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Dolash posted:The universe stuff in particular I'm confused about. If anyone could help explain/explain that we don't know yet? Imagine you've got a video tape (remember those?) of the movie Armageddon starring Bruce Willis and Ben Affleck. You can watch it, rewind it, fastforward it and pick any moment in the movie to watch since you're not on the tape. Say your dog chews up the tape. It still plays but the last half hour of the movie is destroyed. You can still watch the movie up until then though! However, I notice that Weekend at Bernie's starring Terry Kiser is on and want to record it. I don't have any blank tapes so I tape over Armageddon with it. The last half hour of Weekend at Bernie's will still cut out since the external damage to the tape is still there. Same tape, it just had different movies on it at different moments in time from an external viewpoint. Universes work the same way.
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Nov 3, 2011 03:35
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Zoolooman posted:The yard allows us to see both walls instead of having them smashed together. It also gives us a nice name for the mechanism used to bridge realities. It would also send them out the second window at an angle. Not sure if that'll be significant, though.
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Nov 3, 2011 03:36
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Level Slide posted:A part of me believes that the players in the kids' newly recycled universe are going to round out the remaining god tier positions. If there are any left. Are there any left? There's the twelve we know about (the kids and four of the trolls share positions), and as far as I know Andrew hasn't hinted at there being more than that.
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Nov 3, 2011 03:38
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Dolash posted:words The Troll and Kid's universes weren't destroyed by the bomb, they were destroyed by Sn0wman's death and Jack's Red Miles respectively. Their mass was used as fuel by the bomb (somehow) to create the Green Sun. John scratching the session would result in a reset universe, and presumably did. But how this interacts with Jack 'simultaneously' destroying the universe frog we don't know. Maybe there are two frogs now, maybe the new frog will also be destroyed, maybe maybe maybe we don't know. Jade's frog had nothing to do with the Scratch, it was the completion of one of Sburb's 'goals', the others being killing the black king/queen, confronting the denizens, ultimate alchemy, etc. There's been some allusions to Jade using her frog in the new session, although it falling into the lava may change those plans. We don't know how though. We don't really know how the reset session interacts with the old session. The best I can think of is that Paradox Space/the Furthest Ring are kind of weird regarding time and space so the 'same' universe can exist in two different place-times I guess. Once again we don't know if LE/DS will be in the post-Scratch universe. Personally I think LE will, and likely DS or an analogue but no way of knowing right now. I still have no idea what the deal with the Exiles is.
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Nov 3, 2011 03:46
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Lord English just wants to repay his debts and overcome his crippling depression, he is defeated when Terezi gives him all of Dave's boondollars and John gives him a hug. Or not.
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Nov 3, 2011 04:04
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Plom Bar posted:When the screen goes all Pool Balls in the beginning, there appears to be a pattern of where the unchanging 8-balls go. http://i.imgur.com/LSVZm.png http://i.imgur.com/39p41.png From these screenshots you can see that there are some static 8-balls, and by chance i got some of the random-changing balls as 8-balls.
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Nov 3, 2011 04:49
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Someone had previously mentioned possible foreshadowing on Jade becoming a dog, but I found a page that hints at it even more strongly
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Nov 3, 2011 05:17
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A Spider posted:Sadly, it would be very difficult without official Word of God confirmation that it is braille. That definitely doesn't look like braile. Too many lines. But something deep inside me can't not believe that the placement of the eight balls has to mean something
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Nov 3, 2011 05:23
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Mazerunner posted:I still have no idea what the deal with the Exiles is. The Exiles are survivors from Incipisphere that travel to the ruined world of the Session's players by the means of meteorites and Skaia's defences. Just like kids, but much much later. They rebuild civilization, and offer guidance to the players of the Session, by the means of those stations, which were also delivered via meteorites. That's why Spades Slick has "You made this town what it is after all. Wasn't nothin' but a bunch of dust and rocks before you got here." On a different note, I don't understand the 8-player session's existence. By what little logic the game has shown, it is not the one created by Jade. There is a strong implication that the Session that created the Trolls had 48 players, because Karkat mentioned that they created the 12 constellations above earth, while had 48 above theirs. 48 -> 12 -> 4 48/4 -> 12/3 -> 4 (/2?) It's a countdown. The game gets more and more efficient. There are less players, and less time before Reckoning. Logically, the session Jade creates has two players, Knight/Seer of Time/Space, 214 is the significant number, and most likely the code that creates the First Guardian is fit on a single punch card and the Guardian itself is not even an animal anymore.
