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Grammaton posted:The Cthaeh scene is pretty cool though. Well, I'm pretty sure it's the pivotal scene of the series, so I hope so.
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Dec 10, 2011 05:17
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Cervixalot posted:Kruppe ... I mostly disliked him. I rarely if ever skim or skip parts of books, but I did skim most of his TTH Darujhistan exposition dialogue
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Dec 10, 2011 05:52
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I've only read one book with Krupped in it (GotM), and I really liked him as a character. He plays the fool it seems but he's actually quite talented and knows what he's doing. I'm currently reading Memories of Ice and just read the part where Quick Ben talks to the witch in the city to ask why Burn is sleeping. Is Burn is the woman goddes from the prologue that helped to create the Imperial Warren out of the land that the guy in Brood's army destroyed. Correct? Did that make any sense?
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Dec 10, 2011 06:00
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I think you're confusing and mixing several different characters and events, or maybe I am. Either way, Burn is basically Mother Earth.
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Dec 10, 2011 06:09
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Vanilla Mint Ice posted:I think you're confusing and mixing several different characters and events, or maybe I am. Either way, Burn is basically Mother Earth. I wouldn't be surprised that I am. Now that I think about it, the woman from the prologue is now travelling with Toc and Tool and the two Goombas.
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Dec 10, 2011 06:11
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wellwhoopdedooo posted:It's not nearly as bad as practically every other sex scene in a book I've ever read. I like both books in the series so far. I never found the writing boring, which the Malazan books were at time. That being said the plot and world are much weaker. It's lighter in many senses but certainly not trash fantasy. It's a decent, if flawed work, that deserves to be mentioned with other quality fantasy series that have been popping up recently.
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Dec 10, 2011 06:59
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victrix posted:Guys... I just finished Crippled God.
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Dec 10, 2011 23:58
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victrix posted:Guys... I just finished Crippled God. I started The Dresden Files after finishing. I was not disappointed. It was just the right amount of fluff and action to cleanse my palate of the dense amazing-ness that is TMBOTF.
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Dec 11, 2011 02:27
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33rd Degree Idiot posted:I started The Dresden Files after finishing. I was not disappointed. It was just the right amount of fluff and action to cleanse my palate of the dense amazing-ness that is TMBOTF. I did that too. The first book is really good so far.
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Dec 12, 2011 00:25
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Grammaton posted:I did that too. The first book is really good so far. The 2nd book is meh for Dresden but afterwards it's a really entertaining series.
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Dec 12, 2011 02:46
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Lunchtray posted:The 2nd book is meh for Dresden but afterwards it's a really entertaining series. If you like it, look up Ben Aaronovitch's series. It's basically Dresden but he's a member of the Metropolitan Police (and all the baggage that implies). The guy has written Doctor Who and Casualty and is pretty decent.
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Dec 12, 2011 04:10
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savinhill posted:Try the Prince of Nothing series by R Scott Bakker. I like it just as much as Malazan and for a lot of the same reasons. Counterpoint: I thought Bakker was boring and frustratingly written, and I hated nearly all of the POV characters. He feels a bit like he's trying to be Erikson, and the writing feels tighter and more focused, but he's also completely missing the things that make Erikson fun to read, like an interesting story. It reeeeeally drags at points.
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Dec 12, 2011 05:42
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Bakker and Erikson are my favorite writers in fantasy, but the similarities are only about certain themes and ambition. They are actually divergent in the intent and Bakker IS NOT trying to imitate Erikson in any way. It drags wherever you don't follow what he's doing, and it's rather dense with philosophy and the implications. Either you are interested in what he's doing (and unrelated to Erikson), or it's simply unreadable.
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Dec 12, 2011 06:56
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Yeah, I don't think Bakker was trying to copy Erikson at all. I said I like him for some of the same reasons as in both series have very deep world building and lots of philosophy. While Bakker doesn't have humor in his books like Erikson, I think his characterization and prose are better.
