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Y Kant Ozma Post posted:Whoa whoa whoa. Spoilers please. I had no idea there was a mule in the book. You're going to be very thrown off when you start The Gunslinger, especially if you find the original unedited version. It's quite unlike anything King has ever written before or since, and not exactly in a good way. Thankfully the next book has the most attention-grabbing first ten pages of any book I have ever read.
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Apr 6, 2012 19:13
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The Walrus posted:Thankfully the next book has the most attention-grabbing first ten pages of any book I have ever read. Dad-a-chum? Ornamented Death posted:If you do ever get to Black House, feel free to skim or even skip the first chapter. It's 100 pages of mind-numbing tedium. I thought that the opening painted a nice, pastoral picture of that little town and how there was a horrifying cancer in the heart of it.
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Apr 6, 2012 19:29
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Blade_of_tyshalle posted:Dad-a-chum? Ded-a-check? quote:I thought that the opening painted a nice, pastoral picture of that little town and how there was a horrifying cancer in the heart of it. Yeah, but it could have been done in half the legnth and still been just as good. It just drags
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Apr 6, 2012 20:16
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The Walrus posted:You're going to be very thrown off when you start The Gunslinger, especially if you find the original unedited version. It's quite unlike anything King has ever written before or since, and not exactly in a good way. Thankfully the next book has the most attention-grabbing first ten pages of any book I have ever read. I will definitely give it a try- I'm working through EPG's Liminal States (and legit enjoying it) and have a nonfiction in my queue, but I'll do Gunslinger soon.
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Apr 6, 2012 20:20
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Locus posted:Speaking of which, I'm listening to The Running Man audiobook, and in the introduction about Bachman, Stephen King just... spoils the ending. That's actually in my physical copy too.
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Apr 6, 2012 21:17
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Stroth posted:He lived didn't he? Even died peacefully of old age about ten years later if I remember correctly. He did, and was the Adam of dogs. They found an Eve (retriever as well iirc) and had PUPPIES!
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Apr 7, 2012 02:02
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Locus posted:Speaking of which, I'm listening to The Running Man audiobook, and in the introduction about Bachman, Stephen King just... spoils the ending. Yes. Yes, it does. It's kinda bullshit.
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Apr 7, 2012 03:11
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Stroth posted:Ded-a-check? dum-a-chee, you've got the key. 
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Apr 8, 2012 14:32
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Blade_of_tyshalle posted:Dad-a-chum? Stroth posted:Ded-a-check? Jealous Cow posted:dum-a-chee, you've got the key. 
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Apr 8, 2012 16:35
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The Walrus posted:You're going to be very thrown off when you start The Gunslinger, especially if you find the original unedited version. It's quite unlike anything King has ever written before or since, and not exactly in a good way. Thankfully the next book has the most attention-grabbing first ten pages of any book I have ever read. And yeah, the Gunslinger is different from most of his stuff. It's basically an introduction to the series' main character, but he's introduced in a way that (intentionally) tells you very little about him. Some (many, maybe) call it boring and dry, but I dug it and it's a really quick read, besides. jackpot fucked around with this message at 19:53 on Apr 9, 2012 |
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Apr 9, 2012 19:51
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oldpainless posted:And now I'm never going to sleep again. Thanks for that.
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Apr 10, 2012 19:58
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ATTN: People who are planning to read the short story collection Night Shift. Do NOT read "The Woman in the Room". It is 100% depressing. There is nothing funny, cool, scary, or exciting involved. It is a tragically realistic story about a guy and his extremely ill mother. Most of Night Shift is pretty boss, though.
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Apr 10, 2012 22:00
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Stroth posted:And now I'm never going to sleep again. Thanks for that. Success!!! 
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Apr 11, 2012 06:03
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Oh, are we playing Pennywise gifs?
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Apr 11, 2012 06:08
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Pennywise gifs? I'd love some. Post more.
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Apr 11, 2012 06:13
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Eh, I've only made two so I was overselling it a bit. Plus if we post too many gifs the mod will come in and yell at us for not talking seriously about Pennywise the clown that came to earth in a spaceship
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Apr 11, 2012 06:21
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SSDD, right?
