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an oddly awful oud posted:That looks incredibly awesome and I want badly to read it... but $25 for a PDF? Really? The dead tree version comes out in about a month or so, I believe. That's when I'll be picking it up and adding it to my shelf o' sourcebooks.
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Aug 12, 2011 19:00
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Just wanted to chime in here that I'm still enjoying this, despite having no real introduction or experience with the BattleTech universe besides this thread, the Sarna wiki, and some stuff on another message board that I mentioned before. Hell, it was this thread that made me go through the Sarna wiki in the first place. Sure, I might cringe at some of the more stupid stuff that BT has, fluff or crunch wise, but hell, this is an enjoyable read. And all games that have been out this long and are still going have stupid stuff in them, its just finding a balance between that and the good stuff, and getting to enjoy yourself. Not going to bring up the old real world stuff vs BT debate from before since I don't want to run afoul of the rule that PTN instituted somewhat due to some of the  I was doing on that subject, but yeah, I might get hung up on that sometimes, but it still doesn't prevent me from enjoying this thread. This thread has taught me a lot about the game that i otherwise wouldn't have learned or bothered to learn.Even if I don't have any experience with the game, PTN still makes the action really easy to follow. Reading about the travails of Goonlance is always amusing, especially with PTN's skill at writing the fluff pieces. If he messes up the dice rolls or bookkeeping from time to time, I can understand, since he's only human. poo poo like that happens. Constantly pointing out mistakes and poo poo and nagging about them gets annoying to the readers as well. Just keep doing what you're doing, PTN. Keep putting Goonlance against tough opponents and letting us allow you to write new fluff and poo poo like that. Even if you haven't updated in a while, I'm still following this thread like a hawk, waiting for the next update to see what Goonlance has gotten itself into now. Always a fun thing to watch, discuss, and comment on. Some more coordination between goons would be nice, but watching them flail about without talking to each other is fun as well. GhostStalker fucked around with this message at 20:35 on Aug 12, 2011 |
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Aug 12, 2011 20:32
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Grand Fromage posted:I'm totally okay with a "deal with it" rule.
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Aug 12, 2011 22:08
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Mary Annette posted:
Oh yeah, this as well. Seeing as how I'm already partially responsible for a "no about real life stuff" rule, I'd totally get behind a  rule.
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Aug 12, 2011 22:34
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The problem with the "deal with it" rule is that it messes with the people who are more familiar with the game rules, and are planning their moves in accordance with them. Depending on what PTN says, it might be a good idea to tally up our own to-hit numbers and movement modifiers when we send our orders, just to clarify what we're trying to do. Use this: http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Tables Usual Barb fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Aug 12, 2011 |
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Aug 12, 2011 22:54
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I've nitpicked about errors in the past, and I want it to be absolutely clear that I only have done so on the assumption PTN actually wanted that kind of scrutiny. I've GMed games on SA before too, and it's something I've looked for from my players, but I know not all GMs view this issue the same way. It's always a fine line in any case. "Fairness" and adherence to the rules is important; so is keeping things moving and not getting bogged down in revisions of previous action. Sometimes the right thing for the GM is to go back and fix something, and sometimes the right thing is to say "I'm going to let this stand, we'll fix it the next time this situation arises." I think PTN is pretty good at finding that line. My intention was never to disrupt or annoy; certainly never to "score points" or something; and I hope my comments haven't come off that way. PTN, you're doing a fabulous job, I really appreciate all the effort that's gone into this, and I hope you keep at it.
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Aug 12, 2011 22:56
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In response to the folks pointing out that the goonlance is currently doing well: point taken, but I'm disappointed. I'm kinda rooting for the Clans in this LP, honestly. Yes, they're more than a little nutty, but I think the nutty-but-functional Clans are preferable to the relatively-sane-but-highly-dysfunctional Inner Sphere for the most part. Oh, sure, they're probably just as hosed as they were in the canon timeline when they invaded, but who doesn't like a good underdog?
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Aug 13, 2011 00:02
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You should all be rooting for the Death Commandos. Many factions talk about the need to reduce the surplus population, but the Death Commandos are the only ones doing something about the problem at it's source. 
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Aug 13, 2011 00:05
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Zaodai posted:You should all be rooting for the Death Commandos. Many factions talk about the need to reduce the surplus population, but the Death Commandos are the only ones doing something about the problem at it's source. I have the Smoke Jaguars on line two, they say they have a proposal for you...
