|
Im right there with you, I think BB's long rear end combos are cool, but I can see why somebody wouldn't.
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2012 23:05
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 15:37 |
|
|
I don't think long combos are bad at all but BB could definitely expedite this process by like...having a faster game speed? Like there's really no reason for someone to be trapped for a significant amount of in-game seconds by Arakune that then ends in a 4-5 second long super. Dante in MvC 3 falls into this category as well
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2012 23:10
|
|
|
One and the Same posted:What is it about BB that makes it get so much poo poo from the FG community at large? I'm not asking this to be devisive, I genuinely don't know. I hear some people call ot needlessly complicated, others call it too easy, but when I press my SF playing friends for a reason why they don't like it Im given a list that might as well be entitled 'Things that differentiate BB from SF'. Is it VG elitism? Is there something that actually makes it inferior for competitive play? I have friends that used to not even give it the time of day at all but who actually now enjoy the game after learning how it works and getting experience with it beyond what some guy on SRK said. Everyone thinks there is a big conspiracy against the BB community especially after they got left out of Evo main stage, but the fact is that the BB community is online only and doesn't show up to majors. Even when there was big support and prize pool contributions.
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2012 23:20
|
|
|
40 OZ posted:Everyone thinks there is a big conspiracy against the BB community especially after they got left out of Evo main stage, but the fact is that the BB community is online only and doesn't show up to majors. Even when there was big support and prize pool contributions. I actually consider poor turnout to be a pretty good reason not to host it at EVO. \/  \/
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2012 23:23
|
|
|
NecroMonster posted:Hell, I find it easier to do combos in GG than in BB, just to throw my 2c in. Outside of really obnoxious FRC timings, 4x clean hit sidewinder, and I-no. Actually, combo timing is specifically a bitch in BB because of (as mentioned) the unique way they handle hitstun decay. See, normal games with HSD reduce hitstun by the moves used, but BB also reduces hitstun by the timing of the moves used, so if you do AABBCCDABC but your second A is late/early by a frame or two it'll cause the combo to drop around or just after the first set of C's. Hitstun Decay is a frustrating system enough when there is the looming mystery of "is this combo impossible or am I just loving it up," but BB's version borderlines on random combo length.
|
|
#
?
Feb 24, 2012 23:56
|
|
|
Actually, BL, while that was the case in CT, from CS on it's been just by hits. I had a video somewhere comparing a Bang combo which included starting FRKZ in the middle of it for both CT and CS. In CT, it dropped because of the aforementioned timing thing, but in CS, it went through fully, let's see if I can find it again. Edit: vvv This is why I went back to a square gate after being on an oct gate for a while. It really does help you lock into position nicely. ACES CURE PLANES fucked around with this message at 00:45 on Feb 25, 2012 |
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 00:12
|
|
|
Zip posted:But ya what games can you recommend to warm me back into the fighting genre before SF tekken? Did I miss someone suggesting Melty Blood? Anyway, there's also a functional reason to prefer a square gate - diagonals are actually easier to hit with them. Once you figure it out, DP motions are really easy on a square gate.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 00:12
|
|
|
Also with BB the general evolution of the game has been pretty "bleh". After CT level of power Arc Systems never put anything that was "bullshit" back into the game and it was pretty frustrating. CT was fun but terrible, and most of the good stuff got nerfed to hell (Arakune is the only set of changes I agree with). I liked how retarded Nu and Rachel were and was like "man if Tager or whoever get that level of stuff that'd be awesome". Then the nerf train cometh. The bullshit worked pretty well despite how "slow" the game was. There were a lot of failsafes so the most ridiculous stuff was actually pretty reasonable. Like, CT bullshit was a higher level grade bullshit than any game but Marvel 2 or Guilty Gear and was sometimes in it's own leagues, but with a slower system that was a bit more forgiving. I think it kind of balanced out. Anyway my least favorite parts of BB are the combo length vs damage and oki system. The combined effort of the two make the game pretty glacial. Bread and butter combos should NEVER take more than 5 seconds.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 00:25
|
|
|
Boxman posted:Did I miss someone suggesting Melty Blood? I'm the typical Melty Blood enthusiast, but it's honestly not a good game to learn how to play SFxT. Melty Blood does own, though, and you should play it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 01:19
|
|
|
Waterbed posted:CT was fun but terrible Yeah that's pretty much my take on it. BB showed a lot of promise, but they ended up going in the complete opposite direction I was hoping for. The worst for combo length VS damage was CS Rachel. Long rear end 30 hit combos that do like 10% life. I'm actually kind of looking forward to P4U (or I guess it's P4A now?)... it looks WAY faster than BB and has all kinds of extra bullshit systems in it, including rolling and short hops and air turns. And the return of Dust too.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 01:26
|
|
|
Nobody's ever going to bring out a game as simple as ST ever again, are they? 
