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Snollygoster posted:What surprised me was how Hussie clubbed the reader with Dirk's being-gay-ness. He's left enough hints in the writing up to this update to convict a criminal. I'm not saying he "shouldn't" have gone with being this direct! What I'm saying is it felt like Hussie going "HERE, DO YOU GET IT, STUPIDS?" Eh, there were still a lot of MSPA forumites arguing over how only the autoresponder was gay (what?) and/or how Dirk being gay was just ironic and not a real thing at all. I'm not at all surprised that Hussie decided to bring out the hammer for this one. I mean Hussie outright said "Kanaya, from a human perspective, is a lesbian" and fandom types are still arguing over whether she really is or not, so I'll let him do just about anything where this stuff is concerned. EDIT: It's like that whole "no, dumbasses, Gamzee is not Lord English" derail he went on, but involving Dirk and with way less self-inserting. dumb brunette fucked around with this message at 06:15 on Jan 22, 2012 |
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Jan 22, 2012 06:08
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S.S. Le Sign is an anagram of Signless.
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Jan 22, 2012 06:18
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Pessimism posted:That wouldn't make sense, since people were speculating that Bro was gay since the beginning of time. From talking to a lot of people, it appears that him basically mentioning it at all is both a.) incredibly shoehorned and inorganic and b.) massive pandering. Without launching into a whole rant I am pretty sure this is directly related to how loving warped society is about sexuality (especially homosexuality in men). Edit: Basically, what dumb brunette said. 'Clubbing over the head' appears to mean 'removing any slender hope to keep believing that Hussie is trolling and he's not gay'. Cabbit fucked around with this message at 06:38 on Jan 22, 2012 |
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Jan 22, 2012 06:35
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Cabbit posted:From talking to a lot of people, it appears that him basically mentioning it at all is both a.) incredibly shoehorned and inorganic and b.) massive pandering. Without launching into a whole rant I am pretty sure this is directly related to how loving warped society is about sexuality (especially homosexuality in men). But he didn't mention it, Roxy did.
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Jan 22, 2012 06:36
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Hussie, not Dirk. Him as the author.
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Jan 22, 2012 06:38
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Hanks Lust Cafe posted:But he didn't mention it, Roxy did. Yeah, Dirk at no point ever confirms Roxy's assumptions. He just takes the Karkat route of "is that a thing? does it gotta be a thing?" It sounds more like he's just without labels or something and doesn't care. Or he's gay but doesn't care. Or he's asexual but doesn't care. It doesn't matter because the only thing he ever says at any point is that he doesn't care. All it really confirms from a fandom perspective is that Dirk probably would just find it really funny to be put in lots of pairings. (People were shipping him with Jake before he even had a name.)
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Jan 22, 2012 06:40
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quote:TG: ok but terminology aside i dont think im off base! That is pretty clearly him saying "I don't see how me being gay has to be a thing". That is, grammatically, what the pronoun "it" refers to. If this was about anything other than his orientation, I cannot possibly fathom this being a thing.
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Jan 22, 2012 06:42
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Plus it's known that Dirk over-intellectualizes everything, so I don't think it's a stretch to interpret this as him questioning labels while still being gay/liking men.
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Jan 22, 2012 06:45
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Dirk is whateversexual and will have had sex with every other character by the end of the comic. It will be hailed as one of the finest post-modern works.
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Jan 22, 2012 07:43
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quote:TG: why you need to suck the fun out of poo poo Dying here.
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Jan 22, 2012 07:55
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Pastrymancy posted:What gets me curious is how media plays into this. It doesn't seem to be well-known by most other people that Alpha Rose/Dave are dead, if I read Roxy's last log correctly. That's something that I'd like to see elaborated on in future updates. I'm pretty sure you misunderstood it. Roxy has been trying to tell Jane that her mom is dead (I assume the same with Dirk's bro) and Jane wont believe her because of their appearances in the media, which I assume is some sort of Crocker plan with fakes or clones or some poo poo. e: I dont think I'd ever understand this comic without people to talk it over with.
