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Shasta Orange Soda posted:I bookmarked this article 3 years ago because I had a feeling I'd end up linking it a lot in the future. I was right. Good articles, but the comments on the first are terrible. I've only read part of it but All the Devils Are Here is also a good resource, and I've also seen several interviews with the authors of the book. Interestingly, they show that a significant portion of those subprime loans that ruined the economy actually weren't given to people getting mortgages on their first homes but rather people taking out second and/or third mortgages on homes they already own. So, it's less about people getting "homes they couldn't afford" and more about people mortgaging their homes because of the inflated valures of the housing market to support lifestyles they couldn't afford.
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Apr 8, 2012 10:51
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Dr Christmas posted:I think there is an actual law that he's misinterpreting to make his point, and the Fox talking heads conveniently left out that it was implemented decades ago, long enough ago that it wouldn't suddenly gently caress everything up in 2008. The reason why banks went after subprime loans that they often times knew wouldn't get repaid is because the banks didn't care if they got repaid: instead of having their revenue come from the repayment of the home loans (which would force banks to be concerned with repayment) the banks were bundling up those loans and selling them as investments while charging a fee to do so. It didn't matter to them if the loans were never repaid because they didn't own the loans anymore and got the money from the fees already. This became a real problem though because banks were also investing in this garbage. When the bottom fell out on the housing market, a very worrying problem arose: banks had no idea what their goddamn finances were. Were the things they held assets, or debts? What was the value of accounts and investments on their books? They didn't know, and there was no straightforward way to figure it out because of all the bundling and rebundling that was done. For example, a variety of loans were bundled up, then divided into chunks and sold to various investors and banks. Sometimes what banks would do is buy up the riskiest chunks and then rebundle those chunks into a new bundle to split and resell, netting at least some of those risky loans as AAA rated investments. ----- The whole thing really was and is a clusterfuck, and while government was involved, much of the problem with government wasn't forcing bad loans but taking a hands-off free market anti-regulation stance on the entire thing. Would actual government oversight and regulation have stopped the crisis? It's impossible to state definitively but based on what I've read I think it's unlikely. More likely it would've mitigated some of the collateral damage and kept things from hitting so hard. Rating agencies, investors, banking institutions all played a role in the collapse brought about by this poo poo and it's hard to imagine that government oversight alone would've caught it all. All The Devils Are Here, as linked above, is a great book on the subject. For a quick, simplified look at the basics of the crisis, I've found this video to be pretty on the spot. http://vimeo.com/3261363
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Apr 8, 2012 17:16
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Government oversight would have stopped what was happening, regulations already in place had to be loosened to allow banks and other institutions to leverage themselves so heavily. Unfortunately capitalism has become synonymous with a completely free market to the point that plenty regard market regulation as an attack on capitalism.
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Apr 8, 2012 18:21
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quote:Consider this sampling. Yes, Fox is less evil than all other news networds and the media skews left hardcore. Anyone have any good examples of horrendously unmatchable evil things Fox News has done?
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Apr 9, 2012 13:09
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I like how they say ABC "altered the evidence" to make Zimmerman look uninjured and base that revelation on the digitally enhanced (i.e. altered) video that shows what might be an injury. They aired unedited video, that's altering the evidence! And just a reminder, NBC fires people if they selectively edit content, but selective editing of content is just business as usual at fox http://ac360.blogs.cnn.com/2011/04/26/the-ridiculist-sean-hannity/
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Apr 9, 2012 13:24
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Nibbles141 posted:Government oversight would have stopped what was happening, regulations already in place had to be loosened to allow banks and other institutions to leverage themselves so heavily. That's the part that gets to me, when people act like their interpretation of something is the only legitimate version, which is especially common with capitalism, religion and the Constitution. I'm really loving sick of hearing people critical of unregulated capitalism be labeled as "Marxists," people critical of conservative interpretations of the Constitution (e.g. originalism) labeled as anti-American or anti-Constitution, and those who don't subscribe to a conservative form of Christianity dismissed as not being Christian at all.
