrong with points, either, if that's what the system is for, or it's a tournament. It's just a different way of doing things.
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Jun 6, 2011 01:30
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Colonial Air Force posted:It is definitely a different mindset if you've come from the Warhammer (or similar) world, where everything is all about points. Yea, I can see myself enjoying this style a lot though, but mainly because I'm a big dumb history dork, so being able to take the role of commander for major battles gives me a nerd-boner almost as much as leading an army of Orcs to siege some elves in warhammer.
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Jun 6, 2011 03:26
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Who makes good 15mm Vikings?
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Jun 6, 2011 14:21
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CNN Sports Ticker posted:Who makes good 15mm Vikings? I don't have any, but check: http://khurasanminiatures.tripod.com/viking.html http://www.baueda.com/hostis_vik.html http://www.hourofwolves.org/vikingDBAArmy.html (example of Old Glory painted well)
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Jun 6, 2011 14:49
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That reminds me... I've heard really good things about DBA, but the 'same 12 elements'/every army being exactly the same thing turns me off. How true is that and how much does it make things samey?
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Jun 6, 2011 15:00
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CNN Sports Ticker posted:That reminds me... I've heard really good things about DBA, but the 'same 12 elements'/every army being exactly the same thing turns me off. How true is that and how much does it make things samey? My opinion is that DBA is a fun and quick game (a game between veterans lasts 30-60 min), but it is not the most historical game. It is historical enough for me, but most of all, it is a good starter game for people getting into historicals. You don't need many miniatures, so it is cheap and you can paint your entire army without much problems. The rules are mostly simple, and you don't need to buy a lot of sourcebooks etc. for different armies. But most of all, the simplified armies means that you can fight each other even if one player wants to collect Aztecs and you want to collect Hittites. I don't think it is a likely 'be all, end all' game for most players, but I don't see this as a weakness. Other popular games such as FoG and Hail Caesar can be played with the very same miniatures, but you need more of them. So DBA fits a perfect role of giving you a chance to play with your miniatures until you have the money and time to collect a huge army. Got a box of plastic 28mm celts? That's an army. Got a spare bag of 15mm Romans? Buy some horses, and you have an army. Interested in painting up some Moghul Indians by the side? Doing it as a DBA project is affordable, while you still get to paint up some of each unit types. So DBA is for me both a perfect "baby's first historicals" and "quick fix" game, both when it comes to collecting and playing. Not everybody likes it, but you can use the WADBAG guide rules (a clearer version of the original rules writings), google some lists and then try it out with cardboard markers if you are worried you would hate it. If you plan to use any game with the same base sizes, you'd be wasting an opportunity in not trying it out.
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Jun 6, 2011 16:46
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For people coming from Games Workshop, Warhammer Ancients is worth a look. Arguably theres better games out there, and it works better for osme periods than others, but its an easy in. Theres point values, the rules are nearly identical to Warhammer Famntasy Battle and you can get a good game going without buying loads of figures. Thats how my gaming group started with historical wargamimg. We also used 15mm figures (reduced all the moves and ranges accordingly) and you can put a 2000 point army on the table for around £50 in 15mm. Also if you are used to Warmaster, theres Warmaster Ancients and Medieval BUT personally as much as I like the command system, the close combat is too messy. Try Hail Caesar instead which is pretty much Warmaster stripped down and refined to a very elegant system.
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Jun 6, 2011 18:29
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So today I checked Black Powder out and holy crap it's fun. I read over the book for a bit then played a very poor demo game with a friend's redcoats vs another friends american rebels, and it was really fun. For some reason I never noticed this secret world of historic gamers in my social groups, so I should have a decent amount of friends in it. I really have no clue where to jump in, timewise, a lot of options are there for my history nerd self. I'll most likely go Napoleon, but I may actually stick with redcoats too. I should ask just to be clear though, this isn't like GW/Warmachine where there are 'official models' for the game, right? It's just 'whatever fits the army and is in scale'?
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Jun 6, 2011 23:32
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Yup, pretty much. Buy whatever you think looks good (within the specified scale, usually) and go with that.
