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SlyFrog posted:"The futile search for money is the only salve for my empty soul, for I have chosen a profession that makes monsters out of men," chat.
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Aug 2, 2011 12:17
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First day in BigLaw was yesterday, and most of it was spent in orientation. So far, it all seems awesome. I can't wait for the shiny newness to wear off, revealing everyone to be soulless automatons who secretly wish death upon themselves and everyone else. It's pretty cool/confusing having a secretary - what do I use her for? Copying? I don't have any idea how to handle that.
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Aug 2, 2011 12:37
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scheduling, setting up phone calls, basically anything non-substantive that you don't want to do.
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Aug 2, 2011 12:54
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Here are the awesome things my (very good) secretary does for me: 1. Mail/copies. I don't dictate, so I print letters to her printer that I've typed and she prints envelopes, gets postage, whatever. This is more involved than you'd think, especially when it comes to pleadings or discovery in cases with multiple parties. 2. Filing. Everything needs to have a copy scanned and also hard copy to the file. She intuitively knows, whatever I put on her ledge, where in the file it goes. I also just stick poo poo in my outbox with a file number on it and she puts it in the right place. 3. Scheduling. I write her an email that says "I want to depose/meet/file this person/pleading," and she checks schedules with everyone, gets filing fees, orders fee checks, prepares cover letters for my signature, calls the court reporter, and all I have to do is sign whatever and accept the calendar reminder. 4. Is a gatekeeper. 5. Advises me of office gossip and complaints (professional hint: this flow of information should always be a one-way street and should come unprompted). 6. Has candy on her ledge for me to eat.
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Aug 2, 2011 14:46
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entris posted:First day in BigLaw was yesterday, and most of it was spent in orientation. So far, it all seems awesome. I can't wait for the shiny newness to wear off, revealing everyone to be soulless automatons who secretly wish death upon themselves and everyone else. Use her to tell you how poo poo actually works at the office. Treat her like a god. In smaller firms she answers the phone. That is a full-time job because there are so many loving direct marketers you don't want to talk to. G-Mawwwwwww fucked around with this message at 15:58 on Aug 2, 2011 |
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Aug 2, 2011 15:53
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Phil Moscowitz posted:Here are the awesome things my (very good) secretary does for me: Good Morning Mr. Draper. :bigtran:
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Aug 2, 2011 16:00
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Unamuno posted:Good luck with that; you win the official "you told me so" award, as I'm somewhat convinced that I ruined my life by not dropping out of law school (or fully embracing a career in law and going all-out in pursuing a legal career) after 1L year.  there's always the "make great friends in the industry and jump at the chance to work with them" route! (not the legal industry that industry sucks)
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Aug 2, 2011 16:01
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I'm literally amazing at how fast some of these judges can send out rejections. I didn't even think they'd look at paper apps until after the OSCAR deadline or whatever.
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Aug 2, 2011 18:31
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Phil Moscowitz posted:4. Is a gatekeeper.
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Aug 2, 2011 20:42
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blar posted:That's $8,500 a year accruing 6.8% interest. A little better than the 8.5% grad plus loans but still quite the chunk of change when you're talking about law school tuition. Biggest mistake of my life was getting a higher education. If my math is accurate, this will cost $578, in interest, for the first year of law/grad school, $617.30 the second year (paying 6.8% on the first year's interest in addition to the $8,500 second-year loan), and $659.28 in the third year (paying 6.8% on the first and second years' interest in addition to the $8,500 third-year loan). Total increase to the cost of a law degree = $1854.59 Or is my napkin-math bad?
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Aug 2, 2011 22:27
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Lilosh posted:Total increase to the cost of a law degree = $1854.59 Oh well, not like my balance will ever be paid. Keep piling it on!
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Aug 2, 2011 22:56
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CaptainScraps posted:Treat her like a god.
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Aug 2, 2011 23:00
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Roger_Mudd posted:Good Morning Mr. Draper. :bigtran: Hey, Don never messed with his secretaries. Until, you know, he nailed one and then married her replacement in short succession. But not til then!
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Aug 3, 2011 00:04
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CaptainScraps posted:Treat her like a god. He's been on vacation since last week, so I've been: drafting emergency motions, attending court (just to set over, but still), taking phone calls from girlfriends, holdig people's hands theough extraditions, etc. In short, I have learned to appreciate myself more because goddamn doing this poo poo without an extra person to do the little things when poo poo hits the fan is loving ridiculous.
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Aug 3, 2011 00:44
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Just accepted the job. I made more money with my first job out of high school. 
