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So lets say I have a cumulative GPA in the 2.9-3.1 range, it would make sense for me to also put down my major GPA if it is higher right? I've heard some people say just put down your major GPA, but I don't know how reliable that is.
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Nov 11, 2011 22:49
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It's likely that if the employer cares about GPA then they will see the major GPA, think you're hiding your cumulative, and ask you about it immediately. Trust me 
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Nov 11, 2011 23:04
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No Safe Word posted:Why do you think someone's ability to do college-level work 10-13 years ago is relevant to someone who would be looking for a non-junior level position? Even if it's at an elite school, I still don't see it being nearly as relevant as your professional experience (then combined with any screening you'd have to do as part of the interview process).
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Nov 11, 2011 23:24
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csammis posted:It's likely that if the employer cares about GPA then they will see the major GPA, think you're hiding your cumulative, and ask you about it immediately. Trust me But that's easy to spin, who cares if you scraped by in Philosophy 101 if your major GPA is respectable?
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Nov 11, 2011 23:43
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Calcaneus posted:So lets say I have a cumulative GPA in the 2.9-3.1 range, it would make sense for me to also put down my major GPA if it is higher right? I've heard some people say just put down your major GPA, but I don't know how reliable that is. Depends on how closely people are reading your resume. If it's some HR peon with the thought process of "The letters GPA, followed by a large number? This goes in the "good" pile!" or equivalent software you can probably get away with it.
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Nov 11, 2011 23:46
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If they care about it and you don't have it on there, why don't they just ask?
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Nov 12, 2011 00:22
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Or you could just put on your resume that you got a 3.5 GPA but forget to mention that you went to MIT where it's on a 5 point scale.
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Nov 12, 2011 02:33
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Markov Chain Chomp posted:If they care about it and you don't have it on there, why don't they just ask?
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Nov 12, 2011 02:33
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Orzo posted:You could say this about any individual piece of information on the resume. Also, HR filters through resumes, what if yours gets filtered out because you didn't put your GPA down? Well alright.
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Nov 12, 2011 02:39
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I'm in school right now and I don't list my GPA on my resume. I've gotten offers for internships from basically every company I've applied for, and I'm applying to big names with high standards. I've had one company ask, and that company always cares about GPA, even for internal transfers by employees who've been with them for a long time.
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Nov 14, 2011 04:52
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Wouldn't it be trivial for a company to correlate GPA and success rate for new hires over a year or two, then decide to either care or not?
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Nov 14, 2011 07:08
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pokeyman posted:Wouldn't it be trivial for a company to correlate GPA and success rate for new hires over a year or two, then decide to either care or not? In a huge company, you might have a sample size of 20? Maybe 50-100 if we're talking Microsoft or Google.
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Nov 14, 2011 07:32
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In other words, nearly every company making interview/hiring decisions has no clue if it's useful to take GPA into account? I guess a related problem is figuring out how many low-GPA people you turn away would have been star performers. Does anybody have a clue when interviewing/hiring?
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Nov 14, 2011 07:46
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pokeyman posted:In other words, nearly every company making interview/hiring decisions has no clue if it's useful to take GPA into account? I think that in broad terms, it's going to be a useful metric but when zeroing in on candidates it will lose value. If someone scrapes by with a 2.2 or something, they're either going to be absolute crap or have huge motivational issues. The difference between a 3.3 and a 3.6 on the other hard is going to be marginal, especially with the curriculum issues already brought up. My perception and experience lead me to think it's mostly going to be used in these terms, with a cutoff point beyond which value needs to be demonstrated in other ways to distinguish a good candidate.
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Nov 14, 2011 07:53
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Calcaneus posted:So lets say I have a cumulative GPA in the 2.9-3.1 range, it would make sense for me to also put down my major GPA if it is higher right? I've heard some people say just put down your major GPA, but I don't know how reliable that is. My university advised this: if it's higher than a 3.0, put it down. If not, leave it out. If employers ask for it, just tell them.