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Nov 3, 2011 05:25
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Protozoan first guardian?
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Nov 3, 2011 05:30
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Gizmotinker posted:On a different note, I don't understand the 8-player session's existence. By what little logic the game has shown, it is not the one created by Jade. ... Though parallels with the Trolls' session might not work out so well, as we don't have the same issues with the ectobiological birth of the players in a parallel universe. That is, post-Scratch Earth won't necessarily have any versions of the kids or guardians, as the only reason the Trolls universe had versions of themselves them in both is that Karkat made them all post-scratch. Somehow.
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Nov 3, 2011 05:35
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Gizmotinker posted:The Exiles are survivors from Incipisphere that travel to the ruined world of the Session's players by the means of meteorites and Skaia's defences. Just like kids, but much much later. Nah, I get what they've done mechanically, what I don't get is what Hussie's doing with them, I guess. Like White King is going to come out of the time capsule; everyone's all oooh what's going to happen? And he dies ten seconds later. Or WV's daring dream about donning the ring; everyone thinks he'll be the one to confront Jack. Nnnnnope hand through gut and PM's the one who wears the ring. And WQ telling AR to blow up the bases; everyone thinks it's some big cunning plan that will be just so amazing and critical. No, it's to try to stop Jack from doing something he's temporally fated to do, and so they fail miserably. [S]Cascade really just threw the Exiles a massive curveball that really makes it hard to speculate on what's going to happen with them. (And by them I mean the remaining two now,  )
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Nov 3, 2011 05:38
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Man, why did I bother checking MSPA today? Act 6 doesn't start until the 11th and...oh hey an intermission? Probably a recap page or something. ...  
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Nov 3, 2011 05:45
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To get off the Lord English topic for a moment, I've been thinking about the rebooted session that John and Jade are (presumably) headed for. (Off-topic: Assuming the window they exit out of it is still normal sized, they will probably be flying around in a very tiny battleship until Jade chooses to upscale them. That should be fun.) I'm thinking about how we presume everything will be 'same but different' for this new cast. Guardians and Kids switch places, that sort of thing. ...so in this 'same but different' session, who is going to be bothering the new kids? It's probably not going to be the trolls, since they're either dead or otherwise occupied for now. I'm wondering if it's going to John and Jade "trolling" the guardian-kids. Think about if someone claiming to be your dead grandfather or grandmother from an alternate reality messaged you out of the blue one day and tried to strike up a conversation. And talked about nothing but world-dooming video games. Yeah. Thundarr posted:^^^ God-tier Karkat will shooshpap Lord English into oblivion. It is his destiny. ...he's going to have a Friendship Aneurysm?
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Nov 3, 2011 06:04
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Bobulus posted:...so in this 'same but different' session, who is going to be bothering the new kids? It's probably not going to be the trolls, since they're either dead or otherwise occupied for now. Who says anyone has to be bothering them? While the trolls were a useful device for providing information the kids wouldn't have otherwise had, and interesting characters, there's nothing to suggest that communications like that are in any way a normal feature of the game.
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Nov 3, 2011 06:07
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Eiba posted:I don't think it was necessarily 8 players, but 8 planets. Post-scrach Earth, if it follows the Troll's pattern, will have the four guardians as kids (and versions of the kids as guardians? Who knows). Into this session, Jade will drop off the kid's current 4 planets (and their battlefield), resulting in 8 planets total. Eiba posted:... Though parallels with the Trolls' session might not work out so well 10 Have Doc Scratch in Current Session mold the players to succeed, but still gently caress up the New Session 20 When the players in New Session fail, offer a solution that would involve the Scratch 30 Seed the New Scratched Session with those white balls, and create a new Doc Scratch in the New Scratched Session 40 Become Lord English 50 OM NOM NOM 60 GOTO 10 Bobulus posted:...so in this 'same but different' session, who is going to be bothering the new kids? It's probably not going to be the trolls, since they're either dead or otherwise occupied for now. What I'm saying is that that's where the letter to Jade claiming to be from her grandkid came from, also, there is a new Doc Scratch there.
