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Enter Ye Myne Mystic World of Gayng-Raype: What the “R” Stands for in “George R.R. Martin” http://tigerbeatdown.com/2011/08/26/enter-ye-myne-mystic-world-of-gayng-raype-what-the-r-stands-for-in-george-r-r-martin/ quote:Sansa’s entire plot, from this point forward, will consist of an ongoing competition to molest Sansa, in which every male character in her immediate vicinity will participate. Ha ha, serves you right for being such a girl, Sansa!
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Aug 27, 2011 01:32
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soru posted:Are you trolling or do you actually believe this? Because that's a really stupid opinion. Counterpoint: GRRM has admitted that he's gotten fuzzy on certain counts and has had to turn to some fans to help keep him from contradicting himself.
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Aug 27, 2011 01:36
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xamphear posted:Enter Ye Myne Mystic World of Gayng-Raype: What the “R” Stands for in “George R.R. Martin” quote:A NOTE ON ARRANGED MARRIAGE and CHILDREN: Yes, it’s true; in Ye Olde Medieval Europe, female tweens were oft wed to the grown-ups. A Song of Ice and Fire is known for being “gritty” and “authentic,” so really, aren’t I just objecting to the realism? Reader, here are the things that George R. R. Martin changed about Ye Olde Medieval Europe, when he set out to write A Song of Ice and Fire: Religion. Geography. History. Politics. Zombies. Werewolves. Dragons. At one point, when asked why his characters were taller, healthier, and longer-lived than actual Medieval people, George R. R. Martin explained that human genetics and biology do not work the same way in Westeros as they do in the real world. So George R. R. Martin considered that he could change all of that while maintaining “authenticity.” Here’s what he left in, however: Institutionalized pedophilia. So: He makes up the story any way he wants but he didn't make everything nice and happy! He's mean! to his characters! Also the religion, geography, history, politics, zombies, and werewolves are all fairly uniquely handled and just as more horrible than they would be in the real world. I mean, it's not like he softened politics or history and Dany's dragons aren't magic happy time fun dragons, they eat children. That they've roasted alive. It's not like "fantasy dragon land" is all fun and games except for the rape, it sucks in every other conceivable way, too.
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Aug 27, 2011 02:08
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Habibi posted:Counterpoint: GRRM has admitted that he's gotten fuzzy on certain counts and has had to turn to some fans to help keep him from contradicting himself. I've heard him say this about eye color. Did he say it about plot somewhere that I missed?
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Aug 27, 2011 02:27
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Ambiguatron posted:He makes up the story any way he wants but he didn't make everything nice and happy! He's mean! to his characters! Just because a writer has their made-up society endorse sex with children doesn't mean they are encouraging pedophilia or a pedophile themselves. If you want to have a fictional society (or just one character) that expresses violent racism, you might have a character string up a black man while saying vicious things about his race. Does it make you a racist because you can bear to type it? Do writers "relish" the writing of these scenes? I think very few do. You can change racism and pedophilia to anything that modern society doesn't approve of. If these books were written 100 years ago, the homosexuality would cause more of a stir than anything. In any case I can't think of one instance where an underage character was involved in anything sexual "on-screen", other than being groped. If I recall correctly, even when Reek is told to lick Jeyne Whatsherface, the chapter ends before it actually happens. The books are remarkably tame in this regard. A lot of stuff is implied, and people react to the implied moments but you're not actually reading graphic descriptions of 13 year olds having sex. I'm pretty sure that's left to shittier fantasy writers than GRRM.
