|
Charlie Mopps posted:Not really sure if putting on the cut-off faces from the dead counts as actual shapeshifting. We discussed this earlier in the thread. Part of the description of Arya's transformation makes it sound like they're literally just physically putting the face over hers, but certain parts later on make it clear that's not the case. Namely the fact that when she touches the face, it still feels like her own. Do you really think the Faceless Men could go around fooling everyone with what are basically just really good rubber masks? And for that matter, how could Jaaqen just "change" his on the fly if that were the case?
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 14:19
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 14:28 |
|
|
We still haven't seen any grumpkins or snarks which I'm sure actually exist at this point. I just want to know what the hell they even are!
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 14:41
|
|
|
Ratios and Tendency posted:Once Jon comes back that's going to be 4 characters coming back to life and with Arya, Mance and probably Mel, 4 who can shapeshift. poo poo's getting dumb. Can any of those characters shapeshift? What are you talking about? Jon may, or may not, end up being able to control the war stuff, so I guess that's shape shifting... When do we learn Mance can? Or that Mel can? What are you talking about? I'm so confused.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 14:43
|
|
|
Cyvasse sounds like a pretty cool game.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 14:52
|
|
|
Le Woad posted:Can any of those characters shapeshift? What are you talking about? Jon may, or may not, end up being able to control the war stuff, so I guess that's shape shifting... Jon: not really face shifting. Bodysnatching, yes, shapeshifting no. Melisandre: can create glamors so that people look different than they are. This process apparently has some component that causes her jewel to reflect at least some of the pain of the glamorized; her ruby nearly burned her throat before Jon killed fake Mance. Mance: glamorized by Melisandre. No indication that his Abel persona looked like anything other than himself; he's apparently a rather nondescript-looking person, and nobody south of the wall knows what he looks like, and the vast majority don't even know his real name. Faceless Men: either a glamor of sorts or some sort of actual shapeshifting; Arya feels her own face, but that doesn't necessarily mean she hasn't gained the physical abilities of the people she's impersonating. Requires that the person one impersonates be dead.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 15:13
|
|
|
We need to go back and examine every scene where Melisandre's neck ruby is described as throbbing with its own light.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 15:20
|
|
|
whowhatwhere posted:Jon: not really face shifting. Bodysnatching, yes, shapeshifting no. Yep, this is pretty much what I thought. Glad to hear I'm not the idiot and it's Ratios and Tendency.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 15:21
|
|
|
I always pictured magic in aSoIaF working as the Earth's magnetic field; it naturally changes poles over time, but in the middle of a switch it becomes weak. Magic stuff like Others and Dragons can only happen in times of the 'magic field' being strong. This is something I have "made up" in my mind though, the only thing we know for sure is that the strength of magic fluctuates, whether the dragons give magic strength or their birth was possible because of an excess of magic, we don't know. The only thing I know for sure is that I'll have many years to post impotent theories about aSoIaF before Gurm decides to finish the next book.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 15:52
|
|
|
I fear the ending of the story will be some sort of Deus Ex Bran, even though Bloodraven said that no matter how many times he tried he could not interact or change the past, somehow I think Bran will find a way. Also I think Jon was able to read between the lines and knew the letter was from Mance, either thinking that Mance needed help or something. Of course he couldn't admit to the Night's Watch that Mance was still alive and was working to help his sister, so he made it seem like he took the letter personally to get a few trusted people to go with him. Perhaps Mance found a way to use Melisandre's spell or whatever to make himself look like Ramsay. Koirhor fucked around with this message at 16:11 on Aug 3, 2011 |
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 16:09
|
|
|
I'm surprised people complain about the repetition of certain phrases in the book (You know nothing, where do whores go, floppy ears, blood of the dragon, lamprey pies, etc), but I haven't seen anyone complain about the annoying rear end prayers to the Red God or whatever the gently caress. I don't really skim books, especially not these, but goddamn did I get tired of hearing all of that poo poo about light and fire and blah blah blah.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 16:10
|
|
|
Keep us warm and toasty!
