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I'm not a striker but I've taken some leg kicks and only like 1 or 2 is almost crippling if you aren't used to them and miss checking it. I think a legkick KO would be very possible for the MT dude.
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Oct 27, 2011 20:12
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Sunny Side Up fucked around with this message at 03:12 on Jul 8, 2014 |
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Oct 27, 2011 20:24
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I think Muay Thai just has more weapons. You can try to argue who should have more KO power, or what flaws most fighters of a particular type have, or who has tighter technique versus longer-range... The bottom line is that boxers can use hands, and muay thai fighters can use hands, feet, knees, elbows, trips/throws, and I think (traditionally) headbutts. Two fighters of equal skill, and I think the MT should win every time.
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Oct 27, 2011 20:26
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Physical therapist told me she's pretty much sure I'll be able to take part in the competition if they allow taping! That makes me really, really happy! I won't be 100%, but at least I'll get to try a comp!
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Oct 27, 2011 20:33
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Kumo Jr. posted:I think Muay Thai just has more weapons. You can try to argue who should have more KO power, or what flaws most fighters of a particular type have, or who has tighter technique versus longer-range... I think a shark would beat an alligator
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Oct 27, 2011 20:34
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Sunny Side Up posted:Been lurking a bit, figured this was relevant to the boxing discussion. If your goal is actually to compete then do as much wrestling as you can, with a decent amount of BJJ (focusing on submission defense and positioning) and a little bit of the striking art of your choice Also do a ton of cardio and strength and conditioning since thats what decides most fights at the amateur/inexperienced level, where most people are more or less even skill-wise Also do a grappling tournament/kickboxing match or two if you havent yet before you jump into a cage fight because you need to learn to handle the adrenaline dump and performing under pressure
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Oct 27, 2011 20:38
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Kumo Jr. posted:Two fighters of equal skill, and I think the MT should win every time. We have this happen often when we have sparring nights where pure boxers and kickboxers meet in friendly sparring. Boxers are really confused when they are on the receiving end of kicks. My friend, who happens to be a good competitive boxer, had to admit he doesn't know what to do when he's kicked. No training for kicks meant also no defenses against kicks. Boxers would just stand there, receive kicks and try to close the distance until they had to quit. In Finland, when MT guys get bored of winning everything in MT tournaments, they switch to boxing. They train boxing for some time and then take the medals in every competition. The switch from MT to boxing has been really easy as striking is so similar in both arts. A switch from boxing to MT has not been successful so far.
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Oct 27, 2011 20:42
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Sunny Side Up posted:So what would you guys do in my place if your goal was to do some cagefights and really stand up to well trained guys? If you want to compete in mma the best way to become good at mma is to train mma.
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Oct 27, 2011 20:44
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Sunny Side Up fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Jul 8, 2014 |
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Oct 27, 2011 21:01
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Sunny Side Up posted:I want to do mma, but I was thinking "boxing is probably the most effective striking style and bjj is the most effective ground fighting style I should do them separately before mixing it up." Which may or may not be stupid, which is why I'm asking for advice on what and how and in what proportion. I've done both separately and together before, but I'm sperging on how to do it most effectively, now. Do mostly grappling and conditioning, with enough striking so that youre comfortable standing. The reason wrestling is important is so you can dictate where the fight goes, which is really really important at low levels because getting fights then is a total crap shoot and you could find out at the last second that your opponent is a way better striker/way bigger/better submission guy than you, and the ability to choose where the fight goes and manhandle the guy is a big deal especially when youre inexperienced and nervous It also sounds like youre overthinking it, there is no golden ratio of how much to train which art, just do whatever you are good at or have fun doing (as long as its wrestling)
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Oct 27, 2011 21:21
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Guilty posted:Yeah, it works in theory, but so many thai fights are won by the better boxer (of the two thai fighters) that it's scary how well boxers do in thai fights. If you're going by points, the boxer will probably lose, but the boxer will also more likely get a K.O. That's only cuz it's a guy who does mostly boxing techniques but is still experienced in the Muay Thai ruleset. If you've never seen a kick before, it's gonna be a painful night.