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Jan 22, 2012 08:08
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Cabbit posted:That is pretty clearly him saying "I don't see how me being gay has to be a thing". That is, grammatically, what the pronoun "it" refers to. If this was about anything other than his orientation, I cannot possibly fathom this being a thing. Or it could just be the way a gay teenager talks about it when they're insecure and worried it might be seen as their defining trait. It rang true to me. And I don't think this is Hussie going "see? This comic is progressive!" The timing is a bit sus, but it's also the first time we saw Roxy and Dirk talking (I think?) and Roxy's already shown how she feels and responds to boys. She's blunt enough to outright say something like that, so it didn't feel out of character (nor did Dirk's reaction). I dunno, I don't feel like it's pandering, maybe a bit more obvious than normal, but it's not like it wasn't foreshadowed. This is actually why I didn't really want him to be gay, all the drat discussions about it. But yeah, these were some interesting updates, raised a lot of questions (and only answered one that was pretty much irrelevant.) e: Oh wait, I think I get the point you were trying to make: unless Hussie specifically said it there would be people too willfully obtuse to notice anything like subtlety. Because having a guy being gay in the story would just ruin everything. That is... immensely awful if true. Starmaker fucked around with this message at 09:32 on Jan 22, 2012 |
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Jan 22, 2012 09:28
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Starmaker posted:Or it could just be the way a gay teenager talks about it when they're insecure and worried it might be seen as their defining trait. It rang true to me. I'm surprised actually. The majority of people on tumblr are actually insisting that he's really straight :O. The arguments being made are also terrible. The worst I think was "Dirk doesn't like slutty drunk girls, he's just letting Roxy assume he's gay so he doesn't have to explain why he's turning her down. If he was really gay he'd actually say it himself." I have a feeling that this is going to be something that will be debated a very very long time but will only actually be a very minor plot point in the comic itself. There's already fanart though of Roxy hitting on Dirk and him just completely ignoring her.
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Jan 22, 2012 10:09
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I'm pretty sure Dirk is just adopting the troll perspective of sexual orientation, since it's already apparent troll culture influences this world immensely. So the answer to the "Is he/she gay?" question is the same for him as it was for Kanaya.
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Jan 22, 2012 10:15
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Silva posted:I'm pretty sure Dirk is just adopting the troll perspective of sexual orientation, since it's already apparent troll culture influences this world immensely. So the answer to the "Is he/she gay?" question is the same for him as it was for Kanaya. ... But for Kanaya the answer was, by word of Hussie, "from a human perspective she's definitely gay." VV A lot of people had feelings like this during the Hivebent stuff. Though your wording is a little .... dumb brunette fucked around with this message at 10:58 on Jan 22, 2012 |
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Jan 22, 2012 10:30
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So I've been reading homestuck for a while, not entirely crazy over it, but still interested enough to reread it casually to find out what's going on with timelines and such. Reading the MSPAWiki articles helped a lot, too. That's why it resulted strange to me today, that for the first time, I was actually annoyed at the comic. "Oh, hey there Frigglish. He greets you with a sly, conspiratorial purr, almost as if he was privy to what you dreamt. Which is impossible of course." Ok gently caress we know it the cat is important shut up about it already. And then whoop de loving do, the cat was a red herring all along, "OH HUSSIE PLEASE STOP TOYING WITH MY EMOTIONS I HATE YOU SO MUCH UNNGGHH PLEASE SEX ME" posts all over the net... THEN SEVEN BILLION COMICS LATER hey the cat had bullshitium all along and ties these 4 other events together, which themselves tie into etc... I'm wondering if I'm just being a shithead or becoming a bit bummed by the currently slow pace of the story. I'm just surprised that after so long, I finally started to view this thing negativelly, is all. Anyone been through something similar? ArfJason fucked around with this message at 10:45 on Jan 22, 2012 |
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Jan 22, 2012 10:39
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I... don't actually know what your problem with the cat is? But yeah I think at one point or another we all hit a bit of a wall and want the drat story to hurry along. For most of us that was 5.1 with the trolls, but that turned out to be important and pretty necessary (well. Most of it.) Homestuck's not perfect, and I don't think seeing it as perfect is needed in order to enjoy it - clearly that's not your problem, but I think most people here are aware of its flaws, or at least that it has flaws. But yeah, there are some pacing problems definitely. It could just be that the switch in focus from the main kids to the Scratch kids has put you off somewhat. You can either try to bear with it (if you really aren't enjoying them) or just forget about the comic for a couple months then come back and do an archive binge; hopefully by then it will have returned to what you enjoyed.
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Jan 22, 2012 10:58
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You're just being a shithead, sorry.  VVVVVVV: Actually, it is I who is the shithead 
Tollymain fucked around with this message at 11:27 on Jan 22, 2012 |
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Jan 22, 2012 10:59
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Starmaker posted:But yeah, there are some pacing problems definitely. It could just be that the switch in focus from the main kids to the Scratch kids has put you off somewhat. Yeah, I'd think it has to do with that too, but it's not the cat itself, it's that for the first time I found myself rolling my eyes at what's there written on the comic. I generally find the self referencing and subtle foreshadowing cute and clever, but basically "Hey, the cat is so totally important (He's not! (;D)))" rubbed me the wrong way a bit. And lately I've been seeing it more and more. Tollymain posted:You're just being a shithead, sorry. 
