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Thread title really needs a change. I enjoyed Insomnia mind, although it was during my 'read absolutely everything Dark Tower related' phase.
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Dec 28, 2011 02:37
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I think the reason the book drags there is the same reason the sailing parts in Moby Dick are long and boring as gently caress; the author is trying to impress upon you just how bored the characters are during this period of time, by making you as bored as they are. Or I could've just compared Stephen King to Melville in which case I should probably die in a fire.
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Dec 28, 2011 03:45
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MyLightyear posted:Not trying to interrupt King's bad sex discussion but the story in the same book mentioned above about the Maitre D who goes completely homicidal was pretty decent. And to bring it back to bad sex, other than the actual carnage of that story the thing I will always remember is the narrator describing sex with his ex-wife when she "gripped [his] rear end like twin pommels, whispering 'Do me, do me'" or something to that effect. I remember this very clearly because I first heard that story in the Blood & Smoke audio book, read by King himself, so the nasally old nerd voice of Uncle Steve saying those words is forever burned into my memory.
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Dec 28, 2011 04:04
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Maybe I'm wrong about this Kennedy novel, but I just don't think King really needed to write anymore about assassination after The Dead Zone. That one's just such a great, great book, maybe my very favorite of his and I really think he said it all in that book about the very American tradition of psychos shooting our politicians all to poo poo. What's that great line: "In it's own way, it is as American as the Wonderful World of Disney" or something? I mean, can he really have anything better or more on point than that to say? I doubt it. Am I the only one who loves The Dead Zone? It's plenty slow, but he's really at the top of his game. In my opinion.
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Dec 28, 2011 04:11
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H.P. Shivcraft posted:"gripped [his] rear end like twin pommels, whispering 'Do me, do me'" Hahhaa, that's right. I hope to god I never think of that line when actually grabbing a dude's rear end 
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Dec 28, 2011 04:12
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Quad posted:I think the reason the book drags there is the same reason the sailing parts in Moby Dick are long and boring as gently caress; the author is trying to impress upon you just how bored the characters are during this period of time, by making you as bored as they are. I know it's a comedy comparison, but there's some truth to it. King is a commercial writer, but in most of his recent books - from Lisey's Story onward IMO - he's trying to be more literary. The problem is, he doesn't do literary well; i.e. his work generally doesn't warrant deeper readings. So instead of coming off as "deeper," the literary bits in 11/22/63 are just boring. If I want literary fiction I'll read Moby Dick, et al. I guess I'm saying Stephen King should just embrace his commercial fiction nature and roll with it. He seemed to do this more with Under the Dome than any other recent book, and that's probably why I like it the most out of all his recent stuff. With 140 pages to go in 11/22/63 it feels like it could've used a couple more drafts to tighten everything up.
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Dec 28, 2011 05:29
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Harry Manback posted:I've managed to read through some King before but the book that definitely wins the prize is Insomnia. Reading 200 pages of that book made me question my sanity. I can't begin to imagine what kind of masochist can read through the whole book and claim to have enjoyed it. I enjoyed it! So put me on that list. Everything other than the Tower connection worked well for me in that book. The slow build, the revisit to Derry. the hyper-reality episodes and the whole mystical thing with the auras, the explanation that different age groups coexist and yet are "unseen", the way old age was portrayed as being just as much of a transition from one part of life to another a childhood is to adulthood, the small moments of humour, and the horrible realisation that the little bald doctor was using the mentally ill and a complete rear end in a top hat and yet part of the natural order, all those things about that book made it for me. Those and we got to meet Mike again, probably one of my favourite King characters. The books a slow build; the latest one is a fast build with a sharp drop-off. I think that's what is giving some people a problem. You go into a book and the first hundred or so pages are normally a good indication of what type of read it is going to be. This one shifts tone and it's jarring because you're still moving at the same pace as the start of the book while Kings going, "Whoah, down, slow down, we've got some time to kill now," and that shift is tough to do when you just want some pace, some insightful observations, some build up of suspense, anything other than an "A day in the life of" mid-section. That can kill a book quicker than a poo poo ending. At least you've had an enjoyable ride with a bad ending. A bad middle? You might not even make it that far. Ninja Edit: Wow, this thread perked up!