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Oct 27, 2011 21:46
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Guilty, thats garbage. The 'threat of a KO' is not in the boxers favour. Front kicks will keep the boxer away. He'll have no idea where the legs are coming from but the thai boxer will still have enough defense even if he can't punch as well. I've seen many boxers block or move to the wrong side and eat a hard switch kick to the neck or face and then one or two more on the other side to the body and crumble. I know anecdotal evidence sucks, but you're talking like the thai fighter is going to have his hands down and not push his opponent away constantly with front kicks. If the boxer rushes to close the distance and tries to get the KO and fails, well then he's in a muay thai clinch and its all over from there.
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Oct 27, 2011 22:50
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Sunny Side Up posted:I want to do mma, but I was thinking "boxing is probably the most effective striking style and bjj is the most effective ground fighting style I should do them separately before mixing it up." Which may or may not be stupid, which is why I'm asking for advice on what and how and in what proportion. I've done striking and grappling separately and together before, but I'm sperging on how to do it most effectively, now. Boxing and BJJ are different enough that you can easily keep them separate in your head while you train them.
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Oct 27, 2011 23:09
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Sunny Side Up posted:Been lurking a bit, figured this was relevant to the boxing discussion. Or use my method: Every time you don't know where your training is going, schedule an amateur fight and then watch the video to see what went wrong.
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Oct 27, 2011 23:13
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KingColliwog posted:Playing volleyball I did a set and my thumb just curled in a weird way. It was painful as gently caress. After so many years I have become very adept at taping up just about anything, and probably own about 20 different types of ankle/knee/elbow/wrist braces. At this point I only go to the doctor if I think something might be torn or broken. Otherwise I just take some time off and tape/brace the gently caress out of whatever hurts until it stops hurting. Way cheaper that way.
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Oct 28, 2011 02:25
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Thoguh posted:After so many years I have become very adept at taping up just about anything, and probably own about 20 different types of ankle/knee/elbow/wrist braces. At this point I only go to the doctor if I think something might be torn or broken. Otherwise I just take some time off and tape/brace the gently caress out of whatever hurts until it stops hurting. Way cheaper that way. I wouldn't have went to see a physical therapist if I didn't have the comp coming, but I really want to give myself the best shot possible. You know your sport is stupid when you basically know how to tape anyone of your limbs and know instantly how bad you're injured the moment it happens. But yeah, I like taping myself too. People at my club call me the mummy cause I'm quite often covered in tape. Also, seeing the doctor is free here in communist land (canada). I only pay for the physical therapist.
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Oct 28, 2011 02:57
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Two weeks into Muay Thai classes, loving loving it despite my previous aversion to all things physical, but, ugh, today the instructor busted out the jump ropes and it turns out that I have totally forgotten how to jump rope. Like, I can jump the rope maybe three times in a row before I gently caress up and trip. I was not expecting 'jumping rope' and 'holding pads perfectly still' to be the most difficult parts of this class...
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Oct 28, 2011 02:58
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It'll take a while, but eventually you'll be jumping a coupla inches and just whipping that rope under the balls of your feet.
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Oct 28, 2011 03:00
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showbiz_liz posted:Two weeks into Muay Thai classes, loving loving it despite my previous aversion to all things physical, but, ugh, today the instructor busted out the jump ropes and it turns out that I have totally forgotten how to jump rope. Like, I can jump the rope maybe three times in a row before I gently caress up and trip. I was not expecting 'jumping rope' and 'holding pads perfectly still' to be the most difficult parts of this class... The best part of BJJ class is watching dudes who know how to render a man unconscious, destroy limbs, explode knees, etc. be unable to perform a cartwheel.
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Oct 28, 2011 03:03
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showbiz_liz posted:Two weeks into Muay Thai classes, loving loving it despite my previous aversion to all things physical, but, ugh, today the instructor busted out the jump ropes and it turns out that I have totally forgotten how to jump rope. Like, I can jump the rope maybe three times in a row before I gently caress up and trip. I was not expecting 'jumping rope' and 'holding pads perfectly still' to be the most difficult parts of this class... i was lucky, i was able to jump rope but my problem was that my calves got shooting pain from the stress of hopping repeatedly on the balls of my feet. after about a month of strengthening my lower legs the pain vanished
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Oct 28, 2011 03:03
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Oh yeah, from watching it on TUF 14 last night, I decided I should really try the same-side leg reap in sparring. I got it to work, just not pretty. It was still pretty cool, though.