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Apr 9, 2012 13:25
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Yes, Fox is less evil than all other news networds and the media skews left hardcore. The best one in my recent memory is their campaign to make Common out to be some kind of cop killing thug by selectively grabbing one line about killing from one of his songs and neglecting to even mention the very next line which condemned the previous line about killing; that and his support for a woman he believes was unjustly convicted of killing a cop via song. O'Reilly, Hannity, and Beck too, if memory serves, had a field day with it. Jon Stewart did a really good interview with O'Reilly over how ridiculous the entire Fox News 'selective outrage' machine is, and how they're more than happy to support people like Nugent when they talk about making the president suck on his machine gun. I'm at work so I'm pressed for time, but I'm sure a quick google search will give you plenty of ammo.
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Apr 9, 2012 14:46
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Yes, Fox is less evil than all other news networds and the media skews left hardcore. Outfoxed is worth a watch.
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Apr 9, 2012 15:48
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Come to work this morning and find a fax for the boss waiting in the machine. Nothing new, I read it over and, what's this? A bullshit chain fax from the republicans. About how awful Obama is for stopping the keystone project. Need to charge them for wasting our paper. Linked for large - http://i.imgur.com/PJ9nM.jpg
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Apr 9, 2012 15:59
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King Ramses posted:Come to work this morning and find a fax for the boss waiting in the machine. Nothing new, I read it over and, what's this? A bullshit chain fax from the republicans. About how awful Obama is for stopping the keystone project. Need to charge them for wasting our paper. "Not printed at governmental expense."
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Apr 9, 2012 16:23
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Wait, are the Republicans seriously saying the Democrats are "anti development?" There is not a big enough ironicat for that sentence in the entire world.
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Apr 9, 2012 17:23
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Yes, Fox is less evil than all other news networds and the media skews left hardcore. My favorite because it's so blatant and impossible to explain away: 
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Apr 9, 2012 17:59
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Do you have a source for that?
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Apr 9, 2012 18:29
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Do you have a source for that? Here you go http://mediamatters.org/research/200807020002
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Apr 9, 2012 18:34
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King Ramses posted:Come to work this morning and find a fax for the boss waiting in the machine. Nothing new, I read it over and, what's this? A bullshit chain fax from the republicans. About how awful Obama is for stopping the keystone project. Need to charge them for wasting our paper. Actually, I think unsolicited faxes can be used to sue the sender for damages. http://www.fcc.gov/guides/fax-advertising If your boss has no prior business relationship with the National Republican Election Committee, then they violated the law.
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Apr 9, 2012 19:07
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Our business has received several robo-calls from some Ron Paul group in California. I left the phone off the cradle once to see just how long it is and it rambles on about "are freedoms" for almost 22 minutes.
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Apr 9, 2012 19:15
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King Ramses posted:Come to work this morning and find a fax for the boss waiting in the machine. Nothing new, I read it over and, what's this? A bullshit chain fax from the republicans. About how awful Obama is for stopping the keystone project. Need to charge them for wasting our paper. You mean we could start buying oil from Canada? About time 
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Apr 9, 2012 19:16
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zeroprime posted:I like how they say ABC "altered the evidence" to make Zimmerman look uninjured and base that revelation on the digitally enhanced (i.e. altered) video that shows what might be an injury.
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Apr 9, 2012 19:22
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WAFFLEHOUND posted:Yes, Fox is less evil than all other news networds and the media skews left hardcore. Someone has to have that huge (1600x1200 or something) image of all of the Fox News "mistakes" and charts. I used to have it but can't find it right now. e: Here it is: 
SixPabst fucked around with this message at 22:12 on Apr 9, 2012 |
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Apr 9, 2012 19:40
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King Ramses posted:Come to work this morning and find a fax for the boss waiting in the machine. Nothing new, I read it over and, what's this? A bullshit chain fax from the republicans. About how awful Obama is for stopping the keystone project. Need to charge them for wasting our paper. I can guarantee you that the Nebraska Republican Party is praying that this letter doesn't get sent to Nebraskans.