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Nov 3, 2011 06:18
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FrozenGoldfishGod posted:Who says anyone has to be bothering them? While the trolls were a useful device for providing information the kids wouldn't have otherwise had, and interesting characters, there's nothing to suggest that communications like that are in any way a normal feature of the game. Nothing says that anyone has to be bothering them, but: a) Hussie is all about patterns and circumstantial symmetry and stuff. If the original four kids were constantly being trolled, it's pretty likely that the rebooted versions will be, too, just in a different way. b) If no one talks to the new kids, how are they going to get involved in the story? I'm assuming, of course, that if we do start the next chapter from the perspective of the new kids, that it'll start from Day 1, like the comic did.
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Nov 3, 2011 06:18
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Bobulus posted:(Off-topic: Assuming the window they exit out of it is still normal sized, they will probably be flying around in a very tiny battleship until Jade chooses to upscale them. That should be fun.) Act 6 will open with reset-session Jack chasing the battleship around his office, set to Wacky Antics.
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Nov 3, 2011 06:18
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Hanks Lust Cafe posted:
Lord Engrish!
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Nov 3, 2011 06:26
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The best part is going to be John being literally a God in this new universe and being too derpy to act the part of deity.
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Nov 3, 2011 06:29
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Captain Oblivious posted:The best part is going to be John being literally a God in this new universe and being too derpy to act the part of deity. Friend-God 
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Nov 3, 2011 06:40
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Cyrai posted:Someone had previously mentioned possible foreshadowing on Jade becoming a dog, but I found a page that hints at it even more strongly Her becoming a dog is a joke on how she's basically a furry. That's the joke. It's not foreshadowing: it's a humorous thing that Hussie made happen because it is funny. You're arguing that "a joke happening" and a character trait being called back to in a future joke on it is foreshadowing, which is dumb. KoB posted:Friend-God Good God, Best Friend. e: the God Tiers all come to reside on "Mount Brolympus" and hug bumpeth eternally and verily with their chosen people. And it is Good. Zorak fucked around with this message at 06:44 on Nov 3, 2011 |
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Nov 3, 2011 06:40
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Bobulus posted:Nothing says that anyone has to be bothering them, but: Don't you think it's a little late to be introducing new characters? I mean, we'll definitely see the guardians as kids (except maybe Dad, who I think will be exactly the same due to how mundane his creation was; remember, Nanna was technically John's "guardian" as far as the ectobiology babies are concerned), but I don't think they'll be hugely important in the grand scheme of things.
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Nov 3, 2011 06:45
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FrozenGoldfishGod posted:Who says anyone has to be bothering them? While the trolls were a useful device for providing information the kids wouldn't have otherwise had, and interesting characters, there's nothing to suggest that communications like that are in any way a normal feature of the game. What terribly crazy people programmed Trollian/Pesterchum anyway? Someone sat down and said "Y'know, this program is pretty cool, but what if you need a group chat with people from another dimension in the future?"
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Nov 3, 2011 06:49
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YggiDee posted:What terribly crazy people programmed Trollian/Pesterchum anyway? Someone sat down and said "Y'know, this program is pretty cool, but what if you need a group chat with people from another dimension in the future?" Either Sollux or people who were manipulated into making it by scratch so it would be available to the trolls to exert influence on the kids. Also maybe frog temple tech.
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Nov 3, 2011 06:59
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It doesn't need to be coded by anyway. The code can simply -exist-, and be leaked to various timelines by manipulation/ meteor drops from Skaia. That's the thing: if you have a loop that sustains itself by giving the technology to people that results in them creating the system that gives them the technology in the first place, no one has to create the technology at all. It simply always exists. Trollian/ Pesterchum are probably clients adapted from Skaian tech in some way parallel to each other.