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Apr 11, 2012 15:00
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jackpot posted:Regarding the whole "edited or unedited" debate: for anyone just coming to the DT series, just ignore it; the book you're reading is probably the newer version, and that's fine. I remember it being a big deal when the new version came out, but now I'm reading a list of changes and they're pretty minor. It's a retcon, but it's about changing the details, not the plot. It's stuff like changing the name of a town that's mentioned, because the town's name is later the last name of a character. Just as a counterpoint, I abhor the revamped and revised The Gunslinger and think it effectively ruins the tone of the book and more than some of the mystery. It has always felt very "Star Wars: Special Edition" to me, with the changes standing out in attention-seeking, day-glo CGI. So much of the tone of the original feels bleak and empty, very much a "Dying Earth" seventies novel, and it's only throughout the series that we get more and more information about this world and other places and creatures. Particularly jarring to me was the inclusion of a Taheen early on, and talking about Algul Siento and so on. That in particular jumps multiple books ahead instead of keeping the world bleak and possibly empty, and feels about as suble as a CGI Rancor in the background jumping up and down and waving its arms. Also particularly egregious is a line, merely 5-10 pages into the book, that essentially says "Roland felt dizzy for a moment and wondered whether he had lived multiple lives and done this journey countless times before, then took a drink and continued onward. WOW, King, way to be subtle. I encourage anyone to instead seek out the unrevised version whenever possible.
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Apr 11, 2012 15:42
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Tim Curry gifs are the best gifs.
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Apr 11, 2012 18:29
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Knight of the
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Transistor Rhythm posted:"Roland felt dizzy for a moment and wondered whether he had lived multiple lives and done this journey countless times before, then took a drink and continued onward. WOW, King, way to be subtle. I haven't read The Gunslinger for years at this point, and I read the revised version, but if this is true then yeah, gently caress that. Get the old version.
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Apr 11, 2012 20:21
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Yeah, that's pretty hamfisted and terrible. And worse, it's completely unnecessary. Same with the taheen - why do that? I think the comparison to the Star Wars Special Editions is apt - if you saw the originals enough times to notice the differences (I don't care how much sense ghost Anakin made in RotJ, gently caress that), they pissed you off. But if your first Star Wars experience was the SE, and someone explained to you later what Lucas changed, you'd likely shrug your shoulders and go "so...?"* If you've read the original book, I agree King's changes are pretty retarded (but also I think you'd have to have read it several times to pick up on them; I don't think a casual reader, reading them a few years apart, would see anything different). I just don't think new readers will notice anything. * I don't care if I have to dig out the VHS player to prove it, when I have kids, you bet your rear end Han's gonna shoot first. 
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Apr 11, 2012 21:02
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They are two different books: The original Gunslinger is a self contained set of short stories. The revised is part 1 of a series.
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Apr 11, 2012 21:08
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Install Gentoo posted:They are two different books: This isn't true and doesn't even make sense.
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Apr 12, 2012 22:24
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Kunzelman posted:This isn't true and doesn't even make sense. It is mostly true and makes sense. Originally King released a series of short stories for a magazine (which one I can not remember) and after all the stories where released a publisher agreed to put them together into a book. Although King had some distant plan to build on this world he did not plan on The Gunslinger being his Magnum Opus til after its release. After writing the next two portions of the The Dark Tower he rereleased The Gunslinger in a revised version that streamlined a lot of the background stuff to coincide with what he had in mind. References to ancient earth culture and books where taken out but some (Hey Jude!) where purposefully left in. That is why the original statement is mostly true. The original book was a collection of short stories (although the book itself was not designed to be a collection of short stories) and the revision is supposed to serve as the beginning of The Dark Tower series. E: The Magazine of Fantasy and Science Fiction and more info Here
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Apr 12, 2012 22:38
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It was a serialized story - not separate short stories.
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Apr 12, 2012 22:57
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Nog posted:It was a serialized story - not separate short stories. I understand the difference, but everything I have read (Wikipedia and King works) refer to them as separate short stories
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Apr 12, 2012 23:28
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I'm reading Full Dark No Stars and I have a question. I just finished Fair Extension so I'm curious: So, basically the guy who gave his cancer away gets away totally scot free? Like, he wins?
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Apr 13, 2012 00:56
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OldTennisCourt posted:I'm reading Full Dark No Stars and I have a question. Well, in a fictional universe in which The Freaking Devil exists, he is probably going to get some comeuppance on the flipside.