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Apr 9, 2012 22:03
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I have a folder from some old LF thread, sorry this doesn't serve the purpose of a single master image but I think it's pretty funny reading nevertheless.                    
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Apr 9, 2012 22:07
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Apr 9, 2012 22:13
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Iceberg-Slim posted:Wow. Attacking Fred Rogers? Can they get any lower? How about pissing on MLK's statue or taking a poo poo on Rosa Parks' grave?
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Apr 10, 2012 06:55
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This one is funny because it's not immediately apparent why people were upset if they don't remember when the picture was from.
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Apr 10, 2012 07:03
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mintskoal posted:Someone has to have that huge (1600x1200 or something) image of all of the Fox News "mistakes" and charts. I used to have it but can't find it right now. The tribalistic, spiteful, reptillian part of my brain that doesn't care about raising the level of American discourse wonders what would happen if MSNBC or CNN did an ad campaign that of a Daily Show-esque montage of the endless torrent of indefensible poo poo that flows from Fox News, the stuff that moderate conservatives would stop and blink at, like Glenn Beck's "You gotta shoot them in the head," and "the Muppets are Communist propaganda" stuff," and ended with a cheesy tagline like "No hatred, no lies, just news." Yeah, Fox would do some false equivalency stuff, but the point is that now they are on the defensive. These people have dedicated their lives to making sure poor people don't get medicine. Good people, and entire organizations, who dedicated their lives to helping the poor, have been utterly destroyed just by having Glenn Beck repeating their name and the Democrats simply refusing to fight back. I want to see one, just one of them, actually get hurt because of the poo poo they've said. What does it say about me that I think this 
Dr Christmas fucked around with this message at 07:33 on Apr 10, 2012 |
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Apr 10, 2012 07:30
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Dr Christmas posted:The tribalistic, spiteful, reptillian part of my brain that doesn't care about raising the level of American discourse wonders what would happen if MSNBC or CNN did an ad campaign that of a Daily Show-esque montage of the endless torrent of indefensible poo poo that flows from Fox News, the stuff that moderate conservatives would stop and blink at, like Glenn Beck's "You gotta shoot them in the head," and "the Muppets are Communist propaganda" stuff," and ended with a cheesy tagline like "No hatred, no lies, just news." To me, "raising the level of discourse" requires that we point out bullshit when it happens, but just not pulling the same bullshit as the people you are criticizing. Look at Edward R. Murrow, his reports about Joe McCarthy were scathing and extremely important in getting McCarthy censured and ending McCarthy's witch hunt. Murrow used McCarthy's own words to show how absurd and outrageous McCarthy was, and The Daily Show and The Colbert Report do pretty great jobs emulating Murrow from a comedic/satirical perspective. I think your idea is great, but I think many conservatives will simply write off MSNBC/CNN airing it as Fox News rivals simply trying to "steal" viewers. It would probably work much better as an independent internet campaign from someone who doesn't have a financial interest in Fox News being exposed as liars and partisan ideologues. RPZip posted:
poo poo, I couldn't remember when that picture was from, so I used TinEye to find it and discovered this gem with all the false "D-" attributions from Fox News.
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Apr 10, 2012 09:19
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Here's a good chart they aired just a few months ago:  http://mediamatters.org/blog/201112120005
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Apr 10, 2012 13:32
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cbirdsong posted:Here's a good chart they aired just a few months ago: I'm really curious what it is like to work behind the scenes at Fox News. Do the people that work there realize how blatantly dishonest and partisan they are being and they just don't care/feel justified in doing so because of the rest of the "liberal media" OR do they just convince themselves that these are honest mistakes that no one is doing intentionally and believe that everyone there is motivated by a commitment to facts and news from a conservative perspective? I mean, I'd really like to know how these people deal with the blatant misrepresentation of facts by the on-air personalities and the obvious opinion and partisanship in what are supposed to be news segments. Does Roger Ailes rule with such an iron fist that only someone as popular, successful, and well-paid as Shepherd Smith can even approach being openly critical and dissenting from the party line? Are all these behind-the-scenes production staff just trying to keep their jobs, causing them to tolerate this bullshit or do they drink the Kool Aide too?