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 16:13
|
|
|
EC posted:I'm surprised people complain about the repetition of certain phrases in the book (You know nothing, where do whores go, floppy ears, blood of the dragon, lamprey pies, etc), but I haven't seen anyone complain about the annoying rear end prayers to the Red God or whatever the gently caress. I don't really skim books, especially not these, but goddamn did I get tired of hearing all of that poo poo about light and fire and blah blah blah. Well these are prayers, which are generally repetitious anyways, as opposed to phrases the entire continent of Westeros apparently knows and uses at the drop of a hat. If the core tenet of your religion is " the night is dark and full of terrors", I imagine that will be worked into a few sermons here and there.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 16:35
|
|
|
Le Woad posted:Yep, this is pretty much what I thought. Glad to hear I'm not the idiot and it's Ratios and Tendency. I have some bad news...
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 16:51
|
|
|
Ratios and Tendency posted:I have some bad news... Cute. Dude you came in with a poo poo post and just straight up invented things. Also, who are these four resurrected main characters you're talking about?
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 16:55
|
|
|
EC posted:I'm surprised people complain about the repetition of certain phrases in the book (You know nothing, where do whores go, floppy ears, blood of the dragon, lamprey pies, etc), but I haven't seen anyone complain about the annoying rear end prayers to the Red God or whatever the gently caress. I don't really skim books, especially not these, but goddamn did I get tired of hearing all of that poo poo about light and fire and blah blah blah. I actually got more annoyed at the constant use of cock and oval office and "her lips down there" and other juvenile references. And I don't know what kind of sex the GRRM has (if its even physically possible) but I have always remembered I was the one with the penis, and never "forgot who had the cock or who had the oval office." What a terrible loving description of anything. edit: This whole book was trash and nothing happened. I gave myself days to think about i before posting but seriously, this was crap. Utter trash and the reviewers that gave it glowing amazing reviews should be fired. Le Woad posted:Cute. Dude you came in with a poo poo post and just straight up invented things. Also, who are these four resurrected main characters you're talking about? Not to defend him but you got Dondarrion (kind of main for a few chapters) Zombie Caitlyn (main) Zombie Gregor/Robert (main) Brienne doesnt die, Rhaegars son suddenly shows up, if Jon lives after being stabbed a dozen times (at least 4) then well that makes more characters... so on and so forth. Errant Gin Monks fucked around with this message at 16:59 on Aug 3, 2011 |
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 16:55
|
|
|
Yeah, but Dondarrion came back as a pale shadow of himself who died anyway, Cat is all hosed up, "Ser Robert Strong" may only actually be Gregor's torso or part of his skelton, or something, and Jon is probably going to turn into a wight/warg into something/be hosed up somehow too. I hope Martin just straight up doesn't resurrect Jon at all and instead he wargs into Ghost, stays there permanently, and builds a huge pack of wolves and goes on a rampage. 
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 17:03
|
|
|
Ambiguatron posted:I hope Martin just straight up doesn't resurrect Jon at all and instead he wargs into Ghost, stays there permanently, and builds a huge pack of wolves and goes on a rampage. And then meets up with Nymeria, and then the yiffing, yes, the yiffing :grrm:
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 17:08
|
|
|
Errant Gin Monks posted:I actually got more annoyed at the constant use of cock and oval office and "her lips down there" and other juvenile references. And I don't know what kind of sex the GRRM has (if its even physically possible) but I have always remembered I was the one with the penis, and never "forgot who had the cock or who had the oval office." That's really just one main character that's been "resurrected" and it's Caitlyn. Gregor and Beric aren't main characters (And like it's been pointed out, you can hardly call them resurrected), Brienne never died (Did we actually think she did?), and we don't actually know the truth about Aegon yet.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 17:09
|
|
|
What was the deal with Dany being told by Quaithe "Beware the perfumed seneschal!" and then we got a huge loving hint about the boat Tyrion was on, called the [something made up] which means "the stinky steward"? Considering that ship got destroyed, was it just a red herring?
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 17:12
|
|
|
Here's a sneak preview from a Winds Of Winter chapter if anyone's interested. http://twitpic.com/5zztix/full
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 17:18
|
|
|
Le Woad posted:That's really just one main character that's been "resurrected" and it's Caitlyn. Gregor and Beric aren't main characters (And like it's been pointed out, you can hardly call them resurrected), Brienne never died (Did we actually think she did?), and we don't actually know the truth about Aegon yet. Well brienne was hanging from the neck at the end of AFfC
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 17:20
|
|
|
ineptmule posted:Cyvasse sounds like a pretty cool game. Hear hear, I want a game of Cyvasse. Here's hoping GRRM writes some proper rules and releases it when he finishes the final book and runs out of pizza money. On the subject of repetition of phrases, I don't mind them. I liked the 'where do whores go' thing because sometimes Tyrion would just randomly say it and the other characters would be totally baffled. It gave me a chuckle. You know nothing Jon Snow is pretty good, because it morphs into Jon using it as 'you know nothing, everyone,' pretty much. The 'Reek Reek it rhymes with squeak' thing was masterful, it really gave the impression of a mentally fractured, broken individual.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 17:22
|
|
|
Errant Gin Monks posted:Well brienne was hanging from the neck at the end of AFfC Yes...But she's not dead, she even says a "word."
