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Two Finger posted:It's just different worlds, different focus altogether. I guess there would be some crossover with the engineering side of things, but I don't know that much about Navy training - and from what I understand they get a lot of contractors in anyway.  Like you said, the engineering stuff must be very similar (except for the nuclear subs), but I imagine most of the day-to-day of a deck officer can't be very different, either. It's a lot of moving from point A to point B in the ocean, isn't it? And painting, a lot of painting.
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Mar 2, 2012 03:10
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FrozenVent, you want to answer this one? I'm an engineer so I really can't comment on deck officers.
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Mar 2, 2012 03:15
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From the Navy vets I've talked to who are in the engineering program and who did engineering work in the service, each of them had a fairly specific focus on a certain type of equipment, be it reactors, propulsion equipment, auxiliary equipment, electrical equipment, etc.
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Mar 2, 2012 03:18
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Two Finger posted:FrozenVent, you want to answer this one? A) merchant officers also take care of cargo. That's how we make money. On cruise ships, they have different tasks but they still have to deal with commercial operations. B) the bridge team on a commercial vessel is 3 persons or less. Usually less. I'm not sure how many people the navy needs to drive a boat, but I got a feeling it's more than that... So yeah, it's pretty different on the deck side too.
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Mar 2, 2012 03:24
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Navy uses contractors a lot and carries a much larger crew than a merchant ship. Merchant ships use contractors as well but the engineers can usually perform the work being done. When you have 200 men instead of 20 and every one of them needs something to do, you tend to have one guy doing the same specific job. The upper ranks have a better understanding usually of the bigger picture. You also have larger room for error, eg; you can kill two or three fire teams and still be able to deal with the situation. On a merchant ship losing anyone can make life difficult.
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Mar 2, 2012 04:29
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pazrs posted:I'm on a 255m bulk carrier, that is coal powered! One of only two in the world. Pics to come, any questions ask away. Gladstone - Weipa run?
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Mar 2, 2012 07:10
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StopShootingMe posted:Gladstone - Weipa run? Yeah boy! Sorry for the delay, Well since you guys are good seafaring folk, I'll go one better then pics and upload a documentary filmed at the time of construction! Excuse the lovely quality and quiet audio, its from a 1983 VHS. Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Anb43yp98J0 Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55s2OikWLhw The two vessels (sisters) are the River Boyne and the River Embley. They carry bauxite from Weipa to Gladstone (then return in ballast) in Queensland, Australia. All coal handling is pneumatic and ash handling is vacuum and fairly unreliable. If it worked well, us engineers would almost be out of a job because everything else is rock solid. Coal capacity is 3300 tonnes and we burn about 200 a day. The control room doesn't really look like that anymore, its all touch screen interfaces to siemens PLCs. Mitsubishi thought they were going to change the world with these ships, then they didn't sell any more. They probably lost money with all the R&D involved. Anyways back to work, cleaning inside a condenser. Found a sea snake in there!
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Mar 2, 2012 07:38
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This is fantastic, wish I could get my hands on this beast. Thanks a ton for the video.
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Mar 2, 2012 07:51
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Two Finger posted:I read the GBS thread for a while and it made me so angry I had to stop. The worst part is when you realize that there are probably many more such internet experts in other threads, we just can't tell because we're not ignorant in this specific case  O/S here. It's 106 miles to the Baltic Sea, my bank account is far too empty, I got a half a pack of cigarettes, it's a Ship Construction and Stability lecture ... and the lecturer has been telling us about his kids for the past 30 minutes  Hit it.
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Mar 2, 2012 08:35
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pazrs posted:
Hahaha, what in the gently caress? When you say condensor do you mean A/C condensor or what?
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Mar 2, 2012 08:38
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Two Finger posted:Hahaha, what in the gently caress? Steam ship Condensor SW condenses steam
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Mar 2, 2012 09:16
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Two Finger posted:Hahaha, what in the gently caress? Nah steam condenser mate, its split in two so you can run on half at light boiler load and clean the other side. It's usually done every six months or so. It's sea water cooled so you get a lot of hard growth (gooseneck barnacles) as well as fire weed and poo poo.
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Mar 2, 2012 09:17
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How bad is it/old is the ship again? Do you need sawdust or anything? Although since its split it should be easier to plug leaks I guess.