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Aug 27, 2011 02:40
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syndex posted:His uncle Gerion, I believe, taught him. The one who set off to Valyria in search of some sword. He took the ancestral Lannister Valyrian sword with him across the Narrow Sea, and he's been missing ever since. Im sure he'll pop up though, he's been mentioned at least once a book. Maybe Gerion is ColdHands? VVVV Bittersteel is the Blackfyre sword. I think its with the Golden Company. Their motto is something like "beneath the gold, the Bittersteel."VVVV KillRoy fucked around with this message at 03:30 on Aug 27, 2011 |
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Aug 27, 2011 02:42
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KillRoy posted:He took the ancestral Lannister Valyrian sword with him across the Narrow Sea, and he's been missing ever since. Im sure he'll pop up though, he's been mentioned at least once a book. Maybe Gerion is ColdHands? Bran isn't really going to be a dragon rider so he just gives a painted sword to Hodor and makes him fight wights all day long while sitting in the Cave of Boredom.
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Aug 27, 2011 02:49
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Dragon riders are Dany Aegon and Pretty Pig next topic please.
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Aug 27, 2011 03:43
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Ross posted:Dragon riders are Dany Aegon and Pretty Pig next topic please. What if Martin totally flips the fantasy script again and the dragons ride people?
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Aug 27, 2011 03:50
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soru posted:Are you trolling or do you actually believe this? Because that's a really stupid opinion. Blind faith that gurm has a clue at this point is a pretty stupid extreme as well.
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Aug 27, 2011 03:51
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Fog Tripper posted:Blind faith that gurm has a clue at this point is a pretty stupid extreme as well. Why is it blind faith? Some of us actually like the last two books, you know.
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Aug 27, 2011 04:03
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Eggnogium posted:Why is it blind faith? Some of us actually like the last two books, you know. Yeah, some people actually finished reading them too. I thought Gerion went to Valyria to retrieve the Lannister ancestral sword.
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Aug 27, 2011 04:15
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Fog Tripper posted:Blind faith that gurm has a clue at this point is a pretty stupid extreme as well. GRRM's diatribes on the Lost and BSG endings gave me some hope. They indicate to me that he understands how not to end a sprawling series. Rosscifer fucked around with this message at 04:50 on Aug 27, 2011 |
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Aug 27, 2011 04:43
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bigmcgaffney posted:Yeah, some people actually finished reading them too. Well, either way he's got it because anything mentioned more than twice is important. Tyrion gets a sword as big as he is, gets a dragon, will marry Sansa when she realizes that he's the best character aside from Victarion (who will marry Arya after she wargs into a kraken)
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Aug 27, 2011 05:15
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Fog Tripper posted:Blind faith that gurm has a clue at this point is a pretty stupid extreme as well. GRRM may not have a clue on lots of things, but one of the great things about this series are the small things that payoff several books later. He has issues tieing up plot threads, but he's god drat amazing at all the side comments and observations that you can piece together to make up the world of Westeros. The little details are where he thrives.
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Aug 27, 2011 06:25
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George RR Martin is a very good writer, one of the very best in the genre, and the only thing that could stop this series ending amazingly is his quite atrocious health beating him to the ending.
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Aug 27, 2011 07:30
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Quantify! posted:The Faceless Men are either for/against the dragons returning. Theory: with Pycelle dead, the Citadel has to elect (or however it works) a new GrandMaester. Guess whose identity Pate/Jaqen will take next... Rosscifer posted:GRRM's diatribes on the Lost and BSG endings gave me some hope. They indicate to me that he understands how not to end a sprawling series. He also already knows already how it is going to end. The problem now is how to write all the characters to that ending. I have quite some confidence in it being a good ending, especially the bittersweet part of it he hinted at. OperaMouse fucked around with this message at 10:13 on Aug 27, 2011 |
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Aug 27, 2011 10:10
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Well last time the Others popped up did they gently caress up the whole world or just Westeros? I think the bittersweet ending might be Westeros getting destroyed.
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Aug 27, 2011 14:59
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oogyboogs posted:Well last time the Others popped up did they gently caress up the whole world or just Westeros? I think the bittersweet ending might be Westeros getting destroyed. I've been reading about European history and the Little Ice Age and I have to wonder if that was part of the inspiration for the series. Probably!
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Aug 27, 2011 15:21
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That's something I've been wondering about. The red priests and their religion are primarily based in the east, but one of their main goals is to defeat the others, who seem to be a Westeros problem.