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Nov 14, 2011 18:29
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There is actually some data on this in much broader terms. Cumulative GPA correlates poorly with job performance; GPA in major during the last two years is much better, but still not really good. cf. http://psycnet.apa.org/journals/apl/81/5/548/ (nb. the correlation coefficient for the naive case that's most often used was found to be .16)
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Nov 14, 2011 18:45
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Anyone know if it is possible to pick up a programming job with only an associates degree in programming? For reasons I'd rather not get into, I don't think I'll be able to go to a four year college for my bachelors (though if I can, I will). I'm okay with starting off with a lower paying job, as long as I'm working. 
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Nov 15, 2011 04:29
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It is possible to pick up a programming job if you have no degree at all. Just a little bit harder to get noticed.
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Nov 15, 2011 04:33
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Orzo posted:It is possible to pick up a programming job if you have no degree at all. Just a little bit harder to get noticed. It is a bit of a nightmare to get a job as a programmer with no experience right now - it's very easy to find a job if you already have experience, but unless you know someone you're probably going to have to work as a contractor for a couple of years. This isn't something that a B.A. or a M.S. will help with though.
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Nov 15, 2011 04:44
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hieronymus posted:This isn't something that a B.A. or a M.S. will help with though. Really? This actually makes me feel a whole lot better about my situation.
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Nov 15, 2011 04:54
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I disagree. Every senior I know in my Bachelor's CS program that has at least one decent job offer.
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Nov 15, 2011 05:03
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The (good) software industry is one of the few that realizes most of a degree is a heaping amount of bullshit that's just memorizing poo poo for exams and forgetting it forever. Real experience counts more than anything. The rest of the world hasn't figure out yet that teenagers doing good development aren't rare geniuses that they're made out to be but are able to show what they can do without the menial bullshit. So yeah, go do good things, contribute to projects, put stuff up on github or something. Most importantly finish things if you're going on your own.
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Nov 15, 2011 05:05
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NotShadowStar posted:The (good) software industry is one of the few that realizes most of a degree is a heaping amount of bullshit that's just memorizing poo poo for exams and forgetting it forever. Real experience counts more than anything. The rest of the world hasn't figure out yet that teenagers doing good development aren't rare geniuses that they're made out to be but are able to show what they can do without the menial bullshit.
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Nov 15, 2011 05:51
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It's pretty easy to get a decent job with a bachelor's in CS as long as you interview halfway decently. Associate's are sort of joke degrees, but the market seems starved for talent right now so you can probably get a decent job as long as you get some experience (internships/part-time work/your own projects/etc.) and work hard at your job search. Not having a bachelor's probably eliminates you from the running for a lot of big companies that have strict recruiting policies though, unless you have enough serious experience to overcome that bias.
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Nov 15, 2011 07:08
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Mystery Machine posted:Anyone know if it is possible to pick up a programming job with only an associates degree in programming? For reasons I'd rather not get into, I don't think I'll be able to go to a four year college for my bachelors (though if I can, I will). I'm okay with starting off with a lower paying job, as long as I'm working. I was able to without any degree. I did have 6 years of experience as a business/data analyst which certainly helped, though. I spent about a year and a half teaching myself C# and the .Net framework, working on various projects for myself during my spare time. Nothing too great, mostly just line of business type applications replicating what I was doing during my day job, just for practice. I started sending my resume out in January of this year and didn't get much response, mostly due to my lack of any hands on programming experience. I quit my job as a BA in April to focus full time on completing some of my sample projects and look for a job full time. In July I found a company creating business/data analyst type tools, and after impressing them with my code samples and passing some programming tests I was able to get my foot in the door for an in-person interview. The in-person interview consisted of them sitting me in front of a random section of their huge codebase, and asking me to explain what the method did. I passed, and got an offer a week later. I realize this position probably doesn't mirror yours, though, but I base my success on a few things. First and foremost, being able to sell myself very well, despite the lack of degree and any programming experience. I did some VBA and VB6 stuff, and have a lot of experience with requirements gathering and coordinating with developers, so I focused on that. Second, my code samples were very clean, and demonstrated a solid understanding of OOP and inheritance/interfaces/etc. Otherwise, they were extremely generic and not very flashy, but this is what my hiring manager said convinced her to give me a shot. Three, being close to a domain expert in the field of software I'm working with. In short, if you don't have a degree (and even if you do), make sure you have some very solid, documented code samples to demonstrate, and be able to clearly talk through those samples, explaining the choices you made. You don't need fancy programs or anything like that. For reference, the code sample I showed was a simple Win Forms application for calculating staffing models, connecting to a web-API.