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 17:27
|
|
|
Le Woad posted:Yes...But she's not dead, she even says a "word." Speaking of which, does anyone know what the word was? I've heard 'sword', but what's the reasoning behind this?
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 17:40
|
|
|
Jakabite posted:On the subject of repetition of phrases, I don't mind them. I liked the 'where do whores go' thing because sometimes Tyrion would just randomly say it and the other characters would be totally baffled. It gave me a chuckle. You know nothing Jon Snow is pretty good, because it morphs into Jon using it as 'you know nothing, everyone,' pretty much. I agree with your points on the Reek repetition and "Where do whores go?" But for some reason "you know nothing Jon Snow" seemed to be too redundant. I think Arya's prayer helps tie her back to Westeros, and seems pertinent.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 18:31
|
|
|
Jakabite posted:Speaking of which, does anyone know what the word was? I've heard 'sword', but what's the reasoning behind this? She was asked to make a choice earlier: "The sword [kill Jaime] or the noose".
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 18:35
|
|
|
Jakabite posted:Speaking of which, does anyone know what the word was? I've heard 'sword', but what's the reasoning behind this? She was offered the noose or the sword (aka kill jaime). She chooses the noose. Then when they're hanging Podrick as well, she yells at a single word and appears in ADWD to lead jaime into a trap. edit: i really shouldnt open the response page, go away, then finally answer the question 15 minutes later. it's just asking for efb SmugDogMillionaire fucked around with this message at 18:49 on Aug 3, 2011 |
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 18:47
|
|
|
Errant Gin Monks posted:Well brienne was hanging from the neck at the end of AFfC But that is the point of a cliffhanger, no? To bring you back for the next installment, to find out how the character makes it out alive. That's is why Jon isn't dead(or is, only to be Resurrected). If they die in that book, you're going to see a dead body or some sort of confirmation. Look at Eddard, Catelyn, and Robb. It would be stupid to leave them in peril in one book, and then in the next go, "oh yeah he dead lol".
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 19:46
|
|
|
But at the same time, obviously fake death "cliffhangers" are becoming retardedly common at this point and he needs to let them go. It's a cheap and irritating device pretty much 100% of the time.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 19:54
|
|
|
Oh, I definitively agree. I think everybody, except for the biggest fanboys, would agree. The guy just seemed confused by the point of cliffhangers.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 20:05
|
|
|
Ecco the Dolphin posted:But at the same time, obviously fake death "cliffhangers" are becoming retardedly common at this point and he needs to let them go. It's a cheap and irritating device pretty much 100% of the time. My favorite one of these is when they mention Davos being killed by the Manderlys in AFFC. It was a clear cover as the Manderlys were not nearly that bloodthirsty and had no motivation to anger Stannis by killing his Hand. It was so transparent you could see it 1000 pages and 6 years away. And then when he finally wrote the Davos POV, it was just Manderly spouting exposition.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 20:08
|
|
|
Ecco the Dolphin posted:But at the same time, obviously fake death "cliffhangers" are becoming retardedly common at this point and he needs to let them go. It's a cheap and irritating device pretty much 100% of the time. Yeah, I agree with that. At this point, they're just getting on my nerves. "Tyrion is surely drowning...TILL NEXT TIME!" is just annoying me now as I know that it's just a cliffhanger that will be resolved a few chapters later. "Bran gets pushed off the wall, no wait, he's okay" worked because, while annoying, it set up a counterpoint to the Ned/Drogo deaths that worked really well by giving you an early false sense of security. In books 4 and 5, it just seems/feels like a bunch of serial cliffhangers, and has long since served its purpose (unless you just like that sort of thing).