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Oct 28, 2011 03:19
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I just received my new Judogi, it's a Gill Sports (Nicolas Gill brand) and it's awesome. This thing is thick and basically impossible to grip! It's quite heavy and warm though, but I don't really mind. I'm really happy with my choice and would recommend them to anyone who does judo. From what I've seen/heard they are pretty much the best bang for the buck when it comes to competition judogis. I find them much harder to grip than all the other brands I had the chance to experience (addidas, gill sport, mizuno, white tiger, jukado) -- There were very few people at judo tonight (only 5) and two of us were injured and couldn't do randori. I had planned this so I brought my camera and took a few pictures. Thought I'd share a few with you guys, if only to give you an idea of how our dojo is set up. We have two full fight surface and walls covered with wrestling mats.  IMG_1352 by king colliwog, on Flickr  IMG_1338-Edit by king colliwog, on Flickr  IMG_1334 by king colliwog, on Flickr  IMG_1360 by king colliwog, on Flickr KingColliwog fucked around with this message at 04:28 on Oct 28, 2011 |
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Oct 28, 2011 04:14
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Today in mma we did a drill where for three minutes we go between mount, knee on belly, side control, and north south punching and elbowing and kneeing a 100 lb bag while someone else tries to pull or push us off of it. It felt like when the principal had to break up fights in middle school.
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Oct 28, 2011 04:32
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I'm jealous of your mat area. We used to have a huge area but got relegated to a much smaller room about a year ago.
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Oct 28, 2011 04:33
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kimbo305 posted:Oh yeah, from watching it on TUF 14 last night, I decided I should really try the same-side leg reap in sparring. I got it to work, just not pretty. It was still pretty cool, though. Ko Soto Gari is what its called if you feel like looking up more videos of it. I personally have more success with Ko Soto Gake (very similar, but blocking the leg rather than reaping it), especially later in the day of a long tournament when guys are getting tired.
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Oct 28, 2011 04:35
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Thoguh posted:Ko Soto Gari is what its called if you feel like looking up more videos of it. I personally have more success with Ko Soto Gake (very similar, but blocking the leg rather than reaping it), especially later in the day of a long tournament when guys are getting tired. I'll try it. To get that kind of pulling with gloves on, I'd probably want to modify the grip into an arm drag, which I actually do all the time to initiate clinches. The Ko Soto Gari only needs a push, which makes it easier to set up.
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Oct 28, 2011 04:40
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Sunny Side Up posted:Been lurking a bit, figured this was relevant to the boxing discussion. I know a lot of people talked about Muay Thai vs Boxing and Wrestling vs BJJ, but the real answer is this: find a good school(s) in your area and pick at least one of boxing and muay thai (or certain kinds of karate) and one of BJJ, Wrestling, Sambo or Judo. Make sure that whatever you train in is designed for MMA (MMA boxing needs to teach kick defense, MMA wrestling needs to be aware of submissions, MMA judo needs to take off the gi and probably isn't going to exist in your area) and after that just base things on how good the gym is. This is probably going to be BJJ + Boxing because legitimate boxing gyms are pretty easy to find and it's hard to find non-scholastic wrestling, but whatever's good in your area especially at the beginner level.
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Oct 28, 2011 05:43
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I don't get it, why wouldn't he just train mma
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Oct 28, 2011 05:49
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niethan posted:I don't get it, why wouldn't he just train mma This seems like a misnomer. Am I mistaken, or don't most (all?) successful MMA fighters have strong backgrounds in specific disciplines? Wrestling/BJJ seems to be incredibly common. Just jumping in and trying to learn everything seems inefficient.