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Mar 2, 2012 09:25
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lightpole posted:Steam ship Spot the guy who's used to diesel/electric cruise ships...
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Mar 2, 2012 09:35
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lightpole posted:How bad is it/old is the ship again? Do you need sawdust or anything? Although since its split it should be easier to plug leaks I guess. Its in good nick, shes 1982 vintage but built well. Must be Yorcalbro or something. Of the 1000+ plus tubes (guessing) about about 4 or 5 are plugged.
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Mar 2, 2012 10:52
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how does military sealift command works? are the ships owned by the US navy then crewed by civilians or are they chartered from shipping companies.
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Mar 2, 2012 16:55
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Trench_Rat posted:how does military sealift command works? are the ships owned by the US navy then crewed by civilians or are they chartered from shipping companies. I think MARA owns them and has shipping companies operate them in some cases and runs them directly in others but I never thought about this.
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Mar 2, 2012 18:59
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Trench_Rat posted:how does military sealift command works? are the ships owned by the US navy then crewed by civilians or are they chartered from shipping companies. Civilian Merchant Mariners crew the vessels and the vessels resupply Navy vessels. MARAD owns some, and others are owned by commercial shipping companies where the ships are contracted out to MSC, or some combination of the two. Just look at MSC as a very large civilian contractor for the Navy. Not a big fan of them.
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Mar 4, 2012 02:51
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Fish Shalami posted:Not a big fan of them. I get that from a lot of American mariners I've spoken to, that's all I know about them except for advertisement in Professional Mariner and the like. What's so bad about them? Government jobs here (This usually means the Canadian Coast Guard) are pretty much the easy track to retirement. Outside of their apparent inabillity to supply timely reliefs, which, these days, is all the companies.
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Mar 4, 2012 03:23
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FrozenVent posted:I get that from a lot of American mariners I've spoken to, that's all I know about them except for advertisement in Professional Mariner and the like. What's so bad about them? Government jobs here (This usually means the Canadian Coast Guard) are pretty much the easy track to retirement. Main complaint from my friends was you could only apply for a relief after a certain time period like 3 months and then it would be at least 3 more months before you got one, most likely longer. I know Im good for 3-4 months and start to get a little weired after that but somewhere around 6 months is my mental limit.
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Mar 4, 2012 03:30
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pazrs posted:Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Anb43yp98J0 I justgot around to watching this. Ok, the first half of it, you can only watch so many "The Building of the MV X..." videos before they all turn into the same thing. 16 kts is hella fast for a bulker, we trudge around at 12 knots or so all over the lakes... Maybe 14 on a good day with a good day. That whole pneumatic thing sounds like a gigantic pain in the rear end to maintain, tho. Do you know what the consumption would be for 12 kts? That coal handling system is pretty cool, but at 200 tons a day, I can see why it didn't catch on... Most of the boats I've been on burn about 30 a day, every ton of fuel you have to carry is a ton of cargo you can't load... And nobody pays you to carry fuel! Kind of surprised those boats got assigned to a bauxite run... On a coal run, I can see the whole coal-burning thing being the perfect thing. lightpole posted:Main complaint from my friends was you could only apply for a relief after a certain time period like 3 months and then it would be at least 3 more months before you got one, most likely longer. I know Im good for 3-4 months and start to get a little weired after that but somewhere around 6 months is my mental limit. Jesus Christ, they expect people to do a six months run? In 2012? In a civilized country? They're loving nuts. I just did 3 and a half and I was going batshit toward the end. I've done five when I was a cadet, and that probably caused permanent harm to my psyche.
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Mar 4, 2012 03:50
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lightpole posted:Main complaint from my friends was you could only apply for a relief after a certain time period like 3 months and then it would be at least 3 more months before you got one, most likely longer. I know Im good for 3-4 months and start to get a little weired after that but somewhere around 6 months is my mental limit. As a cadet I get to see the MSC make offers to literally the entire graduating class who will even talk to them, and even then no one takes the offers, and this is at the backwoods academy.
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Mar 4, 2012 07:21
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shovelbum posted:As a cadet I get to see the MSC make offers to literally the entire graduating class who will even talk to them, and even then no one takes the offers, and this is at the backwoods academy. I went to a career fair MSC was at in '10 when there wasn't much around and I needed work and they told me they only wanted people right out of school. Im betting the people they hired are the same group 2s I saw in the hall last summer.