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Nov 3, 2011 07:05
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Mazerunner posted:Nah, I get what they've done mechanically, what I don't get is what Hussie's doing with them, I guess. Remember WV was initially introduced solely as an in-story way of getting rid of player commands. Or maybe you weren't reading it yet at that point in which, ok, that's why he was introduced. Hussie was getting tired of that mechanic and wanted to get rid of it (John's message box has been destroyed). And then he brought it back in. And then got rid of it permanently. So the Exiles were only brought in to deal with a mechanic that doesn't even exist anymore, and they likely didn't have any grand character arc. To be honest I don't think he really knows what to do with them. Or, he didn't. He's really good at dealing with unexpected story elements and tying them into a larger narrative. He probably came up with something for them to do awhile ago, but is still having some trouble tying them in. PM is obviously important now, and I'm really hoping WV isn't dead here (I like the idea of him getting Jack's ring). Who knows where they go from there, but having two death-angels on the kids' side wouldn't be bad (the Exiles have been shown to care for the kids, so they'd probably team up.) As for WQ, WK, and their plans to blow up the stations... I don't know, maybe a red herring? I think the reason the kid's exiles' story arc is less satisfying than the others is because they were always sorta shoe-horned in and unexpected, and so Hussie never fully knew what to do with them.
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Nov 3, 2011 07:09
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Gizmotinker posted:On a different note, I don't understand the 8-player session's existence. By what little logic the game has shown, it is not the one created by Jade. I had always assumed it just happened to be one of the many other sessions of Sburb around the planet. Each player chain has its own incisisphere and session, and I'd assume that more than one group of people played the game
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Nov 3, 2011 07:11
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Did we see torllian's transtime features before they entered the medium?
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Nov 3, 2011 07:13
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Zorak posted:It doesn't need to be coded by anyway. The code can simply -exist-, and be leaked to various timelines by manipulation/ meteor drops from Skaia. Ahhh, probably. I'm just endlessly amused at the idea of some CEO requesting increasingly insane Pesterchum features, and the programmers delivering in some sort of bizarre one-upmanship.
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Nov 3, 2011 07:19
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Starmaker posted:Remember WV was initially introduced solely as an in-story way of getting rid of player commands. Or maybe you weren't reading it yet at that point in which, ok, that's why he was introduced. Hussie was getting tired of that mechanic and wanted to get rid of it (John's message box has been destroyed). And then he brought it back in. And then got rid of it permanently. So the Exiles were only brought in to deal with a mechanic that doesn't even exist anymore, and they likely didn't have any grand character arc. Oh, I didn't know that. Makes sense though. But yeah, I completely agree with you- with the other characters and plotlines you can generally have a rough idea of what's coming (with the occasional twist). After the Exiles got their timeloops completed though they kind of stopped being connected to the greater story, and it's harder to connect when you really have no idea what their future is.
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Nov 3, 2011 07:40
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Anyone have a link to the current avatar repository?
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Nov 3, 2011 07:51
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A thought occurred to me re: the post-Scratch universe and trolls and "whose frog is it anyway" and whatnot. First remember that duality is a Big Thing in Homestuck. Then consider how Scratch described a certain thing: http://www.mspaintadventures.com/scratch.php?s=6&p=005953 quote:On the eve of their race's extinction, the twelve heroes would begin playing a game. They would make an admirable effort, but they would fail. Their civilization had not prepared them for the rigors of this game, and the ultimate reward would fall shy of their grasp. Note the wording and remember that Scratch doesn't lie directly. The ultimate reward fell shy of their grasp. Nowhere in here does it say they failed to create a frog; simply that, rather like the trolls we know, something prevented them from reaching the final reward of entering their universe, though presumably rather earlier than the final-millisecond denial the trolls suffered (when they were, as per the agreement, grasping victory). Granted, it doesn't directly say the ancestors created a frog in their session, either, but we know how Scratch likes to be vague. This means there could indeed be a spare universe-frog and accompanying session for the kids to jump to. The one the ancestors created. Which could very well mean the Kid ancestors and the Troll ancestors somehow muck around with or at least influence their sessions. It would be the final part of the mobius loop. All the sessions are born of one another - the Troll ancestors create both their Scratch and the Kid ancestor's universe, and the trolls we know create the kids who then loop back. Either way I cannot loving wait for the 11th.
