|
Are you dumping boiling water on the grounds? The water should be hot 195-205 F, but not boiling. Boiling water causes bitter.
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2011 22:04
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 21:42 |
|
|
Bob_McBob posted:(both subjectively and objectively on the sperg-o-meter) Well, drat. Interesting.
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2011 22:28
|
|
|
Gave it another shot. I boiled the water, waited 3-4 minutes before covering the grounds, let it do its thing for 30 seconds then poured over (in a circular motion around the edge). Brew time was around 2 minutes (first time was 3+ minutes). Grind was coarser than previous attempt. Result... is the same. Flavored water, tastes like death. I feel so goddamn incompetent 
|
|
#
?
Dec 20, 2011 23:10
|
|
|
seravid posted:Gave it another shot. I boiled the water, waited 3-4 minutes before covering the grounds, let it do its thing for 30 seconds then poured over (in a circular motion around the edge). Brew time was around 2 minutes (first time was 3+ minutes). Grind was coarser than previous attempt. I would go with a gently caress-it opposite direction brew next time. Grind finer than the first try, use 1.5x as much coffee, and pour slow, aiming for a 4 minute extraction. The thinking here is maybe the grinds were too coarse to begin with and the water is just passing around them without actually extracting much. This is one reason I really like the CCD, it's a lot more foolproof.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 01:13
|
|
|
seravid posted:then poured over (in a circular motion around the edge)
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 02:41
|
|
|
GrAviTy84 posted:I would go with a gently caress-it opposite direction brew next time. Grind finer than the first try, use 1.5x as much coffee, and pour slow, aiming for a 4 minute extraction. The thinking here is maybe the grinds were too coarse to begin with and the water is just passing around them without actually extracting much. This is one reason I really like the CCD, it's a lot more foolproof. Sounds good, I'll try it first thing in the morning. I also already modded the mini mill, maybe that'll help. that Vai sound posted:How close to the edge were you pouring? Too close and the water will just pass by grounds on the side, or so I've read. I don't think it was that close but I'll definitely keep that in mind.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 03:21
|
|
|
seravid posted:Thanks for the help, I'll try different grinds/temps/pour methods and see how it goes. Have you ever had a well made filter coffee for comparison? I ask because the clean mouth feel is one of the main reasons people drink filter in the first place. The extraction should be taking 3-4 minutes and when you're done there should be a layer of grounds up the sides of the filter paper and the rest in the bottom. If absolutely everything is in the bottom this could be (one of) the reasons your coffee is bitter and you should try pouring the water in a small circle in the middle, avoiding the filter paper and the extracted grounds at the edges.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 03:36
|
|
|
Yeah, I'm kind of thinking that maybe you just don't like coffee. It could be bad beans, or improper brewing method, or... you just don't like coffee. It's supposed to be bitter. It's supposed to have a strong flavor, which makes "watery" seem kind of suspect, but I guess that's kind of subjective. I'd usually recommend that you go find a good coffee shop, where you can try out good coffee prepared in a couple different ways, before you go all-in with your own setup.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 03:49
|
|
|
Since no one has asked this here are a few questions. A. How much coffee have you had before this? B. Was there cream and sugar in it? C. Are you putting anything in it now? If all you knew before this was coffee with cream and sugar, then it's going to seem watery and bitter. There is no shame in starting off drinking coffee with cream and sugar. Not everyone's taste buds, especially the bitter receptive ones act the same. The more coffee you drink and the more you learn what you like in a region, roast and brew method, the less additives you'll need.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 04:55
|
|
|
Keyfour posted:The extraction should be taking 3-4 minutes Gravity Pike posted:Yeah, I'm kind of thinking that maybe you just don't like coffee.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 05:01
|
|
|
I thought about that, maybe it's just me and I'm wasting everyone's time, but consider this: 1) I enjoy espressos/cappuccinos/lattes/etc. (and that's from unpopular machines like the Krups' Dolce Gusto) and 2) there is a total absence of any of the qualities everyone likes about this coffee. Here's one example: http://shop.ritualcoffee.com.au/products/ethiopia-shakiso-natural "Rich, sweet chocolatey aftertaste"... If it's not a problem with the roasting/grinding/brewing/whatever then it must be me, sure, but that means my sense of taste is all hosed up because there was nothing remotely resembling a chocolatey aftertaste, unless that's coffeetalk for "strong bitter taste that won't go away even after 15 minutes" (I actually had to eat something to make it go away). By "watery" I suppose I mean "too diluted". It reminds me of powdered drinks or that concentrated stuff that you mix with water in a 1:10 ratio, but instead of 1:10 you went with 1:1000. Good coffee shops will be hard to find, around here "coffee" means a 50ml shot of cheap espresso drowned in sugar. Besides those and the girly drinks my Krups machine does, that's all I know, really. Hell, people here think you're crazy when you talk about filling a mug with coffee. That's one of the reasons I wanted to make the good stuff at home and hey, no regrets. Trying new things is fun, even when they taste awful. I do apologize for monopolizing the thread. Hopefully in the next few days I'll either fix the problem or acknowledge the fact that maybe I'm more of a tea guy.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 05:10