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Aug 27, 2011 15:23
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bigmcgaffney posted:Yeah, some people actually finished reading them too. Oh, I'm slowly getting there. It's not a matter of liking them or not. Telling someone that it is a "stupid opinion" for suspecting that gurm doesn't have at least a general outline for the series is simple fanboism. The series has grown disjointed IMHO since the first 3, expanding into irrelevant/unnecessary directions. Update: Just finished the Manderly/Glover/Onion Knight chapter, and it pleases me. Not that I give two poops what/where Rickon has been for the past couple books. Thoguh posted:GRRM may not have a clue on lots of things, but one of the great things about this series are the small things that payoff several books later. He has issues tieing up plot threads, but he's god drat amazing at all the side comments and observations that you can piece together to make up the world of Westeros. The little details are where he thrives. I kind of agree with you. That said, I wonder if over the past decade he saw all of us sperging about R+L=J and such and chooses to take them in a different direction just to gently caress with us. The little details that lead to conspiracies are great fun, as long as he doesn't yank the carpet from under them. Fog Tripper fucked around with this message at 15:51 on Aug 27, 2011 |
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Aug 27, 2011 15:46
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Fog Tripper posted:I kind of agree with you. That said, I wonder if over the past decade he saw all of us sperging about R+L=J and such and chooses to take them in a different direction just to gently caress with us. The little details that lead to conspiracies are great fun, as long as he doesn't yank the carpet from under them. GRRM himself said in some google interview/Q&A session that he avoids reading theories and whatnot for just that reason: he doesn't want them to affect his direction for the story. Now as to whether or not you believe him.... who knows? I doubt that he's going to change something that drasticly about the story just based on hearing that someone "figured it out" before he revealed it in the books. He stated that even though he avoids messageboards and the like, he does get people who come up to him and whisper theories in his ear at book signings and conventions. He even joked in the google interview that he could have aliens come down from space and kill everybody and that would certainly suprise the readers but would also ruin the story he's trying to tell.
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Aug 27, 2011 16:01
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OperaMouse posted:Theory: with Pycelle dead, the Citadel has to elect (or however it works) a new GrandMaester. Guess whose identity Pate/Jaqen will take next... Yes, if I remember right, one of the consolations the producers of the show got from him was he had to share with them the major aspects of how the story will end, so they had (1) something to build towards with the character development within and over multiple seasons and (2) a safeguard against GRRM kicking the bucket before the books are finished, leaving the series in limbo. So he does for sure have an end in sight.
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Aug 27, 2011 17:14
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maybe the dragon will end up having seven heads rather than three, because the prophecy grew in the fulfillment.
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Aug 27, 2011 17:16
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Junkenstein posted:That's something I've been wondering about. The red priests and their religion are primarily based in the east, but one of their main goals is to defeat the others, who seem to be a Westeros problem. Well, technically they fight against that other god, and the Others merely seem to be agents of that god.
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Aug 27, 2011 17:37
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Fog Tripper posted:Telling someone that it is a "stupid opinion" for suspecting that gurm doesn't have at least a general outline for the series is simple fanboism. Assuming a writer knows how to write is not being a "fanboy". The fact that you would even use that term is telling. I don't view these books as the kind of pop media that has "fanboys". The books have artistic merit. They're real stories. Books going down dead-end roads is a sign of a sloppy editor more than a sloppy writer. Rowling had the same problem in her later books as well. She also wrote with an outline, and the Harry Potter series as a whole holds together remarkably well. A guy who wrote an epic series without an outline? Stephen King. And even his biggest fans will tell you that the Dark Tower series varies widely in tone.