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Dec 28, 2011 09:01
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Harry Manback posted:I've managed to read through some King before but the book that definitely wins the prize is Insomnia. Reading 200 pages of that book made me question my sanity. I can't begin to imagine what kind of masochist can read through the whole book and claim to have enjoyed it. I liked Insomnia. 
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Dec 28, 2011 14:29
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Well, it took me a year to get through the Dark Tower series through books on tape, listening to sometimes as little as 5-10 minutes a day before bed on occasion. Aside from the middle third of Wolves of the Calla I loved every minute. I even loved Song of Susannah. Deal with it! Loved the ending, and love thinking about what a potential book 8 would be like. drat now I need to find a new epic series :/
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Dec 29, 2011 00:42
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XyrlocShammypants posted:Well, it took me a year to get through the Dark Tower series through books on tape, listening to sometimes as little as 5-10 minutes a day before bed on occasion. Aside from the middle third of Wolves of the Calla I loved every minute. I even loved Song of Susannah. Deal with it! Loved the ending, and love thinking about what a potential book 8 would be like. drat now I need to find a new epic series :/ There actually is a book 8, coming out in March.
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Dec 29, 2011 00:49
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Regarding the thread title change, oh sugar oh honey, hey honey, aww hon...Static Rook posted:I know it's a comedy comparison, but there's some truth to it. King is a commercial writer, but in most of his recent books - from Lisey's Story onward IMO - he's trying to be more literary. The problem is, he doesn't do literary well; i.e. his work generally doesn't warrant deeper readings. So instead of coming off as "deeper," the literary bits in 11/22/63 are just boring. If I want literary fiction I'll read Moby Dick, et al. juliuspringle, I also liked Insomnia.  Going back several posts to the bad sex discussion, I must be blocking it out, because I don't remember this story about a woman guzzling semen because she ate a mushroom. What the gently caress was that one?
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Dec 29, 2011 01:14
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Nightmares and Dreamscapes and I think the story is called Dedication.
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Dec 29, 2011 01:40
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Hedrigall posted:There actually is a book 8, coming out in March. Thought that was 4.5 or something.
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Dec 29, 2011 02:38
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JustFrakkingDoIt posted:Thought that was 4.5 or something. Or 0.5 since the bulk of 4 is before 1.
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Dec 29, 2011 03:11
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Man, you guys complaining about long sex scenes in Stephen King novels must have never read Whispers by Dean Koontz.
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Dec 29, 2011 22:08
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Max22 posted:Man, you guys complaining about long sex scenes in Stephen King novels must have never read Whispers by Dean Koontz. I mostly just read Sutter Cane anymore. No pesky sex scenes in his books. 