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Apr 10, 2012 13:42
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Someone that worked in journalism mentioned on here that they try to hire the true believers, and that severely limits the talent pool. You get a mix of intentional mistakes and a much higher rate of unintentional mistakes, plus a management/editorial staff that is too incompetent to catch a lot of stuff.
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Apr 10, 2012 13:55
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A lot of their orders on how to present a story come directly from Murdoch's desk as well. I believe there were some such memos released a few years ago.
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Apr 10, 2012 14:06
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My favorite is "DID THE RIGHT PEOPLE GET VOTED OFF 'AMERICAN IDOL' THIS WEEK?" Fox News, focusing on the important stuff while your Kenyan Marxist Muslim Secularist """  PRESIDENT """ golfs or whatever
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Apr 10, 2012 14:16
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babies havin rabies posted:A lot of their orders on how to present a story come directly from Murdoch's desk as well. I believe there were some such memos released a few years ago. http://mediamatters.org/blog/201202200003
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Apr 10, 2012 14:31
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babies havin rabies posted:A lot of their orders on how to present a story come directly from Murdoch's desk as well. I believe there were some such memos released a few years ago. Do you mean Ailes, or is it Murdoch as well? Murdoch always struck me as the kind of guy who just likes money without the pretense of helping his fellow man, while Ailes is the kind of person who will unironically call NPR Nazis and has paranoid feelings about "the gays." Every once in a while, some idiot bigot says "Don't call me a homophobe, I'm not afraid of gays  ," but Roger Ailes has an actual, dictionary definition, persistent, irrational fear of gay people.
Dr Christmas fucked around with this message at 14:43 on Apr 10, 2012 |
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Apr 10, 2012 14:41
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Dr Christmas posted:Murdoch always struck me as the kind of guy who just likes money without the pretense of helping his fellow man, There's no difference between this type of person and a true believer in this context.
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Apr 10, 2012 14:52
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I'm just amazed they didn't use a picture of Newports for the whole, "would you vote for a smoker in the white house!?!?!?" thing.
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Apr 10, 2012 15:20
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rscott posted:I'm just amazed they didn't use a picture of Newports for the whole, "would you vote for a smoker in the white house!?!?!?" thing. You are the real racist.
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Apr 10, 2012 20:53
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This is incredibly on-topic: http://gawker.com/5900710/announcing-our-newest-hire-a-current-fox-news-channel-employeequote:I always intended to keep my mouth shut. The plan was simple: get hired, keep my head down and my views to myself, work for a few months, build my resume, then eventually hop to a new job that didn't make me cringe every morning when I looked in the mirror.
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Apr 10, 2012 21:05
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Nevvy Z posted:You are the real racist. Sometimes when you stare into the abyss, it stares back into you.
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Apr 10, 2012 21:09
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zeroprime posted:Someone that worked in journalism mentioned on here that they try to hire the true believers, and that severely limits the talent pool. You get a mix of intentional mistakes and a much higher rate of unintentional mistakes, plus a management/editorial staff that is too incompetent to catch a lot of stuff. Ah, so it's like the Justice Department under George W. Bush that would almost exclusively hire from fourth-tier law schools at conservative, fundamentalist Christian universities like Liberty university and Regents university so that the DoJ would be ideologically pure.
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Apr 10, 2012 23:40
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rscott posted:I'm just amazed they didn't use a picture of Newports for the whole, "would you vote for a smoker in the white house!?!?!?" thing. There's an amazing picture that somehow I've lost of Reagan advertising cigarettes, like bald-faced there he is. Wish I still had it.
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Apr 11, 2012 00:00
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