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Mechafunkzilla posted:Don't even bother. Bu-bu-but I was told there is no limit to what gains I can achieve. As long as I stick with it, I should be able to throw small to medium (maybe even larg-ish!) sized passenger vehicles around like they were toys one day. MIND OVER MATTER
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Jul 18, 2011 15:48
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CaptainScraps posted:I'm actually going to back this up as a dumbass who takes krav maga. A lot of people think groin kicks are super effective until they start sparring and they try to lead with them. Telegraphed as all hell. Who the gently caress would spar with groin kicks, that sounds terrible.
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Jul 18, 2011 15:49
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Mechafunkzilla posted:Who the gently caress would spar with groin kicks, that sounds terrible. Dumbasses.
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Jul 18, 2011 15:51
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TheStampede posted:Bu-bu-but I was told there is no limit to what gains I can achieve. As long as I stick with it, I should be able to throw small to medium (maybe even larg-ish!) sized passenger vehicles around like they were toys one day. MIND OVER MATTER Real life is not zombo.com
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Jul 18, 2011 15:55
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TheStampede posted:Bu-bu-but I was told there is no limit to what gains I can achieve. As long as I stick with it, I should be able to throw small to medium (maybe even larg-ish!) sized passenger vehicles around like they were toys one day. MIND OVER MATTER Nope. If you were 130 lbs and deadlifting 600 and asking for tips, then it would be worth bringing up genetic potential, not so if youre lifting 200. And if you are really 5'6" that would help explain why things seem to keep going over your head "You dont understand Ive been training 2 hours a week since i was SEVENTEEN I couldnt possibly improve any more  it has nothing to do with actual effort, the fates consipired against me Fast twitch muscle fibers "(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jul 18, 2011 16:00
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HATE MONDAYS posted:Good thing the dude in my hypothetical wasn't asking how to be as big as Brock Lesnar, just asking how to improve his lovely deadlift. Kind of like how the guy in this thread wasn't asking how to be exactly as fast as Mike Tyson, just improve his lovely handspeed. As long as there is room to improve (there is), its pointless to bring up genetic potential because there are still plenty of ways you can improve I was really only being facetious because I'm kind of a sarcastic dick IRL, but it does highlight my point. There is a limit to how you can developed your body. On one hand, yes, it's incredibly stupid to say you shouldn't bother trying to make yourself bigger/stronger, but it's just as foolish to say there is no limit to what is possible. I think the only reason this argument is happening is because both sides think the other is saying either of those things, which they're not. EDIT: HATE MONDAYS posted:And if you are really 5'6" that would help explain why things seem to keep going over your head OH gently caress YOU I'M SENSITIVE ABOUT MY HIGHT YOU WANNA FIGHT I DO UFC RARWRAR!!1!! (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jul 18, 2011 16:03
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HATE MONDAYS posted:Nope. If you were 130 lbs and deadlifting 600 and asking for tips, then it would be worth bringing up genetic potential, not so if youre lifting 200. And if you are really 5'6" that would help explain why things seem to keep going over your head You are incredibly obnoxious and willfully obtuse, and contribute nothing of value to the thread. Please do everyone a favor and gently caress off.