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Aug 13, 2011 00:07
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Considering were playing as the proto-WoB, I think we've got that on lockdown.
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Aug 13, 2011 00:10
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Cythereal posted:In response to the folks pointing out that the goonlance is currently doing well: point taken, but I'm disappointed. I'm kinda rooting for the Clans in this LP, honestly. Yes, they're more than a little nutty, but I think the nutty-but-functional Clans are preferable to the relatively-sane-but-highly-dysfunctional Inner Sphere for the most part. Oh, sure, they're probably just as hosed as they were in the canon timeline when they invaded, but who doesn't like a good underdog? So, uh, you think the Clans are the underdogs?
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Aug 13, 2011 00:12
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The Merry Marauder posted:So, uh, you think the Clans are the underdogs? Tactically? No. Strategically? Oh yes. Winning individual battles is a far, far cry from winning the war.
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Aug 13, 2011 00:16
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Cythereal posted:Tactically? No. Strategically? Oh yes. Winning individual battles is a far, far cry from winning the war. Well, the only thing stopping the Clans from dropping on Tharkad/Luthien/loving Sian for that matter and cutting the head off the feudal dragon is their self-imposed system of rules, so I find it difficult to impute any kind of underdog charisma to them.
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Aug 13, 2011 00:30
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Leperflesh posted:I've nitpicked about errors in the past, and I want it to be absolutely clear that I only have done so on the assumption PTN actually wanted that kind of scrutiny. I've GMed games on SA before too, and it's something I've looked for from my players, but I know not all GMs view this issue the same way. It's always a fine line in any case. "Fairness" and adherence to the rules is important; so is keeping things moving and not getting bogged down in revisions of previous action. Sometimes the right thing for the GM is to go back and fix something, and sometimes the right thing is to say "I'm going to let this stand, we'll fix it the next time this situation arises." I think PTN is pretty good at finding that line. I would like to say that this was basically my assumption and I would like to apologize for getting to pushy PTN. Sorry.
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Aug 13, 2011 00:31
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Looking at it, it seems to me that the Clans are a lot like Japan in World War II. Especially if you conflate fighter pilots to 'mech pilots. What you have is a small population supporting a disproportionately large military that, at the start of the war, has the best trained army and best equipment in the world. (Remembering that we're comparing planes to 'mechs here.) You even have a rigid honor code that hampers military operations, and a Midway where the best and brightest are lost and from which the momentum of the early successes is never regained. Tukkayid being the Midway for the Clans, of course. Ergo, like the Japanese, the Clans' only hope was a lightning swift victory inducing a negotiated peace. Once the war moved to one of production and attrition, the smaller population and resource base meant that defeat was inevitable for Japan and the Clans. The primary difference is that in real life, the Allied technology lapped the Japanese, leading to Japan's complete surrender, where as the Clans managed to keep a tech edge, albeit one that had narrowed considerably since the beginning, which allowed them to stave off total defeat.
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Aug 13, 2011 00:34
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The Merry Marauder posted:Well, the only thing stopping the Clans from dropping on Tharkad/Luthien/loving Sian for that matter and cutting the head off the feudal dragon is their self-imposed system of rules, so I find it difficult to impute any kind of underdog charisma to them. The Clans and Inner Sphere are both royally hosed up, just in different ways. I find the Clans more interesting than the Inner Sphere, and wish more had been done with the culture shock aspect of both sides being abruptly introduced to a completely, utterly different way of life and way of thinking. Everyone in this thread knows the Clan invasion in the canon timeline was a lost cause from the very beginning, and I'm hoping they'll be able to pull it off this time, or at least do more than "Whoops, IS caught on to how we roll, we'll go line up for the curb stomp now." Yes, the WW2 Pacific Theatre analogy is pretty accurate, and it's true that the war was lost the moment it began. Doesn't change the fact that I think a lot more thought went into the Clans and how they work than the Inner Sphere, and that they make for a more interesting group to read about and follow than the Inner Sphere circle jerk.