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Oct 28, 2011 06:14
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niethan posted:I don't get it, why wouldn't he just train mma If you can train at an MMA gym train at an MMA gym, but a lot of places either don't have one, have a lovely one or don't have one within a reasonable driving distance. The city I'm in has an "MMA gym" that's really a TKD place that has a BJJ purple belt, a boxing gym run by a former pro who had a legitimate career ten years ago and knows what he's doing and a BJJ place run by a Black Belt who has a reasonably good competitive record. The MMA scene around here isn't that developed but the people who do well train BJJ and Boxing because that's what is good in the area. I imagine it's different if you live in a major city and you can choose from a dozen different legitimate MMA schools, but in a lot of places you're better off finding individual gyms that are good than trying for an overall gym. The problem is that MMA is kind of a buzzword right now so you can find schools selling it that are just cashing in on the name. swmmrmanshen posted:This seems like a misnomer. Am I mistaken, or don't most (all?) successful MMA fighters have strong backgrounds in specific disciplines? Wrestling/BJJ seems to be incredibly common. From talking to amateurs, one of the big things at the lower levels is not having a huge blind spot. If you fight like it's UFC 1 someone will pull a Gracie on you. Basically, there's a few basic things like sprawling, blocking kicks, defending against submissions etc that everyone needs to know. This is all second hand since the closest I get is training BJJ with people that do amateur MMA. NovemberMike fucked around with this message at 06:45 on Oct 28, 2011 |
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Oct 28, 2011 06:17
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TheStampede posted:I train with my brother, so our sparring matches tend to devolve into these sort of affairs. Our couch just shakes his head and ignores us. Haha I can imagine, tbh in Savate Defensé classes (which I attend not nearly often enough) technique and light sparring often devolves into grappling and rolling and just general anything-goes between friends, especially if both have taken BJJ lessons at some point  The instructors just let people they know go on with it. Enthusiasm is good!
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Oct 28, 2011 10:27
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Sunny Side Up fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Jul 8, 2014 |
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Oct 28, 2011 14:16
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Nierbo posted:Guilty, thats garbage. The 'threat of a KO' is not in the boxers favour. Front kicks will keep the boxer away. He'll have no idea where the legs are coming from but the thai boxer will still have enough defense even if he can't punch as well. The reason why boxers usually do well in Muay Thai is because Thai fighters have a tendency to drop guard, and the traditional thai block is basically a death sentence when looking at upper cuts, z.B. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQvvVowW2HA&feature=youtu.be The other reason why is because decent boxers are a LOT more agile and mobile from traditional thai fighters. Look at these guys stalking each other across the ring taking baby steps. A good, decent, strong kick requires a lot of stability and set up, and a mobile boxer isn't going to give the thai fighter that much time to set something up. Throwing kicks randomly also isn't going to do much against a boxer, since a lot of the power from thai kicks comes from precise execution. If you can cut down the mobility by landing a lot of low kicks on the boxer, great. But a lot of kicks need to be set up through good boxing in order to land correctly and effectively. I never claimed that boxing is definitively better than muay thai by all means. Why would I? I fight muay thai myself. All I said is that it's scary how good boxers are in a thai match, and that a boxer in a thai match tends to fare better than a thai fighter in a boxing match.
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Oct 28, 2011 14:29
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Sunny Side Up posted:This is pretty much it, and I really appreciate the advice. You threw out a few things that I'm familiar with to a degree, but what else would you put on the list of "things everyone should know?" If your goal is MMA I wouldn't necessarly recommend Judo. It's what I do and I think it's great, but unless it's specifically "judo for MMA" I think you'd be served better with sambo, wrestling or bjj. Judo would still be useful and even in no gi I can throw the BJJ guys without too much hassle, but in an MMA setting I don't think the rules are good for judo. The ground will absorb all the impact of throws, no clothes on, throws only give points, until you're pretty good you might not end up in a dominant position after a throw, etc.
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Oct 28, 2011 14:34
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KingColliwog posted:I just received my new Judogi, it's a Gill Sports (Nicolas Gill brand) and it's awesome. This thing is thick and basically impossible to grip! It's quite heavy and warm though, but I don't really mind. I'm really happy with my choice and would recommend them to anyone who does judo. From what I've seen/heard they are pretty much the best bang for the buck when it comes to competition judogis. I find them much harder to grip than all the other brands I had the chance to experience (addidas, gill sport, mizuno, white tiger, jukado) Awesome, thanks for the gi recommendation - it's hard to find a good one in Canada without having to pay extra for shipping from the US. I want to buy another gi and I'm up for trying this one. Which one did you get - the beginner or the competition? Btw, great pics in your flickr album - Malajube is awesome! And yeah, I'm also jealous of your mat space. We only have space for 1 randori at a time with everyone circled around like a fight club.