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Jul 18, 2011 16:03
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TheStampede posted:I was really only being facetious because I'm kind of a sarcastic dick IRL, but it does highlight my point. There is a limit to how you can developed your body. On one hand, yes, it's incredibly stupid to say you shouldn't bother trying to make yourself bigger/stronger, but it's just as foolish to say there is no limit to what is possible. I think the only reason this argument is happening is because both sides think the other is saying either of those things, which they're not. That's the thing, I never said there was no limit, I only said that goons asking for advice in this thread haven't reached that limit, so when someone asks for advice the first reaction shouldn't be "you cant!!! There's plateaus!!!" Because you could say the same thing about literally everything (Cooking tips? Sorry but eventually you hit a plateau with cooking skill and its hard to overcome, not everyone can be the next GUY FIEREI so I wont give you any tips)
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Jul 18, 2011 16:08
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TheStampede posted:OH gently caress YOU I'M SENSITIVE ABOUT MY HIGHT YOU WANNA FIGHT I DO UFC RARWRAR!!1!! You asked for it *falls onto back, spreads legs* Get into my freaking guard
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Jul 18, 2011 16:10
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HATE MONDAYS posted:That's the thing, I never said there was no limit, I only said that goons asking for advice in this thread haven't reached that limit, so when someone asks for advice the first reaction shouldn't be "you cant!!! There's plateaus!!!" Because you could say the same thing about literally everything (Cooking tips? Sorry but eventually you hit a plateau with cooking skill and its hard to overcome, not everyone can be the next GUY FIEREI so I wont give you any tips) The one guy who said that was shot down immediately, everyone else has been talking about hand speed in general. You've been arguing against nothing, and your insistence on genetics being as irrelevant to hand speed as it would be to weightlifting is flat wrong. It's much more similar to something like sprinting speed, especially when it comes to things like doubling and tripling up on the jab, which is where this conversation started. A slow sprinter can get faster with training, but they will never become fast. Plus, the things that do improve your handspeed -- working mitts, jumping rope, hitting a heavy bag, shadow boxing, just throwing lots of punches -- are things someone who boxes would be doing anyway. There aren't really "hand speed specific" exercises. Making a lovely post with a bunch of emoticons doesn't make you any less wrong.Work on your technique, practice combinations and throw a few million punches, but keep in mind that you will probably never look like Tyson on the heavy bag because you don't have the same physical gifts regardless of how much you train. There. loving drop it already, this thread was so entertaining before you came along. Mechafunkzilla fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Jul 18, 2011 |
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Jul 18, 2011 16:19
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Mechafunkzilla posted:The one guy who said that was shot down immediately, everyone else has been talking about hand speed in general. quote:Work on your technique, practice combinations and throw lots and lots of punches, but keep in mind that you will probably never look like Tyson on the heavy bag because you don't have the same physical gifts regardless of how much you train. quote:There. loving drop it already, this thread was so entertaining before you came along.
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Jul 18, 2011 16:28
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Handspeed is part of the whole package. What speed you can gain (starting from 0 experience) will come naturally as part of good training. Well, say 90% of your top speed. Then you could work really hard on the last 10% as extra effort. From only training kickboxing, my vertical went from some inches under the basketball rim to almost barely being able to nick the rim. If I put loads of effort into just training my vertical, I'm sure I could squeeze the last few inches out of it. I think the initial advice still holds -- don't worry about it, it should improve as a consequence of your other training. I suppose if you were really gungho, you could get those elastic bands and snap out jabs and crosses while holding onto those tied to something.
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Jul 18, 2011 16:31
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kimbo305 posted:Handspeed is part of the whole package. What speed you can gain (starting from 0 experience) will come naturally as part of good training. Well, say 90% of your top speed. Then you could work really hard on the last 10% as extra effort. From only training kickboxing, my vertical went from some inches under the basketball rim to almost barely being able to nick the rim. If I put loads of effort into just training my vertical, I'm sure I could squeeze the last few inches out of it. I don't think resistance bands will really improve your handspeed, seems like that would more affect your power, since it would basically be punching through resistance. I always used things like that to develop muscular endurance, since it's a high rep kind of exercise. Actually, lifting heavy would be better for handspeed since it will better develop those muscle fibers and your CNS efficiency.
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Jul 18, 2011 16:41
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How much % will steroids help?
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Jul 18, 2011 16:49
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Sorry to change subjects from the awesome genetic potential of goons, but I just wanted to say that I am now a brown belt in diseased pajama hugging. Now who wants to get in my guard.
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Jul 18, 2011 17:11
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Mechafunkzilla posted:I don't think resistance bands will really improve your handspeed, seems like that would more affect your power, since it would basically be punching through resistance. I always used things like that to develop muscular endurance, since it's a high rep kind of exercise. Actually, lifting heavy would be better for handspeed since it will better develop those muscle fibers and your CNS efficiency. I think the bigger difference between lifting and bands is form. You'd have to have some fancy equipment to maintain your form while getting heavy resistance. As long as you explode into every strike with the bands, it should definitely help.
