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This is pretty much why I posted on the thread in the first place. I don't know any better and want to make sure my speed shop isn't full of poo poo. I was under the presumption that I was making 275ish at the wheels stock, and the intake, downpipe, Q300 exhaust, and pro tune had me at 345. That's what the dyno report said anyway. (I'll scan and post it once I get home from vaca) I have to think that they know what they're doing, but I'm naive and impressionable. Their tuner (Andy Brahy) had some good history when I looked him up, and they are always working on Skylines, Vipers, and mostly subarus, so people trust them. They also sponsor a lot of winning cars at local time attacks and track events. They have the car right now, but haven't started the job yet. I'd really like to make sure I'm not getting ripped off, should I stall them up and get some specifics on what Garrett model they're looking at and validate that they're talking real numbers? Now that I'm dropping big bucks, I want to make sure I'm not buying ebay bolt ons and having 13 year olds who don't know what they're doing performing an engine rebuild on my much loved mid-life crisis.
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Mar 10, 2012 16:54
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Plenty of dynos read low/high. It isn't uncommon on NASIOC to see someone say something like "a stock 2012 STi reads 220 whp on this dyno," followed by then whatever whp they were able to put out. Something like this http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2112090
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Mar 10, 2012 17:45
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I did notice a change around '08-'09 when COBB's dynos went from reading 200-210whp for a stock STI to 230-240whp, and other shops seemed to follow suit. That's when we started seeing Stage 2 cars dyno at 300+whp on 93 octane.. it's just a number.
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Mar 10, 2012 17:55
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Does anyone have a "definitive" answer to the average loss between crank and wheels? I kind of believe the 230 whp for a stock STi because thats ~24.5% loss. I mean, if you went to a dyno and it said 400 whp stock then 500 whp (barring adjustments to the dyno) with mods/tuning added, it seems like you could reasonably claim a 25% increase over stock. Scale 305 by 1.25, and you get 381 hp at the crank. Now, if we had a good number for transmission loss, we could scale our derived crank hp by that number, lets say 24.5% (cause its all I got) and you get 287 derived whp, even though your sick dyno plot says 500. I've never had my car on a dyno, nor do I operate dynamometers so  But, take amandyke's car for example. Running an upgraded turbo and supporting mods seems like the dyno he's using may be low, and perhaps a more accurate number could be found by scaling his observed gains against the one thing we "know for sure" which is stock at the crank its "305" and then incorporating drivetrain loss.I could be totally off base here, but I *think* it makes sense.
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Mar 10, 2012 18:41
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I have a '99 2.5rs with 147k miles and have been looking for new suspension. Luckily enough, I found a new set of koni inserts for my car on craigslist last night for $300 and just got back from picking them up. I'm trying to keep the suspension replacement inexpensive, how would the konis perform with my stock springs and tophats? The car is a daily driver and I was pretty content with the stock suspension (when it was new). If it'd be worth it, I wouldn't be heartbroken about spending another $1-200 on better springs or tophats. dyne fucked around with this message at 18:56 on Mar 10, 2012 |
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Mar 10, 2012 18:54
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THE BLACK NINJA posted:I cant believe that. That puts loss between crank and wheels at more than 33 %. I don't think floo roo is really getting 345 at the wheels either but... cmon with that. Obviously my experience is limited to what my tuner has used and seen. His dyno puts a bone stock STI at ~210-220whp and a 2.0l wrx at around 170whp. That puts drivetrain loss in the 25% area. THE BLACK NINJA posted:But, take amandyke's car for example. Running an upgraded turbo and supporting mods seems like the dyno he's using may be low, and perhaps a more accurate number could be found by scaling his observed gains against the one thing we "know for sure" which is stock at the crank its "305" and then incorporating drivetrain loss. My tuner also applies a 10% deduction to the final number his dyno spits out to match with what his road dyno's read. So if you want to, add 10% to all the numbers I'm spitting out and that's probably what other dyno's would read for similar cars. So with that extra 10% my car makes 301whp/335torques accounting for driveline loss (assuming 25%) at the crank would be 376bhp/418btorques Amandyke fucked around with this message at 21:47 on Mar 10, 2012 |
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Mar 10, 2012 21:38