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Mar 4, 2012 07:50
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I'm not sure how it is on the MSC front exactly but that time frame sounds about right for a navy deployment, at least a carrier. I imagine it's tough to get replacements due to the Navy's operation cycle as well as the general climate of the industry. No idea really though, I'm just on the navy side of things and I know we had the same ship do unreps for us every week for a good solid 4 or 5 months v  vAlso this thread is great without it I would have never looked at the maritime academies. Definitely planning on going down this road when this enlistment's done.
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Mar 4, 2012 07:53
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FrozenVent posted:I justgot around to watching this. Ok, the first half of it, you can only watch so many "The Building of the MV X..." videos before they all turn into the same thing. The official service speed is 16 kts, we probably average 13-14 as we have to navigate the great barrier reef. Coal makes sense in a couple of ways, Australia has a poo poo load of it. The port of Gladstone is a big coal hub so its always available and the same company that wants the bauxite exports the coal so economically it works for them. I don't know what would be a comparable HFO consumption to be honest.
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Mar 4, 2012 08:16
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pazrs posted:Coal makes sense in a couple of ways, Australia has a poo poo load of it. The port of Gladstone is a big coal hub so its always available and the same company that wants the bauxite exports the coal so economically it works for them. Yeah, I guess if the charterer also does coal, it makes sense that they might as well burn their own poo poo. I don't know how much a steamship burns in HFO, but a diesel powered boat of similar size would burn something like 30-40 tons a day for a comparable speed. Maybe a bit less. (You can usually ballpark lake boats at a ton an hour, plus two tons of MDO a day.) Never been through the Great Barrier Reef, it's something I'd like to see someday.
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Mar 4, 2012 18:01
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Got to look around the Badger engine room for a few hours today. The chief down there gave us a great tour, considering none of us had ever really spent time on a steamship. Their fuel system: Coal is brought on by truck and is stored in bunkers low in the ship. A conveyor system brings the coal to a crusher. The crushed coal is lifted again and fed using screw augers into small day bunkers. This is fed by gravity to automatic stokers, which throw more or less coal using paddle wheel type throwers into the furnace according to the position of a plate. When the fire burns to ash, the ashes are dumped through a series of flip-up grates into a pit below. A fireman with a long hoe then rakes these ashes into an opening connected to a pipe where an eductor is pulling some vacuum to suck the ashes out, mix them with water, and dump them overboard.
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Mar 7, 2012 23:26
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Thanks all for answering my silly Navy-comparison questions. I would also like to thank whoever recommended Mighty Ships. I watched the Emma Maersk episode, and I finally understand why the Somali pirate situation is such a big deal. It's right there at the entrance to the Red Sea! 
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Mar 11, 2012 03:34
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Anyone ever worked for Stabbert Maritime? They just offered me a gig on a Fisheries Research vessel out of the west coast. It's probably hunting whales for all I know.
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Mar 17, 2012 04:18
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Fish Shalami posted:It's probably hunting whales for all I know. Take it then send me a photo so I can troll the gently caress out of Sea Shepherd. Speaking of Sea Shepherd... When we were offloading sludge in Sydney I had a bit of a yarn to the guy and he was telling me they got a call from them. SS: We need to offload some sludge, heard you guys are the only ones in town? Guy: Yep, just let us know how much you need to discharge. SS: Er, what do you need to know that for? Guy: Well, let us know how much so we can work out a price for you. SS: You won't be charging us, though. Guy: What? SS: We're a charitable organisation, you won't be charging us. Guy .... Yeah look thanks for the opportunity but maybe you should find someone else to help you.
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Mar 17, 2012 08:45
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Fish Shalami posted:Anyone ever worked for Stabbert Maritime? They just offered me a gig on a Fisheries Research vessel out of the west coast. It's probably hunting whales for all I know. The company I work for used to do electrical support on Dan Stabberts vessels and I was working in his yard last week. Having said though i've never sailed on any of his boats, I do have friends that do and a few that have in the past and they are all pretty positive about the working for Stabbert Maritime. Only downside....can't find parking within a country mile of his freaking yard.] edit/ The ballard waterfront is a pretty tight knit community and i've been in the thick of it for many years, if there were any glaring issues with his company or being employed by his company i'd know, and gladly pass it on.