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Apr 13, 2012 00:59
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JustFrakkingDoIt posted:Well, in a fictional universe in which The Freaking Devil exists, he is probably going to get some comeuppance on the flipside. It seems vague though. Doesn't the Devil even say he didn't give up his soul though? It seems like the implication was that the guy totally wins. I think my major issue with the story is how the guy goes from normal to this unbelievable monster in this really huge turn. He goes from worried that the guy will get cancer to absolutely reveling in the pain and horror that hurts this guys' family. It felt really strange.
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Apr 13, 2012 01:02
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Transistor Rhythm posted:Just as a counterpoint, I abhor the revamped and revised The Gunslinger and think it effectively ruins the tone of the book and more than some of the mystery. It has always felt very "Star Wars: Special Edition" to me, with the changes standing out in attention-seeking, day-glo CGI. So much of the tone of the original feels bleak and empty, very much a "Dying Earth" seventies novel, and it's only throughout the series that we get more and more information about this world and other places and creatures. Particularly jarring to me was the inclusion of a Taheen early on, and talking about Algul Siento and so on. That in particular jumps multiple books ahead instead of keeping the world bleak and possibly empty, and feels about as suble as a CGI Rancor in the background jumping up and down and waving its arms. Also particularly egregious is a line, merely 5-10 pages into the book, that essentially says "Roland felt dizzy for a moment and wondered whether he had lived multiple lives and done this journey countless times before, then took a drink and continued onward. WOW, King, way to be subtle. According to Wikipedia, Roland's cold-hearted killing of Allie is changed to make him appear more humane. Originally, when the town of Tull turn on Roland, Allie is seized by a townsperson and used as a human shield. She begs Roland not to fire before he ruthlessly guns down both her and her captor.[6] In the revised version, she has been driven mad by Walter by the time she is seized, and begs Roland to put her out of her misery." This seems wildly at odds with not only the end of The Gunslinger but also the next two books at least. Roland is somewhat of a monster in the beginning, he'll do whatever it takes to save the Tower. Then, Eddie and Susanna humanize him again. It seems really stupid to change his cold-hearted nature at the beginning, then have him let Jake die later on.
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Apr 13, 2012 01:47
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OldTennisCourt posted:It seems vague though. Doesn't the Devil even say he didn't give up his soul though? It seems like the implication was that the guy totally wins. But, the devil dude could have lied to him. I mean, when do good things happen to people in King books? Here's another thing about that story, his friend who had the garbage disposal company (sounds shady already) already had a huge accounting discrepancy (or some kind of problem with his business, I forget) going on before his good friend made a deal with the devil.
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Apr 13, 2012 01:49
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Fair Extension Spoilers:OldTennisCourt posted:It seems vague though. Doesn't the Devil even say he didn't give up his soul though? It seems like the implication was that the guy totally wins. Well, using that kind of power turns you into a monster, which is a King theme. As far as not losing your soul, you turned your best friend's fate over to Satan in return for turning your luck around. If there is such a thing as a soul, and you have one, then in that case, you have probably irredeemably hosed it.
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Apr 13, 2012 03:10
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navyjack posted:Fair Extension Spoilers: I think, to me, the change was just not very gradual. He goes from being scared and nervoius and maybe a little happy that the guy will get some poo poo thrown on him to this grinning monster who just delights in the fact that family members who never did anything to him, not simply the guy he hated, were being horrifically hosed over. It really seems like a much longer story crammed into a really short amount of space so we lose a poo poo ton of character development.
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Apr 13, 2012 03:47
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I think the idea was that he was always that way, and the deal was just the catalyst to bring out his true nature. Which is also why he was chosen.