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Jun 6, 2011 23:48
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shotgunbadger posted:I should ask just to be clear though, this isn't like GW/Warmachine where there are 'official models' for the game, right? It's just 'whatever fits the army and is in scale'? Right! Black powder is just a rules set and it is up to you what scale/manufacturer you use.
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Jun 6, 2011 23:48
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Alright so while I spend weeks debating where to start, two questions now that I'm throwing myself all in this historical stuff. A) Wargames Illustrated worth subscribing to? For the first time in a while my White Dwarf is ending and I'm not planning to resubscribe, so I got budget for a new gaming mag. Is it a good magazine or is it the WD method of 'make it a big advertisement gently caress rules and hobby and poo poo'? B) Any resources other then the core book to look into for historical scenarios? It has a lot of good info and enough examples to work with, but I was just wondering if any other major battles of assorted eras were covered somewhere else?
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Jun 7, 2011 06:09
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No Pun Intended posted:Right! Black powder is just a rules set and it is up to you what scale/manufacturer you use. And the great thing is there lots of optioins. Most obviously if you are doing Napoleonics in 28mm then Perry ir Victrix plastics are a good starting point. Disadvantage of 28mm for BlackPowder is that you need a big table to ge the most from the rules. If however you play with smaller figures you can reduce all the games ranges very easily and it works just as well. We play it in 6 mm and convert all the ranges from inches to cm- works great. As for magazines- WI is ok, but now it's been taken over by Battlefront it's gone a little morenWhite Dwarfy, but it's still not a bad mag. Try Wargames, Soldiers and Strategy which has just been re-released and looks good. Battle games is also pretty good and they even do a pdf version.
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Jun 7, 2011 07:10
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shotgunbadger posted:Alright so while I spend weeks debating where to start, two questions now that I'm throwing myself all in this historical stuff. WGI is a pretty good mag, sure it has ads (like all magazines do), but other than that it has has a pretty good balance of hobby and gaming articles. It also has quite good coverage of various cons and tournaments. The only caveat I guess is you may find it a little FoW centric as it is owned by battlefront . Currently it is a better magazine than WD (but WD probably has better painting articles). It is probably worth your while to pick one up and see if you like it.
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Jun 7, 2011 08:20
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I like WGI and don't really find it that FoW-centric except when there's some big release. Of course I also enjoy FoW. Unlike WD, you'll find that it has articles on all sorts of games, not just Battlefront games, and I've seen ads (if not articles) on other WWII games and miniatures.
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Jun 7, 2011 13:46
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I've seen a few articles on 20 and 28mil WWII games, but never on specific game systems or anything in 15mil. Ambush Valley in 15mil is basically just going to sell them some toy mans, so I can see them pushing that too.
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Jun 7, 2011 14:40
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CNN Sports Ticker posted:That reminds me... I've heard really good things about DBA, but the 'same 12 elements'/every army being exactly the same thing turns me off. How true is that and how much does it make things samey? To add to what lilljonas said: Honestly, coming from Warhammer, I don't see it as too much of a problem. Monotype armies might not be particularly fun compared to more varied armies, but on the other hand the armies are dirt cheap and fast to paint. And with 300 armies to choose from some will end up similar, but there's more than enough variation. Most armies have options which can change how an army plays. Add to that that terrain can have a huge impact on how a game plays out. Really, the only downside I've found is that since the number of dicerolls are so few, it's much easier to get screwed by the dice. Having a game decided by bad dice is not uncommon. But unlike Warhammer, when it happens you can just set up and have another go since a game is usually over in half an hour. Also, the army lists are not balanced so a random matchup can be very uneven, and terrain can be used to further unbalance things. If you're hypercompetitive it's not too hard to have an army that's beaten before the game starts. Historical matchups tend to work though, and I prefer to run each matchup twice, changing sides after the first.