potentiometer fucked around with this message at 13:07 on Mar 17, 2012 |
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Mar 17, 2012 12:57
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Alright, let's say a guy has a chief mate unlimited, four years of 3rd / 2nd experience aboard bulkers and self unloaders, no tanker time at all, six months as a cadet on a cruise ship six years ago, and decides he needs a change of scenery. Any suggestions of jobs that don't involve finishing your watch covered head to toe in aggregate? I'm going to paper the cruise industry and possibly a few off-shore seismic jobs, but I was wondering if anyone had any cool suggestions. Or an employer who offered a recruitment bonus and hires Canadians, I'm cool with that too.
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Apr 3, 2012 15:24
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You get hold of my contact, FV?
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Apr 4, 2012 04:59
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Two Finger posted:You get hold of my contact, FV? Yeah, today's going to be "National Stop Procrastinating Day", I'll write to him this afternoon.
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Apr 4, 2012 12:03
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FrozenVent posted:Yeah, today's going to be "National Stop Procrastinating Day", I'll write to him this afternoon. National for Canada, right, so I don't have to stop procrastinating?
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Apr 4, 2012 12:12
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shovelbum posted:National for Canada, right, so I don't have to stop procrastinating? The US is gonna implent it next year or something.
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Apr 4, 2012 12:16
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Has anyone been on a DP shuttle tanker and do you think it would be a good time for a deck cadet? I've possibly got a chance to get on a DP shuttle tanker on my last sea phase (deck cadet) and was wondering if anyone could advise me as to whether I should go for that or try and get more time on LNG for the gas endorsement? I would have thought a bit of DP time during the cadetship would be an advantage but its not necessary for the basic dp course so I dunno. Ideally I'll have time to get both but scheduling is a nightmare; I'm sure I'll come out of the cadetship with enough time for the oil endorsement, dp or not, but the gas could be time constrained. In the long term would you recommend going down the dangerous cargo route or the DP route?
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Apr 10, 2012 16:21
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DP DP DP DP DP DP DP DP DP DP DP What I'm trying to say is, get your DP papers. If you can get your LNG endorsment, that's a big plus, but if you can get your DP and your foot in the door at a DP outfit, who'll likely then hire you and then pay for your DP course, go for the DP. DP's not booming the way it was a few years ago, but holy gently caress if you can get your DPO, get your loving DPO, why are you even asking about this. And your tanker endorsment, obviously. LNG's nice, but the bloom is off of that too - How many UK flags LNGs are there anyway? Edit: Since this is SA, I should probably specify that DP stands for dynamic positioning.
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Apr 10, 2012 16:33
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FrozenVent posted:DP's not booming the way it was a few years ago, but holy gently caress if you can get your DPO, get your loving DPO, why are you even asking about this. And your tanker endorsment, obviously. This was my main concern about the job market (which to be honest I am pretty clueless about at this early stage); almost every British cadet I talk to wants to go for DP but none even seem to think about LNG (none of my sponsor company's oil/gas/chemical tankers are UK flagged), even though there are a lot of LNG tankers on order. Everyone's going to have DP, although I think a lot of them will also take shore jobs at the earliest possible chance.
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Apr 10, 2012 16:56
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You can work regular with a DP cert in your pocket, you can't work DP without a cert. I'm not up to the second on the DP market, since I don't have my papers, but I doubt off shore drilling is going away anytime soon. That said, check out http://www.dpoperators.org/, they probably have info on the situation. As to LNG... Yes, it's a great cert to have. Get both if you can; the market was absolutely loving insane a few years ago. Don't know what is it like right now, but you really have to find out how many are actually hiring UK officers at a decent pay rate. I could probably go work on a supertanker next week, even with my poo poo rear end baby tanker papers, but I'd make 25 grands a year. gently caress that poo poo. Try to get both, but my personnal opinion is to get oil and chemical -> DP -> LNG, in that order of priority, unless you really really really want to work on an LNG. That said, I don't know jack about the UK market, the DP market, the LNG market or much of anything. I'm talking out of my rear end for I am, as they say, a deck officer. Also, everyone is gonna go to the office as soon as they can, and about a third of your first year class will be sailing two years after you graduate. Your class, like every classes ever, is not an accurate representation of the market.
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Apr 10, 2012 17:22
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