|
|
|
seravid posted:I thought about that, maybe it's just me and I'm wasting everyone's time, but consider this: I highly doubt you don't have a taste for coffee, since you do like espresso. It definitely should not be watery either, or really really bitter and astringent. And as an aside, drip and french press coffee really shouldn't be that spergy. Yes, you could weigh out every cup and get the temp of your water before the pour and time the extraction, and yes, it will get you an epic cup of coffee if everything's right. But I wing it the vast majority of the time, and I definitely do not drink coffee that could be described as you describe it, so I'm guessing something is definitely wrong, and not your taste buds. Like I said before, try a fine grind, and also check the amount of grounds you use. I try and stick to a 2 tablespoon of grounds per cup, but I frequently go over that because I end up grinding more than I want to since I never weigh out my beans before brewing. But I'm guessing it's just a weak extraction from your coarse grind, or a bad batch of beans. Try seeking out a local roaster; mail order is nice, but no matter how good they are shipped, nothing really beats coffee roasted the day you buy it. Plus, it lets you try out smaller quantities more frequently. My money's on the coarse grind being the culprit. It really sounds like you're getting an under-extracted cup.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 06:00
|
|
|
Don't worry about "monopolizing" the thread. If people wanted to talk about other things, they'd bring them up. We want you to brew a cup you'll enjoy 
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 06:16
|
|
|
Lots of useful bits of information usually come out that are pretty informative when someone has basic problems or questions anyway. I'm going to agree with pnumoman and say that you should try a finer grind. If you're still getting "watery" coffee, it might just be weak and because the actual flavors aren't being extracted, you're just getting a bad tasting, hot water.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 07:10
|
|
|
Try finer, yes. But maybe also try brewing it French press style (coarse ish) in a separate container, and filtering it into your cup. My reasoning is this should identify if "watery" is just lack of body that you're used to in espresso or your pour over method.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 10:59
|
|
|
Update  Finer grind (and more consistent now with the modded mill), 50% more beans (18g for 200g of water), 4 minute extraction. First impression - while brewing - was positive, I noticed some bubbles around the cup, something I usually saw on youtube but never had here. Definite improvement on the taste, I actually managed to drink the whole cup. Still no sign of red fruits or chocolatey impressions, though. It starts with a somewhat sweet taste but that fades very quickly, instead becoming acidic (not unpleasant) and ending with the familiar bitter aftertaste (unpleasant). That bitter taste seemed less aggressive than before and I think I can pinpoint one of its characteristics now. It feels burned, like I'm drinking coals. I have no boiling-water-proof thermometer, but I'll try to wait a few extra minutes before starting the brew to see if it helps. I'll keep experimenting with the Ethiopian beans, but in the meantime I'd also like to try a more noob-friendly coffee, to check 1) if maybe the beans I have are over-roasted and 2) just to try an overall less aggressive coffee. Could you guys take a look here: http://www.hasbean.co.uk/ and give me a few pointers? No local roasters in my area, I'm afraid, online ones will have to do. lags posted:Try finer, yes. But maybe also try brewing it French press style (coarse ish) in a separate container, and filtering it into your cup. My reasoning is this should identify if "watery" is just lack of body that you're used to in espresso or your pour over method. Good idea, I'll take a look at those.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 16:47
|
|
|
If you want a sweeter coffee, try something south american. I have a columbian at the moment that smells exactly like coffee, it is amazing! If you want to start noticing flavours more go for something totally differentso you can get a good coverage of the different possibilities.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 17:34
|
|
|
seravid posted:Good idea, I'll take a look at those. By all means buy more stuff! But for the record I just meant brew the grounds & water in a separate cup and filter into your other using your current pourover filter thingamawhatchit. Sounds like you're making progress in the right direction anyway though.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 18:30
|
|
|
Smiley Face posted:If you want a sweeter coffee, try something south american. I have a columbian at the moment that smells exactly like coffee, it is amazing! South American it is, thanks. lags posted:By all means buy more stuff! But for the record I just meant brew the grounds & water in a separate cup and filter into your other using your current pourover filter thingamawhatchit. Sounds like you're making progress in the right direction anyway though. Haha, I guess I went straight to the "throw money at the problem" method. So, I should dump the grounds in a cup, fill it with water (stir?) and filter the whole thing through the dripper, is that right?