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Dec 29, 2011 22:30
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Max22 posted:Man, you guys complaining about long sex scenes in Stephen King novels must have never read Whispers by Dean Koontz. Do tell  I've said it before I think, but if there were a "GOD DAMMIT, DEAN KOONTZ" thread I would post in it probably every day (well, maybe, he's too boring of an author to hold much long-term interest, unlike King). And it's been like two years since I binged on a few of his books. The bizarre Mary Sue stuff, recurring narcotics+incest=superpowers themes, horribly conservative and privileged world view, swing music (or was it big band?), and dogs dogs dogs oh my GOD YOU GUYS DOGS still haunt me. Locus fucked around with this message at 22:46 on Dec 29, 2011 |
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Dec 29, 2011 22:43
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As such a big fan you must have, by now, seen his website not to mention Trixie the goddamn loving wonder-dog. Yep, she has her own section. Allow the flash banner to load if you use flashblock and turn those speakers up for maximum enjoyment of all things tricietrrixieTRIXIE. I wonder if all popular genre authors are a little crazy and fixated on one or two things because crap like Koontz and his dogs, King and his magical retard/coming of the white and Richard Laymon and his very weird view of relationships and how they start all seem like some kind of literary Tourette Syndrome. That Trixie website annex gets me every time though. I loved a lot of his books, Watchers is still probably my favourite genre novel for nostalgic reading, but I never knew the man was this crazy. The way her eyes follow your cursor is the scariest thing Koontz has ever done. If whoever built his site did it then that person needs to write his books instead. Wait for the image of Trixie and Koontz in post-coitus to load before leaving the page in horror though. Local Group Bus fucked around with this message at 00:00 on Dec 30, 2011 |
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Dec 29, 2011 23:53
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Max22 posted:Man, you guys complaining about long sex scenes in Stephen King novels must have never read Whispers by Dean Koontz. I read this. I remember it was like sixth grade and we had a state-mandated week of standardized testing, and since we were allowed to free-read I'd grabbed one of my mom's Dean Koontz books. When I asked her what it was about she said "I think there are cockroaches in that one." Well, there are. Among other things. A crazy guy has sex with himself except actually it's his twin, they've been conditioned to think they're the same person, also they are the product of an abusive, incestuous relationship between an old rich dude and his daughter. The guy/these guys rape and murder girls. That's just what I remember off the top of my head. Also, I remember Watchers, wherein a sheltered emotionally abused woman is rescued by the hero and it turns out under her dowdy church clothes she has a banging bod and she finds out she just loves to bone. This all makes Koontz's recent turn to a sort of bizarre libertarian social conservatism all the more strange. Say what you will about King, he's been pretty consistent about his tie-dyed baby-boomer Christianity.
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Dec 30, 2011 01:19
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Static Rook posted:I know it's a comedy comparison, but there's some truth to it. King is a commercial writer, but in most of his recent books - from Lisey's Story onward IMO - he's trying to be more literary. The problem is, he doesn't do literary well; i.e. his work generally doesn't warrant deeper readings. So instead of coming off as "deeper," the literary bits in 11/22/63 are just boring. If I want literary fiction I'll read Moby Dick, et al. I think it's more subtle than that. A lot of his "commercial fiction" actually does warrant a deeper, more literary reading. But when he tries to make his work deep, that's when it just turns out pretentious and less artistic than, say, The Library Policeman, which he probably didn't think of as art when he was writing it. When you starting thinking of your own work as "art," you're basically dead in the water. Most people kind of back into "art" accidentally.
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Dec 30, 2011 04:06
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H.P. Shivcraft posted:Horrible I thought King was non-vocally atheist/agnostic.
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Dec 30, 2011 04:28
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Ozmaugh posted:Don't forget, she uses one of those loving loofah/sponge mitt things for the handjob. Yeah, a loofah handjob is what guys love. There's always that scene in 'Tommyknockers' where two of the pod people have sex in the photo lab; one a virgin, biting the guy's shoulder so hard he starts bleeding, all the while he's thinking "Just like old times!"
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Dec 30, 2011 04:33
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JustFrakkingDoIt posted:I thought King was non-vocally atheist/agnostic. Well The Stand is overtly Christian. His theme of evil constantly undoing itself is also a trope grounded in Christian theology, though that can be chalked up to cultural inheritance more than his specific beliefs. He attacks fundamentalism pretty consistently, and he's obviously pretty liberal politically, but King seems very grounded in a sort of loving, open-arms Christianity in keeping with his demographic. In practice he probably would be better classified as agnostic, but the hints of his sprituality seen in his fiction and in terms of how he constructs his moral universes, he's got some heavy Christian trappings. Also, a popular story King tells involves Kubrick's filming of The Shining. Kubrick calls him at some ungodly hour and asks him if he believes in God; King thinks for a moment before saying yes. Kubrick says he doesn't and hangs up.