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Aug 27, 2011 19:14
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Martin Van Buren posted:maybe the dragon will end up having seven heads rather than three, because the prophecy grew in the fulfillment. HEY THIS IS ONLY HALF A DRAGON WTF
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Aug 27, 2011 19:14
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Junkenstein posted:That's something I've been wondering about. The red priests and their religion are primarily based in the east, but one of their main goals is to defeat the others, who seem to be a Westeros problem. At this point, I'm rooting for the Others. They're dicks but they have a game plan: eat the poo poo out of everyone and get through the Wall. What have the red priests doing? Besides being sexy (Melisandre) and giving guys burned up hands? GRRM has stacked the odds so high against the humans that they will have to lose. Speaking of Melisandre, does anyone else get the vibe that her appearance is just a glamour? I feel like she really looks like some sort of burned, wretched monster. Kind of like Victarion's hand.
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Aug 27, 2011 22:37
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I don't think the Others are a Westeros only problem, it's just that nowhere else we have any insight into remembers them; Westeros barely remembers them. Has anyone outside the Nightwatch, the red priests, the wildlings and Old Nan even acknowledged them? Maybe Valeria knew all about them, but Valeria is gone. The Dothraki have done a great job of destroying anyone who might remember in that part of the world. The warlocks of Quarth might be up on them, but they're clearly huge assholes. Does Dany's shadowbinder ever allude to them?
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Aug 27, 2011 22:45
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the talent deficit posted:I don't think the Others are a Westeros only problem, it's just that nowhere else we have any insight into remembers them; Westeros barely remembers them. We also haven't run into any other place that has a frozen north.
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Aug 27, 2011 23:00
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Whenever I reread the novels, I can't help but imagine Cersei Lannister to look and act exactly like Nancy Grace.
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Aug 28, 2011 02:08
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JerkyBunion posted:We also haven't run into any other place that has a frozen north. There's Ibben which is a decent-sized island north of Braavos, but all we know about it is that (1) it's pretty cold (2) the Ibbenese are great sailors (3) the Ibbenese are extremely hairy.
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Aug 28, 2011 03:23
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NihilCredo posted:There's Ibben which is a decent-sized island... Pretty sure Westeros is the only contiguous land mass with a frozen north.
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Aug 28, 2011 03:25
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NihilCredo posted:There's Ibben which is a decent-sized island north of Braavos, but all we know about it is that (1) it's pretty cold (2) the Ibbenese are great sailors (3) the Ibbenese are extremely hairy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbrIjyxzmhM&t=20s
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Aug 28, 2011 03:27
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Oxford Comma posted:Whenever I reread the novels, I can't help but imagine Cersei Lannister to look and act exactly like Nancy Grace. Nancy Grace loving her brother was never something I wanted to think about, thanks. Nancy Grace loving anything is pretty well out of bounds.
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Aug 28, 2011 06:20
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Writing an outline and getting to its ending are two completely different things. He might have an idea where he wants to go or what he wants to do, does not mean he will remain faithful to that outline at all.
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Aug 28, 2011 21:24
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Curtis of Nigeria posted:Writing an outline and getting to its ending are two completely different things. He might have an idea where he wants to go or what he wants to do, does not mean he will remain faithful to that outline at all.
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Aug 28, 2011 22:34
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Just finished ADwD. I'm in that group that started reading around the time the HBO series was announced so I haven't been waiting 5 years between books for the last couple. I think ADwD was good but maybe somewhere on the level of ACoK in that it just sets more things up without enough resolutions to balance them. That's fine in the second book but not so much in the fifth. I wanted Dany out of Meeren and more resolution with Stannis.
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Aug 29, 2011 05:00
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xamphear posted:Enter Ye Myne Mystic World of Gayng-Raype: What the “R” Stands for in “George R.R. Martin” I hate people who write like that. Also this thread has died it's depressing. We all agree the book sucked rear end but we can't go buck wild about it like we could have in the thread that may not be mentioned, so it's just depressing and sobering that we waited so long for this, and we don't even get to go ape-poo poo about it and act all stupid to cheer each other up. Umph fucked around with this message at 10:16 on Aug 29, 2011 |
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Aug 29, 2011 10:12
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We don't all agree it sucked rear end, a number of us quite enjoyed it actually.
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Aug 29, 2011 10:24
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