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Aug 13, 2011 00:42
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jng2058 posted:What you have is a small population supporting a disproportionately large military that, at the start of the war, has the best trained army and best equipment in the world. (Remembering that we're comparing planes to 'mechs here.) Unlike the Japanese situation, however, the Clans could have won the war at any time if they chose to disregard their honor codes. The IJN never had the tools to sail up and destroy every US shipyard while the Essexes were still building, or vaporize San Diego, or to invade and occupy Washington. E: Cythereal posted:The Clans and Inner Sphere are both royally hosed up, just in different ways. I find the Clans more interesting than the Inner Sphere, and wish more had been done with the culture shock aspect of both sides being abruptly introduced to a completely, utterly different way of life and way of thinking. Everyone in this thread knows the Clan invasion in the canon timeline was a lost cause from the very beginning, and I'm hoping they'll be able to pull it off this time, or at least do more than "Whoops, IS caught on to how we roll, we'll go line up for the curb stomp now." Fair enough. I can't look past my initial "Space Mongols with goofy dueling code and totally nebulous economy/logistics" impression, but that's just my grognardian curmudgeonliness talking, etc etc The Merry Marauder fucked around with this message at 00:48 on Aug 13, 2011 |
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Aug 13, 2011 00:43
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The Merry Marauder posted:Unlike the Japanese situation, however, the Clans could have won the war at any time if they chose to disregard their honor codes. The IJN never had the tools to sail up and destroy every US shipyard while the Essexes were still building, or vaporize San Diego, or to invade and occupy Washington. Don't the Clans also have a mostly intact manufacturing base that can pump out more new Mechs than the Inner Sphere, with better technology as well? Yeah, their supply lines are awfully long, and they only bid so much to attack the Sphere, but if truly pressed, they could call in a bunch more Mechs if they really need it, if only they swallowed their honor a bit (which, being the Clans, I know they are loathe to do). Meanwhile, the Inner Sphere doesn't have many operational factories making new Mechs to re-outfit their troops after taking a beating from the Clans or to outfit new units with which to fight them. Also, which both the Clans and the Inner Sphere are politically divided somewhat, it's way more pronounced in the Inner Sphere, so there's that to take into account. While the Clans might fight amongst each other all the time, they're still nominally a united polity of some sort, as opposed to the Inner Sphere which is (in PTN's timeline here, primarily divided into 5 polities that constantly fight one another and ComStar, who is constantly screwing all of them over and playing one against the other. Keep in mind almost all my knowledge of comes from this thread, Sarna, and another message board which I have discussed before. If my analysis is incorrect, please don't hold it against me.
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Aug 13, 2011 00:54
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The Merry Marauder posted:Unlike the Japanese situation, however, the Clans could have won the war at any time if they chose to disregard their honor codes. The IJN never had the tools to sail up and destroy every US shipyard while the Essexes were still building, or vaporize San Diego, or to invade and occupy Washington. If it helps, just imagine everyone in the Battletech universe is really really stupid in very specific ways. I find it helps make everything much more credible.
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Aug 13, 2011 00:55
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The Merry Marauder posted:Unlike the Japanese situation, however, the Clans could have won the war at any time if they chose to disregard their honor codes. The IJN never had the tools to sail up and destroy every US shipyard while the Essexes were still building, or vaporize San Diego, or to invade and occupy Washington. Only because of the Clan warship monopoly. Except it wasn't really a monopoly, because Comstar has warships too. They only forbore from using them because, Turtle Bay excepted, the Clans weren't using theirs either. I would tend to suspect that had the Clans come out with NPPCs blazing, Comstar would have gone over to the Inner Sphere side much faster and would have broken out the fleet to do it. Furthermore, widespread orbital bombardment is entering into WMD land. And while the Successor States may lack modern warships they CAN make nukes. You start blowing everything to hell First Succession War style and you'll start seeing the nukes flying like crazy. Which was the whole point of the Clan honor code...to AVOID the destruction of total war in favor of strictly limited conflicts. That's what makes the Clans the Clans. If you take that out, they probably would have wiped themselves out long since and wouldn't have been around to invade the Sphere in the first place. For that matter if the Sphere itself didn't move to the much more limited war concept that arose in the Thrid Succession War rather than the total war of the First and Second, it's possible that there wouldn't have been a Sphere worth invading in the first place.
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Aug 13, 2011 00:55
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jng2058 posted:Only because of the Clan warship monopoly. Except it wasn't really a monopoly, because Comstar has warships too. They only forbore from using them because, Turtle Bay excepted, the Clans weren't using theirs either. I would tend to suspect that had the Clans come out with NPPCs blazing, Comstar would have gone over to the Inner Sphere side much faster and would have broken out the fleet to do it. Nah, only the vaporization part is WarShip specific. With no Dragoon cavalry to save the day in this universe, literally nothing but their code stops a Clan assault with irresistible force on say, New Avalon or, indeed, every major factory site in a Successor State. As far as ComStar's WarShips, yes, granting them equal proficiency, which is generous, they're a match for several Clans, as long as Snow Raven isn't one. Hardly compelling. My whole point here is that intentionally fighting with three limbs tied behind your back doesn't make you an underdog in my eyes, it just makes you an rear end in a top hat. paragon1 posted:If it helps, just imagine everyone in the Battletech universe is really really stupid in very specific ways. I find it helps make everything much more credible. Indeed.