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Jun 7, 2011 20:18
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Had probably the best game of Blitzkreing Commander to date last night. So much fun i forgot to take pics! Nice simple game- 8x4 table with roughly in the middle a largish town that had been fortified by a British battlegroup, mainly comprising a British infantry battallion with the usual support of a few 17 pounder AT guns, some off table heavy artillery and a company of Churchills. It was a multi player game 2 aside and GMd with hidden deployment for the Brits. I was playing Axis, and on our side we had 2 companies of Panthers, a Stug company, 3 companies of Heer conscripts and 2 companies of SS. Also a nice Wespe artillery battery off table. Never in any warmaster based game have I seen so many succesful orders as we German players had last night. It was full on Blitzkrieg. By turn 3 we had wiped out the entire British armoured support and their anti tank guns, and through effective counter battery fire we had silenced their guns. It was looking like a whitewash was coming. Then it all sort of went wrong. Could we take the town? Could we gently caress. Tine and time again the infantrys attempts to advance into the town was repelled. Every window of every bulding seemed to bristle with rifles and MGs and the Germans infantry had to cross a large open area in order to adavnce on the town which became a death trap. No matter how much supporting fire we poured into the town from a seemingly invulnerable Panther group formed in battleline outside the town perimeter, nothing worked. The icing on the cake was when as per the scenario (an early morning attack) the fog finally lifted allowing British air support, and a squadron of Typhoons to make some devestating attacks on the SS and their armoured cars. By this point it was 1am, and both sides had reached their breakpoint, and we called the game. The Germans had managed to take a bunker on ahill outside the town that had been their secondary objective after soem hard hand to hand fighting, but the town was held solidly by the British infantry, with the decimated Heer in no state to press an attack. And with the fog lifting, and the Typhoons swarming the skies, the Panthers were looking mightily vulnerable sat on a hill overlooking the village, so the game was handed in a gentlemanly manner to the allied players. For all you FOW players, I really urge you to look at BKC. You can even use the models you already own for it! http://www.blitzkrieg-commander.com/default.aspx?Area=BKC
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Jun 8, 2011 19:27
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So, after not playing a wargame or painting miniatures for over 10 years, I am getting the itch to play FoW! I have bought the starter set with the rulebook and 5 tanks and plan on having a good read of the rulebook before I decide on what army to go for. I am currently thinking either Brit infantry or German Mech Infantry. Will have to have a good think on it though, as I can't afford to have both at the moment. The one thing I do need some help on is where to start with buying paints and tools. What is the basic stuff I will need to get started and paint the tanks to a good enough standard? I was looking at the FoW paint sets you can get, but it all seems a bit much getting the quartermaster kit and either the german or brit kit as well. Also, anyone know a good starter set of brushes? Also, if anyone is in or near Cambridgeshire, UK and is willing to play some FoW with a newbie let me know! I don't have any friends that are into miniatures, and it seems as if there isn't any local groups near me 
Pogue_Mahone fucked around with this message at 21:27 on Jun 8, 2011 |
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Jun 8, 2011 20:09
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Jinjin Bemar posted:Had probably the best game of Blitzkreing Commander to date last night. So much fun i forgot to take pics! I think my local store has this, I should check it out. What scale were you using, sounds like an awful lot of things to be doing 15mm scale like FoW.
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Jun 8, 2011 23:05
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10mm - a mix of Pendraken and Minifigs.
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Jun 8, 2011 23:12
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Looks like a FoW army with ~three platoons + support would roughly equate to a BKC Batallion and support companies. I may have to get these rules sometime, just to see how they play.
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Jun 9, 2011 02:45
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Since I'm in a city that actually has things for a few days, I've managed to track down a store which has a copy of the Black Powder rules and some Napoleonic miniatures. I'm also picking up something to supplement my rather bare-boned Soviet FoW army for my first game on Sunday. I'm aiming for Motostrelkovy but I only have two infantry companies and ten tanks (I know that's not exactly small, but there's a lack of variety). What else would be a good choice?