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 18:41
|
|
|
seravid posted:
You want to grind it medium coarse and let it steep for about 4 minutes then filter. The trouble with filtering with tour dripped is that it adds more time. You need a fine mesh of some kind. Honestly I'd just buy a french press, they are dirt cheap.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 19:09
|
|
|
I was getting average to bitter taste from my aeropress. Decided to dial my Baratza (Starbucks version) to the highest (just under drip setting) "espresso" setting and ground away. Boiled water, measured with thermopen fo 203 degrees, poured into aeropress. Stirred, waited 4 minutes then pressed into cup. Re-boiled water to 203, made an americano. Tasted great. I think my issue was my grind was too coarse. For anyone with bitter aeropress coffee, try a smaller grind. Worked here although I may try even finer tomorrow.
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 20:57
|
|
|
seravid posted:Update
|
|
#
?
Dec 21, 2011 22:49
|
|
|
Finally received the new Virtuoso grinder that comes with Preciso burrs. I was having trouble with it at first. The bean hopper would turn on its own to finer settings when I started grinding, and sometimes nothing came out. It took a little while to figure out that the red tab on the top burr (used for alignment) was painted on the wrong side. Now it seems to be working fine when I set it up backwards to the instructions.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 00:56
|
|
|
that Vai sound posted:Finally received the new Virtuoso grinder that comes with Preciso burrs. I was having trouble with it at first. The bean hopper would turn on its own to finer settings when I started grinding, and sometimes nothing came out. It took a little while to figure out that the red tab on the top burr (used for alignment) was painted on the wrong side. Now it seems to be working fine when I set it up backwards to the instructions. What is going on with them lately? The guy getting the filthy one and yours being incorrectly labeled. Their quality control is a bit suspect at the moment.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 02:44
|
|
|
Sounds like they should fire their new technician.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 03:31
|
|
|
that Vai sound posted:I'd also recommend trying filtered water instead of tap water, if you're not already. Some people have good tap water, but I don't know what your situation is.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 03:37
|
|
|
Now that I have 10lbs of it in my hands (well, it's a Christmas present to my wife), I wanted to mention that Sweet Maria's got in a Dry Process Ethiopia Sidama Aleta Wondo. It cupped at a 90.6 at City+, and I'm pretty excited to give it a whirl. A few years back, I tried a very similar coffee (Ethiopia Sidamo Aleta Wondo Special Prep) and it was one of the best coffees I've ever tasted. It was like drinking a cup of blueberries.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 08:12
|
|
|
seravid posted:Update A week from roasting should not have any detrimental effect on the coffee, it tends to stay OK up to a month or so. I buy coffee from Hasbean all the time, and they tend to roast on the lighter side, hence there is virtually no risk of getting over-roasted beans, El Salvador La Ilusion would be first on my list to try followed by one of the Kenyan beans. Also, do yourself a favour and get a Clever Coffee Dripper (sweetmarias/hasbean sells them). It's really a foolproof brewing device and I get fantastic results on it every time. I prefer it to the aeropress as the coffee tends to be cleaner and with a heavier body. My recipe is 18 g coffee (slightly finer than drip), 300 ml of 90 deg C water and steep for 2 min 50s. Having Square Mile's Kenya Tegu AA these days.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 10:35
|
|
|
My coffee guy told me I shouldn't use their espresso roast in an aeropress and he wouldn't elaborate on why. Any idea where he got that notion from? I like to use the aeropress to make espresso-like shots for my not-quite-a-cappuccino every morning. I figured the espresso beans would be a way to get a bit closer to what I was trying to achieve.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 13:28