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Aug 13, 2011 01:10
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The Merry Marauder posted:Fair enough. I can't look past my initial "Space Mongols with goofy dueling code and totally nebulous economy/logistics" impression, but that's just my grognardian curmudgeonliness talking, etc etc I like the Clans. Presupposing a society that has giant battle robots and won't get rid of them because they're awesome, the Clans strike me as a pretty good way to keep said giant battle robots around and use them regularly with a minimum of disruption to civilian society. I find the economy and logistics of the Inner Sphere only marginally less nebulous, given how everything keeps getting retconned/handwaved/undergoing massive changes in improbably small time spans. My doomed wish for the BattleTech setting is rebooting it and trying to re-establish things from the ground up to be, if not rational and sensible, then at least consistent. Heck, include the LAMs if you want, but, say, make them a specialty of Clan Snow Raven. Or even go whole hog and include actual rules to differentiate different nations/merc bands/Clans. Say, minimum tonnage requirements for Steiners or giving Star Adders easier access to experimental technology/designs/custom configurations or Highlanders getting something to reflect their laser comms and jamming of radio communications with bagpipes. Comedy option: A major IS power, like House Marik, allies with the Clans. Yes, during the invasion.
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Aug 13, 2011 01:19
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Cythereal posted:Comedy option: A major IS power, like House Marik, allies with the Clans. Yes, during the invasion. The better option would be House Steiner. Remember, Clan Steel Viper does have Caesar Steiner in their custody.
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Aug 13, 2011 01:21
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landcollector posted:The better option would be House Steiner. Remember, Clan Steel Viper does have Caesar Steiner in their custody. Meh. House Marik needs to do *something* interesting. Why not ring up the Clans and go "Hey, I can generally keep *this* band of treacherous, scheming, short-sighted fuckups in line. You'll need someone like me if you really intend to make a new Star League..."
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Aug 13, 2011 01:25
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Cythereal posted:Meh. House Marik needs to do *something* interesting. Why not ring up the Clans and go "Hey, I can generally keep *this* band of treacherous, scheming, short-sighted fuckups in line. You'll need someone like me if you really intend to make a new Star League..." Of course they don't want a new Star League in this version. In this one they're just pissed off and want to wreck the joint.
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Aug 13, 2011 01:27
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Cythereal posted:Comedy option: A major IS power, like House Marik, allies with the Clans. Yes, during the invasion. This is actually a pretty good idea, aside from the fact that it would not work out politically. A two front war is still a two front war, and with the Lyran part FedCom barely holding on and the Fed side (eventually) having to push units to save the Draconis Combine, The FWL's only competition comes from the Capellan Confederation, with the southern rump of FedCom ripe for the taking. But this is all speculation. Let's focus on what's at issue here: Clanners curbstomping space mystics and vice versa.
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Aug 13, 2011 01:38
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The Merry Marauder posted:Unlike the Japanese situation, however, the Clans could have won the war at any time if they chose to disregard their honor codes. The IJN never had the tools to sail up and destroy every US shipyard while the Essexes were still building, or vaporize San Diego, or to invade and occupy Washington. No, no they couldn't win. Rack up the butchers bill, yes, but not win. If the Clanners started doing orbital bombardements, you'd see the IS breaking out the fireworks because the informal agreement about WMDs just went out the window and further attempts to bombard major worlds will quickly end with the offending warships having to go through a nuclear gauntlet. Clan warships for most of the part have poo poo point defense and anti-fighter defenses and the Clanners never enjoyed the kind of superiority they had on the ground when it came to ASF. GhostStalker posted:Don't the Clans also have a mostly intact manufacturing base that can pump out more new Mechs than the Inner Sphere, with better technology as well? Not really, regarding the numbers. Even with their infrastructure as much as a basket case as it was at the end of the 3rd Succession War, each single one of the Successor States still cranked out troops at a rate matching or exceeding the entirety of the Clans. As it stood, no matter what the Clans would have done, at some point they would have lost their momentum, while still being faced with the Successor States building up troops at a rate the Clans simply can't match with their smaller population, industrial base and training methods.