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Jul 18, 2011 17:13
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kimbo305 posted:I think the bigger difference between lifting and bands is form. You'd have to have some fancy equipment to maintain your form while getting heavy resistance. As long as you explode into every strike with the bands, it should definitely help. Well, sticking to the punching form specifically wouldn't necessarily help with developing the relevant fast-twitch muscle and improving CNS recruitment more than doing real lifts like bench, rows, squats, etc. which would be more effective in building those muscle groups. What you can do, though, is use a cable machine to get heavier resistance for a "punch" lift. Mechafunkzilla fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Jul 18, 2011 |
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Jul 18, 2011 17:49
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Yuns posted:Sorry to change subjects from the awesome genetic potential of goons, but I just wanted to say that I am now a brown belt in diseased pajama hugging. Now who wants to get in my guard. Hmmm, I'll have to take a look at your alleles, but sounds to me like youve reached your Genetic Potential Plateau. Don't go expecting to look like Roger Gracie on the mats now. (Seriously though, congrats, Goon. That is a great accomplishement)
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Jul 18, 2011 18:02
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Hey guys! I'm 7 weeks out from an amateur kickboxing match (maybe shootboxing if I'm lucky) against a kid who's 0-1. Fight takes place September 10th and I can't fuckin wait. Question: I'm working with a dedicated private boxing coach to make my hands suck less, and they're telling me to improve foot movement by bouncing around more, staying more mobile and avoiding the typical thai boxing shuffle my gym teaches because it's way too slow. Is this a good idea to follow? I really enjoy being a more mobile target, staying elusive and cutting angles faster just by virtue of being almost constantly in motion. Guys from my gym have been giving me poo poo about it and telling me how they'll just sweep my ankle with a kick when I'm in the air, but my hangtime is like an eighth of a second and every who's tried I've always been way out of the way beforehand. Any advice boxing/thai boxing goons?
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Jul 18, 2011 18:06
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Fontoyn posted:Hey guys! I'm 7 weeks out from an amateur kickboxing match (maybe shootboxing if I'm lucky) against a kid who's 0-1. Fight takes place September 10th and I can't fuckin wait. You need to be able to quickly put weight on your back foot to be able to check leg kicks, which explains the difference in stances and movement. So if you're not worried about leg kicks, you can be lighter on your feet.
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Jul 18, 2011 18:10
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Mechafunkzilla posted:You need to be able to quickly put weight on your back foot to be able to check leg kicks, which explains the difference in stances and movement. So if you're not worried about leg kicks, you can be lighter on your feet. I personally like the new style because I can alternate between stuffing leg kicks and circling out from them as opposed to checking and potentially hurting myself with weak shins.
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Jul 18, 2011 18:13
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Yuns posted:Sorry to change subjects from the awesome genetic potential of goons, but I just wanted to say that I am now a brown belt in diseased pajama hugging. Now who wants to get in my guard. You might be the highest ranked guy here, or at least tied with one or two others. Congratulations! How long have you been at it?
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Jul 18, 2011 18:16
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Fontoyn posted:I personally like the new style because I can alternate between stuffing leg kicks and circling out from them as opposed to checking and potentially hurting myself with weak shins. It's amateur, won't you be wearing shin pads? In any case, if something works for you then go for it, but there's a reason that when you compare pro boxing and pro kickboxing, the footwork is very different.
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Jul 18, 2011 18:19
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Mechafunkzilla posted:It's amateur, won't you be wearing shin pads? Yeah, but my shins are still pretty terrible - it's definitely one of the things I'm putting a lot of work into before the fight. I really want to avoid taking a shin to the knee or something because my check wasn't high enough. On the other hand, it'll definitely stay open as an option in case he's able to back me up or cut a funky angle.
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Jul 18, 2011 18:23
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Xguard86 posted:You might be the highest ranked guy here, or at least tied with one or two others. Congratulations! How long have you been at it?
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Jul 18, 2011 18:40
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Yuns posted:Thanks. Jam Master Flash is also a brown belt and I think there may be one other brown belt so there is a least one or two others. I've been training 5-6 days a week for 5 1/2 years. It's been around 1350 classes and more than 3000 hours of training. Do you have any aspirations to teach? What's your motivation for training so hard? e: Oh, and congratulations. Brown belt is a huge accomplishment.