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 01:31
|
|
|
Crackbone posted:Nobody's ever going to bring out a game as simple as ST ever again, are they? ST? Pfft that game was ruined by Supers and Throw Softening. Give me some World Warrior simplicity.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 01:34
|
|
|
Boxman posted:Anyway, there's also a functional reason to prefer a square gate - diagonals are actually easier to hit with them. Once you figure it out, DP motions are really easy on a square gate. Easier diagonals is the main reason why I prefer square gate on 3D games. Trying to play Soul Calibur on a circle gate is pretty irritating.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 01:42
|
|
|
Brett824 posted:A lot of people have gripes with the community that actually does play BlazBlue, not even the game itself. I remember Fanatiq was telling a story about how he really wanted to learn BlazBlue but then encountered so much elitism on the DustLoop forums that he just decided not to. There can't be a community with more elitist jerks than Third Strike. I can understand Guilty Gear, but BlazBlue's guys seem okay if you can avoid the "odd ones." The fight nights in my area had dudes who were mostly chill, and gladly gave you advice when they slapped you silly.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 01:52
|
|
|
Schmendrick posted:There can't be a community with more elitist jerks than Third Strike. Agreed. In no other game have I been constantly told to "stop playing my game!" The mentality makes my head hurt.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 02:09
|
|
|
There can I find a quanba q4raf for the cheapest price? Play asia? My old SE stick is starting to age. I think the mount or the screws or something have gotten stripped because it makes the worst noise and gets loose so I gotta open the drat thing and tighten the screws holding the stick in after playing marvel for like 5 mins. I've been thinking about getting a q4raf for forever and now I think I will finally bite the bullet and not be a cheapskate on my sticks because I'm getting tired of my current one crapping out.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 02:20
|
|
|
I think BB is a good example of how "fixing" a game can actively make it less fun to play. Everyone who played CT knew it was unbalanced and in many ways broken, but I still really enjoyed the game. Things were significantly evened out in CS, but I felt like I was only playing CS for the time I spent with it because it was the sequel to CT. I still haven't touched CS2 and doubt I'll ever play Extend. Balance does not necessarily equal fun. It's also pretty difficult to get excited about watching a game of BB these days. It is almost catatonic. Oh here comes another fifteen second combo for 3500 damage. There was a time when it was easy to get excited about Mike Z's Tager, Bang's ridiculous super, a Hakumen player managing to get in on Nu. Not so much now.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 03:09
|
|
|
Crackbone posted:Nobody's ever going to bring out a game as simple as ST ever again, are they? I've been wondering why no wants to do this. There seems to be genuine desire for a simpler, less system mechanic and more character driven fighter, but no one seems to want to make it. The big name guys are doing what they do, and all the indie designers seem to want to make juggle-and-air-dash games.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 03:30
|
|
|
No one is doing it because no one would buy it.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 03:33
|
|
|
Brosnan posted:No one is doing it because no one would buy it. To be honest, I don't think this is the case at all. You just can't call it "Street Fighter".