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Aug 13, 2011 02:43
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I thought the IS was pretty much strained to industrial capacity already due to lack of parts and whatnot? Unless ComStar has a bunch old factory blueprints they hoard?
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Aug 13, 2011 03:06
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ComStar has Earth. And virtually everything on it, including laboratories, factories, warehouses, bunkers...
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Aug 13, 2011 03:11
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As previously mentioned, ComStar has Earth. That's why they have so much LosTech and poo poo. As for the other Houses, they're not at full industrial capacity. They don't go balls out producing everything they can, because that poo poo is expensive and they wouldn't use it all anyway. If it came down to "we need everything we can get, right now", they'd do like the US did in WW2 and just throw their massive industrial might fully towards weapons of war. They'll still have inferior mechs, but they'll have a lot more of them. Considering the Clans only have so many pilots, at some point they're never giong to be able to secure their gains and they'll eventually get worn down. Each clan pilot killed or captured is one more major asset lost that can't easily be replaced. I imagine if it really got desperate, the IS could just zerg the clans down with barely trained guys in relatively light mechs. They'd come up with something that was the T-34 of it's era.
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Aug 13, 2011 03:34
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Even if it is Earth it's just one planet, though. I guess they could distribute supplies to fix the half and non functional factories everyone else seems to run. My Battletech knowledge is limited to "robots shoot lasers at each other" so yeah. It just seems to me that while the IS was faffing about the clans left with Star League era tech, and the ability to build.maintain it,and then went and further improved it. I don't know how big their cluster or nebulae is but if it's anywhere near a decent percentage of the size of the IS it seems like they'd straight out produce them because their poo poo actually works.
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Aug 13, 2011 03:36
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GruntyThrst posted:Even if it is Earth it's just one planet, though. I guess they could distribute supplies to fix the half and non functional factories everyone else seems to run. My Battletech knowledge is limited to "robots shoot lasers at each other" so yeah. It just seems to me that while the IS was faffing about the clans left with Star League era tech, and the ability to build.maintain it,and then went and further improved it. I don't know how big their cluster or nebulae is but if it's anywhere near a decent percentage of the size of the IS it seems like they'd straight out produce them because their poo poo actually works. One of the main reasons the Clans are so big on minimizing waste is that the worlds they control typically are resource poor (as far as I know), so it would be very difficult (if not impossible) for them to straight out out-produce the IS.
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Aug 13, 2011 03:42
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IS tech works, just not as well. Superior numbers and terrain will still make up that advantage. The main thing about Earth is that it means ComStar has a base that, functionally, can't be assaulted. It has a shitload of manufacturing capacity of Star League era quailty. They might not be able to save the entire IS single handedly, but it means the Clans aren't going to take them down.
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Aug 13, 2011 03:44
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Zaodai posted:IS tech works, just not as well. Superior numbers and terrain will still make up that advantage. Yeah. If I remember, Sol has as much functional manufacturing bases and hidden catches of in-tact Star League tech as the entire rest of the Inner Sphere combined.
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Aug 13, 2011 03:54
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Magni posted:No, no they couldn't win. Rack up the butchers bill, yes, but not win. What does winning entail? Subjugating every planet in the IS? Yeah, that's probably not going to happen. Utterly shattering every Mech contingent of the Successor States that came out to engage? Seizing or destroying the Mech production lines? Completely plausible with the gloves off. Magni posted:Not really, regarding the numbers. Even with their infrastructure as much as a basket case as it was at the end of the 3rd Succession War, each single one of the Successor States still cranked out troops at a rate matching or exceeding the entirety of the Clans. "troops" are not the issue here, however - I find it extremely difficult to believe IS Mech output in 3025, an era of jury-rigged and rusted rides in even the best units, can be favorably compared to the totally opaque but obviously robust Clan production ability. As an example, the Masakari was developed as late as 2999 and produced by only one Clan. It was not rare by the time of the Invasion. Magni posted:As it stood, no matter what the Clans would have done, at some point they would have lost their momentum, while still being faced with the Successor States building up troops at a rate the Clans simply can't match with their smaller population, industrial base and training methods. Probably true if you behave as irrationally and inefficiently as the actual invading Clans. That's another thing, of course, the whole contiguous conquests fetish. Zaodai posted:They don't go balls out producing everything they can, because that poo poo is expensive and they wouldn't use it all anyway. If it came down to "we need everything we can get, right now", they'd do like the US did in WW2 and just throw their massive industrial might fully towards weapons of war. Massive industrial might? This is the Inner Sphere post Succession Wars we're talking about, yes? The Merry Marauder fucked around with this message at 04:03 on Aug 13, 2011 |
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Aug 13, 2011 04:00
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They've got factories they could convert. If not entirely for battlemech production, they could still roll out tanks and aircraft like nobody's business. The Houses have resources they choose not to use because it would be prohibitively expensive in a war that wasn't a huge risk to their survival. They could bury the Clans under a wave of PPC carriers and SRM launchers if they had to.