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Dec 30, 2011 04:46
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I could be wrong, but I think that in On Writing he mentions that he's pretty sure there's a God, but he has absolutely no use for organized religion.
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Dec 30, 2011 05:27
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Can I just say, I haven't read anything by Stephen King lately, but I saw a book by him in the newsagency the other day called "Full Dark; No Stars" and that is a loving AWESOME TITLE. It loving grabbed me. It grabbed me more awesomely than a thousand other titles have grabbed me over the years. I saw those words and I saw a black, cloudless sky and my torch illuminating a path through skeletal scrub. It was such a huge "not in kansas" moment, just reading those words and seeing that. Like "Blood Music" makes me think of a lymphocyte playing the violin or "Cloud Atlas" makes me think of a book of fluffy clouds with subtitles like "cumulus" and "lenticularis", this book title made me see hell. I didn't buy it though, such a loving mark-up. I'll buy that poo poo on the eBay, gently caress you old thalidomide baby newsagency proprietor.
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Dec 30, 2011 06:36
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I just finished the new one, it was ok. I laughed at certain things such as Hey reader don't expect me to just tell summarize what happened to the world after I saved JFK. I was too upset. Ok, so here's basically a summary of what happened after I saved JFK. And the poundcake reference just reminded me of what I hated about Sammy Hagar in Van Halen. But there were other moments that really hit home for me. The one I am thinking of right now was when Jake/George called Harry's sister and she said, "Are you him? The guy who saved him? Because where were you when he died in Vietnam you son of a bitch?" That got to me. There were a few other moments like that, too (for me); but I rushed through the book in a hurry and it's not settled yet. The ending was ok, but mostly unsatisfying for me. There's always that weird feeling in a time-travel story when the ending is something of a reset. I know it's dumb, but there is always that nagging voice saying, "Why did I read all of that if none of it exists except in one dude's memory?" Simplistic, I know. Color me shocked that S.K. has a writer son name Joe Hill and that there's a The Shining sequel coming out? P.S. - Bag of Bones the miniseries was loving execrable and all could do was laugh at it. They made a tree that looked like a naked woman. At least they didn't include the weird tank-track/corkscrew tread/wtf-ever all terrain wheelchair, or the DeVore's big daughter is his cross-dressing son or... and you know I really enjoyed the book. There were some spots in there that really made my hair stand up, and of course the huge downer ending. I thought about it a lot as the romance bloomed between Jake/George and Sadie. P.P.S. - If they gently caress up Under the Dome as bad as they did Bag of Bones I'm gonna be pissed. P.P.P.S. - This was my first Kindle read. I don't like how slow it is if you want to search for something page-by-page, but it has other tools. It's really a cool little device and it's very nice my sis bought me a Christmas gift that's cool for once. Mostly she just gets me random shirts that I never wear. Happy New Year! [final random thought]I recently re-read N. and I gotta say it's one of the most awesome things he's ever come up with. Really great![/edit] Dr. Faustus fucked around with this message at 07:19 on Dec 30, 2011 |
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Dec 30, 2011 07:16
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Dr. Faustus posted:P.P.S. - If they gently caress up Under the Dome as bad as they did Bag of Bones I'm gonna be pissed.
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Dec 30, 2011 07:26
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H.P. Shivcraft posted:Well The Stand is overtly Christian. His theme of evil constantly undoing itself is also a trope grounded in Christian theology, though that can be chalked up to cultural inheritance more than his specific beliefs. I'd say Desperation was one of the most christian-y of his books. If his actual beliefs were reflected in his writing I'd guess he was a Gnostic. "God is cruel. Sometimes he makes you live." and all that.
