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blar posted:David Segal is making a career out of law school hatchet jobs. I love how he interviews law professors and then uses the titles of their "scholarship" to show how worthless the whole system really is. I like how one of his examples of worthless scholarship in the legal academy is a philosophy article title, written by a philosophy professor and placed in a philosophy journal (“What Is Wrong With Kamm’s and Scanlon’s Arguments Against Taurek” from The Journal of Ethics & Social Philosophy). Not saying he doesn't have some points, but that article is sloppy as gently caress.
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Nov 21, 2011 01:18
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Brian Leiter has a long rear end response to "the hatchet job on law schools"  http://leiterlawschool.typepad.com/leiter/2011/11/another-hatchet-job-on-law-schools.html
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Nov 21, 2011 02:43
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Linguica posted:Brian Leiter has a long rear end response to "the hatchet job on law schools" quote:Law schools hire people to be law teachers and scholars, and law firms hire people to be lawyers. Why is this so surprising? Even someone like me, at the 'highly theoretical' end of the scholarly spectrum, with only a bit more than a year of full-time practice experience, has often helped out lawyers and judges with problems in evidence law, a substantive law area that I've taught and thought about long enough that I can see my way through an evidence thicket that even skilled practitioners can't. I'm Brian Leiter and I'm so smart everybody look at me and listen to my opinions I am a big smartypants because I write legal philosophy law review articles that no one reads because they are intimidated even though philosophy is super important hahaha Brian Leiter is such an insufferable douchebag and I laugh (dismissively) every time I read anything he writes.
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Nov 21, 2011 05:41
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I am now a small firm lawyer, barely six months after graduation. I feel very happy and very lucky. Waiting in line for an hour to see a municipal prosecutor at 7 PM for 90 seconds still feels more like the magic of employment than a waste of time.
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Nov 21, 2011 06:05
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Tetrix posted:http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/20/business/after-law-school-associates-learn-to-be-lawyers.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1 the #1 thing I got out of this article is that I would rather drink Drano than work at Drinker Biddle edit: oops didn't see there were multiple pages quote:Consider, for instance, Contracts, a first-year staple. It is one of many that originated in the Langdell era and endures today. In it, students will typically encounter such classics as Hadley v. Baxendale, an 1854 dispute about financial damages caused by the late delivery of a crankshaft to a British miller.
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Nov 21, 2011 14:42
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Law students learn how to take out massive loans, that's a contract.
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Nov 21, 2011 15:51
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Soothing Vapors posted:the #1 thing I got out of this article is that I would rather drink Drano than work at Drinker Biddle My favorite part was where they paid them a reduced salary. My firm bills us at a reduced rate (around the price of a senior paralegal) for the first 4 months and has weekly training based on what group we're in and then monthly training we all do together. No billable expectations for first years. More importantly, no reduced salary. HiddenReplaced fucked around with this message at 18:12 on Nov 21, 2011 |
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Nov 21, 2011 16:58
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Oh drat, my Contracts professor is talking about the article now, including the part about contracts. He also wrote an angry comment.
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Nov 21, 2011 18:03
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Soothing Vapors posted:the #1 thing I got out of this article is that I would rather drink Drano than work at Drinker Biddle Four months at reduced salary, that blows. My firm does intensive 2 month training, first month is the crash-mba and the second month is your standard firm training but across all departments of the firm. After that you sink or swim. We're not doing any billing because every hour is spent studying basically, but we're also not getting reduced salary.
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Nov 21, 2011 18:19
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Besides google scholar, what are some good online sources for legal research besides westlaw and lexis?
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Nov 21, 2011 18:24
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Vander posted:Besides google scholar, what are some good online sources for legal research besides westlaw and lexis? Our bar gives us free access to: http://www.lawriter.net/ Also some people like: http://www.fastcase.com/
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Nov 21, 2011 18:29
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MoFauxHawk posted:Oh drat, my Contracts professor is talking about the article now, including the part about contracts. He also wrote an angry comment. I also had a professor that used newspaper articles and recent events to waste classroom time to go on ridiculous tirades that sometimes bordered on conspiracy theories. I guess those law review articles and AbaJournal blogging takes a mental toll.