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Whelp, it looks like my 08 STI has a blown piston ring again. For those of you not keeping score at home, that would be blown engine #3 in this car (first was spun bearing, second was blown piston ring). Now, I do autocross the car but on this last engine I have tried to be extra good and put a few gallons of 100 octane in it every time I do anything like autocross, I have a 91 octane map I run on the Accessport and I try not to hit the rev limiter too much. Even so, driving home the other night I noticed the car was shaking a lot while idling at a stop sign. When I got home I opened the oil filler cap and sure enough there was excessive smoke coming out. Now when I crank it I can hear it skipping a beat like the starter isn't getting resistance from one of the cylinders. To top it off, while driving it yesterday the check engine light came on and it went into limp mode. I uninstalled the AP after that and after a bit more driving the CEL came on again. I plan to take it to the dealer sometime this week but have a bad feeling they won't cover engine #4 under warranty, even though engine #3 has less than 6k miles on it. Here's what I'm thinking my options are: 1. Take it to the dealer and they cover engine #3 under warranty. Drive the car for another year or so while still under power train warranty then hopefully trade in for a BRZ before it blows up again. 2. Take it to the dealer and they don't cover it under warranty. Take it to an independent shop and have them modify the engine to be more reliable (forged pistons, etc.), keep the car and drive it forever like I originally planned when buying it. My question is, if I take it somewhere else on my own dime, what should I have them do to keep this from happening again and what should it cost? I don't want to do any crazy power mods or anything, stock power has been fine for me, I just want it to be reliable and not have to worry about it blowing again. I originally bought this car new expecting to drive it until the wheels fell off but with all of these engine failures I've been planning on trading it in to get a BRZ before the power train warranty runs out. That isn't for a while since I've had it a little over 3 years and it's got a little over 35k miles on it. I figured I had some time for the hype to settle and for them to become more available before I trade it in for one, but if I'm going to pay to fix it right I'm going to keep it.
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Mar 11, 2012 15:33
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Lazor posted:lovely day Have you had an accessport and uninstalled it before bringing it in with the previous motors? That definitely sucks. Any other power mods? It seems like you could get a basic build for 3-4K based on Floo roo getting a big turbo and all types of poo poo for 7K but that is just an parametric estimate off of Floo roo and other such EJ257 failure threads I've seen.
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Mar 11, 2012 17:05
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Hey you know what, dyno numbers are loving dumb as poo poo. You can easily fudge numbers and scaling to have a dyno give a pinto 1000hp. Dynos should be used to set of a baseline of YOUR car. Make some changes and see what you gain. You should ALWAYS get a baseline dyno of your car before a tuner starts futzing with it and make sure he doesn't gently caress with load settings or scaling.
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Mar 11, 2012 18:59
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Dynos...stupid?! SupraDynoGraph.mov https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lq-jflRymHk
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Mar 11, 2012 19:15
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Lazor posted:Whelp, it looks like my 08 STI has a blown piston ring again. Have you looked into lemon laws in your state?
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Mar 11, 2012 19:55
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THE BLACK NINJA posted:Have you had an accessport and uninstalled it before bringing it in with the previous motors? That definitely sucks. Any other power mods? I got the AP after the first motor went and installed it after break in on the second one. I tried to be good to the second one so it wouldn't have any problems but the AP and 100 octane at autocross wasn't enough. I uninstalled it before I took it in after the second one blew but drove it around for a while before I actually took it. I heard that when you uninstall it the ECU has to go through some re-initialization checklist or something and if that's not done it will throw a red flag with the dealer. They didn't say anything about it and ended up covering it under warranty so I guess that worked. All I've done as far as engine goes is the AP running a Stage 1 91 octane map and a K&N filter. BoostCreep posted:
I haven't looked into it but this car has also had it fair share of other problems that have been covered by warranty. The transmission had to be rebuilt when 3rd gear went out, they had to replace the AC a while ago because it wasn't working and they tried twice to fix it unsuccessfully, the ipod dock I didn't even want when I bought the car doesn't work right anymore and the expensive mirror I was forced to buy because it was already installed fell off the other day due to some stripped threads. I'm worried that if I claim lemon law they look too far into it and see that I autocross sometimes and they'll say it failed due to "racing" and not cover anything.