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Nov 15, 2011 08:51
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I have been working as a programmer for over 5 years now and I don't have a degree, but I seriously doubt my ability to pick up another comparably paying job until I get one if I were to be laid off. I also work for a small company creating business-y type winform tools that generate reports and stuff like that, nothing too complicated. I'm currently on year 6/? of an electrical engineering degree and hopefully I will be finishing it up in the next 2 years.
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Nov 15, 2011 12:45
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Mystery Machine posted:Anyone know if it is possible to pick up a programming job with only an associates degree in programming? For reasons I'd rather not get into, I don't think I'll be able to go to a four year college for my bachelors (though if I can, I will). I'm okay with starting off with a lower paying job, as long as I'm working. It really just depends on what the job market is like where you are and what kind of skills you can demonstrate. I only have an associate degree and have never had any difficulty finding a job, mostly because I interview well and live in the DC metro area where the IT job market never really felt the recession. Elsewhere I hear it's pretty bad even for guys with experience and a 4 year degree. For example, my uncle who lives in Houston has a 4 year degree with several years of IT managerial experience but he got laid off nearly 2 years ago and is still out of a job. If going to a four year college is out of the question you'd probably at least be able to get your foot in the door somewhere for an entry level code monkey job with a 2 year degree. Then try and go back to school part time and earn a bachelor's.
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Nov 21, 2011 17:21
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I've been reading this thread for the past 3 days and picked up a lot of information. This thread and much of what many of you have posted has definitely inspired and further motivated me to reach my goals. I'm 24, finished up honorable military service, and on my way to college for a computer science degree. There's so much to soak up in this thread but definitely worth the the time and effort to read.
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Nov 24, 2011 01:29
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My B.S. (and first post-collegiate job) is in Chemistry, but I'm trying to jump the awful-paying chemistry research ship and follow my ~true calling~ as a developer. Is it worth mentioning on my resume that I took the first year of my university's CS courses when I was toying with the idea of changing majors? I got a 4.0 GPA in them (and actually ranked #1 in each class), but it seems almost petty to list something like three courses' worth of GPA on a resume, especially since first year CS is pretty straightforward.
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Nov 24, 2011 02:16
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To sorta rekindle an old discussion with a new twist: (how) should an intern moving into part-time go about asking for a raise? I've been working at my current company since the beginning of the summer as an intern and I'm looking into doing part time with them once I'm in school again. I've been getting conflicting suggestions from people i've asked about whether or not I should ask for more money. I've been getting paid well for an intern since starting, but I definitely feel like I'm able to get a lot more done per hour now than before, not to mention working during school is going to be a particular pain. Am I thinking too much about this? Is it kosher? Am I a bad, spoiled person for even wondering about this in the first place? I'm way more beard than suit, and this businessy politicking stuff intimidates me.
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Nov 24, 2011 02:49
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Deus Rex posted:My B.S. (and first post-collegiate job) is in Chemistry, but I'm trying to jump the awful-paying chemistry research ship and follow my ~true calling~ as a developer. Is it worth mentioning on my resume that I took the first year of my university's CS courses when I was toying with the idea of changing majors? I got a 4.0 GPA in them (and actually ranked #1 in each class), but it seems almost petty to list something like three courses' worth of GPA on a resume, especially since first year CS is pretty straightforward. I did the same thing but with Biology. Yes, definitely list them and talk up how they changed your life. I don't know about listing the GPA just for them though.