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Nov 21, 2011 19:05
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One thing I've realized through teaching paralegal students is that they are more prepared to practice law upon graduation than attorneys are after law school. This is because we teach them how to do actual things. The article talks about how to complete a merger -- my students just turned in a assignment where they prepared those forms. There really needs to be an element of that in law schools.
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Nov 21, 2011 20:25
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At my internship last summer the 16 year old high school part-time worker had to teach me how to fill out and file forms at the courthouse.
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Nov 21, 2011 20:41
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quepasa18 posted:One thing I've realized through teaching paralegal students is that they are more prepared to practice law upon graduation than attorneys are after law school. This is because we teach them how to do actual things. The article talks about how to complete a merger -- my students just turned in a assignment where they prepared those forms. There really needs to be an element of that in law schools. Yes but can they *think like a lawyer*? (Yes, probably they can)
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Nov 21, 2011 21:28
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The thing in the box on the side about schools not teaching students about appropriate corporate response to government regulatory investigations is legit, except that Duke has a brand new class taught by a really fantastic prosecutor on just that subject, and I can't recommend it more highly.
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Nov 21, 2011 23:08
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MoFauxHawk posted:Oh drat, my Contracts professor is talking about the article now, including the part about contracts. He also wrote an angry comment. You should ask him why you're paying $35,000 a year to hear him justify his existence instead of teach you contracts.
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Nov 21, 2011 23:29
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Vander posted:Besides google scholar, what are some good online sources for legal research besides westlaw and lexis? BloombergLaw has some stuff that is nice for transactional work/study and a really slick interface. I wouldn't say it's better for anything litigation oriented.
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Nov 21, 2011 23:41
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Vander posted:Besides google scholar, what are some good online sources for legal research besides westlaw and lexis? Practical Law Company (PLC) is good for some basic practice stuff. Not nearly as in depth as Westlaw or Lexis, but generally pretty useful.
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Nov 22, 2011 00:02
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Jesus Christ, law school, that was an unbelievable amount of drama for a good-natured pie-eating contest. Killed it though, even without Direwolf at my side. Have to wash my pants though.
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Nov 22, 2011 00:25
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Didn't get that clerkship I interviewed for. Back to square one. God I hope I figure something out by graduation.
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Nov 22, 2011 01:18
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Just got laid off, no severance. 
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Nov 22, 2011 02:56
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Roger_Mudd posted:Just got laid off, no severance.
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Nov 22, 2011 03:04
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Roger_Mudd posted:Just got laid off, no severance. That loving sucks, man.
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Nov 22, 2011 03:36
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sigmachiev posted:Where are my CA bar takers and when do you light the blunt? Not today, that's for sure. Any study aid suggestions or tips for repeat takers? I didn't see anything in the OP.
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Nov 22, 2011 07:04
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This page got depressing fast. 
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Nov 22, 2011 07:09
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LASTCAR posted:Not today, that's for sure. What did you do to study the first time? I like this article, even though it is a disbarment http://www.calbarjournal.com/November2011/TopHeadlines/TH2.aspx nm fucked around with this message at 07:15 on Nov 22, 2011 |
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Nov 22, 2011 07:10
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nm posted:The CA bar is really hard, unlike most other bars, and a number of well known lawyers have failed the first time. It's reassuring to hear that, but my family's devastated. Dad's a sole practitioner. I didn't put in enough time. Bad, bad news. I used BARBRI. There's extra questions left, but I need a helluva lot more than that. Especially MBEs.
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Nov 22, 2011 07:15
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I used a flashcard memory program http://ankisrs.net/ to study for two bars and it was a big help. I have a file of, like, 1300 California bar flashcards I could send to you if you want to PM me or something.
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Nov 22, 2011 07:32
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LASTCAR posted:It's reassuring to hear that, but my family's devastated. Dad's a sole practitioner. I didn't put in enough time. Bad, bad news. You might even just luck out, the mix of essay prompts might be better for you next time. The key is to not get too down, that is why people fail the second time.