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Mar 11, 2012 20:16
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I changed my oil for the first time (1600 miles) and.. well.. Probably never again. You save what, 30 bucks? get filthy, risk your life crawling under your car that you jacked up in what you think is probably the right place (I am not a smart man). Finally finish only to spend 30 minutes trying to get the plastic shield thingy underneath the engine bay re-attached. You know taking that thing off is pretty easy, but when you want to put it back on, good luck figuring out which of the 16 holes drilled through it actually have a receptacle for a bolt behind them  It was worth learning how to do though, thanks Subaru owning co-workers for a "fun" day. It didn't help that the first yokel decided to undo the drain plug and take off the filter at the same time with a pretty small oil pan and I had to change my oil with my back pressed into his mess. We had some cardboard to lay down but my hair still managed to get some dirty 5w-30 in it. At least we had beer.
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Mar 11, 2012 20:33
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Lazor posted:my car is a lemon Good lord, I've owned multiple Subarus and never had a single issue, but if half of that ever happened to me I'd dump the car at the nearest dealership and never buy another Subaru again.
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Mar 11, 2012 20:47
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Lazor posted:I'm worried that if I claim lemon law they look too far into it and see that I autocross sometimes and they'll say it failed due to "racing" and not cover anything. I wouldn't worry about that.
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Mar 11, 2012 21:02
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Wendigee posted:I changed my oil for the first time (1600 miles) and.. well.. This is why I only do my own work on my motorcycle. Cars are a pain in the rear end.
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Mar 11, 2012 22:56
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Wendigee posted:I changed my oil for the first time (1600 miles) and.. well.. With some ramps and practice it takes less than 30 minutes, which beats a trip to the dealer to me. Dealers forget to put oil in and leave filler caps off sometimes as well.
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Mar 12, 2012 01:27
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Lazor posted:Whelp, it looks like my 08 STI has a blown piston ring again. That sounds amazingly frustrating. The 2.5 turbo motors could all benefit from better pistons. Where are you located? At the very least you should have someone tear it down, machine it, and have new pistons, bearings, and rods put in. I'd do that even id they give you a new short block. Is that what they've been doing, or just replacing broken pistons? That will give you a solid foundation to either build on later, or at least solve the weak piston issue for good. Pistons will give you the durability to drop in a bigger turbo etc down the road without this headache returning. I'm impressed with your good spirit. There is no reason a stock car with an AP stage 1 map can't take autocross. This happens so often it's strange Subaru hasn't done something about it. Must a be a cost benefit ratio.