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Aug 3, 2011 02:32
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Lilosh posted:If my math is accurate, this will cost $578, in interest, for the first year of law/grad school, $617.30 the second year (paying 6.8% on the first year's interest in addition to the $8,500 second-year loan), and $659.28 in the third year (paying 6.8% on the first and second years' interest in addition to the $8,500 third-year loan). That is a lot of money for a degree not worth much more than a bachelors.
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Aug 3, 2011 03:18
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Say there, law thread, what can you tell me about the lucrative discipline of patent law? There's a patent law abuse thread on the forums and This American Life did a whole episode about patent trolls in the software engineering field. I'm more interested in patent law as pertaining to scientific discovery. Do any goons have experience with that?
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Aug 3, 2011 04:03
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Save me jeebus posted:drafting emergency motions, attending court
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Aug 3, 2011 04:16
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Defleshed posted:Oh well, not like my balance will ever be paid. Keep piling it on! My only fleeting concern about any of this is that when I want to buy a place in a few years, mortgage companies might freak out when they see the loan balance on my credit report. I'm choosing to believe that IBR and PSLF is something that can be explained to a loan officer at a local credit union. Carooe posted:goddamn having a lawyer for a secretary must loving own
10-8 fucked around with this message at 04:52 on Aug 3, 2011 |
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Aug 3, 2011 04:49
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Gameko posted:I'm more interested in patent law as pertaining to scientific discovery. That sounds like the international law panda of the IP world. More so than "copyright lawyer" but still.
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Aug 3, 2011 04:58
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10-8 posted:My secretary leaves at 3:30 each day whether I'm done working or not, and, on good days, will make a few copies and perhaps mail some letters. I make my own appointments, answer my own phone, and more-or-less have to handhold her through any tasks that she hasn't done 300 times before. She was hired for her looks, wasn't she? 
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Aug 3, 2011 05:00
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Passed both bar exams. Time to unclench my rear end in a top hat after a few months of dread. edit: I'm pretty sure that unless I decide to go to another jurisdiction I'll never have to write another test in my entire life. CmdrSmirnoff fucked around with this message at 05:44 on Aug 3, 2011 |
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Aug 3, 2011 05:36
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10-8 posted:My secretary leaves at 3:30 each day whether I'm done working or not, and, on good days, will make a few copies and perhaps mail some letters. I make my own appointments, answer my own phone, and more-or-less have to handhold her through any tasks that she hasn't done 300 times before. Because recently there was this debt limit ordeal. And you work in government. But your secretary is not that good. It is a joke.
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Aug 3, 2011 05:42
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CmdrSmirnoff posted:Passed both bar exams. Time to unclench my rear end in a top hat after a few months of dread. Enjoy that feeling. Congrats!
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Aug 3, 2011 07:17
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10-8 posted:
They are on top of things already. We just closed on a place last week and our loan officer didn't bat an eye at my 175k balance. He asked what the payment was per month and I said "Zero Dollars" and he didn't even ask a follow up question. Later I saw the underwriting paperwork and my student loans had a big line through them with a note that said "IBR". You should probably buy now before they pull the IBR rug out from under us somehow. Something this good is bound to be taken away by "Libertarians" or something. Defleshed fucked around with this message at 12:25 on Aug 3, 2011 |
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Aug 3, 2011 12:22
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Going to law school and buying a house, I don't think a person can make two worse decisions in one lifetime.
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Aug 3, 2011 13:53
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Baruch Obamawitz posted:That sounds like the international law panda of the IP world. More so than "copyright lawyer" but still. Interesting. The reason I'm interested in the field of scientific discovery is I'm currently a professional scientist and I've worked with our staff lawyers on patents in the past. I imagine if I actually want to become a patent lawyer I'll have a pretty tough road, but I wanted to get more information. This thread has such an awesome op I figured someone would try and talk me out of it. Or talk me into it? Qualifications for a particular specialization (like patent law) is listed in the OP as one of the few good reasons to go to law school.
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Aug 3, 2011 15:21
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What do you mean by the "field of scientific discovery"?
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Aug 3, 2011 15:28
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For scientific discovery I mean biological and chemical research and development. Patenting of drugs for big pharma, patenting custom-made biological agents, small molecules, things like that.