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Jul 18, 2011 18:41
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Fontoyn posted:Question: I'm working with a dedicated private boxing coach Someone who's really good can read you when you settle for a kick and teep you away or just defend your kick. So you'll have to make sure to open up with your hands and mix the kicks in mid-combo.
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Jul 18, 2011 19:21
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Mechafunkzilla posted:Do you have any aspirations to teach? What's your motivation for training so hard?
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Jul 18, 2011 19:25
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Nierbo posted:Also I got the mother fuckin sweetest seio nage into kouchi gari. It felt incredible. -- For the question that was 2-3 page ago before some new argument poped up, my favorite techniques are Kouchi gari because it's just ridiculously effective, quick and can link into almost anything. Some technique I can't remember the name of, where your on someone side, you sort of hug them, put one of your legs behind his and then fall to your side/his back. This is the throw that gets me the most ippon by far. Uchi mata : so good with kouchi gari and a beauty when you manage to do it perfectly. (almost never for me) On the ground I'm very partial to the triangle choke and I love me some lapel chokes. -- Congrats on the brown belt! I didn't even know there was a brown belt in BJJ! 5 days a week for 5.5 years is definitely a lot of time devoted to something so yeah, that's a great accomplishment! Talking of belt I'm curious, what is everyone and in what? Also, how much do you train and since when? I'll start first. I'm green belt in judo. I train twice a week on average and I've been training for 4 years I think. I was hoping to get my black belt when I would get 30 years old (just turned 26) but that doesn't seem likely. Right now I'm gunning for my brown belt when I get 30 and black belt some time after that! KingColliwog fucked around with this message at 19:37 on Jul 18, 2011 |
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Jul 18, 2011 19:26
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kimbo305 posted:Someone who's really good can read you when you settle for a kick and teep you away or just defend your kick. So you'll have to make sure to open up with your hands and mix the kicks in mid-combo. That's been the worst hangup when I spar. I can take the half-step in and strike, but there's a slight pause in my canter right before that half-step occurs. I'll need to drill that more -- it's a lot like when guys will be moving their hands out of striking distance but freeze up right before they start a combination.
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Jul 18, 2011 20:31
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Fontoyn posted:That's been the worst hangup when I spar. I can take the half-step in and strike, but there's a slight pause in my canter right before that half-step occurs. I'll need to drill that more -- it's a lot like when guys will be moving their hands out of striking distance but freeze up right before they start a combination. I found that doing a lot of really light sparring where you just stand close with your partner and trade (at like 10-25% power) took a lot of hesitation and hitches out of my striking. It forces you to throw and throw and not have a "build up", so to speak, before you go for a strike or combination.
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Jul 18, 2011 20:36
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Mechafunkzilla posted:I found that doing a lot of really light sparring where you just stand close with your partner and trade (at like 10-25% power) took a lot of hesitation and hitches out of my striking. It forces you to throw and throw and not have a "build up", so to speak, before you go for a strike or combination. My Muay Thai coach talks a lot about this: his basic advice is to open up more instead of thinking during the round. I generally only get tagged when my mind wanders to what kind of attack I want to launch. It should be opening- BAM - six punches and a leg kick. EDIT: He also tells me to explore my chi more and represent myself through the art. Basically to be more loose and have more fun with it without going by the books or I'll burn out and get bored really quickly sparring 5 times a week. Fontoyn fucked around with this message at 22:20 on Jul 18, 2011 |
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Jul 18, 2011 21:34
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One of the Savate Combat fighters from our gym recently came back from France, apparently had fun and thus we did drills like this: Role #1 has to launch a combination of at least 6-7 strikes, Role #2 has to wait until #1 has attacked with at least 4 strikes of the combination before countering with a series of at least 5+ strikes of his/her own. When Role #2 starts the counter, Role #1 must still finish his/her combination (this means during the drill you very probably have to eat a bunch of strikes while finishing your own attack - which is good). If Role #2 does NOT counter but is overwhelmed and frozen by the flow of attacks, Role #1 just keeps on kicking and punching with more combinations until the round ends. And other drills like that, no specific techniques were involved apart from having to chain long combinations, what strikes were used were completely up to the practitioner as long as the purposes was to land. Depending on the type of (striking) training a person has done that might sound like a lot of thinking but in the end it's really not. And drills like that are really, really good for you if you wish to not-freeze when fighting or doing more serious sparring. Also the thing with dozens and dozens of rounds of 10-25% power sparring, yes. You can go pretty fast too, and still use very little power if you practice it for a bit. After a while you'll start feeling comfortable in all kinds of flurries.