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Mar 12, 2012 04:34
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Lazor posted:Whelp, it looks like my 08 STI has a blown piston ring again. For those of you not keeping score at home, that would be blown engine #3 in this car (first was spun bearing, second was blown piston ring). Now, I do autocross the car but on this last engine I have tried to be extra good and put a few gallons of 100 octane in it every time I do anything like autocross, I have a 91 octane map I run on the Accessport and I try not to hit the rev limiter too much. Even so, driving home the other night I noticed the car was shaking a lot while idling at a stop sign. When I got home I opened the oil filler cap and sure enough there was excessive smoke coming out. Now when I crank it I can hear it skipping a beat like the starter isn't getting resistance from one of the cylinders. To top it off, while driving it yesterday the check engine light came on and it went into limp mode. I uninstalled the AP after that and after a bit more driving the CEL came on again. I plan to take it to the dealer sometime this week but have a bad feeling they won't cover engine #4 under warranty, even though engine #3 has less than 6k miles on it. Here's what I'm thinking my options are: I'm really not certain the generic Cobb tune is any safer than the stock tune, as I'm pretty sure I blew up two pistons rings on the stg 1 ACN map. If warranty doesn't cover it, the way to prevent it is forged pistons and a conservative dyno tune. -- That said, if you're under warranty, I'd expect it to be covered. Your dealer is getting paid a healthy chunk of change to replace/rebuild your motor from subaru. Unflash it and bring it in. After 6k mi, it is almost more likely to be just a defect (not counting the cheapass pistons a defect) nm fucked around with this message at 04:50 on Mar 12, 2012 |
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Mar 12, 2012 04:48
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(((k))) posted:That sounds amazingly frustrating. The 2.5 turbo motors could all benefit from better pistons. Where are you located? At the very least you should have someone tear it down, machine it, and have new pistons, bearings, and rods put in. I'd do that even id they give you a new short block. Is that what they've been doing, or just replacing broken pistons? That will give you a solid foundation to either build on later, or at least solve the weak piston issue for good. Pistons will give you the durability to drop in a bigger turbo etc down the road without this headache returning. The first time they replaced the longblock and the second time they replaced the shortblock, each time put the car in the shop for about a month. The transmission put it in the shop for a month as well so for the 3.5 years I've had it it's spent over 3 months at the dealer. I'm thinking I'm going to try and pursue the lemon law angle first (if anyone has any tips regarding how to do that please let me know). If that doesn't work they'll hopefully still fix it under warranty and then I'll drive it until I can trade it in for a BRZ. If they won't cover it under warranty I'll build up the engine a bit to be more reliable, but at this point that's my last resort. If I go the build the engine route a dyno tune will be in the mix as well. I was actually running the Perrin 91 octane map (I'm in CA and we only get 91), I heard it was better than the Cobb one. That last time I blew a ring it was the one time I had switched to the Cobb tune to try it out, haven't touched it since.
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Mar 12, 2012 04:57
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How the hell did a transmission put you out of commission for a month? Mine was completely borked on my '02 and they turned the car around for me in about 5 business days.
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Mar 12, 2012 05:12
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Lazor posted:I was actually running the Perrin 91 octane map (I'm in CA and we only get 91), I heard it was better than the Cobb one. That last time I blew a ring it was the one time I had switched to the Cobb tune to try it out, haven't touched it since. because Cobb has a different tune for CA. If you're keeping the car get a dyno tune ASAP after the pistons are done. bull3964 posted:How the hell did a transmission put you out of commission for a month? Mine was completely borked on my '02 and they turned the car around for me in about 5 business days.
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Mar 12, 2012 05:41
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I ran stage 1 and stage 2 AP on my '09 STI for about 6 months each without any problems at all. I used the ACN/91 maps and avoided places like Arco for gas (I'm in LA). One of my friends has been running the same maps on his '07 WRX for 4 years without a hitch. If your engine has blown that many times it sounds like a lemon to me for sure.
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Mar 12, 2012 09:13
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Lazor posted:Lemon law angle I have gone this route before, there is some criteria that needs to be met before you are eligible for a states official protection. This is really a mediation between you and the dealer to either buy back your car or fix it for good if possible. You can also hire a consumer protection attorney who will contact Subaru (FHI) and sue for some amount to satisfy your inconvenience. I don't know California law but you probably don't pay attorneys fees if you win or lose. If they really replaced what you said, they are being pretty reasonable so far. Also, if they have always supplied a loaner that affects eligibility for lemon law which I assume they did. It is however bullshit and sounds like either poor fuel, you may be pushing it too hard, or incredibly bad luck.
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Mar 12, 2012 16:06
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This is why I made the decision that I loved the car enough to go for the engine rebuild and forged pistons. The service manager at subaru was a douche, so I went for the rebuild to negate this issue from happening again. Sorry for what you're going through. I'm sorta glad I said "screw the warranty" and went for the rebuild. I'll be back in 1 month with pics and dyno export. Should be interesting to say the least.