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Nov 3, 2011 08:03
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After careful thought, I'm calling it. Lord English isn't going to die to any of the kids, trolls, or even the post-scratch guardians. He will meet his fate at the hands (err, claws) of the SORD..... wielding crocodile still living on the currently shrunken Land of Heat and Clockwork. Defeatable only by glitches indeed.
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Nov 3, 2011 08:18
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Eiba posted:... Though parallels with the Trolls' session might not work out so well, as we don't have the same issues with the ectobiological birth of the players in a parallel universe. That is, post-Scratch Earth won't necessarily have any versions of the kids or guardians, as the only reason the Trolls universe had versions of themselves them in both is that Karkat made them all post-scratch. Somehow. Except the trolls made in the post-scratch session all have complete timlines/lives within it and the post scratch universe, they didn't take a few years out to be their pre-scratch selves or anything. The pre-scratch troll session is one of the few honest to god paradoxes in this whole story, since they were never created despite obviously existing in a finite capacity. If "the session in which they were spawned" was the post-scratch one, there would have to be another 24 grubs made at some point, because even though they share genetic code with 'our' 24, they are not physically the same ones, having lived different lives. They still have no obvious origin, even now, and that's kind of the point: if this was an acceptable stable paradox like all of those ontological loops, it would be fine, there'd be no real problem and this whole thing would be just another quirk of the game. The implication however is that as it was part of a "glitch", an unintended event and a signifier something is properly broken here, we're not dealing with regular time poo poo, and that LE as the indirect cause of this is not a guy to be taken lightly. tl;dr: stop trying to figure out the existence of the pre-scratch trolls, that their existence is impossible is sort of the point.
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Nov 3, 2011 10:46
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Factory Factory posted:One thing I've been wondering is, why the yellow yard? The Yellow Yard was, in my mind, Hussie very elegantly giving the finger to those fans who whined about his self insert. Remember when he explained it? Remember when people kept complaining about the frequency of his self-insert and the inevitability of his interference? Those people pissed me off so much. The self-inserts were goofy little asides simply used for recaps. He never did anything or interacted with the main story in any way. But he decided he was going to, just to shut those fuckers up. I'm pretty certain those two windows were always facing each other, either directly or separated by a different amount. He moved them to being a yard apart. The result of this? "The heroes will coexist with me, the author, for the span of three feet, and while traveling very quickly, for the duration of three nanoseconds." I don't think this will have any effect on the story. I don't think LE will teleport onto their ship (he just showed us that scene for a timeframe on when LE grabbed his coat), I don't think they're going to fly around his room, I don't think it will make a single lick of difference. Why? Because Hussie only did this to troll idiots. It's a joke, and nothing more. He wouldn't have had any influence, but because of people saying he would he had three nanosecond's worth. A real amount, but so small, and so meaningless, that only sperglords could get upset by it. If this does have any actual influence on the story (the windows weren't touching, so Jade's plan wouldn't have worked, or LE jumps onto their ship whereas he otherwise couldn't have) then this would no longer be a joke. No, it'd be a prank, and no one likes to be pranked. e: explaining jokes ruins them Starmaker fucked around with this message at 11:19 on Nov 3, 2011 |
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Nov 3, 2011 11:06
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Mazerunner posted:After the Exiles got their timeloops completed though they kind of stopped being connected to the greater story, and it's harder to connect when you really have no idea what their future is. But that's what Hussie is doing. You're right, if the exiles plans had worked out they'd have just destroyed the capsules and lived happy lives rebuilding society. Their roles in the story would effectively be over. But by killing them, their lease in the story has been all over extended. So it’s a good thing, in a round about way (if you ignore all the death that is).
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Nov 3, 2011 12:04
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Hey I have a question unconnected to Lord English stuff: Was the horse painting always on this page? I could have sworn it wasn't ... 
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Nov 3, 2011 14:41
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YggiDee posted:Ahhh, probably. I'm just endlessly amused at the idea of some CEO requesting increasingly insane Pesterchum features, and the programmers delivering in some sort of bizarre one-upmanship.
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Nov 3, 2011 14:42
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dumb brunette posted:Hey I have a question unconnected to Lord English stuff: Pretty sure it was. Hussie owns that painting in real life, and finds it hilarious because of how terrible it is.
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Nov 3, 2011 15:49
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