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Jul 18, 2011 21:47
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Fontoyn posted:My Muay Thai coach talks a lot about this: his basic advice is to open up more instead of thinking during the round. I generally only get tagged when my mind wanders to what kind of attack I want to launch. It should be opening- BAM - six punches and a leg kick. Yeah, when you watch pro kickboxing or boxing and see a guy go a round barely getting hit, 99% of the time it's going to be because he was attacking the whole time (the other 1% is Floyd Mayweather).
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Jul 18, 2011 21:54
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Yuns posted:Sorry to change subjects from the awesome genetic potential of goons, but I just wanted to say that I am now a brown belt in diseased pajama hugging. Now who wants to get in my guard. Congrats dude!
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Jul 18, 2011 23:03
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Ive become very interested in pursuing a martial arts. I was thinking Id start training in a practical form, but am worried because a) Ill only really have maybe 3/4 days a week to train and b) Im pretty out of shape right now. Most of the talk seems to suggest the practical forms tend to be for people trying to train up for MMA, would I be out of place pursuing it for personal development? My priorities, in case you guys have any general advice, are fitness > mental development (confidence, dedication, motivation) > practical defense techniques.
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Jul 18, 2011 23:12
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KidDynamite posted:Yes tell me about all the secret techniques I haven't learned in the 7 years I've been boxing. All boxing coaches must be holding back on their students. Are you making the argument that you punch just as hard and just as fast as you did seven years ago when you started? Cause if you do I can see your point but I bet you improved, which means that your power and hand speed are not "hardwired". Here is an unfortunate truth, boxing is probably the worst western sport out there when it comes to research. So I bet there is tons that you boxing coaches missed because there is so little evidence based information for them to look at. Let's take a look at "KO power", a study published by McGill last year showed the evidence of something called double peak activation. What that is, is the bodies ability to activate core musculature to propel a limb, then relax to allow maximal speed of a limb and then re-activate to stiffen the strike on landing. Research shows that this is key to developing power in striking. While some people just do this naturally there is no evidence that this can't be taught to athletes. As of now there haven't been any published protocols on how to improve this but you can bet there will be. So, one of the key components of "KO power" was just proven to exist a year ago, even though we have had the ability to find this out for decades. The study that found this, was surprise not a boxing study, it was a study of MMA fighters. Boxing is so stuck in its' tradition that I'm not surprised that you are being fed incorrect information by your trainer, although I doubt it is purposeful.
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Jul 18, 2011 23:15
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Jenkl posted:Ive become very interested in pursuing a martial arts. I was thinking Id start training in a practical form, but am worried because a) Ill only really have maybe 3/4 days a week to train and b) Im pretty out of shape right now. Most of the talk seems to suggest the practical forms tend to be for people trying to train up for MMA, would I be out of place pursuing it for personal development? 3 days is enough, it doesn't matter if you're out of shape, the best way to get in shape is just to go to the gym and train, a lot of people do MMA without ever wanting to compete
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Jul 18, 2011 23:22
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Jenkl posted:Ive become very interested in pursuing a martial arts. I was thinking Id start training in a practical form, but am worried because a) Ill only really have maybe 3/4 days a week to train and b) Im pretty out of shape right now. Most of the talk seems to suggest the practical forms tend to be for people trying to train up for MMA, would I be out of place pursuing it for personal development? Most people who train in grappling/MMA/striking don't ever intend on competing. Go for it! Also if you tell us where you live one of us could probably suggest a good place to train.
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Jul 18, 2011 23:55
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So 13 people have joined the Martial Arts Goons group on Fitocracy. And it looks like those who have joined are actually using it. I still wish they were better equiped for non-weightlifting activities, but I like having a place to log my stuff for goon judgement. Reposting the invite here: http://ftcy.co/lAGD2X if anybody wants in. I need to come up with a picture for the group. Any suggestion?
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Jul 19, 2011 00:09
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