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Mar 12, 2012 16:20
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So I've been having a problem with my 98LGT (automatic) that's been annoying the gently caress out of me. It started about a month ago, it was making a whining noise on deceleration, but not cruising or acceleration. It's been getting gradually worse, and now whines at almost all times except hard accel. If I'm cruising at a constant speed for a while, it will shut up. But as soon as I decel it will start again and not go away until I cruise at a constant speed for a few minutes. It annoys the hell out of my girlfriend, so therefor pisses me off too... It doesn't make any difference when I use the brakes or corner. The noise is almost definitely coming from the rear. The back wheels don't have any play, side to side or in/out. And when I rotate them it doesn't feel or sound like a bad bearing. I drained the diff, it was very slightly low, but not anything I'd worry about. The gear oil came out slightly dark, a deep amber colour. And it smelled like gear oil. Not burned, etc. The magnetic plug had normal very fine goopy dust on it. No shiny bits or shards, anything like that. Cleaned it up and added new gear oil to no change. What the hell is wrong with my car?!
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Mar 12, 2012 17:14
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Dumb maintenance question: how much ATF should I need to do two cars? My Haynes manual has the capacity as 9.3 liters but the order page at Fred Beans parts claims you only need 5 quarts. I'm assuming that's for an Impreza, but that still seems like a big gap. Also, is there a better place to get OEM fluids than FBP?
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Mar 12, 2012 19:47
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When you drain the trans from the plug on the oil pan it only dumps out about 5qt. A couple qt stay in the torque converter, cooler lines, innards of the transmission.
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Mar 12, 2012 19:54
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Can you guys give me a vote of confidence for using Tire Rack? I want to pull the trigger on a set of wheels and tires, but am a little worried over complaints that it is an absolute disaster if they screw something up. Checking around locally, Tire Rack has a better price by $300.
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Mar 12, 2012 20:27
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War Bunny posted:Can you guys give me a vote of confidence for using Tire Rack? I want to pull the trigger on a set of wheels and tires, but am a little worried over complaints that it is an absolute disaster if they screw something up. Checking around locally, Tire Rack has a better price by $300. For wheels though, they are great (brick and morter can't match as they don't have those wheels). CS is very good.
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Mar 12, 2012 20:34
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War Bunny posted:Can you guys give me a vote of confidence for using Tire Rack? I want to pull the trigger on a set of wheels and tires, but am a little worried over complaints that it is an absolute disaster if they screw something up. Checking around locally, Tire Rack has a better price by $300. I've ordered 3 sets of tires, and one mounted on wheels from them, always been perfect.
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Mar 12, 2012 20:36
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I don't have access to Discount or America's Tire and I've never had anything go wrong with Tire Rack. They're excellent. My only complaint is that if you order suspension bits from them you obviously can't do stuff like have them dynoed to make sure you got a matching set of struts, etc, but that's not really a concern for highly repeatable items like tires and wheels.
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Mar 12, 2012 20:36
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War Bunny posted:Can you guys give me a vote of confidence for using Tire Rack? I want to pull the trigger on a set of wheels and tires, but am a little worried over complaints that it is an absolute disaster if they screw something up. Checking around locally, Tire Rack has a better price by $300. I am a handful of a customer and they were really helpful and patient. I got a set of wheels/tires and am getting ready for another. If you have any doubts, they were great about me emailing a bunch of questions.
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Mar 12, 2012 21:04
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Cool, that's good news then. I saw someone's Subaru a few pages back with the Enkei EDR9's, and that's the set I've been eyeing. So, if I have them mounted and balanced before delivery, can I take them down and have a tire shop switch over my TPS?