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Oct 28, 2011 14:37
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Guilty posted:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQvvVowW2HA&feature=youtu.be Nice uppercut pummeling  Has to be my favouritest punch anyway. When it hits it hits. Which reminds me the current basic courses are done and I more or less failed to teach a group how to throw one  Granted it's the most difficult boxing punch for most people to get a hang of, and it's wishful thinking 2.5 months or so would learn a person with experience in watching television or aerobic to throw a good one, but to even grasp the basic mechanics of this short and quick strike. Better luck next time! I might be a secondary teacher for one of the upcoming fitness boxing classes. Fitness boxers often aren't that interested in beautiful or even semi-good technique though. They mostly want a good cardio workout and some anaerobic exercises now and then and get frustrated if you try to explain too much about this "boxing" thing because they like the "fitness" part more.
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Oct 28, 2011 14:43
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Bangkero posted:Awesome, thanks for the gi recommendation - it's hard to find a good one in Canada without having to pay extra for shipping from the US. I want to buy another gi and I'm up for trying this one. Which one did you get - the beginner or the competition? Btw, great pics in your flickr album - Malajube is awesome! yeah, we do have a nice space. We can have something like 5+ randori going on at the same time (just need to make sure you don't throw someone on someone else's head...) if we're cautious. I bought the competition gi, I don't know how the regular one compares. The thing is really thick it's almost stupid. It's just so hard to get a good grip on the lapels and the back is basically like plywood. I'm in Quebec and shipping was 10$ for two gi's (I bought one for a friend too). Received the thing in 2 days from Montreal. Also "only" 150$ or 160$ depending on the size you need. Oh and  take a judogi ~10cm smaller than your actual height. Actually, just contact them and tell them your height and weight and which size you should buy. That's what I did and I'm something like 173cm tall and the 165 they told me I should get fits me perfectly.Thanks for the comments on the pics. Yeah malajube is great, and getting in their show for free with authorization to take picture was a blast! I wish my friend who was writing for some online blog about music would come back here so I could get into more shows with my camera. KingColliwog fucked around with this message at 15:37 on Oct 28, 2011 |
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Oct 28, 2011 15:32
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Do any Virginia/MD goons have an opinion on Olympia Boxing in Falls Church, VA? http://www.olympiaboxing.com/index.html I am thinking of doing their $55 2-day tryout, just wanted to see if I could gather any opinions from here.
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Oct 28, 2011 16:51
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That seems pretty bad value/money. Guilty, I believe you're confusing boxers that have crosstrained in MT with pure boxers. A boxer that isn't used to kicks looks lost. Bonjasky/Mercer is a hilarious example.
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Oct 28, 2011 18:47
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Sunny Side Up posted:This is pretty much it, and I really appreciate the advice. You threw out a few things that I'm familiar with to a degree, but what else would you put on the list of "things everyone should know?" Again, I don't do MMA and I'm just coming from what I've talked about with people I train with who do MMA, but what I've generally heard is that you need to be competent in the standup, clinch, ground game and submissions or you need to be able to move out of any position you are bad in. Boxing + BJJ can have the problem that you don't have training in the clinch and you don't have training in moving out of it. Boxing + Wrestling or Muay Thai + BJJ don't have that problem, and neither does Boxing + BJJ + specific training in the clinch. quote:In this vein, I didn't think about how a boxer's ducking would get them kicked in the face because I typically block my face and raise my legs/lower my elbows to defend against kicks. Like this and like how wrestling has you expose your back a bunch, are there any really glaring pitfalls to watch out for in any of BJJ, Wrestling, Sambo, Judo, Muay Thai, and boxing that immediately come to mind? I always think in terms of what I want to repeat a thousand times instead of what I want to avoid. Just look at the rules for each system and it's pretty obvious where the deficiencies lie. Sambo doesn't allow chokeholds IIRC, Boxing doesn't allow fighting from the clinch, BJJ deemphasizes the takedown, Judo relies on pajamas and doesn't allow a bunch of joint locks or takedowns using the legs, wrestling doesn't allow submissions and all grappling bars strikes. If you are planning on fighting MMA then you will need to do at least some MMA integration training under an MMA rule set to work these little differences out. The biggest thing though is going to be physical fitness. Chances are that your opponent isn't going to be some master who is really going to test your preparation in each of 20 different areas and is instead going to be some retard that gasses out in three minutes and opens himself up to whatever you want to do. Cardio is probably the best thing for you at the amateur level.
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Oct 28, 2011 18:55
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