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Nov 24, 2011 03:03
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I received a degree in software engineering this year and I'm looking for an entry level job. Main problem: my CGPA is mediocre (2.7) and I'm light on experience. I have some smaller projects I could show potential employers but nothing huge; would this matter or do they just want a small sample so that they know I'm not bullshitting? Despite my GPA I'm pretty confident I know my poo poo. A couple summers ago I worked for a small credit union where I overhauled their abomination of an intranet using modern web technology. My boss there loved me but I don't think it'll be that impressive to recruiters, especially since I didn't do much with OOP. So my resume is pretty much the skills I picked up in school (OO development techniques, programming languages, blah blah blah which I'm sure everyone else would have) and my limited work experience. I've been working as a bartender at two different places during my last two years of school up until now. I'm hoping that this experience will show that I'm not a shut in who has trouble speaking with people, but I'm not sure anyone will really give a poo poo. I've included it in a very brief summary of my recent work experience at the end of my resume to show that I haven't been a complete bum while I haven't been in school. Should I emphasize it a bit more or should I leave it as is? Finally, what is the most effective way to search for jobs? I've mainly been going directly to company web sites and browsing the careers sections, but most of the jobs there have requirements of 2+ years of professional experience. Lots of the sites state that if you don't see an offering that suits your experience or skills, you can still submit a resume and they may contact you later. Anyone had luck with these or is it a waste of time?
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Nov 24, 2011 23:50
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Boy Wunder posted:Finally, what is the most effective way to search for jobs? I've mainly been going directly to company web sites and browsing the careers sections, but most of the jobs there have requirements of 2+ years of professional experience. Lots of the sites state that if you don't see an offering that suits your experience or skills, you can still submit a resume and they may contact you later. Anyone had luck with these or is it a waste of time? Stupid question, do you live in a major metro area, or a college town or something? If so, what sort of technical interests do you have? I don't live in a terribly huge city but here we have local meetups for web dev, two different mobile groups (one iOS, one Android), a .NET group, a JavaScript group, and even a functional programming group. These are things you'd either find in a big city or a college town where there are students and recent grads sticking around in town. There's one thing in common with all these groups and that is that they are crawling with people who are trying to hire. Every one of these meetings I've gone to, I've had at least one, usually more, person ask me if I wanted a new job. At most all these, the free food/beer was usually also sponsored by independent recruiters or tech staffing companies who a person there at the meeting to talk to. I would say consider searching around for any of these technical groups because they are great networking opportunities and you'll probably learn something out of it to help boost your skills too. While you might expect these meetings are full of awkward sperglords the majority of people I've met at these sorts of things are pretty cool folks.
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Nov 25, 2011 06:41
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I currently live in a very small community, unfortunately, with the nearest city about a two hour drive away. Networking is something I definitely need to improve on, though, so thanks for the suggestion.
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Nov 25, 2011 12:41
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I've still got a year 'til I graduate but I cannot find any internships or entry-level positions in my area. I did however just find a "Data Entry Admin" posting. $15/hr as a student is acceptable to me, considering the work I'd be doing. And there's probably chance to grow, I'd hope. But what I'm curious is what's a Data Entry Admin? Like, the job posting just lists 40+ WPM (lol) and other than that, it's the typical entry-level bullshit like being team oriented and goal focused. Is it just a fancy title to make you feel better about being a typing monkey?
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Nov 28, 2011 05:00
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Hopefully having "admin" in your title will help you find a better job.
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Nov 28, 2011 05:33
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That usually means it's an administrative assistant position which involves a lot of data entry as opposed to just endlessly entering handwritten forms into computers. It has nothing to do with sysadmin work.
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Nov 28, 2011 05:52
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Sab669 posted:I've still got a year 'til I graduate but I cannot find any internships or entry-level positions in my area.
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Nov 28, 2011 06:51
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Sab669 posted:I've still got a year 'til I graduate but I cannot find any internships or entry-level positions in my area. Try looking not in your area.
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Nov 28, 2011 08:18
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shrughes posted:Try looking not in your area. As you can see the text you quoted, I don't graduate until next year. I can't afford, both financially and time-wise, to commute however far away for a job and go to school. And as far as not necessarily being 100% menial typing, that would be ideal! e; I don't mean for the first half of this post to sound as snarky as it did. But yea, I have no money to my name and can't afford to start commuting a significant distance to a job, and then I'd be late for all of my classes if it's too far away. Sab669 fucked around with this message at 17:46 on Nov 28, 2011 |
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Nov 28, 2011 16:04
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