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Dec 30, 2011 07:45
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Goddam, is it just me or does King put like 10% of his book in parentheses? I noticed it on like the 2nd page of 11/22/63 and randomly flipped around and there are all these half-thoughts in parentheses. So I actually grabbed other books and theres a shitload of them in everything, it seems. STOP USING SO MANY PARENTHESES STEPHEN!! The lion approached and smelled the blood in air (human, otter blood had more of a tangy quality)... Frank unhooked Lisa's bra (blue, just like Grandmas) and dropped it to the floor.... Gina drove to church because Bishop Hugecock always comforted her (though she was aware his interest in her was very "biblical" in a certain way)...
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Dec 30, 2011 18:50
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Oh yeah, he does that a LOT. I just chalk it up to being part of his style - I could see it even in older books like IT and The Shining.
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Dec 30, 2011 22:11
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Joining the just finished 11/22/63 club. After Under the Dome this one is a let down. The first 250 pages are good - the setup and the first two visits to the past got me pumped for the rest of the book. It felt like a good ol' Stephen King book with a weird and interesting premise, clear-cut characters, and a trim plotline. Then...Jake gets to Jodie and twiddles his loving thumbs for 300 pages or so. Yes, "stuff happens" in that time, but it's all pointless. Then the climax kicks in and things get moving again, but it's not enough to save the book. The more interesting ideas like the Green Card Men and the Dallas-Derry connection of EVIL are left unexplored in favor of melodrama and dancing to "In the Mood" for the tenth time. Like I said in an earlier post, it felt like I read the fifth draft of something that needed 8 or 10 to get it into proper shape.
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Dec 30, 2011 22:21
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I've been sick, so reading new stuff requiring thought was out of the question and I figured I'd reread Bag of Bones. I shouldn't have done it, it used to be one of my favorites and now I cannot stand Mike Noonan. I blame the miniseries, but oh my god I just want him dead now. 'The book was big, okay? The book was major.' or whatever. 
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Dec 30, 2011 22:23
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I found that I never liked Mike Noonan once he started to recover from his grief. As awful as it sounds he was a lot more interesting floundering about unable to write and crying in Derry than he was when he started to recover and was on the TR. When he starts talking about Kyra and how he meets her on the road there is half a page of hand-wringing about an assumption he makes about what her mother is going to be like; cheaply clothed, probably going to yell at the kid and physically harm her, then says he would have to put himself in the way of her mothers anger if she was going to show up like that and it sounded like the thought processes of a total prick. From then on all I could imagine was a rich dude = remember, not rich by John Grisham standards, because he couldn't write anything other than mid=best sellers, but still one of the richest guys in town, thank you very much = fighting with another rich dude over who gets to have their say over Mattie and Kyra. Mattie is held up like a cause and from then on it's up to this rich white guy to save her from her mean life because he's sick of doing crosswords and has money to burn. Then the rich white guy starts getting jealous when the attorney he hires falls for Mattie and he wrings his hands about that for a while, thinking he still has time to make a move because the attorney can't while he is representing her but it's okay folks, she does want the rich old guy after all and Mikes a smug little prick about that too. What was it that he said he imagined sex with her would be like? Being packed deep in mud? Yep, one hell of a guy, just looking out for the concerns of those poorer than he is, a sexually frustrated crossword addicted failing writer version of Robin Hood except this time he aims to give it to the poor in the biblical sense. So nope, never liked Mike. We were all introduced to him while he was in shock over the death of his wife, then the grief kicked in and he was still an interesting character, but once that is over I really felt like he was just some rich douche who seemed to think that his new book was the most important and precious thing in the world and to even move wou8ld kill it, while staying almost killed the kid. Shuddering at old ladies, having a laugh about his Yankee maintenance man, imagining that his dead wife would criticise the size of Matties breasts after accidentally brushing them when loading Kyra back into the car, good 'ol Mike, the hero of the day. Good thing for Mattie that he came along when he did because she was the one on the road and he could save her with his bank account. Wow, that's a lot of words about the guy. I knew I didn't like him but not to that extent.