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Jan 22, 2012 11:22
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I remember feeling the same way with the reveal that Aradia was dead all along. And also the reveal that both sessions were a part of the same one. Sometimes the self-referencing gets a little heavy-handed. It got better. I don't think it's symptomatic of a downward spiral, every now and then he just tries a joke that doesn't go off so well. Personally I don't mind the cat parts, probably a good part of that is because I just like cats and believe, somewhere deep-down inside, that they have magical powers. Also, we all pretty much know exactly what's going to happen with Jaspers: he'll be combined with the BARK code to make the GCat. And then somehow die and be sent back to Rose. And Hussie knows we know that, so he's just playing around with those expectations like he always does - it's so even when we know what's going to happen there's still some element of surprise. Really, the biggest question mark of the whole thing is what GCat will become, or what his purpose is in the story.
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Jan 22, 2012 11:44
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KoB posted:I'm pretty sure you misunderstood it. Roxy has been trying to tell Jane that her mom is dead (I assume the same with Dirk's bro) and Jane wont believe her because of their appearances in the media, which I assume is some sort of Crocker plan with fakes or clones or some poo poo. ...this is one alternative I can think of to the whole "B2-Rose-Mom is somehow secretly dead" scenario. While we assume that Roxy assumes that B2-Rose is her mom, the fact of the matter is that Rose is, (ecto)biologically, the daughter of Roxy in both universes. They just appeared and were adopted in different orders in the two universes. And Roxy apparently knows about appearifiers and ectobiology. So maybe when she's talking about her Mom being dead, she's not talking about her adoptive Mom, B2-Rose, but somehow knows she's adopted and thinks her biological mother is dead? But that would be simple to explain to Jane, so it's probably not the case.
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Jan 22, 2012 11:44
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Based on her "you just know" feeling, maybe she's subconsciously starting to remember the B1 universe?
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Jan 22, 2012 11:54
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Starmaker posted:I remember feeling the same way with the reveal that Aradia was dead all along... See this is what I want, some rational post, thoughtful and respectful! Not some random dude calling me out on my douchebag ways and- Tollymain posted:VVVVVVV: Actually, it is I who is the shithead I am... BECOME the shithead (Really though, no harm done bro, don't beat up yourself about it  )
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Jan 22, 2012 11:57
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FebrezeNinja posted:Based on her "you just know" feeling, maybe she's subconsciously starting to remember the B1 universe? That's a possibility! We do know the Signless had some flashes of quasi-memory going on, so it's definitely something that can happen to some extent. (If this turns out true, whoever pointed out Signless <-> "SS Le Sign" above can pat themselves on the back. Though of course that might be a serendipitous coincidence even so.)
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Jan 22, 2012 12:01
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quote:TT: And need I remind you, So, does this mean we're going to have another Davesprite?
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Jan 22, 2012 12:19
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Starmaker posted:But yeah I think at one point or another we all hit a bit of a wall and want the drat story to hurry along. For most of us that was 5.1 with the trolls, but that turned out to be important and pretty necessary (well. Most of it.) One of my friends who was a fan of Homestuck told me today that he's stopped reading. When I asked him why, he said that he'd already been through all this stuff at the start of the story, it just felt like a rehash for no particular reason and he was going to wait till it was all finished to read. While I don't really agree with him (certainly not enough to stop reading) I totally understand where he's coming from.
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Jan 22, 2012 12:19
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Oh yeah, I just remembered a thing I was going to point out: the term "antediluvian." Dirk used it twice, once in reference to the word "gay," and once in regards to the letters r and k. What the hell does that even mean? (Antediluvian means "before the flood," in reference to the Great Flood of Noah's Ark fame. It even made its way into scientific texts as recently as Victorian times, but in general refers to anything ancient or in the distant past.) He's probably referring to a time before the Condesce and her NWO, possibly with trolls or just troll influence. Antediluvian usually means something from the ancient past in contrast to the modern day. So, saying the idea of being gay is antediluvian (and his "read history books" remark) would imply troll ideas of romance being applied to humans. The thing that confuses me is that r and k would be antediluvian, do they just not use those letters anymore? (Clearly they do, since both Jake and Roxy use them). Either that or he just likes the word because he's a smug know-it-all.