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Dec 12, 2011 07:09
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pakman posted:I wouldn't be surprised that I am. Now that I think about it, the woman from the prologue is now travelling with Toc and Tool and the two Goombas. Still confusing characters. Toc and Tool are with Spite or Envy, one of Draconus's daughters anyway. The three gods in the prologue were K'rul, Draconus and "Sister of Cold Nights", who we've also met. Don't worry, Memories of Ice is, in part, about said woman. I can't remember if you are told, should have assumed by now or would simply be spoiled by more information, so I won't say anything more. If you're still confused at the end, just say. 
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Dec 12, 2011 10:01
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savinhill posted:Yeah, I don't think Bakker was trying to copy Erikson at all. I said I like him for some of the same reasons as in both series have very deep world building and lots of philosophy. While Bakker doesn't have humor in his books like Erikson, I think his characterization and prose are better. Yeah, Bakker is "copying" Erikson in the sense that Erikson was one of the trailblazers in the whole "gritty adult fantasy is okay!" movement we've seen recently, opening the way for Bakker, Abercrombie and the like to follow... But beyond that they are pretty much polar opposites. I like Bakker, but he can be a little heavy at times, and more than a little disturbed. On the other side, while Erikson can do serious, there's usually an undercurrent of comedy, even if it's only comedy in the tragic greek sense.
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Dec 12, 2011 10:05
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I'm almost finished with Deadhouse Gates and I'm finding it tough to get through. So much crazy stuff is happening. Eriksons prose can be odd at times as well and I find myself rereading a sentence or paragraph trying to make better sense of it. Maybe I'm too dumb for this series  . I did like GotM though. I loved ASoIaF and raced through all the books whereas I don't seem to be as enthusiastic about Malazan. I might take a break to read some Sanderson and come back later...
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Dec 12, 2011 14:36
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Masonity posted:Still confusing characters. Toc and Tool are with Spite or Envy, one of Draconus's daughters anyway. The three gods in the prologue were K'rul, Draconus and "Sister of Cold Nights", who we've also met. Don't worry, Memories of Ice is, in part, about said woman. I can't remember if you are told, should have assumed by now or would simply be spoiled by more information, so I won't say anything more. If you're still confused at the end, just say. It is a little confusing that there are so many Gods in this one. Last night I read the chapter where I think I am introduced to the plot for the entire series. Brood has a decision to make, Paran travels to the Finnist, and learns that he can travel to any of the cards in the Deck along with the Houses, Kruppe has joined the armies, etc. It was a kickass chapter and I'm looking forward to the rest of the book.
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Dec 12, 2011 15:02
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Think of them less as gods and more as kickass characters. :-p
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Dec 12, 2011 15:07
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I tried reading the Mistborn novels last week and had to give up. The action was so stilted and the characters were so shallow. I think erikson has kinda ruined the genre for me now. Next Ice novel comes out in 4 weeks!!!
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Dec 12, 2011 23:10
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pakman posted:It is a little confusing that there are so many Gods in this one. Last night I read the chapter where I think I am introduced to the plot for the entire series. Brood has a decision to make, Paran travels to the Finnist, and learns that he can travel to any of the cards in the Deck along with the Houses, Kruppe has joined the armies, etc. It was a kickass chapter and I'm looking forward to the rest of the book. One thing to remember about the gods is that there is only a small difference between a god and a sufficiently badass mortal. I wouldn't even be surprised if some of the high mages could take on Ascendents in a fair fight and other mortals could win through trickery or guile. One of the big themes is that Gods are only protected by the fact that they can act from afar, and if they appear in a physical sense they are as vulnerable as any other manifestation of primordial power.
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Dec 13, 2011 00:46
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NovemberMike posted:One thing to remember about the gods is that there is only a small difference between a god and a sufficiently badass mortal. I wouldn't even be surprised if some of the high mages could take on Ascendents in a fair fight and other mortals could win through trickery or guile. Or Moranth munitions. I love that there's different magical systems and ways to ascend, and that some people strive for ascension their whole lives while others just fall rear end-backwards into it.