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Apr 13, 2012 12:34
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Having read both versions of The Gunslinger, and having read the newer version first, I'd have to say that I didn't think it was terrible, or indeed all that different. As for the fact that the revised version foreshadows the ending, who gives a gently caress, you're not going to remember what appears to be a throwaway line unless you already knew the ending. I liked the ending of The Dark Tower, and I don't understand why people got so pissed off about it. Also, I can't help but wonder if the world gets a little more decrepit every time the cycle repeats itself. I mean, has it always been so post-apocalyptic, or is it getting worse and worse and worse until Roland gets everything right? Is it possible that he's running out of restarts? Is the next time the last try? Does he have everything he needs now?. -- Another King book that people didn't seem to like but I quite enjoyed was Under The Dome. I guess I absolutely need to spoiler my thoughts, so: It reminded me very much of the parts I liked about The Stand, where the supernatural element is more of a catalyst for people being awful to each other than it is a spider demon or a scary clown or some zombies. Also, the parts with people going about their business and just getting hosed up at random were pretty heartwrenching, especially the woman who dies with her hands cut off by the dome, her husband's reaction made me put the book down for a bit. Both Rennies were scary as gently caress, but for different reasons. I thought Junior was going to turn out to be possessed by demons or something, but the brain tumor was was scarier. Big Jim was freaky because you can kind of see your local council turning out like that if there was an apocalyptic scenario. I didn't like the aliens though. It felt like a copout, it would have been better if the Dome was just this inexplicable barrier created by an inexplicable device. I did like the way the device showed you the thing you felt worst about. I wish it had gone through some more characters. I think that if the key had been accepting what a horrible person you are and working out that everyone's a horrible person and accepting that, it would have made a better ending. Obviously that's why I'm not a famous author. Now, tell me if Cell is worth reading, I haven't got around to it yet. It's got zombies, right? Are they like new movie ones, old movie ones, or does he have a unique take on it? Edit: Under The Dome spoilers again... Why the gently caress was there the world's biggest meth lab in the town? The Chef was kind of cool, but it really seemed like that whole subplot was shoehorned in so something could blow up real big. Big Jim seems like the kind of douchebag that would be stealing propane (and maybe diesel, fertiliser, ammo, dynamite, etc) from town stores just to sell them, or because of some survivalist bullshit, or just for the sake of keeping them out of the hands of his rivals. He does not seem like a drug lord. Or was that the point? Elector_Nerdlingen fucked around with this message at 14:53 on Apr 13, 2012 |
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Apr 13, 2012 14:44
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That was the point. The final scene with Renne trapped in that shack with the failing air filter is the cap on a story about what makes a real sociopath.
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Apr 13, 2012 15:47
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AlphaDog posted:I liked the ending of The Dark Tower, and I don't understand why people got so pissed off about it. Also, I can't help but wonder if the world gets a little more decrepit every time the cycle repeats itself. I mean, has it always been so post-apocalyptic, or is it getting worse and worse and worse until Roland gets everything right? Is it possible that he's running out of restarts? Is the next time the last try? Does he have everything he needs now?. I always took King at his word when he said that Browning's poem about Roland was the real ending, such that the cycle we have just read about was the penultimate loop, and that the next time will be the time Roland blows the Horn of Eld (which he has now, when he begins the last loop at the novels' end) for his friends and forefathers.
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Apr 13, 2012 17:22
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AlphaDog posted:I liked the ending of The Dark Tower, and I don't understand why people got so pissed off about it. Not a long thread, this has been addressed in detail already multiple times.
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Apr 13, 2012 20:40
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AlphaDog posted:Now, tell me if Cell is worth reading, I haven't got around to it yet. It's got zombies, right? Are they like new movie ones, old movie ones, or does he have a unique take on it? They're kind of weird. I wouldn't call them zombies per se. They share some elements with them, but they're not what you'd traditionally think of when invoking that word. The book itself is better than Gerald's Game (haha, not a ringing endorsement is it), and to me it was an enjoyable enough read, the pacing is decent and the story has a lot of parts that I enjoyed reading I am a huge fan of dystopian/the Stand type scenarios, where 99% of humanity is non compos mentis and the rest have to figure out how to survive and what to do BUT to compare it to Stand or other books of that nature isn't a good idea. A lot of folks in this thread really hated it and I can see why, and I didn't hate it but it wouldn't be one of the 25 King books I'd take on a deserted island. It's a really weak plot and not his best writing by any stretch. I really did not sympathise much with the main character, which is pretty rare for me in a King story. Usually the ones that you're intended to relate with and root for have redeeming qualities but this guy was pretty insufferable. There was one character that I really liked (but he was never given any depth, only a supporting character), and the rest were unremarkable, but the main guy was just such a weak unpleasant character, and it probably affected the enjoyment of the story for me. It felt like he wanted to do another Stand type book but it just flopped on way too many points where the Stand was strong. If that makes sense. It's just sad because the premise had a lot of potential, but he didn't take it to great heights. It's not a bad way to waste a few hours and I didn't hate it, but I didn't LIKE it much either. I won't be needing to re-read it again soon.
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Apr 13, 2012 22:29
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I think someone waaay earlier in the thread summed up Cell with "It's the only book I've ever read where every chapter is slightly worse than the previous one," which I though was dead-on at the time. It starts off great, but ends up pretty bad by the third act.
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Apr 13, 2012 22:54
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