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Aug 3, 2011 15:37
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Gameko posted:Interesting. The reason I'm interested in the field of scientific discovery is I'm currently a professional scientist and I've worked with our staff lawyers on patents in the past. I imagine if I actually want to become a patent lawyer I'll have a pretty tough road, but I wanted to get more information. Patent law has two (arguably 3) career tracks: 1) Prosecution: Preparing patent applications and bickering with the patent office to get those patent applications turned into issued patents. The vast majority of your clients will be large corporations and children of the independently wealthy who are trying to start their own business. You will roll your eyes at the majority of patent disclosures you receive, but proceed to file the case anyway because the client has no interest in paying for a prior art search. Depending upon your field and location, you may be able to get a job doing this sort of work without going to law school, though in my experience it's been tough to find a job as a patent agent lately unless you have an advanced degree in your scientific discipline. 2) Litigation: Suing and defending clients in infringement actions. The vast majority of your clients will be large corporations and/or patent trolls. Technically, you don't even need to have a scientific background to be a patent litigator, but many firms prefer one. The litigator in the office next to mine never EVER leaves before me, and I usually stay until 8pm every day. 3) (Comedy Option) Patent Examiner: Working at the USPTO, bickering with patent prosecutors about why their client's inventions are unpatentable. Good hours, possibility of working from home, six figure salary. The Federal government is also a disaster right now and even though the patent office is profitable and they are understaffed, good luck getting a job there. There's also a pay freeze in effect. You also don't need a law degree to work there. It sounds like you're looking for a prosecution position, but I can assure you it's not all that glamorous. A non-trivial amount of the inventors you work with will never return your phone calls or e-mails because they have better things to do, like meet project deadlines. 30% or so will be actively hostile to you because they hate the patent system. You will, rarely, get to see some cool technology before it hits the public. Also, I wouldn't say that qualification to practice patent law is a "good" reason to go to law school. While career prospects for patent attorneys (particularly EEs and Computer Engineers) are not as bad as the rest of the profession, you're still not guaranteed employment. Still, with all of that said, I like my job, and I make enough money that it ended up being worth it to go to law school. In retrospect though, I took a huge risk that I wasn't even aware of going in (went to a lower T2 law school, graduated somewhere around top 30%), and managed to hit the lottery job-wise. If I had to do it all over again knowing what I know now, but without knowing that I'd end up employed, I probably would have saved myself the ~60k or so of debt and kept working as a software developer.
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Aug 3, 2011 15:41
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NJ Deac posted:Also, I wouldn't say that qualification to practice patent law is a "good" reason to go to law school. While career prospects for patent attorneys (particularly EEs and Computer Engineers) are not as bad as the rest of the profession, you're still not guaranteed employment. NJ Deac posted:Still, with all of that said, I like my job, and I make enough money that it ended up being worth it to go to law school. In retrospect though, I took a huge risk that I wasn't even aware of going in (went to a lower T2 law school, graduated somewhere around top 30%), and managed to hit the lottery job-wise. If I had to do it all over again knowing what I know now, but without knowing that I'd end up employed, I probably would have saved myself the ~60k or so of debt and kept working as a software developer. I am a lot better patent litigator than I am a software developer, so I guess I made the right call there between those two. I wish I actually learned to code in school, and stayed more math-focused. gvibes fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Aug 3, 2011 |
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Aug 3, 2011 17:55
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Wait - if we have to start paying interest on subsidized loans while in school, what's the difference between those loans and the unsubsidized loans?
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Aug 3, 2011 18:58
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Feces Starship posted:Wait - if we have to start paying interest on subsidized loans while in school, what's the difference between those loans and the unsubsidized loans? Slightly lower interest rates than GradPLUS?
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Aug 3, 2011 19:06
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Gameko posted:I'm currently a professional scientist That sounds pretty rad, why do you want to leave science?
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Aug 3, 2011 23:27
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Feces Starship posted:we have to start paying interest on subsidized loans while in school I think these two things are opposites.
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Aug 3, 2011 23:45
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IBR? Heh.  Scotland knows what's up:quote:STUDENTS should be able to sell their kidneys for tens of thousands of pounds to pay off university debts, according to a Scots academic.
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Aug 3, 2011 23:46
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Yeah right. Once kidney sales are legal the dummycRats will start telling me how much they cost and limiting the number of kidneys I can buy, and next thing you know Obama will be serving bbq white children's kidneys to the king of Kenya at a white house dinner. NOT IN MY AMERICA
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Aug 4, 2011 01:03
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Was in a meeting today where the marketing director for my firm commented that partner's at big firms are expected to clock more than 2500 hours a year - doing billable work for clients, of course, but also doing 200 or 300 hours of business development plus 100 hours or so of firm management stuff. I think you've really gotta want that kind of lifestyle to be happy there, wow.
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Aug 4, 2011 02:23
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Why can't we return to the days of 1300 hour billable requirements of the 70s  ?
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Aug 4, 2011 02:30
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For firms that have ~2500 billable hour requirements, how on earth do they keep billing honest?
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Aug 4, 2011 04:04
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