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Dec 13, 2011 10:21
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Leospeare posted:Or Moranth munitions. Yeah, I'm a fan of how he didn't try to really "tier" things. Sure there are a few things like the Jaghut Tyrants that are on a different level but an Ascendant, a Dragon or a High Mage can all go down to a sapper.
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Dec 13, 2011 10:39
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NovemberMike posted:Yeah, I'm a fan of how he didn't try to really "tier" things. Sure there are a few things like the Jaghut Tyrants that are on a different level but an Ascendant, a Dragon or a High Mage can all go down to a sapper. Even Jaghut Tyrants! In GOTM, either Fiddler or Hedge (can't remember which) took down Raest with a cusser. (Okay, it wasn't a single-handed victory nor an outright kill, but still counts for something.) So when do you all think an ascendent is considered a god? Is it when people start worshipping them, or they take over a Deck of Dragons house, or something else? Dessambrae has worshippers but I don't recall if he's ever shown to have a place in the Deck. Shadowthrone and Cotillion seemed to jump straight into godhood because High House Shadow was empty - I always got the impression that they didn't have much in the way of actual worshippers beforehand, though there may have been cults of Shadow that they effectively took over when they ascended.
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Dec 13, 2011 11:13
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About Bakker and Erikson there's also an important point at the foundation of their work. Erikson's series as a whole is an attempt to grasp humanity. Bakker's series instead could end in a very dark and cold place, if he really sticks to his ideas. He has the potential of writing the most frightening thing ever written in the history of literature. That's also why they are divergent. Bakker once defined writing his series as a "race": to describe the apocalypse before it comes for real...
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Dec 13, 2011 19:19
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Leospeare posted:So when do you all think an ascendent is considered a god? Is it when people start worshipping them, or they take over a Deck of Dragons house, or something else? Dessambrae has worshippers but I don't recall if he's ever shown to have a place in the Deck. Shadowthrone and Cotillion seemed to jump straight into godhood because High House Shadow was empty - I always got the impression that they didn't have much in the way of actual worshippers beforehand, though there may have been cults of Shadow that they effectively took over when they ascended. From what I've seen, there isn't really a difference from a god and an ascendent power-wise. Gods are basically just ascendents that have worshippers and accept their prayers (and their godhood). I believe in HoC there's a flashback where Cotillion assassinates a Shadow cult leader, probably to remove opposition when they eventually ascended. There's also in TcG where Dessembrae is the side of Dassem that accepted godhood and worshippers (Lord of Tragedy) while actual Dassem is just a really emotional ascendent. Most of the established gods in the series protect themselves by hanging out in guarded warrens and acting from there(Queen of Dreams, Shadowthrone+Cotillion, Hood). Those that don't are easy prey, just ask Fiddler and Hedge 
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Dec 14, 2011 00:09
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IncendiaC posted:From what I've seen, there isn't really a difference from a god and an ascendent power-wise. Gods are basically just ascendents that have worshippers and accept their prayers (and their godhood). I believe in HoC there's a flashback where Cotillion assassinates a Shadow cult leader, probably to remove opposition when they eventually ascended. There's also in TcG where Dessembrae is the side of Dassem that accepted godhood and worshippers (Lord of Tragedy) while actual Dassem is just a really emotional ascendent. Exactly how many gods / ascendents have those two killed anyways?
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Dec 14, 2011 12:40
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Finished up Deadhouse Gates last night. The last 20% really picked up and everything sort of 'clicked' in the end. Coltaine's death was heart wrenching - that whole section was very cinematic.