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Jan 22, 2012 12:24
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Starmaker posted:Oh yeah, I just remembered a thing I was going to point out: the term "antediluvian." Dirk used it twice, once in reference to the word "gay," and once in regards to the letters r and k. What the hell does that even mean? Wait, what? When'd the latter happen? I can only find one instance of the word on the entirety of mspaintadventures.com, in his response to Roxy's "too bad he's gay" remark.
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Jan 22, 2012 12:39
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Ah, my bad. It says diluvial symbols. It stuck out to me at the time as being very strange, but I never got to say anything because of the whole racestuck thing. http://www.mspaintadventures.com/?s=6&p=006367 So, what, did the trolls teach them to write? e: I remember thinking at the time that Roxy's last two symbols were chromosomal, and it was an obvious link. Calling R and K diluvial made no sense to me, what do they have to do with floods? But this last update puts it in a bit of perspective: antediluvian referring, presumably, to pre-troll (or at least pre-Condesce), so diluvial would obviously mean post-troll. VVVVVVV Oh yeah. Layers upon layers. Starmaker fucked around with this message at 13:06 on Jan 22, 2012 |
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Jan 22, 2012 12:56
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Starmaker posted:e: I remember thinking at the time that Roxy's last two symbols were chromosomal, and it was an obvious link. Calling R and K diluvial made no sense to me, what do they have to do with floods? But this last update puts it in a bit of perspective: antediluvian referring, presumably, to pre-troll (or at least pre-Condesce), so diluvial would obviously mean post-troll. Well, R and K are part of the BARK code. The "flood" thing does tie in nicely with the Empress being a sea troll and all. Never thought of that.
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Jan 22, 2012 13:04
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"Flood". "Ark". edit: to make this post longer than two words, I'm dying to know what the huge thing in Jake's inventory is. Going to go out on a ridiculous limb and suggest it's a battleship. Maybe the wreck of the Condesce's, salvaged/stolen by B2 Jade at some point. Hamiltonian Bicycle fucked around with this message at 13:15 on Jan 22, 2012 |
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Jan 22, 2012 13:05
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Also, r/K selection species. Trolls are r type, humans are K type.
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Jan 22, 2012 13:40
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Antediluvian is an uncommon but still used adjective that simply means reactionary or backwards and has an air of high handed insult to it. You occasionally see political commentators or academics use it, its one of those old words that has unexpected impact and makes you sound well read. Dirk is effectively saying that Roxy calling him gay is possibly offensive, probably old fashioned, that she's an idiot to do so and that he's smart enough to use the word antediluvian. ed: http://www.economist.com/node/18745417 - The Economist calling the Dutch SGP antediluvian, a hardline Calvinist party that only admitted female members in 2006 annatar fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Jan 22, 2012 |
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Jan 22, 2012 16:13
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Hamiltonian Bicycle posted:edit: to make this post longer than two words, I'm dying to know what the huge thing in Jake's inventory is. Going to go out on a ridiculous limb and suggest it's a battleship. Maybe the wreck of the Condesce's, salvaged/stolen by B2 Jade at some point. As soon as i saw it i thought it was the green sun because it instantly reminded me of this
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Jan 22, 2012 16:40
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Hamiltonian Bicycle posted:edit: to make this post longer than two words, I'm dying to know what the huge thing in Jake's inventory is. Going to go out on a ridiculous limb and suggest it's a battleship. Maybe the wreck of the Condesce's, salvaged/stolen by B2 Jade at some point. I'm just gonna make a longshot vote and say it's the sylladex itself. I'm not sure how that works, but I don't care.
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Jan 22, 2012 16:59
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annatar posted:Antediluvian is an uncommon but still used adjective that simply means reactionary or backwards and has an air of high handed insult to it. You occasionally see political commentators or academics use it, its one of those old words that has unexpected impact and makes you sound well read. Yeah, it means old fashioned or outdated. It also means "Look at my big vocabulary  ".
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Jan 22, 2012 18:24
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Antediluvian also has connotative connections with Dirk's bizarre fascination with showers.
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Jan 22, 2012 19:01
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I'm liking the connection with the deluge. Did you know that Masis is the Armenian name for the peak of Mount Ararat? Not really ironing out much in the way of answers or even foreshadowing, but everything new we see about this universe sets the tone that things may be more hosed up than we could imagine.
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Jan 22, 2012 19:36
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In the category of poo poo Hussie Probably Didn't Know But Is Neat Anyway: You don't even have to turn bark into ark to have the godcode/boat connection. Barque is an archaic word for a boat.
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Jan 22, 2012 20:13
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True. I mainly brought up "ark" because the question was what "rk" and "diluvial" have to do with each other, though.
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Jan 22, 2012 20:18
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