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 03:39
|
|
|
Gammatron 64 posted:There can I find a quanba q4raf for the cheapest price? Play asia? PlayAsia is certainly one of the cheapest places I found. I ended up getting it from Gremlin Solutions as they are based in the UK and I like to support the little guys. Plus PlayAsia bit me in the arse once when I wanted to return something. Sometimes paying that little bit extra is worth it for the peace of mind. Mega Comrade fucked around with this message at 03:45 on Feb 25, 2012 |
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 03:41
|
|
|
Periodiko posted:I've been wondering why no wants to do this. There seems to be genuine desire for a simpler, less system mechanic and more character driven fighter, but no one seems to want to make it. The big name guys are doing what they do, and all the indie designers seem to want to make juggle-and-air-dash games. You can't put "No system mechanics!" on the back of a box or pitch it to reviewers/publishers and expect to achieve anything.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 03:51
|
|
|
Periodiko posted:I've been wondering why no wants to do this. There seems to be genuine desire for a simpler, less system mechanic and more character driven fighter, but no one seems to want to make it. David Sirlin found his true calling in tabletop games and/or hasn't discovered kickstarter yet.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 03:51
|
|
|
Brosnan posted:No one is doing it because no one would buy it. SF4 isn't significantly more complex than ST though, it's just bad.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 04:13
|
|
|
Periodiko posted:I've been wondering why no wants to do this. There seems to be genuine desire for a simpler, less system mechanic and more character driven fighter, but no one seems to want to make it. The big name guys are doing what they do, and all the indie designers seem to want to make juggle-and-air-dash games. I think there's kind of a weird balance of factors going on here. A game like SF4 can be relatively simple systems-wise and still be popular because it's slow and forgiving and accessible (and named Street Fighter). But once you start talking about two games that are both fast-paced, unforgiving and skillful, I think most people will end up preferring the one that gives you a greater variety of ways to be good at it -- or maybe "more ways to have a chance" would be a better way to put it. Or maybe I'm overthinking it and fighting games with complex systems are just a more interesting and fruitful design challenge than "do SF2 better than SF2." Not to mention what happened to the last guy who tried that. 
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 04:23
|
|
|
Tokyo Slutty Gal posted:SF4 isn't significantly more complex than ST though, it's just bad. For someone who clearly doesn't like SF4 you certainly talk about it a lot. Don't get me wrong you post some informative stuff too but you do bring up how bad you think it is an awful lot.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 04:24
|
|
|
Periodiko posted:I've been wondering why no wants to do this. There seems to be genuine desire for a simpler, less system mechanic and more character driven fighter, but no one seems to want to make it. The big name guys are doing what they do, and all the indie designers seem to want to make juggle-and-air-dash games. There was a game like this, Akatsuki Blitzkampf (and it owned), but no one plays it now.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 04:26
|
|
|
taser rates posted:There was a game like this, Akatsuki Blitzkampf (and it owned), but no one plays it now. That game is boring as hell because no one actually has any interesting tools and it also looks like rainbow barf. There's maybe like 3 characters that are actually interesting.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 04:29
|
|
|
Did the last revision get released outside of arcades? they sure added a bunch of unnecessary visual poo poo to that game. The older PC versions of the game where pretty reasonable in visual feedback at least. vvv That's strange to hear. I played the PC versions for like a little bit. What happened to the game to make it so different? ThePhenomenalBaby fucked around with this message at 04:39 on Feb 25, 2012 |
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 04:29
|
|
|
I'm not talking about the latest revision (En-eins perfektewelt, which is a completely different game that happens to have the same characters), I'm talking about the one that was released for PC (Akatsuki Blitzkamp) and the subsequent arcade revision, Ausf Achse.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 04:37
|
|
|
ImperialGuard posted:Game knowledge is an important thing. You don't want to sound like Adam Sessler that one time he did commentary at EVO. Boxman posted:Don't get too caught up in play by play. poo poo happens too fast, and commentary where you're just narrating is bad commentary. Thanks, guys! Yeah, I'm going practicing a lot to brush up on the mechanics and whatnot. Also, and I guess this is SC specific, how important would you say knowing button inputs for moves are? To me, it would just seem awkward to be constantly going "Left, right, right, A" etc. I guess that would fall into the "narrating" aspect.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 04:55
|
|
|
Blitzkampf is fun if you like playing advanced Rock/Paper/Scissors. Until you realize that the two best characters (Akatsuki, Marilyn) have retardedly good Rock (Overhead/Low) and that Paper (Reflector, which acts like parry with punishable recovery)) isn't even that good vs them. From either of their overheads midscreen, you'll eat 25% and get pushed to the corner. In the corner, you'll eat 40% off a BnB for no meter. If they have their Level 3 supers up, they can cancel the last hits of their BnB to tack on an extra 4-5k damage. So you lose the guessing game and then eat a 80% damage combo once you get pushed into the corner. Fair. (Really, though, if you just want to mash around with most of the cast, it's pretty fun.)