|
|
|
Bobx66 posted:My coffee guy told me I shouldn't use their espresso roast in an aeropress and he wouldn't elaborate on why. Any idea where he got that notion from? I like to use the aeropress to make espresso-like shots for my not-quite-a-cappuccino every morning. I figured the espresso beans would be a way to get a bit closer to what I was trying to achieve. "Espresso roast" is misnomer. It is true that that many roasters will go a little darker to tone down bright or acidic notes (for instance) when roasting for espresso, because they would be undesirably amplified by the high-pressure extraction. Espresso blends in general, or SOs roasted this way may taste flat when not brewed as espresso. Kind of dumb he wouldn't explain this to you. The Aeropress doesn't make espresso or anything close to it.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 14:33
|
|
|
Bob_McBob posted:The Aeropress doesn't make espresso or anything close to it. No poo poo Sherlock. Did I not use enough qualifiers to stop your spergmeter from going off? Jackass. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 14:49
|
|
|
Bobx66 posted:No poo poo Sherlock. Did I not use enough qualifiers to stop your spergmeter from going off? 
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 14:59
|
|
|
Everyone in this thread is a jackass.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 15:41
|
|
|
Bobx66 posted:No poo poo Sherlock. Did I not use enough qualifiers to stop your spergmeter from going off? Looks like someone hasn't had their cup yet But yeah, aeropress doesn't (and can't) make espresso, mostly a pressure issue, they've been trying to correct the box advertising for years. good way to make brewed coffee, but not espresso.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 15:46
|
|
|
Bob_McBob posted:If I could empty quote a one-emoticon reply I totally would. Maybe he had TOO MUCH coffee and is all jittery and angryreplyposting without thinking. Calm down, dude. <insert decaf joke here>
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 16:55
|
|
|
grabulasa posted:A week from roasting should not have any detrimental effect on the coffee, it tends to stay OK up to a month or so. Wait, what? After reading the OP I was set on the CCD, but couldn't find it here in Europe. I just re-checked and Hasbean doesn't sell it...? Thanks for the recommendations, I'll try them after the holidays. Too late now and I already ordered some Brazilian beans yesterday anyway.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 17:22
|
|
|
seravid posted:Wait, what? After reading the OP I was set on the CCD, but couldn't find it here in Europe. I just re-checked and Hasbean doesn't sell it...? Brazilian coffee is pretty mellow and smooth, might be more your speed as far as drip coffee goes. I'm on a business trip right now and I'm really anxious to get home because Christmas gift of a Freshroast SR500 and four lbs of Sweet Maria's green coffee is waiting for me. I'm going to roast a lb of it when I get back so I can bring it with me on the flight back home as a thank you. Really excited to get to roasting.
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 18:51
|
|
|
Bobx66 posted:No poo poo Sherlock. Did I not use enough qualifiers to stop your spergmeter from going off? And you're calling him a sperger?
|
|
#
?
Dec 22, 2011 19:59
|
|
|
nm posted:And you're calling him a sperger? Haha, being probated 3 times in a row for being a "jerk". I think we see a trend here?
|
|
#
?
Dec 23, 2011 01:10
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 21:42 |
|
|
seravid posted:Wait, what? After reading the OP I was set on the CCD, but couldn't find it here in Europe. I just re-checked and Hasbean doesn't sell it...? I just did some quick searching, and while Hasbean doesn't seem to sell them, it looked like most people in the few UK coffee forums I could find were picking them up off CoffeeHit (or a few other sites that don't even ship to the entirety of the UK). It looks like they should ship to wherever, so I hope that helps. Alternatively, there's Amazon as well, and while you're giving money to the same company, it looks like it may save you some on shipping.
|
|
#
?
Dec 23, 2011 07:00
|
|