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Dec 31, 2011 00:34
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H.P. Shivcraft posted:Also, a popular story King tells involves Kubrick's filming of The Shining. Kubrick calls him at some ungodly hour and asks him if he believes in God; King thinks for a moment before saying yes. Kubrick says he doesn't and hangs up. Oh, Darwin Bless Stanley Kubrick  . Sounds like something he might do.
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Dec 31, 2011 02:00
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At that stage in his career I imagine time and space itself were of no concern for Kubrick. If he had a question that needed to be asked he asked it, whether that meant an associate or someone in another time zone asleep or his personal assistant who he had sent to Tanzania to get him a coffee on a whim.
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Dec 31, 2011 02:36
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Local Group Bus posted:Wow, that's a lot of words about the guy. I knew I didn't like him but not to that extent. No, it's actually how I feel about him now so I don't mind the words. I think I'm also just increasingly tired of the trope about a man needing to swoop in and fix the life of a woman, whose sole contribution to the situation is a "don't you root for us" speech and some stupid dancing here and there. Mike's the money and the brains while also being an acknowledged poo poo husband who never really had a clue what was going on with his wife. But most of all I just get tired of Noonan-ism talk, like the way he has to slide in stupid jokes that Stephen King must have chuckled at while typing it up. Just, oh god, shut up old man. I'd better not reread Pet Sematary next because if I ruin that book for myself... 
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Dec 31, 2011 02:43
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Maybe King needs to do some part time work in the real world to get some better grist for the mill. Dude's probably too old now though but I know he does a lot for charity so maybe instead of reaching into his pocket he could do some work on the front-lines. I'd imagine being a full time writer over such an extended time would dull a feel for non-writers and their concerns which might explain a lot when it comes to either repeating the same characterisations or misfiring when he does try something new. King worked in a mill, then taught for a while then gave that up to write full-time. We've had stories based on working in mills, and teachers as protagonists and, obviously writers, so maybe the man needs to follow Thomas Hardy and other authors who did their best work "among the people." I just imagine King as this retiree who still wears the work uniform and potters around with his craft at home not letting the outside world in and causing some kind of entropy. Basically, Paul Sheldon as King still in bed being led to the table to write because that's how the craving stops.
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Dec 31, 2011 03:07
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JustFrakkingDoIt posted:I'd say Desperation was one of the most christian-y of his books. If his actual beliefs were reflected in his writing I'd guess he was a Gnostic. Well, in a Time interview from a couple of years ago, King said that "I was raised in a religious household, and I really wanted to give God his due in [Desperation]." He went on to argue that "you can still reconcile the idea that things are not necessarily going to go well without falling back on platitudes like 'God has a plan' and 'This is for the greater good.' It’s possible to be in pain and still believe that there is some force for good in the universe." http://entertainment.time.com/2009/11/09/stephen-king-on-his-10-longest-novels/#desperation-1996
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Dec 31, 2011 03:46
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Local Group Bus posted:I just imagine King as this retiree who still wears the work uniform and potters around with his craft at home not letting the outside world in and causing some kind of entropy. I'm not entirely sure why he shies away from it because it's not as though a writer whose character is blue collar sits and devotes chapters to what's going on at work, but I get a lil tired of "rich dude who has oodles of time to deal with scary stuff" plotlines.
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Dec 31, 2011 03:50
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The problem is that King is now that character. Rich dude with oodles of time to deal with scary stuff is pretty much the more successful horror writers curse. I think it's his ear for dialogue that suffers the most from this. From the silly in-speak in Liseys story to the way the kids in Dome talk, King seems to be more interior driven with his writing than exterior. Does he talk to his family that way when they get together? Urgh, horrible thought. I hope he gets it all back for Dr Sleep or the new King/Straub book but at the moment I'm feeling a little weary of King so I hope Straub takes the wheel on the latter and brings it up to the level of something like A Dark Matter or Lost Boy/Lost girl which are both fantastic and kills most recent King by the first fifty pages.
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Dec 31, 2011 04:04
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