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Nov 22, 2011 07:33
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nm posted:If you don't mind sharing, what was your raw score (Not sure you get that yet.) I'd analyze that to see where you're losing points. At this point it will all be about perfecting the rough edges, especially is you get close. That's good advice. I'm trying to get out of this funk as quickly as possible. Written: 585.0 MBE: 92 Total Scaled Score: 1290.4775 And thank you, too, Linguica; I'll drop you a PM next.
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Nov 22, 2011 07:43
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92 is your base score, not your scaled score, right? The new scaling, I can't find, but based on Feb 2011 scaling, that is worth 401 point of your score. The maximum points you can get is 700 on the MBE (35% of 2000 points). 92 isn't a terrible score, I'd focus on the essays. The good news is that essays are full of extra points
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Nov 22, 2011 08:08
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Do any of you remember that news story RE that notorious Law Firm specializing in foreclosures where a bunch of employee's dressed as homeless people for the halloween party and had mocking signs? http://tpmmuckraker.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/11/homeless_halloween_firm_goes_under.php It just went under. I can taste the irony and it is delicious
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Nov 22, 2011 08:08
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Lemonus posted:Do any of you remember that news story RE that notorious Law Firm specializing in foreclosures where a bunch of employee's dressed as homeless people for the halloween party and had mocking signs? Is the irony that you're scorning and feeling superior to people for making fun of homeless people while at same time you're laughing at 89 people, including support staff, losing their jobs? Nah I'm just kidding, it's kind of funny and that firm seemed pretty rotten to the core. Also gently caress graded memos.
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Nov 22, 2011 08:47
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After writing a Note and a few other papers this semester, outlining is a joke. Going to eat the poo poo out of some turkey this holiday because catching up on class review ain't a problem. Also, belated thanks for all the input regarding Secured Transactions.
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Nov 22, 2011 13:22
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I'm pretty sure this guy wants to go into radiology, so at least he will never interact with a patient.Totally Negro posted:I've said it before and I'll say it again: I wish I could have been a doc 30 years ago. Old boys club (no women allowed), could get away with anything on the wards, tons of medicine-changing technology on the horizon, and massive money.
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Nov 22, 2011 14:48
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Lady at the unemployment office: "You were only making X? Isn't that an extremely low wage for an attorney?" 
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Nov 22, 2011 15:06
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HiddenReplaced posted:I'm pretty sure this guy wants to go into radiology, so at least he will never interact with a patient. That guy has serious problems with women, jesus Also goondolences to R Mudd and cali bar guy. Bar guy: anki owns, do what Linguica said. You can get Anki for your iphone and it's like a giant deck of flashcards you can take anywhere. And there's no shame in failing the CA bar
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Nov 22, 2011 15:24
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Roger_Mudd posted:Lady at the unemployment office: Well sure, but coupled with the prestige of being a lawyer... (sorry you lost your job )
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Nov 22, 2011 15:26
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Welp, the pie contest got onto ATL. They left out some people's emails and got a lot of facts wrong, but that happens. The emails are also in the completely wrong order. http://abovethelaw.com/2011/11/for-students-at-top-chicago-area-law-schools-its-all-about-the-pie/ The only reason there was any drama was that one girl being weirdly vindictive and nasty and grabbing the trophy after I won and scuttling to her backpack with it hoping nobody would notice. I wasn't upset and I didn't hound her about it, the judges told me to ask her for the trophy. She was also wrong about the audience, nobody agreed with her. The judges emailed me saying they asked her to apologize to the listserv because she was being so snarky and dishonest. Anyway, that contest was awesome and they should post the video. I was voted to compete by my section, but we had a midterm review at the same time so nobody was at the contest, but when I walked into the class covered in pie and holding the trophy, everybody cheered for me and it was cool. Anyway the point is law school is actually a lot of fun and the community at Northwestern is overall really cool despite all the stupid listserv stuff, but gently caress this memo due tomorrow morning. MoFauxHawk fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Nov 22, 2011 |
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Nov 22, 2011 19:05
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