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 04:56
|
|
|
It also let you play as a goddamn demon tank. Which seems rather meh these days now that you can play as goddamn Galactus in UMVC3.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 05:01
|
|
|
PunkBoy posted:Thanks, guys! Yeah, I'm going practicing a lot to brush up on the mechanics and whatnot. Also, and I guess this is SC specific, how important would you say knowing button inputs for moves are? To me, it would just seem awkward to be constantly going "Left, right, right, A" etc. I guess that would fall into the "narrating" aspect. I haven't watched a lot of competitive SC5 yet but I wouldn't expect to hear that level of detail. I think that as long as you can tell what *type* of move is being used (e.g. launcher, horizontal, vertical, poke, etc.), you'll be fine.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 05:19
|
|
|
I just think the reason why BB players don't show up to offline tourneys is because they're too poor to travel. Or maybe they're just socially awkward/lazy.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 05:26
|
|
|
taser rates posted:There was a game like this, Akatsuki Blitzkampf (and it owned), but no one plays it now. I played it today for like an hour with some friends actually, Marilyn Sue status still stupid good. I play all the anime games...all of them. interrodactyl posted:Blitzkampf is fun if you like playing advanced Rock/Paper/Scissors. This is more true with Akatsuki, Marilyn does the same damage mid or corner, the midscreen combo is easier too. It is more like 65%-70% damage at most unless your playing against that Nun or some poo poo. Akatsuki is like 3S(anime edition), and in much the same way there is no doubt they are the best characters but if you know the game engine better you can win with pretty much anyone.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 05:33
|
|
|
DiscoJ posted:I haven't watched a lot of competitive SC5 yet but I wouldn't expect to hear that level of detail. I think that as long as you can tell what *type* of move is being used (e.g. launcher, horizontal, vertical, poke, etc.), you'll be fine. The main problem with trying to commentate SC5 is it's a game comprised almost entirely of match-up knowledge. It almost helps to know your opponent's movesets more intimately than your own. I know this goes for any fighter, but it's less pronounced when things are more universal (eg - c.rh generally sweeps, that uppercut was probably a shoryu motion with invincibility/priority, that sort of thing) so if you are watching a character doing stuff for the first time, you are probably just repeating "what the gently caress is that?" over and over. In this way I think 3D fighters are inherently more difficult to commentate for one who doesn't play much. "You can get more out of that", "he did the best punisher he could", "that stun is shake-able!", etc. are all things you probably won't know. That doesn't mean you still can't rock it. Good luck!
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 06:09
|
|
|
Fixing BB did ruin a lot of the fun for it. I had a ton of fun learning CT Haku-men and grindng out difficult matchups, my best friend played Arakune and that matchup is like threading the needle. I remember going to the arcade and dethroning a complete rear end in a top hat that played v-13, that matchup was something absurd like 80-20 in his favor, but I had trained for it so much that I crushed him. And then CS came out and all his normals changed around and I lost interest :/ Just goes to show that too much balancing just makes games homogenous and takes away from the sweet, sweet hype.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 10:00
|
|
|
PunkBoy posted:Thanks, guys! Yeah, I'm going practicing a lot to brush up on the mechanics and whatnot. Also, and I guess this is SC specific, how important would you say knowing button inputs for moves are? To me, it would just seem awkward to be constantly going "Left, right, right, A" etc. I guess that would fall into the "narrating" aspect. From what I've seen, it seems like Soul Calibur commentators generally refer to moves by numpad notations - for example, left right right A as 466A (I think). This is quicker than saying the move motion the normal way, but you'd probably have to explain it to people so they aren't completely lost. I don't think it's that important if you don't want to bother memorizing a billion moves, though.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 11:29
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 6, 2024 15:37 |
|
|
Tokyo Slutty Gal posted:SF4 isn't significantly more complex than ST though, it's just bad. It is far more complex than ST. You've got EX moves, Ultras, focus attacks (and FADCs), quick getups, a much more convoluted juggling system, longer combo chains, and plinking. Sure it's not GG, but there's a ton of stuff dumped on top of the something like HF or ST.
|
|
#
?
Feb 25, 2012 14:22
|
|