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Mar 12, 2012 21:09
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War Bunny posted:Cool, that's good news then. I saw someone's Subaru a few pages back with the Enkei EDR9's, and that's the set I've been eyeing. So, if I have them mounted and balanced before delivery, can I take them down and have a tire shop switch over my TPS? Their site makes it seem so. I've replaced the tires on my Outback that has them without needing a specialist or to buy new ones, but they are the stock wheels still, too. This is what they say: Tire Rack posted:Can I reuse my Original Equipment (O.E.) TPMS sensors instead of buying new sensors when I purchase new wheels?
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Mar 13, 2012 01:42
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Anyone own a 2011 or 2012 Forester? I'm thinking about purchasing one and would love to hear some of AI's opinions.
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Mar 13, 2012 03:04
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Hughmoris posted:Anyone own a 2011 or 2012 Forester? I'm thinking about purchasing one and would love to hear some of AI's opinions. My friend has an '11 Forester XT and I think it's great. Plenty of utility, decent pickup, etc. He has cloth interior which feels cheap, so I'd get the leather if that's your thing. Otherwise it's pretty standard Subaru build quality and basically rides like a slightly taller Impreza. What exactly are you looking for in terms of opinions? If I were in the market for a mid-size SUV/crossover thing, I'd definitely consider the Forester. The only thing with the turbo engine is my friend averages around 19mpg combined city/highway, and he drives like a grandma. So if you're looking for fuel efficiency, I'd stay away from the XT.
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Mar 13, 2012 03:30
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BoostCreep posted:My friend has an '11 Forester XT and I think it's great. Plenty of utility, decent pickup, etc. He has cloth interior which feels cheap, so I'd get the leather if that's your thing. Otherwise it's pretty standard Subaru build quality and basically rides like a slightly taller Impreza. What exactly are you looking for in terms of opinions? If I were in the market for a mid-size SUV/crossover thing, I'd definitely consider the Forester. The only thing with the turbo engine is my friend averages around 19mpg combined city/highway, and he drives like a grandma. So if you're looking for fuel efficiency, I'd stay away from the XT.
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Mar 13, 2012 03:34
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Lazor posted:Whelp, it looks like my 08 STI has a blown piston ring again... I have a 91 octane map I run on the Accessport and I try not to hit the rev limiter too much Good on you for keeping the car and trying to work with it despite the problems - I would say though to bite the bullet and go with forged pistons, or else to go through the lemon laws. The reason I highlighted this part of your explanation is to suggest that in the future you spend the extra cash on a real tune - the california 91 cobb map is better than stock, but 91 (particularly california/arizona 91) is hard on an engine that was really made for significantly higher octane gas. A custom tune for your engine would make it much more likely to survive, and would give you an idea of whether there may have been any other niggling underlying problems that were too small for you to notice but significant enough to toast the engine. And while I know it can be hard to avoid, hitting the rev limiter/fuel cut regularly is almost always a death sentence for these cars. You're making for the absolute worst operating conditions for the engine every time it happens (other than maybe oil deprivation) - you're going ultra lean under very high RPM's, creating extremely high cylinder temperatures and loads of the nastiest sort of knock. Knowing that, it might be easier to retrain your driving habits to avoid the fuel cut.
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Mar 13, 2012 04:08
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BoostCreep posted:My friend has an '11 Forester XT and I think it's great. Plenty of utility, decent pickup, etc. He has cloth interior which feels cheap, so I'd get the leather if that's your thing. Otherwise it's pretty standard Subaru build quality and basically rides like a slightly taller Impreza. What exactly are you looking for in terms of opinions? If I were in the market for a mid-size SUV/crossover thing, I'd definitely consider the Forester. The only thing with the turbo engine is my friend averages around 19mpg combined city/highway, and he drives like a grandma. So if you're looking for fuel efficiency, I'd stay away from the XT. I can't afford the XT, will probably look for the Forester Premium W/ All-Weather Package and the 5-speed manual transmission. The m/t is rated 21/27 mpg which isn't toooo bad. What are the opinions on the manual transmission in these? Am I better off going with the automatic?
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Mar 13, 2012 04:11
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