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 20:11
|
|
|
Darko posted:Yeah, I agree with that. At this point, they're just getting on my nerves. "Tyrion is surely drowning...TILL NEXT TIME!" is just annoying me now as I know that it's just a cliffhanger that will be resolved a few chapters later. "Bran gets pushed off the wall, no wait, he's okay" worked because, while annoying, it set up a counterpoint to the Ned/Drogo deaths that worked really well by giving you an early false sense of security. In books 4 and 5, it just seems/feels like a bunch of serial cliffhangers, and has long since served its purpose (unless you just like that sort of thing). Maybe GRRM wanted to mimic Dan Brown  Tyrion's worked well, a bit over the top (only missing the 1960s Batman voice over at the end) as he just as easily with out ruining the narrative been saved someone to close out the chapter. It really only was worth it because it set up the Connington grey scale reveal.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 20:26
|
|
|
Speaking of grey scale, is it safe to assume that Shireen's greyscale is going to be fatal? What would this mean to the overall story I wonder?
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 20:45
|
|
|
CornHolio posted:Speaking of grey scale, is it safe to assume that Shireen's greyscale is going to be fatal? Didn't they spend several paragraphs explaining that it's generally not fatal in children?
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 20:47
|
|
|
Ecco the Dolphin posted:Didn't they spend several paragraphs explaining that it's generally not fatal in children? That was combined with "You know nothing!"
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 20:48
|
|
|
So I was thinking about that weird scene in the TV show where Pycelle is shown to be putting on an old man act. Now this makes the audience think there's something big in store for him, or that he's a big schemer. Though until he gets offed he doesn't actually do anything? I think Pycelle may replace Qyburn in the series, as there's really not much Qyburn does that Pycelle couldn't do anyway, and he wouldn't have to die in the series where he does in the book, as Varys kills Kevan too.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 20:56
|
|
|
Mowglis Haircut posted:So I was thinking about that weird scene in the TV show where Pycelle is shown to be putting on an old man act. Now this makes the audience think there's something big in store for him, or that he's a big schemer. Though until he gets offed he doesn't actually do anything? I think Pycelle may replace Qyburn in the series, as there's really not much Qyburn does that Pycelle couldn't do anyway, and he wouldn't have to die in the series where he does in the book, as Varys kills Kevan too. And it's not really correct to say Pycelle "doesn't actually do anything" since after Cersei is imprisoned, it turns out that Pycelle and Harys Swyft are basically ruling the kingdom by putting papers in front of Tommen to stamp. Linguica fucked around with this message at 21:08 on Aug 3, 2011 |
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 21:04
|
|
|
Mowglis Haircut posted:So I was thinking about that weird scene in the TV show where Pycelle is shown to be putting on an old man act. Now this makes the audience think there's something big in store for him, or that he's a big schemer. Though until he gets offed he doesn't actually do anything? I think Pycelle may replace Qyburn in the series, as there's really not much Qyburn does that Pycelle couldn't do anyway, and he wouldn't have to die in the series where he does in the book, as Varys kills Kevan too. I don't think that will work, but considering the massive change to Qarth and Xaro, I wouldn't be surprised. One: it's a drastically different character and would be a huge character change. I've always imagined Qyburn as more of a Wyrmtounge-mad-scientist type character. Two: Qyburn is with Jaime (or in the vicinity) and heals his hand / wrist after it was cut off before Jaime returned to King's Landing. Third: the "weird Pycelle scene" is more foreshadowing to Tyrion ambushing him in ACoK when he's found in his bedchambers with the serving girl(s?). Right before his beard is shaved and he's thrown into the dungeon.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 21:09
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 14:28 |
|
|
I'm trying to get a sense of how big the cities on Essos are. According to this wiki http://gameofthrones.wikia.com/wiki/King%27s_Landing. Kings landing is approx 500,000, Lannisport 300,000 with oldtown in between. When Tyroin comes upon Selhorys he initially calls it a city but then downgrades reasoning that by eastern standards it would be a town. Going by this, Volantis and Meereen which seem to be the biggest cities would then be in the millions maybe? We know that Volantis is big enough to support a fleet of 300-500 dromonds (which if they are anything like byzantine dromonds would be 200 sailors each) for a naval force of at least 60,000 to 100,000. I don't know if theirs enough info on the other free cities to estimate sizes though. Or on cities like Qarth or Asshai.
|
|
#
?
Aug 3, 2011 21:20
|
|