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Aug 13, 2011 04:16
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I was under the impression they did not know how to build many models of PPCs, which are why there are so few "brands" of different kinds of weapons, and specific planets are very important, and attacking factories is a crime against humanity. As long as the factories keep on trucking whenever you put a pile of parts A, B, and C into the hoppers, you can keep building things. If you break the industrial robotics and design systems, you can never re-create them because you lack the ability to bootstrap back up to that point.
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Aug 13, 2011 04:32
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Leperflesh posted:I've nitpicked about errors in the past, and I want it to be absolutely clear that I only have done so on the assumption PTN actually wanted that kind of scrutiny. I do. If there's something I'm routinely getting wrong, I want to know about it. If it's a typo? Yeah, I probably need to know about it but I don't need twelve people pointing it out or raging at me for not fixing it instantly. I'm totally ok with error-checking, the differences between running a game like this and a game on the tabletop are pretty huge; since by the time the next turn rolls around I have to spend quite a bit of time refamiliarizing myself with what's going on, it makes it much harder to keep a feel for the battlefield (and having a split map doesn't help). I have a feeling most of my next missions are going to be smaller scale so I can avoid some of the targeting (and linework issues) the split map keeps causing me. AtomikKrab posted:I would like to say that this was basically my assumption and I would like to apologize for getting to pushy PTN. Sorry. It's alright, AtomikKrab. There's just a difference between saying "Hey, next turn could you double-check the ranges for the Kraken? I think you might have confused its ultras with the LB-2X (which I strongly considered swapping its armament with) by mistake" and saying "Oh, sure, things will be fine so long as Poptarts stops loving up / loving over the players." I'm not loving up maliciously, but this really is a different ballgame compared to playing on tabletop.
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Aug 13, 2011 04:54
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Chronojam posted:I was under the impression they did not know how to build many models of PPCs, which are why there are so few "brands" of different kinds of weapons, and specific planets are very important, and attacking factories is a crime against humanity. Yeah, this is what I had heard and was talking about. While converting other factories to pump out weapons of war and all that might help, I very much doubt that the Inner Sphere has the technology and blueprints to do so. They don't know how to change the programming of the machinery from producing consumer goods and civilian vehicles and all that into producing combat vehicle parts. Even if it isn't building mechs, combat vehicles still use the same weapons, engines, electronics, components, and structural materials. It might be easier to build them than mechs, but if they don't have operational factories for mech parts, how could they build the same parts for tanks and other combat vehicles, aircraft, and all that? While modern day factories might be able to convert from civilian manufacturing to military production in a matter of months or so, the factories of the Inner Sphere, falling apart and unable to meet production, give every indication that they would not be able to do so. Without the blueprints for machinery to retool their factories, I don't see how converting to "full scale" military production would be possible. This of course doesn't take into account ComStar, who has all the factories of Terra operational and pumping out equipment, but they don't have the troops trained to man all of it if they step up production. And they would never produce mech and other military vehicles for use by the Inner Sphere, especially with their whole shtick with keeping them in the dark and letting them beat each other senseless and all that so they can take control of it and all that. While the Clan planets may be resource deficient, they still have a working manufacturing base, allowing them to build stuff. Again, I'm not really knowledgeable about all this stuff, so take everything I say about all this with a grain of salt. GhostStalker fucked around with this message at 05:13 on Aug 13, 2011 |
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Aug 13, 2011 05:08
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| # ? May 11, 2024 09:50 |
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Actually, even including Terra, ComStar's actual [i]production[i] capabilities are quite limited. They've got stockpiles and warehouses, but they're no closer to restarting old assembly lines than, say, the Marian Hegemony is.
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Aug 13, 2011 05:18
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