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Dec 15, 2011 12:25
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I just finished the series. I love that (TCG spoiler, I guess) the Jaghut all prefer solitude because they're all pretty much annoying jerks. Between the undead(/living) Jaghut army, Raest, and Gothos, I think they might have had some of the best dialogue outside Tehol and Bugg (who should probably have a 10 book series dedicated to the two of them just hanging out) Also, Fiddler deciding he wanted Hedge to stick around, and Hedge deciding he wanted to stick around was probably the best part of the whole series
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Dec 15, 2011 15:30
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Aralan posted:Between the undead(/living) Jaghut army, Raest, and Gothos, I think they might have had some of the best dialogue Yeah, he really nailed an odd, opaque sense of humor that is still funny.
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Dec 15, 2011 15:48
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Leospeare posted:Even Jaghut Tyrants! In GOTM, either Fiddler or Hedge (can't remember which) took down Raest with a cusser. (Okay, it wasn't a single-handed victory nor an outright kill, but still counts for something.) That's what I thought, anyway.
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Dec 15, 2011 17:42
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coyo7e posted:and the REALLY alien gods (the jade statues.) Actually, (The Crippled God spoiler) the jade statues aren't gods but the Crippled God's people. TCG is a really alien god though.
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Dec 15, 2011 20:27
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More art from the special edition Deadhouse Gates. Olar Ethil from the silanda is definitely my favourite.    
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Dec 19, 2011 06:50
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coyo7e posted:I was under the impression that gods are just ascendants who've claimed a throne and thus gives them power/dominion over the warren that it represents. There are also different "tiers" or "races" of gods, such as the basic ones such as Hood and Shadowthrone (who're really simply Ascendants who took a throne, or who found a role and filled it,) the primordial gods such as Mother/Father Dark and Burn etc, then there's alien gods (The Chained God, who doesn't give much indication of ever having a mortal background, although that may be simply because you never see his origins,) and the REALLY alien gods (the jade statues.) I thought gods were just ascendants that had worshippers. Rake isn't a god because he doesn't have real worshipers and the thing that defined Dassembrae was that his enemies worshiped him. Being a god also ties you to your worshipers in a way that a normal ascendent isn't.
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Dec 19, 2011 09:29
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NovemberMike posted:I thought gods were just ascendants that had worshippers. Rake isn't a god because he doesn't have real worshipers I think this is pretty questionable by the time Toll the Hounds rolls around, just look at what Rake's compatriots do to fulfill his schemes in this book. I don't think they could achieve what they achieved without revering Rake as a God. edit: I guess I'm talking about 'faith'
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Dec 19, 2011 17:12
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NovemberMike posted:I thought gods were just ascendants that had worshippers. Rake isn't a god because he doesn't have real worshipers and the thing that defined Dassembrae was that his enemies worshiped him. Being a god also ties you to your worshipers in a way that a normal ascendent isn't. Rake is also worshiped as the Black Winged Lord by the people of Bluerose.
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Dec 20, 2011 10:24
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Juaguocio posted:Rake is also worshiped as the Black Winged Lord by the people of Bluerose.
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Dec 20, 2011 19:23
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Fuzzy Mammal posted:More art from the special edition Deadhouse Gates. Olar Ethil from the silanda is definitely my favourite. 1. These are all completely awesome. 2. Who is the second one? Felisin? Apsalar? 3. whole series spoilers Olar Ethil was the dragon in Deadhouse Gates? How did you work that out? I'm only vaguely remembering the scene, that's the dragon that accidentally drags them through a few warrens or something including Tellann?
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Dec 21, 2011 02:09
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02-6611-0142-1 posted:3. whole series spoilers Olar Ethil was the dragon in Deadhouse Gates? How did you work that out? I'm only vaguely remembering the scene, that's the dragon that accidentally drags them through a few warrens or something including Tellann?
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Dec 21, 2011 02:13
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WeWereSchizo posted:I'm pretty sure she's the only undead dragon flying around. Going through Tellann's a good clue, too (which is how Stormy, Gesler, and Truth got all shiny). But I could be wrong. Also consensus last time was Lostara Yil?
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Dec 21, 2011 03:21
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