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Jun 9, 2011 07:12
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Arquinsiel posted:Looks like a FoW army with ~three platoons + support would roughly equate to a BKC Batallion and support companies. I may have to get these rules sometime, just to see how they play. They play well. If you have ever played Warmaster the rules will feel familiar. They are fairly abstracted (but not in a bad way) in as much as there arent loads of tables and charts taking in to account penetration, calibre of rounds etc, but they give very plausible outcomes if you can get your head round the abstraction. For example a unit of Tiger 2s in theory could be taken out by a unit of Shermans (tough but doable with good rolling). For some WW2 players they would throw their rattle out of the pram and cite armour and round penetrations etc, but in BKC knocking a unit out means that they are no longer comabt effective, rather than necessarily all dead if that makes sense. The other thing that you need to take into account is that a single unit/model is a platoon. This makes perfect sense with infantry stands, but for some people they dont like this for AFVs. I have said before if I was doing BKC and CWC (the modern warfare variant) again I would do them in 3mm and that way you could base up a proper platoon of tanks, say 3 to 4 of the tiny wee models on each base and that would look cool. Its fast play, buckets of dice and fun. Ticks all my boxes. My blog has pics of my US battlegroup- this is a lot of points in game (around 4000pts) and in my experience most games we play in an evening are 2500 pts tops. http://serotonins.blogspot.com/search/label/Blitzkrieg%20Commander Ive also got a German force on the go, and a British desert one for North Africa in 1941 ready to be painted., Going to do Afrika Korp after that!
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Jun 9, 2011 08:51
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I saw some local dudes playing it last night. Looked like they were having fun, but it seemed very weird when they could call it so early.
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Jun 9, 2011 15:54
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CNN Sports Ticker posted:I'm also picking up something to supplement my rather bare-boned Soviet FoW army for my first game on Sunday. I'm aiming for Motostrelkovy but I only have two infantry companies and ten tanks (I know that's not exactly small, but there's a lack of variety). What else would be a good choice? Soviet artillery tends to not be that great because they are rated Trained and they can't fire smoke. Might also want to look into getting some heavy tanks. Nothing says "Soviets" like KVs. Also tankodesnatki (sp?) tend to always be a solid choice.
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Jun 9, 2011 23:12
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Pogue_Mahone posted:Staring questions... You'll need a decent set of files for the metal bits of your tanks and metal mans, I've got a good set of 6 from Gyro that cost me ~$10 and a lower quality set of 10 that I got in a gas station dollar bin for ~$1, the later would be fine in most cases. I would check a hardware store. Cyanoacrylate is a great glue for everything except grass on bases so pick up a small bottle of that, you probably want the thicker formula. As for brushes, poke around an art store and see what they've got, I've had decent luck getting natural and synthetic haired brush sets in the $5 range. I don't have any great recs other than don't pay a premium price for some brand name brush, all of the big name game companies release their own brushes and they are usually a really poor value (especially GW but also Privateer Press). If you want the very best check out Windsor and Newton Series 7, I've got a couple of their brushes and they're super expensive and super worth it if you take care of your brushes. Beneath that are the Windsor and Newton University series which are usually a cut above the bargain bin quality but have a lifespan, good value though. As for paints, the FoW sets are a good value and excellent paint, if you're just getting started you probably want the paint set for your force + Black, White, and whatever your painting metal at a minimum. Also, if you want to look at army lists before you but the books check out easyarmy.com, its amazing that this website is free as its better than any other army building software that I've seen. Not all lists are available there yet though.
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Jun 9, 2011 23:29
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Conan the Librarian posted:I haven't played soviets personally (though I do have an army in the works for them) but I would say pick up air support. You can get the Battlefront Il-2s if you'd like or you can go the vastly cheaper route and get the ones from Zvezda which are every bit as good (they really only lack external weapons) and are a tiny fraction of the cost ($4 each). Air support sucks in FoW. Don't bother. Soviet artillery may be "trained" but they have a TON of guns.
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Jun 9, 2011 23:42
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Air support is a good way to use up extra points.
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Jun 10, 2011 01:41
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I ended up getting some Guards Rocket Mortar. Rocket trucks!
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Jun 10, 2011 04:12
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CNN Sports Ticker posted:I ended up getting some Guards Rocket Mortar. Rocket trucks! Only 3000 dollars~
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Jun 10, 2011 04:15
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